Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[DeltaSceptile]

I've been thinking about the "don't expect too many new challengers" line alot. I have a thought, but I don't know how correct it is. What if Sakurai meant to not expect too many newcomers in comparison to the other games?

Brawl got 18

Smash 4 got 17 (21 counting DLC)

So far for Ultimate, we have 9 counting echos. Not counting echos, we have 5.

If we got 13, 14, or 15 newcomers total, it'd not be as many as Smash 4 or Brawl. I don't know how much sense it makes, but it's something to consider

Take 16-5, then subtract 7 from that(counting for the returning cut veterans) and we easily would have at least 4 slots left for unique newcomers.

 

[Luigi The President]

Well, it can't be Ken because Ken's place is accounted for on the box. We're assuming DLC won't be on the box. So yes, technically the final slot could be Incineroar or it could be SE character. The point is that with the knowledge (strong assumption) of DLC, it allows for Verge's leak to fit with box theory, regardless of which character is actually relegated to it (besides Ken).

Perhaps, but that's not the issue I have; my issue is when people say it's the SE character just because we know-as we basically always have assumed-DLC is coming. Feels sketchy to me.

 

[LetterO]

I...thought that was what he meant the whole time?

To me it seemed like alot people thought he meant in general, so I decided to make this theory which is more optimistic than the others we've been discussing.

Take 16-5, then subtract 7 from that(counting for the returning cut veterans) and we easily would have at least 4 slots left for unique newcomers.

I hope so.

 

[Deleted member]

You already know my opinion on cutting all the FE characters, including three totally unique movesets, except for Marth and some unnamed guy.

Well, I was planning for the "unnamed guy" to be either ,:ultrobin, or , since those are popular FE Smash characters.

 

[Kuon]

So, because I'm bored, I though'd I'd list some Smash opinions of mine. Out of these four, tell me which of them is the "craziest" to you.

#1: I like Brawl as game more then Melee
#2: I prefer the 3DS version of Smash 4 than the Wii U version
#3: If I had the ability, I would cut the Pokemon roster in half, and cut all Fire Emblem characters aside from only and one other FE character.
#4: Indies are wouldn't be very exciting additions to Smash.

1. I agree 100%. Melee was my least favorite
2. I like Wii U better because it has stage builder
3. I think this one is pretty crazy. I don't think any characters should ever be cut, ever. And I'm fine with lots of Pokémon and FE characters.
4. I partly agree. I really want Shantae, but don't want Sans and never wanted SK. But that's kind of an unfair opinion to have.

For my opinions:
1. Stage builder is quite possibly my favorite thing to be included in Smash
2. Brawl and Smash 4 are tied for my favorite, but I also like 64 a lot.
3. I think the biggest letdown for Ultimate would be if there was no stage builder/custom stages option. Hopefully it'll be a combination between Brawl's and Smash 4's, with some new stuff added.
4. Sora makes me cringe and I hope neither he nor Kingdom Hearts are ever in Smash (sorry if this offends anyone).
5. We don't have enough villains or female characters in Smash.

 

[Troykv]

Well, I was planning for the "unnamed guy" to be either ,:ultrobin, or , since those are popular FE Smash characters.

Oh hey; I arrived too late for another FE Discussion xD

 

[Opossum]

I hate boxes, i hate speculation.
Post Nintendo-only characters that you'd like to see in Smash

I've said Celica and Decidueye too often, so...

WINDS, HEED ME!

 

[SmashChu]

Mow how is the css going to look with 63-78 characters. Are talking about 1 more unique newcomer or 3-5.

We are not to expect to many. And give me what the css will look like with these extra chacters in order hy number.

It needs to look good and make sense.

Check my sig for box theory post. 1 more unique character makes the most sense.

And you have to be naive of you think the marketing division has no idea what is going on.

First, I don't need to give you anything.

Second, the point is this is promotional stuff and does change. All this mock-up was suppose to do was show what the product generally looks like. I'm sure it will follow a similar design but to think it is THE final design just with some black boxes is silly. Its more likely the guy designed it off what was available (same as we have) and made that.

 

[Zinith]

Oh, the title was reverted back...

