Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[ZephyrZ]

One thing I'm worried about with Incineroar's inclusion is that the cat has a base speed stat of 60. For those of you who aren't literate in pokemon base stats, for a fully evolved pokemon, 60 speed is pretty bad. If they want to be faithful to the character, he's probably going to be in the lower end of run speeds. If he's going to be a heavy, close-range grappler like Bowser and DK, then it sounds like he's all set up to be a low tier competitively. Being a character who specializes in close combat without the speed to get close just sounds plain bad in 1vs1, even if he's extremely powerful to try to make up for it.

Not that I let tiers dictate my enjoyment of a character or not, but I do wonder how and if the're going to avoid letting him fall under the same trappings that tend to keep poor Ganondorf so low on tier lists.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

This is what I'm thinking as well.



They're leaking all this Granblue related stuff which seems odd as hell, unless they have a source within Cygames. Granblue is such an unknown property outside of Japan, but Cygames has recently shown a much more passionate feeling of wanting the property to get known outside of Japan.

And what better way to do that than by getting a character of their's in Smash Bros.?

I wouldn't be so quick to discount that part of Hitagi's statement.

 

[Shroob]

And what better way to do that than by getting a character of their's in Smash Bros.?

I wouldn't be so quick to discount that part of Hitagi's statement.

That's what I'm starting to suspect as well.

Nintendo and Cygames are on working relations if Dragalia is anything to go by, and Nintendo owns stock in the company. Despite Granblue having little to no relationship to Nintendo consoles, I legit could see it happen as DLC as an advertisement pick.

 

[Noipoi]

Wishlist time baybee.

I had to crop some of these it looks so bad i'm sorry

 

[Jedisupersonic]

One thing I'm worried about with Incineroar's inclusion is that the cat has a base speed stat of 60. For those of you who aren't literate in pokemon base stats, for a fully evolved pokemon, 60 speed is pretty bad. If they want to be faithful to the character, he's probably going to be in the lower end of run speeds. If he's going to be a heavy, close-range grappler like Bowser and DK, then it sounds like he's all set up to be a low tier competitively. Being a character who specializes in close combat without the speed to get close just sounds plain bad in 1vs1, even if he's extremely powerful to try to make up for it.

Not that I let tiers dictate my enjoyment of a character or not, but I do wonder how and if the're going to avoid letting him fall under the same trappings that tend to keep poor Ganondorf so low on tier lists.

If Pokemon base stats actually dictated how they were in Smash, Pikachu would be near bottom tier in every single game.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

If Incineroar really is some sort of "Fire version of King", then we are in for one of the most unique fighters in the series.

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

Guys no offense, but we can't really justify the leak thread being killed because it was "off topic" if we're literally just going to start ranking our favorite Zelda games in a Smash Ultimate discussion thread, apropos of nothing.

Anyways, I'm getting pretty excited about whatever info is coming up soon. I hope it's more than a character reveal. In fact I hope they just give us the final info dump and tell us everything since miraculously very little has leaked so far. If they wait until November I feel like the risk of having major things spoiled by leakers rises exponentially.

And I'll look at all those spoilers as soon as they materialize, of course. I already decided I'm getting the game, so I don't give a darn about Nintendo's marketing cycle or whatever. I just want to know ASAP. I'd rather hear it from Nintendo themselves but if not that's fine. Which again is why I want them to do a tell-all very soon.

 

[Idon]

....What is it with people lately and not being able to read?

Start from the beginning....read slowly this time.

Oh right, I completely misread that.

Yeah, no just because Bamco are working on it doesn't mean they're going to give Incineroar King's moves because they're both wrestlers.

King's an entirely different character from an entirely different type who's built on his throws and the grab-routes his grabs give him, which if not dodged, can be OHKOs, whereas in Smash, that wouldn't translate so well. He might have lip-service in the form of some throw animations, and maybe a body-splat but I can't see a system like that working for Incineroar.

One thing I'm worried about with Incineroar's inclusion is that the cat has a base speed stat of 60. For those of you who aren't literate in pokemon base stats, for a fully evolved pokemon, 60 speed is pretty bad. If they want to be faithful to the character, he's probably going to be in the lower end of run speeds. If he's going to be a heavy, close-range grappler like Bowser and DK, then it sounds like he's all set up to be a low tier competitively. Being a character who specializes in close combat without the speed to get close just sounds plain bad in 1vs1, even if he's extremely powerful to try to make up for it.

