Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Idon]

Now you've just made the one way this thread and the community will like Incineroar. The thought of him breaking into peoples houses is something I now want.

Woah, you can't just leak Incineroar's announcement trailer like that.

 

[Jetsurge]

If Pokemon base stats actually dictated how they were in Smash, Pikachu would be near bottom tier in every single game.

And Mewtwo would be the heaviest Pokemon in the game not the 2nd lightest.

 

[Nekoo]

Re: Cloud inclusion

Now that's revisionism lvl 100
Cloud has always been requested, in general he was seen as the "Goku" of smash as a literall Never Ever and that if someone gets in, Geno would be in.
But saying that he wasn't asked is just straight up lying all the way back then, most people did their speculation/wishlist in website outside of Smash board in other games forum, GameFaqs , Neogaf, YouTube comment, and IGN. I can godamn bet you that once Snake was announced Sonic/Megaman/Cloud Were the big 100% third parties pick with Sora getting a cult following big enough to get Mentioned by IGN in their brawl newcomers poll as their honorable mention.

I bet we will soon say that Ridley was an obvious pick with K.Rool and that Simon had no following and isn't deserving his spot and got in only thanks to Snake.

 

[Jetsurge]

In retrospect, I'm a tad surprised that Ultimate isn't giving us a retro surprise character of some sort (I assume, at least).

It's something that Sakurai always did in the past.

I'm okay with it, but I'm a little bummed.

I actually thought of some cool reboot ideas for Sheriff and got excited over the possibilities.

There still could be but people don't want to think about it because of the limited amount of newcomers.

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

Yeah, I'm sure it's only because of the focus on explicitly giving the fans what they want this time around. I expect the next game to follow more in line with past Smash games, with lots of new characters and stages in exchange for some cut characters and stages. Honestly, as much as I'm excited for this game and am unsure if it can ever be topped by later entries in the series, I have to admit that I am already looking forward to the next game's pre-release hype cycle just so we can all enjoy the sense of limitless possibilities that we largely enjoyed before the release of the past few games, not having to worry so much about not expecting too many newcomers or the new fighter picks largely being confined to exciting fan favorites. I hope that when that day comes we can all get back together and have a great time speculating and anticipating once again.

I think those good times exist for about a week or two after each new Smash game is announced, and then the infighting between the different fandoms start, the gematsu leaks and the vergebens spawn a cult of followers who go around shouting down everyone else's opinions and hopes, and after a few months the community's opinion on who is a "safe, acceptable pick" to talk about congeals and god help you if you go against the majority.

Sorry, I made myself sad.

 

[Shroob]

I honestly think Senjou calling the Switch upgrade a few weeks in advance is a bit of a scary bump in the possibility of Steve? being in, especially if the reveal in October isn't the final Smash Direct.


Drop Incineroar+Ken next week, and then end ridiculously strong with Steve and the Square rep in November.


Kills every theory outright while having 'surprise yet powerhouse' final reveals.

It's kind of a win-win.

 

[Jetsurge]

I bet we will soon say that Ridley was an obvious pick with K.Rool and that Simon had no following and isn't deserving his spot and got in only thanks to Snake.

Simon got in because Sakurai loves Castlevania

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

Simon got in because Sakurai loves Castlevania

Simon got in because lots of people including Sakurai love Castlevania and it is a massively influential franchise with long ties to Nintendo.

I do think Sakurai lets his biases show through occasionally (Dark Pit, lol), but Simon didn't seem like a case of that to me personally. One thing he does seem fairly biased against is characters that were developed in the West. Are Diddy, Dark Samus and K. Rool the only characters who didn't originate in Japan to make it into the roster so far?

I'm asking because I wish Eternal Darkness would get some kind of nod, even if it's just a music track or an Assist Trophy...

 

[Nekoo]

Simon got in because Sakurai loves Castlevania

I don't know if you did it on purpose or if you Genuinely missed the point of that part in the post and took the bait.

 

[Impa4Smash]

I honestly think Senjou calling the Switch upgrade a few weeks in advance is a bit of a scary bump in the possibility of Steve? being in, especially if the reveal in October isn't the final Smash Direct.


Drop Incineroar+Ken next week, and then end ridiculously strong with Steve and the Square rep in November.


Kills every theory outright while having 'surprise yet powerhouse' final reveals.

It's kind of a win-win.

This seems pretty likely to me. Maybe 2 more echoes along with SE Rep and Steve and we got a nice 80 characters for base

 

[Makai Wars]

and god help you if you go against the majority.

