Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Over9000BPM]

So what's the new game now? Throwing out ideas for the 5 stages?

1. Minecraft (Would be cool if it worked like SMM and randomized each time)
2. Rhythm Heaven (Works like Wario Ware and goes into minigames)
3. Gangplank Galleon (or something else DK)
4. Monster Hunter (shown as a boss stage in the Direct)
5. Skyrim (With playable Dovahkiin. Shut up, I can put one dream on)

I heard the new game was just trying not to lose our goddamn minds. Some are playing better than others.

 

[MrPowerfulJeans]

Is it true the Smash Switch bundle is $999.99?

What are you bundling it with? The license to Super Mario?

 

[Diddy Kong]

I got a game for you all, think of a newcomer that can fit into both the hardcore and casual categories.

Impa
Dixie Kong

And I wanna say Isaac, but probably not.

 

[KingBroly]

As far as I know it’s the latter. It’s very possible the Square Rep isn’t Geno.

in which case PLEASE be Neku

I think there was somebody who suggested Geno wasn't the second Square character in Smash. I'm not sure who it was, though.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Impa
Dixie Kong

And I wanna say Isaac, but probably not.

Diddy, not a one of these is a casual pleaser. MAYBE Dixie Kong.

The others however? They'd probably a illicit a big ole ''Who?"

 

[Rie Sonomura]

I think there was somebody who suggested Geno wasn't the second Square character in Smash. I'm not sure who it was, though.

Was it the updated Dante rumor that predicted Isabelle a day before her official trailer?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

What are you bundling it with? The license to Super Mario?

I mean that's cheap for one of the most recognizable faces in media

 

[Exalt4747]

I feel like this concept demands too many assumptions to find a good answer to.

You have to define hardcore and casual, and then understand that neither of the two are monolithic, and that not all players necessarily fit into either.

 

[Deleted member]

I think the disappointing thing frlm the Box theory is that it emds speculation but it's not even a big BANG like the ESRB leak was. It's just... a box that tells what we already knew is the only stuff that remains.
I'd take an ESRB 2.0 over Nintendo's marketing team underestimating the Smash fanbase's ability to analyze a piece of cardboard.

 

[Megadoomer]

Both Zelda and Xenoblade 2 DLC is 50 bucks in total. The DLC for Smash Wii U and 3DS, in total, cost about $73 (someone else did the calculation). If you bought just the characters and stages, its $53 dollars. So to say that "It made more money because its more expense" is incorrect. Moreoever, the numbers I'm comparing also include Mario Kart 8 DLC. If anything, it might have under performed. Note that the Wii U version is over 5 million and the 3DS is under 10 million (keep in mind, this doesn't consider double purchases). Zelda now is over 10 million and Xenoblade was at about 1 million at the end of FY 2017. So your comparison is wrong.

Ignoring New Super Mario Bros U and 3D World (it was a type BTW), look at Mario Kart 8 which sold far more than Smash. Most sales for games are made within the first few months (if not weeks or days). Nintendo games usually sell longer, but those games releasing sooner won't much a difference in the long run and the sales for both will eventually hit a sort of 0 point. Maybe you can say NSMBU was higher because it was a launch title, but if you look at sales, people were buying the system to get NSMBU, not the other way around.\

As for Smash increasing sales of other games, there doesn't seem to be much evidence of it happening. Supposedly it helped Bayonetta 2, but the sales of that game were still low even after that. It doesn't seem to create a large affect. If that the logic though, wouldn't Nintendo be better served promoting their own characters? They only get a licensing fee for the third party games. They get most of the revenue for their own games. If we are going by that logic, seems like Nintendo would be better served to do what I say and push their own characters to increase sales of their own games. Of course, this is assuming that even happens which I'm doubtful of.

A big difference between Zelda/Xenoblade and Smash is how the DLC is handled. With Zelda, you can't buy the DLC packs individually - you have to buy the season pass, so that's a $20 purchase. With the Xenoblade expansion pass, it's $30, and outside of the Torna expansion (which, oddly enough, is more expensive than the expansion pass), the items also cannot be purchased individually. The season passes are literally the only way to get the new content, whereas Smash Bros. characters, stages, and costumes can be bought individually.