R.I.P. Pineapple

 

[Iridium]

I see. They called it Royal Guard and I just assumed Hyrule Warriors.

Which immediately made suspicious they might have actually used Hyrule Warriors Impa after all if she got in somehow.

I mean, that's actually what it's called. It resembles this:

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, that's actually what it's called. It resembles this:

Hello, where was this outfit in the game? I've never seen that before.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Oh, the title was reverted back...

R.I.P. Pineapple

tbh I’m allergic to pineapple so nothing of value was lost

 

[Pyra]

Hello, where was this outfit in the game? I've never seen that before.

It's a DLC costume.


I have a lot of free time right now oops

 

[staindgrey]

I've been thinking about the "don't expect too many new challengers" line alot. I have a thought, but I don't know how correct it is. What if Sakurai meant to not expect too many newcomers in comparison to the other games?

Brawl got 18

Smash 4 got 17 (21 counting DLC)

So far for Ultimate, we have 9 counting echos. Not counting echos, we have 5.

If we got 13, 14, or 15 newcomers total, it'd not be as many as Smash 4 or Brawl. I don't know how much sense it makes, but it's something to consider

Expecting 13, 14 or 15 newcomers is discrediting the amount of work that goes into returning veterans. Those are essentially the same amount of work as newcomers, since their properties, 3D models, textures, etc. can't just be copied and pasted from Melee/Brawl.

If you count up the returning vets, you have seven of them () in addition to the newcomers ( and Isabelle) and echoes (). Even if we only get one more newcomer and one more echo, as has been hypothesized, that still leaves us with 13 new characters made and five echoes. Smash 4, which had a nearly identical development schedule, had 15 newcomers and two echoes. So it almost lines up.

 

[Iridium]

Hello, where was this outfit in the game? I've never seen that before.

It's actually concept art that you see there.

Seriously though. If you look it up, you should see it.

 

[Zinith]

Apparently Cyndane is paying attention to me

 

[Will]

popular

Mmmmm I don't know about that one, chief. Everyone has their favorites but I wouldn't put it at a top favorite.
I wouldn't put Fates near any favorite

 

[staindgrey]

Well, I was planning for the "unnamed guy" to be either ,:ultrobin, or , since those are popular FE Smash characters.

I'm still not a fan of removing a unique moveset all for the sake of perceived over-representation.

I won't argue against anyone for wanting to remove Lucina and Chrom, and I'd understand wanting to remove Roy at least. But I don't see what the roster possibly has to gain from cutting entirely unique movesets already established.

Also, yesterday your unnamed guy was Hector.

 

[monadoboy]

DLC is the biggest epidemic in the gaming industry.

With how incredibly amazing DLC was for both Breath of the Wild and Xenoblade 2 I have to disagree.

That and Smash 4's amazing DLC, although it could've been handled better (can't say I was happy with buying characters twice).

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I hate boxes, i hate speculation.
Post Nintendo-only characters that you'd like to see in Smash

If you haven't seen this coming, then you clearly don't know me enough.

And now for something completely different!

What is everyone's hopes for what Spirits mode could be?

For me, I would love a Subspace-esqe adventure mode. 2 player Co-Op would still be a thing with the introduction of 4 player Co-Op...That would be neat.

Pretty much that, but I'm not so concerned about co-op.

 

[Deleted member]

Mmmmm I don't know about that one, chief. Everyone has their favorites but I wouldn't put it at a top favorite.
I wouldn't put Fates near any favorite

I understand. I don't particularly have a very high opinion of the 3DS Fire Emblem entries either. I was referring to how was in Smash. AKA The only good thing he and :ultrobin are in.

staindgrey Hector's a pretty popular and belvoed FE lord, right?

 

[drag0nscythe]

First, I don't need to give you anything.

Second, the point is this is promotional stuff and does change. All this mock-up was suppose to do was show what the product generally looks like. I'm sure it will follow a similar design but to think it is THE final design just with some black boxes is silly. Its more likely the guy designed it off what was available (same as we have) and made that.

1. You point is usless if you have nothing to back it up.
2. Point is that marketing is not sitting there clueless with no idea what is going on. They have more information than you think and it is naive to think otherwise. Marketing is part of the entire process and not some island. And give me proof of the boxes changing dramatically after release. Otherwise, it is smoke and mirrors.