Haha
Ahahahaha
God I know that feel.

 

[osby]

By the way, this "Senjou" guy everybody keeps talking about... Is his user name "Hitagi Senjougahara"?

 

[Shroob]

By the way, this "Senjou" guy everybody keeps talking about... Is his user name "Hitagi Senjougahara"?

Yes. Verg backs them up as a 'credible' leaker, surprisingly.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Yes. Verg backs them up as a 'credible' leaker, surprisingly.

What did they leak?

Edit: Nvm. It’s the Gran Blue/Minecraft one

 

[Nekoo]

By the way, this "Senjou" guy everybody keeps talking about... Is his user name "Hitagi Senjougahara"?

Yes chef~
That's him who believe that Minecraft will get a rep.
First one to say that Square-Enix are protecting their rep like crazy before Vergeben explain.
That there talk about a Grand Blue rep
And that DLC might be guest Characters

 

[Shroob]

What did they leak?

Everything Verg did + Steve, and a lot of other **** related to other fighting games, which has come true.

 

[Jetsurge]

Everything Verg did + Steve, and a lot of other **** related to other fighting games, which has come true.

If the Gran blue thing is real the backlash will be even worse than Corrin.

 

[Impa4Smash]

I do wonder if we’re looking at Gran and Djeeta for base roster? Would they work like Robin/Corrin?

Spoiler

 

[osby]

If the Gran blue thing is real the backlash will be even worse than Corrin.

Probably, but the real question is why?

 

[Deoxys911]

If the Granbull thing is real the backlash will be even worse than Corrin.

Definitely, we have enough Fairy-types in the game as it is.

 

[Shroob]

If the Gran blue thing is real the backlash will be even worse than Corrin.

Maybe in America, Japan is obsessed with that game.


I don't think it's really 'fair' to look at picks from only one side, to be brutally honest. A Granblue character isn't my first choice as dlc of ****ing course, but hey, it's advertisement.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Probably, but the real question is why?

Entitlement.

 

[Shroob]

I do wonder if we’re looking at Gran and Djeeta for base roster? Would they work like Robin/Corrin?

Spoiler

View attachment 168066

Senjou said Katalina.

"HOW" they know that is beyond me, but at the same time, they seem to know quite a bit about cygames-related projects, which leads me to believe that they may have a source within cygames.


If they're fully trustworthy, that is.


I'm not sold 100%.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Senjou said Katalina.

"HOW" they know that is beyond me, but at the same time, they seem to know quite a bit about cygames-related projects, which leads me to believe that they may have a source within cygames.


If they're fully trustworthy, that is.


I'm not sold 100%.

Huh interesting. I mean no clue who it is but good for fans of the game.

Odd that a mobile game would get characters in but if Nintendo owns some of it (?) I guess it makes sense for promoting it

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

You know, I really thought Bayonetta was the moment when Smash jumped the shark and started letting literally anyone in, but if we get a Granblue character we may as well start campaigning for Shrek and Reggie Fils-aime unironically.

 

[Shroob]

I think Senjou's biggest credibility boost will be if Steve? gets shown off either next week or whenever the last Smash Direct is.


If Steve? is in.... brace yourself, gacha is coming.

 

[Impa4Smash]

You know, I really thought Bayonetta was the moment when Smash jumped the shark and started letting literally anyone in, but if we get a Granblue character we may as well start campaigning for Shrek and Reggie Fils-aime unironically.

Shrek and Reggie didn’t originate from a video game. A Granblue character did.

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

Guess we better brace ourselves for Kratos and Master Chief then.

 

[Shroob]

You know, I really thought Bayonetta was the moment when Smash jumped the shark and started letting literally anyone in, but if we get a Granblue character we may as well start campaigning for Shrek and Reggie Fils-aime unironically.

The difference here is Nintendo more or less salvaged Bayonetta from the dumpster, and they personally own a chunk of Cygame's stocks.


I think a Granblue character in Smash is frankly outlandish, but it's literally a win win for both Nintendo and them.


Gives the series exposure in the west via arguably the biggest crossover videogame in history, while both Cygames and Nintendo rake in the profits.

 

[osby]

Senjou said Katalina.

"HOW" they know that is beyond me, but at the same time, they seem to know quite a bit about cygames-related projects, which leads me to believe that they may have a source within cygames.


If they're fully trustworthy, that is.


I'm not sold 100%.

I guess she has a cool design. I don't know enough about Granblue to say how she'd fight, however.

I don't expect a character originated from a mobile game too much either, but I'd prefer to keep an open mind if it's true.