Not that I let tiers dictate my enjoyment of a character or not, but I do wonder how and if the're going to avoid letting him fall under the same trappings that tend to keep poor Ganondorf so low on tier lists.

Stats, shmats. Pikachu's awful in Competitive Pokemon in all his incarnations, but is always top tier, if not the best character outright.

Plus, being low-tier never stopped a character from being fun. Just look at Ganondorf.

 

[Deleted member]

They're leaking all this Granblue related stuff which seems odd as hell, unless they have a source within Cygames. Granblue is such an unknown property outside of Japan, but Cygames has recently shown a much more passionate feeling of wanting the property to get known outside of Japan.

Now, I'm mainly asking this just as a financial standpoint, character wants aside - but if they were gonna push any IP they've made for phones, wouldn't it make sense to go the iDOLM@STER route? They co-developed Cinderella Girls' Starlight Stage and Viewing Revolution games with Bandai Namco and they've stated in 2017 that compared to Granblue making them ¥9.1 billion and other games like that one Love Live mobile game, Starlight Stage alone grossed ¥26.6 billion in Japan. For a spin-off of Cinderella Girls? That's unfathomable, if you ask me. They literally separate their financials in some points with stuff like "iDOLM@STER vs Other Games" because of how huge it is for the company. (http://www.mobileindex.com/report/Mobile Index_2D_Idol_Reprt_jp.pdf)

They've already have Bandai Namco at it again for Smash Ultimate, so why not go for an idol property that Namco has the hold of that makes them the most money and is at least somewhat known around other countries in the world that isn't Japan? I guess if you want to consider Smash factors with one being having a Nintendo presence at one point, even iM@S has had Nintendo presence before with Dearly Stars on the DS. (Granted, that's a Japanese-exclusive, but of course, that doesn't really matter when we got Roy and Lucas in the mix lmao)

I dunno, to me, it just doesn't make sense to go for such pretty huge financial risk to push a still fresh IP in Smash that has will have such an exorbitantly high rate of a negative reception due to practically nobody outside of Japan knowing the game, rather than the IP that has been making half of their company's revenue and at least has lesser rate of people being pissed, since some might know iM@S. Or maybe I'm just up at night and can't sleep.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

 

[ZoroCarlos]

I'll be REALLY upset if Incineroar comes along and he's not a grappler like everyone is hyping him up to be. :/

 

[Jedisupersonic]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

Honestly in a weird sense, I could see (if he happened) Geno fufilling that role, but then that goes down the path of "will we get Geno, will SE allow Geno".

 

[Swamp Sensei]

I'll be REALLY upset if Incineroar comes along and he's not a grappler like everyone is hyping him up to be. :/

I mean, its really the only route that can work for him.

It's like K.Rool being a heavy projectile character.

It just kinda flows to mind once you know the character.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

I'll be REALLY upset if Incineroar comes along and he's not a grappler like everyone is hyping him up to be. :/

Honestly they should either play the grappler aspect up or the dirty fighter bit, with like chairs, tables and everything.

Golden situation is we get both.

 

[Idon]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

I'd assume that's because of the unique position Ultimate's in, rather then a typical Smash development cycle.
With the resource sink it is to bring back every single veteran and most stages, in a <2 year dev cycle, newcomer traditions are probably gonna be scrapped for this entry.

 

[CaptainAmerica]

If we get Incineroar, I don't care how made up or fan headcanon-y it is: He ****ing well better have a special where he pulls out a folding chair and slams it on someone's head. Plus fire-crotch is an absolute must. I'm trying to decide which should be the side special and which should be neutral, since both the images of Kirby smashing someone with a chair and Kirby using a flame move from down under are making me lmao.