By comparison, for Smash, the characters are about $5 or $6 each, and people have the option to buy them in smaller pieces. So if someone has no attachment to Cloud, Roy, or Lucas, for example, or they don't see the need to have all of the stages, then they can choose not to buy them. With Zelda (and, effectively, with Xenoblade), the season passes are literally the only options to get the DLC; the comparison seems flawed when someone has to spend $20 or $30 for the DLC in those two games, but hypothetically, they might only spend $6 or $10 on Smash and be perfectly happy with it since they haven't heard of Fire Emblem, Mother 3, or Bayonetta, or they haven't played Final Fantasy VII, or they got Mewtwo as a free bonus through Club Nintendo.

---

I can't really comment on Mario Kart (its sales are not something that I've looked heavily into, though in theory, it's a game that's much easier to get into than Smash), but as far as the game improving sales of other games, Nintendo cannot survive with little to no third party support - the Wii U failed miserably due to poor marketing, but third party companies abandoning it in droves certainly didn't help.

Having third party characters in Smash helps to get both third party characters more exposure (fans who got into Nintendo through the Wii or Switch may not be familiar with franchises like Street Fighter, Castlevania, or Mega Man) as well as helping to get Nintendo series more exposure. (there might not be much overlap between fans of Nintendo and fans of Metal Gear or Final Fantasy 7 - people who look into Smash Bros. due to the inclusion of Snake or Cloud might start looking into the Legend of Zelda or Metroid since those characters look interesting, and that's all it takes)

Nintendo might get more revenue from using their characters over third party ones, but when it comes to sticking purely with Nintendo characters, there's going to be a point where the reveals aren't overly exciting. It's going to be hard to top something like Ridley or K. Rool; both characters had over a decade of passionate support behind them.

Having a mix of both Nintendo characters and third party characters allows Smash to represent a much broader view of video game history (even in the NES days, it's not like Nintendo was completely independent - games like Mega Man or Castlevania helped to make people Nintendo fans), strengthen relationships with third party companies, and make character reveals more exciting. (if they stuck heavily/exclusively to one or the other, they'd be scraping the bottom of the barrel by now)

 

[Diddy Kong]

Diddy, not a one of these is a casual pleaser. MAYBE Dixie Kong.

The others however? They'd probably a illicit a big ole ''Who?"

Oh yes definitely they are. Dixie Kong is hugely popular because of Tropical Freeze, both on Wii U and the Switch. Same for Impa, who's popular through Hyrule Warriors also both on Wii U and the Switch. So that makes them both popular with the casual and hardcore crowds I would say.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I think the disappointing thing frlm the Box theory is that it emds speculation but it's not even a big BANG like the ESRB leak was. It's just... a box that tells what we already knew is the only stuff that remains.
I'd take an ESRB 2.0 over Nintendo's marketing team underestimating the Smash fanbase's ability to analyze a piece of cardboard.

I mean, it lets us speculate on DLC. Our front runners are now a Square Enix character that possibly isn't Geno and Dante.


**** me that sounds so odd, imagine being told that before Cloud was revealed

 

[SonicMario]

I got a game for you all, think of a newcomer that can fit into both the hardcore and casual categories.

Tails.

Hardcore Smashers remember the EGM Melee April Fools prank

Many more casual fans know at least the classic main Sonic characters (Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, and Eggman), and Tails has always been an especially marketed/reappearing character even in games where Sonic is the only playable character.

 

[IGuessItsOver]

Wow, such a bargain!

 

[dezeray112]

Was it the updated Dante rumor that predicted Isabelle a day before her official trailer?

Is it this one?

https://smashboards.com/threads/kee....446379/page-3#lg=_xfUid-2-1537113039&slide=0

 

[Chrono.]

I got a game for you all, think of a newcomer that can fit into both the hardcore and casual categories.

Shadow the Hedgehog, at this point.