 

[Impa4Smash]

Guess we better brace ourselves for Kratos and Master Chief then.

Kratos is unlikely because Sony. But Microsoft and Nintendo are more buddy-buddy so maybe Master Chief will join Steve and Banjo

 

[Sharkarat]

the gematsu leaks and the vergebens spawn a cult of followers who go around shouting down everyone else's opinions and hopes

Oh boy. I'm just gonna say, the "spesific characters are in" type leaks like those two have little to do with shouting down opinions, that happens anyway.

 

[Shroob]

I guess she has a cool design. I don't know enough about Granblue to say how she'd fight, however.

I don't expect a character originated from a mobile game too much either, but I'd prefer to keep an open mind if it's true.

As someone who knows the game inside and out, think Jin Kisaragi from Blazblue if you're familiar with the series.


Swords-woman with ice powers that can summon blades of frost, while also acting as a more defensive character with heals and preventing debuffs.

 

[Dukemon]

I do not expect a Smash Direct for this month. More likley the fighter of the month reveal will be part of another Direct with a game that is related to Smash. They have to show something in November, too.

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

The difference here is Nintendo more or less salvaged Bayonetta from the dumpster, and they personally own a chunk of Cygame's stocks.


I think a Granblue character in Smash is frankly outlandish, but it's literally a win win for both Nintendo and them.


Gives the series exposure in the west via arguably the biggest crossover videogame in history, while both Cygames and Nintendo rake in the profits.

Yeah I mean I have no doubt that Cygames would be thrilled at having a character of theirs in Smash, but how does Nintendo possibly justify that?

I’m an Isaac supporter and I have been since before Brawl, so I have a lot of patience for unorthodox picks and I hate dismissing anything out of hand. I even see the logic behind Steve, who is part of one of the undeniably largest franchises in the world. But Granblue is a bridge too far for me. I’ll continue believing it’s 100% impossible until it happens and then all I’ll be able to do is shake my head. At the very least I hope Isaac and Banjo are in by that point.

 

[Impa4Smash]

As someone who knows the game inside and out, think Jin Kisaragi from Blazblue if you're familiar with the series.


Swords-woman with ice powers that can summon blades of frost, while also acting as a more defensive character with heals and preventing debuffs.

Okay a swordswoman with ice powers sounds dope as hell. I’m all in. Bring on Katherine

 

[FirestormNeos]

I did a wishlist meme.

Here's a game:

You Are Sakurai Bias!

Pick 1 Smash Franchise (hell, it can be one that isn't in SSB yet if you want) and say how you would shamelessly cater to your own bias in Smash with content

Spoiler: Mario Bias (aka Why Contain It?)

• Peach, Daisy and Rosalina receive their Mario Kart outfits as an alt. costume.
• Newcomer: King Boo
• Newcomer: Chain Chomp
• Newcomer: Pauline
• Newcomer: Vivian (Paper Mario)
• Newcomer or Semiclone Newcomer (Hybrid of Bowser's & Peach's Movesets): Bowsette
• Added Stages: Bowser's Castle, Comet Observatory

Spoiler: Zelda Bias (aka The Hyrule Warriors Happy Funtime Hour)

• Every palette swap of Link and Zelda is an alt skin from a different game. Link's default is his BOTW incarnation, and Zelda's default is her ALBW/ALTTP incarnation. Both have at least their OOT, TP, BOTW, HW, and Skyward Sword outfits.
• Young Link and Toon Link are made into Echo Fighters of eachother.
• Ganondorf gets his Twilight Princess version back as an alternate costume, as well his Hyrule Warriors look.
• Newcomer, Semiclone Newcomer or Echo Fighter (Link): Linkle
• Newcomer: Midna
• Newcomer: Cia (with Lana echo)
• Added Stage: Palace of Twilight

Spoiler: Pokemon Bias (aka going mad with starters!)

• Pokemon Trainer's Squirtle and Ivysaur are replaced with Blastoise and Venusaur.
• Newcomer: Gen 2 Trainer (uses Meganium, Typhlosion, Feraligatr)
• Newcomer: Tyranitar
• Newcomer: Gen 3 Trainer (uses Sceptile, Blaziken, Swampert)
• Newcomer: Gardevoir (with Gothitelle Echo Fighter)
• Newcomer: Gen 4 Trainer (uses Torterra, Infernape, Empoleon)
• Newcomer: Gen 5 Trainer (uses Serperior, Emboar, Samurott)
• Newcomer: Bisharp
• Newcomer: Lilligant
• Newcomer: Gen 6 Trainer (uses Chesnaught, Delphox, Greninja)
• Newcomer: Gen 7 Trainer (uses Decidueye, Incineroar, Primarina)
• Added Stages: Mt. Silver Summit, Cave of Origin, Sinnoh Champion Room, Distortion World, N's Throne Room