If they meme him up, it'll make him 1000% more appealing.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Now, I'm mainly asking this just as a financial standpoint, character wants aside - but if they were gonna push any IP they've made for phones, wouldn't it make sense to go the iDOLM@STER route? They co-developed Cinderella Girls' Starlight Stage and Viewing Revolution games with Bandai Namco and they've stated in 2017 that compared to Granblue making them ¥9.1 billion and other games like that one Love Live mobile game, Starlight Stage alone grossed ¥26.6 billion in Japan. For a spin-off of Cinderella Girls? That's unfathomable, if you ask me. They literally separate their financials in some points with stuff like "iDOLM@STER vs Other Games" because of how huge it is for the company. (http://www.mobileindex.com/report/Mobile Index_2D_Idol_Reprt_jp.pdf)

They've already have Bandai Namco at it again for Smash Ultimate, so why not go for an idol property that Namco has the hold of that makes them the most money and is at least somewhat known around other countries in the world that isn't Japan? I guess if you want to consider Smash factors with one being having a Nintendo presence at one point, even iM@S has had Nintendo presence before with Dearly Stars on the DS. (Granted, that's a Japanese-exclusive, but of course, that doesn't really matter when we got Roy and Lucas in the mix lmao)

I dunno, to me, it just doesn't make sense to go for such pretty huge financial risk to push a still fresh IP in Smash that has will have such an exorbitantly high rate of a negative reception due to practically nobody outside of Japan knowing the game, rather than the IP that has been making half of their company's revenue and at least has lesser rate of people being pissed, since some might know iM@S. Or maybe I'm just up at night and can't sleep.

I think it's the latter there /s

If Bandai Namco owns iDOLM@STER, then there's the problem right there. There's a third party they have to work with, instead of a direct deal between Nintendo and Cygames. It's a lot less hoops to jump through, and Granblue is still a massive series in it's own right.

Granblue is large enough to be our mobile game representation, as much as I never thought I'd say the phrase "mobile game representation" in the context of a Smash Brothers. game. One hell of a speculation cycle, huh?

 

[Michael the Spikester]

Well power went out for a few hours but now I'm back. Only for 50 more minutes though then I'm going to bed.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

DaybreakHorizon

According to a friend of mine, Senjougahara_hitagi leaked a Granblue fighting game being made by Arcsys.


As soon as they get out of their game, I'll update.



Edit: Found it


https://www.reddit.com/r/Kappa/comments/9eloaw/new_samsho_trailer/e5q72i8/

Did this Granblue fighting game get confirmed recently or is this something we're still looking out for?

 

[MasterOfKnees]

If we get Incineroar, I don't care how made up or fan headcanon-y it is: He ****ing well better have a special where he pulls out a folding chair and slams it on someone's head. Plus fire-crotch is an absolute must. I'm trying to decide which should be the side special and which should be neutral, since both the images of Kirby smashing someone with a chair and Kirby using a flame move from down under are making me lmao.

If they meme him up, it'll make him 1000% more appealing.

The chair could also be a side-smash, would be stupid good with such a long disjointed hitbox. I really hope they crank the comical aspect of the character up to 11.

 

[Shroob]

Now, I'm mainly asking this just as a financial standpoint, character wants aside - but if they were gonna push any IP they've made for phones, wouldn't it make sense to go the iDOLM@STER route? They co-developed Cinderella Girls' Starlight Stage and Viewing Revolution games with Bandai Namco and they've stated in 2017 that compared to Granblue making them ¥9.1 billion and other games like that one Love Live mobile game, Starlight Stage alone grossed ¥26.6 billion in Japan. For a spin-off of Cinderella Girls? That's unfathomable, if you ask me. They literally separate their financials in some points with stuff like "iDOLM@STER vs Other Games" because of how huge it is for the company. (http://www.mobileindex.com/report/Mobile Index_2D_Idol_Reprt_jp.pdf)

They've already have Bandai Namco at it again for Smash Ultimate, so why not go for an idol property that Namco has the hold of that makes them the most money and is at least somewhat known around other countries in the world that isn't Japan? I guess if you want to consider Smash factors with one being having a Nintendo presence at one point, even iM@S has had Nintendo presence before with Dearly Stars on the DS. (Granted, that's a Japanese-exclusive, but of course, that doesn't really matter when we got Roy and Lucas in the mix lmao)

I dunno, to me, it just doesn't make sense to go for such pretty huge financial risk to push a still fresh IP in Smash that has will have such an exorbitantly high rate of a negative reception due to practically nobody outside of Japan knowing the game, rather than the IP that has been making half of their company's revenue and at least has lesser rate of people being pissed, since some might know iM@S. Or maybe I'm just up at night and can't sleep.