 

[Aurane]

Leon Powalski is the only Star Fox newcomer we need and I cannot be convinced otherwise.

 

[Iridium]

Luigi The President Did you look up the outfit? It's seriously real, I promise...

@Alastor017?

 

[Nekoo]

Oh boy, I come back to a lot of things- Especially the Blog/Music theory. Now that's a nice one!
I believe the Music theory is true, especially if we take the Blog Update delay in count. Which mean beside echoes (Like Ken if Vergeben is real) it doesn't leave a lot of series with possible newcomers. Very interesting. If Vergeben is right, it might lead to Incineroar and might Kill/Decrease the chance of some newcomers (Like Bandana Dee/Geno/Skull Kids)


Now then, if I may take a stance on the whole Square-Rep being DLC or not:
Let's be real. The game industry and Nintendo's vision changed ever since the last game. And I'm absolutely sure that there is a tiny team already thinking of the "after release" of Ultimate. Yes. Not everyone is 100% On polishing and such, maybe 98% but those 2% are probably still planning the future.

Now then, nothing say that the Square Enix Rep won't be in the base game of course, it might, and probably WILL happens, however, lemme put this scenario down for you.
-Sakurai make game document back in 2015
-Go back to get licence for veterant/Newcomers/Music and such.
-Sakurai asks to Square for that newcomers alongside renewing Cloud's Licence.
-Square are absolute ass and say no, accept for Cloud without new music
- INSERT TWO/THREE YEARS OF DEVELOPMENT

Now two possibilities are here first one:

-Square get back from their decision mid-way through the development, or very near the end.
-Accept to lend that characters only if they get a cut in sales
-Block Sakurai from Base game, but Sakurai really want to put that characters in so it becomes first DLC
-Team start working on that characters knowing it will be DLC alongside the polishing and stuff
-Both Nintendo and Square win more money because of DLC sales.

Second possibilities:
-Square backtrack and say yes for the characters BUT too late
-Sakurai really want that characters in, but he can't delay the game. Nintendo Excec say it must be NOW, no Delay. Big marketing campain for 2018.
-Oh well, Sakurai have to make it DLC
-Nintendo and Square are Happy, more moeny thanks to DLC sales.


This might sounds cruel, and disgusting, but as someone just doing some low-class scum job stage who roamed in two game studio and one being Ubisoft I can say, DLC are sometime though about, or planned ESPECIALLY during that polishing stage of the development.
BUT like I said, the fact that the Square REP might be base-game STILL EXIST and will probably happens, just want to bust the bubble of people thinking DLC aren't in planning stage, or aren't already being made by a small team.

Anyway, My takes on who it might be?
-Dragon Quest Protagonist ( the one witht the best chance tbh. I think it might be Eldrick or Eight. I wish for Eight tbh by pure Nostalgia google)
-Geno (The music theory hurt his chance a biiit. But there a chance that he might get his own Icons? Maybe not? However, I'm 100% sure the second Mario Icon in the music is Mario Kart...Not just for Spin-off, it has been the same since Brawl.)
-Sora (Yes, It's a Disney Characters, but since we had to wait until freaking March of this year to get the OFFICIAL confirmation about it removing all doubt, and the game still having tons of square Influence, it wouldn't be far-eached for someone to still put him in the Square Case, since well...The game are made by Square)
-Another FF rep? The music count being a fake out? (I don't believe this at all. I think Cloud is all we get.)

 

[praline]

Mmmmm I don't know about that one, chief. Everyone has their favorites but I wouldn't put it at a top favorite.
I wouldn't put Fates near any favorite

It’s pretty wild to make a character that weilds a chainsaw sword and can turn into a dragon, and yet they’re still super lame.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Leon Powalski is the only Star Fox newcomer we need and I cannot be convinced otherwise.

That's a funny way of saying Slippy Toad.

 

[Luigi The President]

Luigi The President Did you look up the outfit? It's seriously real, I promise...