Spoiler: Pokemon Bias (aka "or alternatively, find the starter pokemon and pull their ****ing spot on the roster out. yeah, you get the bad ending, but **** it, I got places to be")

• Pichu is removed from the playable roster, but there's a seperate mode where you can pet the adorable little baby electric mouse
• Pokemon Trainer and Greninja are removed
• Newcomer: Tyranitar
• Newcomer: Gardevoir (with Gothitelle Echo Fighter)
• Newcomer: Bisharp
• Newcomer: Lilligant
• Added Stages: Mt. Silver Summit, Cave of Origin, Sinnoh Champion Room, Distortion World, N's Throne Room, Kalos Power Plant, Team Flare HQ Core

Spoiler: Kirby Bias (aka Sakurai stops giving a crap)

• When Kirby copies a character, he now copies all of their specials instead of just the neutral special
• Masked Dedede is an alt. skin for King Dedede
• King Dedede comes with the option to change his voice between Sakurai and his voice actor for the 4kids show
• Meta Knight comes with the option to change his voice between whoever usually voices him and his voice actor for the 4kids show
• Newcomer: Waddle Dee (fights with Spear, Bow, Parasol, etc.), who is Smash Ultimate's answer to Melee Fox, Brawl Meta Knight and Smash 4 Bayonetta-- no **** that, they're more OP then all three of those combined.
• Newcomer: Ribbon
• Newcomer: Adeline
• Newcomer: Marx
• Newcomer: Suzie
• If there is a story mode, Zero Two or Zero Three is the main villain

Spoiler: Fire Emblem Bias (aka the weeb takeover we've all been waiting for)

• Lucina, Roy and Chrom are made into alts of Marth, but retain their unique voices, victory animations, taunts, idles, and other cosmetic stuff.
• Newcomer: Tharja
• Newcomer: Camilla
• Newcomer or Marth Alt. with unique animations: Lyndis
• Newcomer: Celica
• Newcomer: Hector
• If Ultimate has any form of Boss Rush mode, Grima is a boss you can fight.

Spoiler: Metal Gear Bias (aka so how 'bout them politics, eh?)

• Snake's Side-B is replaced with something that doesn't suck
• Snake receives more then just one taunt
• Codec Calls return, except they're with Otacon instead of Colonel and they're for every fighter (even DLC and post-brawl newcomers).
• Newcomer: Raiden
• Newcomer: Quiet
• Newcomer: EVA
• Added Stages: The lowered arena you fight Volgin in, Rex's Lair, Arsenal's Guts, that outdoor area in Denver you fight Monsoon in.
• Added Assist Trophies: Volgin, Meryl, Blade Wolf
• If Ultimate has any form of Boss Rush mode, Metal Gear REX and Metal Gear RAY are bosses that you can fight.
• An option to replace Sandbag with Huey

Spoiler: Sonic Bias (aka Sonic's Relatively Decent Friends)

• Classic, Rider and Boom Sonic as alternate costumes for Sonic
• Sonic's Side-Taunt has him say "You're Too Slow!" again
• Either Sonic's Side-B is replaced with the Boost, or his Down-B is replaced with the Drop-Dash
• Sonic receiving a metal box item turns him into the Metal Sonic from Sonic CD
• Semiclone Newcomer or Echo Fighter (Shadow): Shadow the Hedgehog
• Newcomer: Dr. Eggman
• Newcomer: E-102 Gamma
• Newcomer: E-123 Omega
• Newcomer: Rouge
• Added Stages: Circular Arena of Egg Carrier (Where you fight Chaos 6, Zero, and E-101 Beta MK2), Circular Arena of Eggmanland (Where you fight Egg Dragoon), Arena in the center of the ARK (Where you fight the Biolizard), Chemical Plant, Stardust Speedway, Ice Cap, Aquarium Park
• Added Assist Trophies: Upgraded Metal Sonic, Big the Cat
• If Ultimate has any form of Boss Rush mode, Egg Dragoon, Biolizard and E-101 Beta MK2 are all bosses you can fight.
• More then one sonic remix plz. I know you have Jun Senoue back there! Let him play Sonic music, damnit!