The thing is, Granblue is more or less their mascot franchise, and they've slowly been pushing for the game to get localized as of late.

The game has an entire english translation, and has been showing up at comicon and PAX despite its unknown presence, and is starting to 'branch out' to consoles via Spin-off games.


On the platform that I play Granblue on, it's the most played game on the platform.


Omega Tyrant


Still looking out for.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Incineroar will lose all the haters if they straight up make him goofy with him being a heel.

His personality is his strongest point. Don't let him lose it Sakurai.

 

[Deleted member]

I think it's the latter there /s

If Bandai Namco owns iDOLM@STER, then there's the problem right there. There's a third party they have to work with, instead of a direct deal between Nintendo and Cygames. It's a lot less hoops to jump through, and Granblue is still a massive series in it's own right. Granblue could be our mobile game representation, as much as I never thought I'd say the phrase "mobile game representation" in a Smash Brothers. game.

No, I'm pretty sure you're right because holy **** I've been trying so damn hard to sleep at a normal time and yet I STILL WILL BE AWAKE AT 12 ****ING AM IN THE WEST COAST so excuse me if half of my brain is on some 200 billion galaxy brain IQ LMAO

Yeah, THE iDOLM@STER is owned by Bandai Namco. Though I don't think it'd be that much of a hassle, given how unimaginably insane iM@S makes. It'd be kinda like asking for a Namco rep, like Tekken, but your asking for an IP that makes billions upon billions of dollars.

I mean, it makes sense rather to go for Dragalia Lost than Granblue, since it's been pushed by Nintendo a fair amount, but it wouldn't be a fair comparison between the two because, y'know, it came out days ago lol

 

[Calane]

I took the time to join in on the wishlist thing.

 

[Makai Wars]

One thing I'm worried about with Incineroar's inclusion is that the cat has a base speed stat of 60. For those of you who aren't literate in pokemon base stats, for a fully evolved pokemon, 60 speed is pretty bad. If they want to be faithful to the character, he's probably going to be in the lower end of run speeds. If he's going to be a heavy, close-range grappler like Bowser and DK, then it sounds like he's all set up to be a low tier competitively. Being a character who specializes in close combat without the speed to get close just sounds plain bad in 1vs1, even if he's extremely powerful to try to make up for it.

Not that I let tiers dictate my enjoyment of a character or not, but I do wonder how and if the're going to avoid letting him fall under the same trappings that tend to keep poor Ganondorf so low on tier lists.

You bringing up his speed reminded me of how weird he looks when he runs.

That is such a big oof from me. He's a cat that runs like a gorilla...

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

What do you mean? They already revealed the retro surprise character.

Seriously though, I would have loved to have had Mike Jones and Takamaru in as playable fighters. It's too bad their games weren't originally released worldwide, because if they were I imagine we would have seen them in Smash at this point.

I also really want Muddy Mole, but it seems that he's too obscure.

To me most of the other choices would be cool to see, just based on the idea of bringing back an old character alone, but they don't have much pull other than that.

 

[EricTheGamerman]

I'd assume that's because of the unique position Ultimate's in, rather then a typical Smash development cycle.
With the resource sink it is to bring back every single veteran and most stages, in a <2 year dev cycle, newcomer traditions are probably gonna be scrapped for this entry.

I agree with the point of all the content, but this game really hasn't had a different development cycle compared to Smash 4 and Brawl. They were both developed in the 2.5 - 3 year time frame like Ultimate has been.

I do think Sakurai approached newcomers differently for sure with Ultimate. With so few slots (And look we can argue about slots all people want to, but the point is he could only make so many unique within the time frame for Ultimate), I'm sure he decided against some traditions. One of the reasons I don't think Incineroar is guaranteed to happen quite yet. I do agree, if they play up the heel angle of Incineroar, I'll stick think him one of the lamer announcements to end on, but I'd actually quite enjoy him as a character. If he's generic fire/fighting type with no flavor... Why did Sakurai bother?