I'm not the one you need to convince lol

 

[Opossum]

It's always baffling to me that so many people want Chrom cut when he and Marth were literally the only two Fire Emblem characters added due to high popularity (Marth scored well on the Melee Poll, and Chrom on the ballot). Roy and Corrin were promotional additions, Ike and Robin were added due to being recent main characters, and Lucina was added due to being an easy promotion from an alternate costume swap.

 

[Troykv]

I hate boxes, i hate speculation.
Post Nintendo-only characters that you'd like to see in Smash

Okay then!

Micaiah!

 

[JustCallMeJon]

This leaker from 4chan leaked a good chunk of characters that will make it into Smash.

New Echoes:

• Shadow
• Octolings
• Dixie
• Ken

Newcomers:

• Geno
• Incineroar
• Rayman
• Chorus Kids
• Skull Kid
• Stanley (Stanley the Bugman)
  

Although his list may look fake (especially when Sakurai CLEARLY states that there were FEW characters making it into Smash), the one thing that REALLY caught my eye is that this leaker actually have FOOTAGE for the said revealed characters and that he will release the footage either Tomorrow or Friday.

Right now, the leaker may have doing this to grab attention but stating that he has VIDEO is really a stretch..

Who knows? He may lie or actually spoil the characters in multiple footages.

If I am late at the news...I'm sorry.

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/432174058

 

[Knight Dude]

I hate boxes, i hate speculation.
Post Nintendo-only characters that you'd like to see in Smash

You already know.

I'm ready to throw rocks at people already.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I hate boxes, i hate speculation.
Post Nintendo-only characters that you'd like to see in Smash

This should be pretty obvious but:

 

[Guybrush20X6]

So, because I'm bored, I though'd I'd list some Smash opinions of mine. Out of these four, tell me which of them is the "craziest" to you.

#1: I like Brawl as game more then Melee
#2: I prefer the 3DS version of Smash 4 than the Wii U version
#3: If I had the ability, I would cut the Pokemon roster in half, and cut all Fire Emblem characters aside from only and one other FE character.
#4: Indies are wouldn't be very exciting additions to Smash.

4
Definitely 4

 

[Kuon]

I think it's crazy how some people that I know refuse to play Smash if items are on and if it's not an omega stage. Are most people in the Smash community like this?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

This leaker from 4chan leaked a good chunk of characters that will make it into Smash.

New Echoes:

• Shadow
• Octolings
• Dixie
• Ken

Newcomers:

• Geno
• Incineroar
• Rayman
• Chorus Kids
• Skull Kid
• Stanley (Stanley the Bugman)

Although his list may look fake (especially when Sakurai CLEARLY states that there were FEW characters making it into Smash), the one thing that REALLY caught my eye is that this leaker actually have FOOTAGE for the said revealed characters and that he will release the footage either Tomorrow or Friday.

Right now, the leaker may have doing this to grab attention but stating that he has VIDEO is really a stretch..

Who knows? He may lie or actually spoil the characters in multiple footages.

If I am late at the news...I'm sorry.

Link: http://boards.4chan.org/v/thread/432174058

Octolings are more likely to be DLC, and Stanley? First thing I thought was “Who”?

I kinda wanna call fake

 

[drag0nscythe]

4
Definitely 4

Are you a mighty pirate? Is you main k rool?

 

[Deleted member]

4
Definitely 4

Well, what can I say? The Shovel Knight man's not hot. (That's a song reference I think.)

 

[Luigi The President]

Octolings are more likely to be DLC, and Stanley? First thing I thought was “Who”?

I kinda wanna call fake

You also would've said that at Game & Watch and R.O.B and Ice Climbers, I'm sure.

Let's not dismiss a leak due to the presence of a retro rep who is a bit of a WTF.

Let's dismiss it due to Octolings and being absolutely fake.

 

[Idon]

It's always baffling to me that so many people want Chrom cut when he and Marth were literally the only two Fire Emblem characters added due to high popularity (Marth scored well on the Melee Poll, and Chrom on the ballot). Roy and Corrin were promotional additions, Ike and Robin were added due to being recent main characters, and Lucina was added due to being an easy promotion from an alternate costume swap.

Yeah, we should cut Roy instead!
Add in a REAL character like Zephiel.