Maybe Tails too but I don't see as much demand for him from the hardcore crowd.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I’m down for paying for totally unique newcomers, and even semiclones for DLC, but I can’t be the only one who thinks it’d be weird to charge $5 for an echo fighter.

In most case there’s barely any difference, and its just the model and animations, with some stat adjustments.
They’re nice as fans service and padding for the roster, but I don’t know if I’d really buy them.

Maybe $1 or $2, but I’m hoping they cost about half as much as a unique newcomer.

Best case scenario is that they give a few every now and then as free updates, but I know they won’t and that’s fine. Just make it like $2.

 

[Dee Dude]

If Dante gets in over Banjo, Geno, Rayman, or anyone else as the second 3rd Party base newcomer, there will be so much salt and pissed off people.


I’ll be one of those people.

 

[Opossum]

Box Theory's looking pretty good right about now. :D








:D

 

[WaxPython]

Wow, such a bargain!

Lol typical Nintendo ace$$ories. It's why I usually buy 3rd party, better quality too and for a fraction of the cost.

I love their games but I'd prefer it if Nintendo was a 3rd party dev tbh like Sega just with the quality.

I can't believe they're holding us at random cloud saves if we ever cancel the subscription the cloud save is deleted...

 

[Ryuuma]

Is it this one?

https://smashboards.com/threads/kee....446379/page-3#lg=_xfUid-2-1537113039&slide=0

wow, this is kinda huge, right?

 

[Cutie Gwen]

If Dante gets in over Banjo, Geno, Rayman, or anyone else as the second 3rd Party base newcomer, there will be so much salt and pissed off people.


I’ll be one of those people.

There's going to be salt regardless, might as well accept that if you haven't already

 

[Pakky]

So are we looking at two more or four more?

 

[Mega Bidoof]

I got a game for you all, think of a newcomer that can fit into both the hardcore and casual categories.

Waluigi. I still think he’ll be DLC. The absolute outcry seems like too good of an opportunity to pass up on. I feel like he’ll be the Mewtwo of this game where the fan outcry is noticed too late, but they start working on him as soon as the base game goes gold.

Also any Sonic character really.

 

[Momotsuki]

On my life, are we really back to this? Like... did I miss some sort of revolutionary development in the almighty theory of cardboard or...?

 

[Ramen Tengoku]

Waluigi. I still think he’ll be DLC. The absolute outcry seems like too good of an opportunity to pass up on. I feel like he’ll be the Mewtwo of this game where the fan outcry is noticed too late, but they start working on him as soon as the base game goes gold.

Also any Sonic character really.

So are you saying that they're gonna scrap his assist trophy?

 

[Michele]

Lol typical Nintendo ace$$ories. It's why I usually buy 3rd party, better quality too and for a fraction of the cost.

I love their games but I'd prefer it if Nintendo was a 3rd party dev tbh like Sega just with the quality.

I can't believe they're holding us at random cloud saves if we ever cancel the subscription the cloud save is deleted...

But the third parties accessory also have their risks, remember when version 5 caused some accessories to brick Switch?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Wow, such a bargain!

Please be a misprint...PLEASE let THAT be a misprint...

Is it this one?

https://smashboards.com/threads/kee....446379/page-3#lg=_xfUid-2-1537113039&slide=0

It’s from this screenshot:

Spoiler: image contains swearing; I’m not on PC to censor it right now so viewer discretion is advised

 

[Originality]

I’m down for paying for totally unique newcomers, and even semiclones for DLC, but I can’t be the only one who thinks it’d be weird to charge $5 for an echo fighter.

In most case there’s barely any difference, and its just the model and animations, with some stat adjustments.
They’re nice as fans service and padding for the roster, but I don’t know if I’d really buy them.

Maybe $1 or $2, but I’m hoping they cost about half as much as a unique newcomer.

Best case scenario is that they give a few every now and then as free updates, but I know they won’t and that’s fine. Just make it like $2.

I was thinking/hoping that echoes would come in bundles. 2 or 3 for the price of 1 unique.