 

[Dee Dude]

We're doing this? Sweet, here's mine.

 

[Idon]

For heel wrestling, there's several boxes that you've gotta check off.

1. Outside objects
2. Taunting the crowd
3. Dirty moves (chokeholds, scratches, dragging, stomps, and maaaaaybe pile-driving)
4. Straight up cheating.

Now 3. is something any fighter can get down pat. The difficulty then is 1. 2. and 4.

1. Outside objects are not things Pokemon usually summon and it may look slightly strange. I see this working if he reaches into the background to pretend he's secretly smuggling something in?

2. Heels talk and they talk a lot to make people mad. In any game you'd probably just give him a mic where he trash talks you infinitely ala Bayonetta but pokemon can't talk, so he'd need to convey the insults through body language alone and has to do it often. I like Opossum 's idea of being rewarded for how much you taunt.

And for 4. "Cheating" is reaaaally hard to define in a non-wrestling situation where the opponent can just have guns straight up. The only thing I can think of that could show this personality trait off is something like having an indepth moveset when he's lying down pretending to be knocked down.

 

[Shroob]

For heel wrestling, there's several boxes that you've gotta check off.

1. Outside objects
2. Taunting the crowd
3. Dirty moves (chokeholds, scratches, dragging, stomps, and maaaaaybe pile-driving)
4. Straight up cheating.

Now 3. is something any fighter can get down pat. The difficulty then is 1. 2. and 4.

1. Outside objects are not things Pokemon usually summon and it may look slightly strange. I see this working if he reaches into the background to pretend he's secretly smuggling something in?

2. Heels talk and they talk a lot to make people mad. In any game you'd probably just give him a mic where he trash talks you infinitely ala Bayonetta but pokemon can't talk, so he'd need to convey the insults through body language alone and has to do it often. I like Opossum 's idea of being rewarded for how much you taunt.

And for 4. "Cheating" is reaaaally hard to define in a non-wrestling situation where the opponent can just have guns straight up. The only thing I can think of that could show this personality trait off is something like having an indepth moveset when he's lying down pretending to be knocked down.

I mean, wouldn't Sand Attack quite literally be a heel move in this case?



A shame people get so up in arms about certain gestures. Giving him the "Up yours" arm gesture where you lift one forearm up and place your arm on your elbow would be fitting.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I don't have photoshop apparently but here's mine.

Hard Lock: Ken
Most Wanted First Party: Medusa
Most Wanted Third Party: Banjo-Kazooie
Will Get Their Chance Another Day: N/A
Most Wanted Boss: General Scales w/ King RedEye
Most Wanted Assist: N/A
Most Wanted Pokeball Pokemon: N/A
Most Wanted Stage: Gangplank Galleon

 

[Deleted member]

For heel wrestling, there's several boxes that you've gotta check off.

1. Outside objects
2. Taunting the crowd
3. Dirty moves (chokeholds, scratches, dragging, stomps, and maaaaaybe pile-driving)
4. Straight up cheating.

Now 3. is something any fighter can get down pat. The difficulty then is 1. 2. and 4.

1. Outside objects are not things Pokemon usually summon and it may look slightly strange. I see this working if he reaches into the background to pretend he's secretly smuggling something in?

2. Heels talk and they talk a lot to make people mad. In any game you'd probably just give him a mic where he trash talks you infinitely ala Bayonetta but pokemon can't talk, so he'd need to convey the insults through body language alone and has to do it often. I like Opossum 's idea of being rewarded for how much you taunt.

And for 4. "Cheating" is reaaaally hard to define in a non-wrestling situation where the opponent can just have guns straight up. The only thing I can think of that could show this personality trait off is something like having an indepth moveset when he's lying down pretending to be knocked down.

Or scratch all of that and go the Roman Reigns route.

 

[CosmicQuark]

I agree with the point of all the content, but this game really hasn't had a different development cycle compared to Smash 4 and Brawl. They were both developed in the 2.5 - 3 year time frame like Ultimate has been.