Spoiler: Final Fantasy Bias (aka this is me punishing myself for buying Dissidia NT)

• Cloud receives his crossdressing outfit as an alt costume.
• Newcomer: Sephiroth
• Newcomer: Tifa Lockhart
• Newcomer: Terra
• Newcomer: Vivi
• Newcomer: Lightning
• Newcomer: Noctis
• Added Stages: The Moon, as well as that room where Aerith BITES ZA DUSTO
• If Ultimate has any form of Boss Rush mode, Zeromus, Exdeath and Kefka are all bosses you can fight.
• MORE. ****ING. MUSIC.

Spoiler: Kingdom Hearts Bias (that's a lotta hoods tbh)

• Newcomer: Sora
• Newcomer: Aqua
• Newcomers: The Entire Organization XIII (with Xion as an Echo of Roxas, who is a semiclone of Sora)
• Added Stages: Destiny Island, Hollow Bastion, The World That Never Was
• Added Assist Trophies: Riku, Ansem the Wise
• If Ultimate has any form of Boss Rush mode, No Heart is one of the bosses you can fight

Spoiler: The "Smash is now officially just MUGEN except objectively better in every way" Bias

• Miis once again let you use your Miis for their faces, or alternatively, Miis are scrapped entirely and replaced with a custom character creator system that goes full SoulCalibur V in its visual customizability.
• Mage and Puppetmaster are added to the list of Mii Fighter Classes
• All Mii Classes now have specializations that alter what their neutrals, smash attacks and grabs do.
  • Mii Brawlers can choose from various melee fighting styles, including Martial Arts, Capiora, Military CQC, etc.
  • Mii Swordfighters can now choose from various weapons, including Swords, Hammers, Axes, etc.
  • Mii Gunners can now choose from various weapons, including Dual-Wielding Pistols, Machineguns, Shotguns, Sniper Rifles, etc.
  • Mii Mages choose a specialization of magic, such as Fire, Ice, Lightning, Darkness, etc.
  • Mii Puppetmasters choose from a variety of minions, such as robots, soldiers, insects, demons, etc.
• Both the Brawl and Smash 4 stage builders return and are expanded upon, as well as a third stage builder introduced on top of those two.
• All custom stages can be placed into external storage so you don't have to worry about running out of space
• All custom stages can have multiple music tracks to choose from.
• The hidden mode is actually something that lets you create your own story modes (provided you have the storage space). You first select the number of fights your story mode with have. Then you will set up the parameters of every fight (rules, stage, characters used). Then, you can create cutscenes between matches where you can type out dialogue between characters.
  • This would of course include features like having the ability to make branching pathways, forced-loss fights, the ability to choose from a limited set of characters, the ability to choose which team a certain character is on, etc.
  • There's not a screaming snowball's chance in atomic hellfire that Nintendo would ever allow such story modes to be shared through their online servers (unless they want me to flood the servers with PG-rated fluff stories of Palutena and Lucina being adorably wholesome gay wives together), but that's a small price to pay to be able to make people's edgy OC fanfics real.
• You can set it so that Stamina matches have more then one stock.

Random question - who will have their CSS with Echoes separate and who will have it with the Echoes combined?

I'll be going with them separate myself.

Separate.

Which Smash character would you like to see turn into Peach with the Super Crown?

Why not all of them?

 

[Shroob]

Yeah I mean I have no doubt that Cygames would be thrilled at having a character of theirs in Smash, but how does Nintendo possibly justify that?

I’m an Isaac supporter and I have been since before Brawl, so I have a lot of patience for unorthodox picks and I hate dismissing anything out of hand. I even see the logic behind Steve, who is part of one of the undeniably largest franchises in the world. But Granblue is a bridge too far for me. I’ll continue believing it’s 100% impossible until it happens and then all I’ll be able to do is shake my head. At the very least I hope Isaac and Banjo are in by that point.

Granblue is massive in Japan, and Nintendo has nothing to lose and everything to gain with a character in.


You want a reason?


Money.

 

[Isaac for Smash Pls]

Oh boy. I'm just gonna say, the "spesific characters are in" type leaks like those two have little to do with shouting down opinions, that happens anyway.

People definitely use those theories as a bludgeon though. You have no idea how many times I’ve been told “Isaac can’t be in because Verge said only Incineroar and Ken and squeenix are left” when what they actually mean is “I don’t want Isaac in the game because I don’t care about Golden Sun.” At least I’d respect their honesty for the latter opinion. Verge is plenty fallible.

 

[osby]

Okay a swordswoman with ice powers sounds dope as hell. I’m all in. Bring on Katherine

Wasn't her name Katalina? (I want to make a Catherine joke)