 

[Ryuuma]

If Dante gets in over Banjo, Geno, Rayman, or anyone else as the second 3rd Party base newcomer, there will be so much salt and pissed off people.


I’ll be one of those people.

People shoul expect this kind stuff since cloud.

Its not news anymore.

 

[Deleted member]

I mean, it lets us speculate on DLC. Our front runners are now a Square Enix character that possibly isn't Geno and Dante.


**** me that sounds so odd, imagine being told that before Cloud was revealed

Unlike most here, I'm not that hyped for DLC Speculation, I'll still participate in for sure but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth to discuss DLC so early.
And besides, I feel like if there are only 1 newcomer and 1 unique, Sakurai should have stressed "fewer new fighters" a lot harder because 6 uniques is just disappointing. Guess I just skipped denial and am entering depression early for the end of thus speculation period

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Lol typical Nintendo ace$$ories. It's why I usually buy 3rd party, better quality too and for a fraction of the cost.

The Pro Controller bundle is actually correctly priced. It’s like that for all retailers.

$60 game.
$70 controller.
$10(?) steelbook.

Although I think it should be a little less. That’s supposed to be part of the whole incentive for a bundle, right?

 

[Booper Blooper]

I’m down for paying for totally unique newcomers, and even semiclones for DLC, but I can’t be the only one who thinks it’d be weird to charge $5 for an echo fighter.

In most case there’s barely any difference, and its just the model and animations, with some stat adjustments.
They’re nice as fans service and padding for the roster, but I don’t know if I’d really buy them.

Maybe $1 or $2, but I’m hoping they cost about half as much as a unique newcomer.

Best case scenario is that they give a few every now and then as free updates, but I know they won’t and that’s fine. Just make it like $2.

I feel like any echo fighters/alt costumes/any other cosmetic-y stuff would be sold in bundles, in stead of single purchases like with characters, as that's the simplest way to entice more players to buy something they don't need at all.
Like as an example, $5 for echo Dixie sounds lame, $3-5 for say Dixie, Shadow, and Black Shadow together sounds a lot more reasonable.

 

[Ryuuma]

Please be a misprint...PLEASE let THAT be a misprint...

It’s from this screenshot:

Spoiler: image contains swearing; I’m not on PC to censor it right now so viewer discretion is advised

Anyone has the link for this thread?

 

[Tree Gelbman]

It is possibly they might want to save some fan pleasers for DLC and hence they've had their ATs and such removed.

 

[Sigran101]

Have we talked about how coro coro said there's more stages? I really thought 103 was final but apparently not.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

Unlike most here, I'm not that hyped for DLC Speculation, I'll still participate in for sure but it leaves a bad taste in my mouth to discuss DLC so early.
And besides, I feel like if there are only 1 newcomer and 1 unique, Sakurai should have stressed "fewer new fighters" a lot harder because 6 uniques is just disappointing. Guess I just skipped denial and am entering depression early for the end of thus speculation period

Oh I'm not excited about the speculation, I'm excited that ****ing Dante is our front-runner

 

[Nap_]

So, how do you feel about DLC? Will be for free as in Mario Tennis? Will cost money? Cheaper or more expensive than in WiiU? Echoes allowed? When it will start? Is everything decided by now? How long would be the time window?
Gotta say, about it, the theories about Smashdown are hot crap with DLC, just add one more fighter and using every character till the end will be imposible.
And about Ken and Incineroar becoming the last fighters... Something bugs me about it. No retro or strange choice or a new Namco rep. After a DK newcomer I would bet money on this.

 

[WaxPython]

But the third parties accessory also have their risks, remember when version 5 caused some accessories to brick Switch?

Nope haven't heard of it but sounds like a typical Nintendo thing to do. I remember buying a region locked fire emblem fates and went through quite a process to get it to work on my 3ds. For a company that makes such great games they're not very consumer friendly these days.

 

[praline]

It is possibly they might want to save some fan pleasers for DLC and hence they've had their ATs and such removed.

As long as Waluigi isn’t one of them.