I do think Sakurai approached newcomers differently for sure with Ultimate. With so few slots (And look we can argue about slots all people want to, but the point is he could only make so many unique within the time frame for Ultimate), I'm sure he decided against some traditions. One of the reasons I don't think Incineroar is guaranteed to happen quite yet. I do agree, if they play up the heel angle of Incineroar, I'll stick think him one of the lamer announcements to end on, but I'd actually quite enjoy him as a character. If he's generic fire/fighting type with no flavor... Why did Sakurai bother?

Agreed. With a limited roster, every spot in the roster is precious, and makes it more important to not go to "waste". Had this been a typical roster, I'd have no problem with a Pokemon for the sake of a Pokemon, or an off-the-wall character I'll never play, or a popular character for the sake of being popular (while unoriginal), because there'd still be around 14 more unique characters to be revealed. And while I wouldn't change the philosophy of the game at all--this should be the Ultimate Smash game with everyone here--this may also be the first time in a Smash game where I had never played a game with a unique newcomer. Brawl had Sonic, 4 had Megaman and Pacman--those appealed to me, in addition to Nintendo favorites like Pokemon Trainer and Bowser Jr. The only characters I'm personally excited for have been the ones returning. Of course, Sakurai's not making the game for me, he's making a game for as many people as possible. But the disadvantage with a limited roster is, at least in terms of *new* stuff, it may not be as appealing to some as it is to others. Dems the breaks.

 

[ZephyrZ]

If Pokemon base stats actually dictated how they were in Smash, Pikachu would be near bottom tier in every single game.

Oh right, I completely misread that.

Yeah, no just because Bamco are working on it doesn't mean they're going to give Incineroar King's moves because they're both wrestlers.

King's an entirely different character from an entirely different type who's built on his throws and the grab-routes his grabs give him, which if not dodged, can be OHKOs, whereas in Smash, that wouldn't translate so well. He might have lip-service in the form of some throw animations, and maybe a body-splat but I can't see a system like that working for Incineroar.



Stats, shmats. Pikachu's awful in Competitive Pokemon in all his incarnations, but is always top tier, if not the best character outright.

Plus, being low-tier never stopped a character from being fun. Just look at Ganondorf.

But Pikachu's properties do reflect his stats. Low attack, low defense, and very high speed for a base form.

I'm not saying "Incineroar will be bad because he's bad in competive Pokemon singles", I'm saying "Incineroar will probably be slow because Incineroar is canonically slow".

That said, Squirtle isn't exactly a speedster in his home game so its not like they haven't taken creative liberties before, but still.

I actually don't think Ganon is fun at all in 1vs1s, just in free-for-alls.

 

[Arymle Roseanne]

I decided to participate.

 

[Idon]

Or scratch all of that and go the Roman Reigns route.

**** it. Just make him triple H and give him a goddamm sledgehammer.

And multiple backup incineroars
And change the announcer to another incineroar.

 

[Deleted member]

**** it. Just make him triple H and give him a goddamm sledgehammer.

And multiple backup incineroars
And change the announcer to another incineroar.

Now you've just made the one way this thread and the community will like Incineroar. The thought of him breaking into peoples houses is something I now want.

 

[SirCamp]

If Pokemon base stats actually dictated how they were in Smash, Pikachu would be near bottom tier in every single game.

maybe smash Pikachu swallowed a lightball

But for real forget Pikachu, what about Pichu? lol

 

[Shroob]

I think that's what made me fall in love with the idea of Incineroar more than anything else.

Not Vergeben or some cardboard box.


We'd have a straight up wrestleMANIAC, BRUTHUR, being in Smash, and I hope to god if he's in that Sakurai dials the camp level of wrestling up to 11.

 

[Deoxys911]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

Yeah, I'm sure it's only because of the focus on explicitly giving the fans what they want this time around. I expect the next game to follow more in line with past Smash games, with lots of new characters and stages in exchange for some cut characters and stages. Honestly, as much as I'm excited for this game and am unsure if it can ever be topped by later entries in the series, I have to admit that I am already looking forward to the next game's pre-release hype cycle just so we can all enjoy the sense of limitless possibilities that we largely enjoyed before the release of the past few games, not having to worry so much about not expecting too many newcomers or the new fighter picks largely being confined to exciting fan favorites. I hope that when that day comes we can all get back together and have a great time speculating and anticipating once again.