Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Verde Coeden Scalesworth]

And this is why spirited discussions here are great. You and I have vastly different opinions on the same character for, really, the same reasons? I agree with everything you said-- and yet, in my mind, it makes him less suitable for a celebration of Nintendo's history. It's like how world history and a country's history aren't always celebrated at the same time.

In my opinion, he should've been in Playstation All-Stars, not Smash. (Really, so should Snake, but you can fudge him into Smash with the GCN exclusive and NES games.) And Smash's FF representative, should there be one, would be better off drawing from the SNES classics. But he has tons of fans in the Smash community, so good for them. I can hold my opinion without trying to convince them their character doesn't "deserve" to be in.

He should've also been is PSBAS.

You see, I never viewed Smash as purely Nintendo history. At any time. But I also never thought it was a big deal to begin with. I mean, literally the character I wanted most was Diablos from FFVIII. It's just a part of it. I viewed it as gaming history for ages to come. Coincidentally, that was also Sakurai's bigger focus to begin with. He didn't add Nintendo characters to make it Nintendo-centric, it was just the only way to make the series sell. He was ready to say yes to Snake and Sonic in Melee, with development time making it impossible. He jumped at the chance to make them work for Brawl, too.

That said, we know that Sakurai doesn't care about it, and there's a pretty good chance he never designed the series to be all about "Nintendo history", but that we can't say for sure. Thought his wording right now "I want to make this the best character game in the world." Part of why stuff like Goku doesn't bother me. It's clear having a recognizable and awesome cast is a bit more important than people like to think it is. It's no coincidence they're a system seller, it's literally the reason the series exists(coincidentally, if it weren't for Mario, the series is unlikely to have done as well. Though that's just a nod to the old joke of how Smash wouldn't exist without Mario on some earlier page. They're right, though).

To be fair, you don't need a tutorial in early FF7. Nearly every normal enemy dies in 1-2 hits and deals single digit damage for the first couple hours lol. By the time the game has any real challenge, you've gone through all the tutorials.

You don't drop a person right into the battle areas with zero time to understand the game mechanics. You put them in an easier spot to get the feel of the game. It was a bad decision and poor game design. It's not about tutorials. It's about putting you in a good spot to help introduce you into the game without pressuring you into a "do well enough or die" situation. It's very easy to lose interest if you never played an rpg before. I thankfully have, but the game quickly lost my interest when it wasn't actually fun. It had no buildup, it was just immediate battle area. I've spoken to this among other people, and it's an issue that isn't very vocal, but very much exists. FFVII has a way better startup, though that game has a very confusing equipment system too. But hey, nothing's perfect.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

The fact that this lines up with Dantetheory is kinda gut wrenching.

Wait why does this specifically line up with the Dante theory?

 

[LetterO]

By the way, CoroCoro has made mistakes and so some of the Japanese are being cautious (like, the 3 could have been mistaken for an 8). It looks like a normal CoroCoro page, though. Mainly because of that FamiSta stuff on the other page.

Excuse me, but how do you mistake a 3 for an 8?

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

With the background shenanigans interfering with Stage Morph?
View attachment 164588
Dixie can still be in though, but if K. Rool didn't get a stage Dixie sure as hell won't.

Dixie herself won't be getting a stage, the donkey kong franchise and the recent, majorly successful tropical freeze will. And just don't put in any background shenanigans?

 

[Will]

My hope for a Archanea stage lives on!

FTFY

The fact that people think this might be a misprint really indicates a strange expectation of disappointment by default.

Y'all are nuts.

Are you assuming that I could be wrong?
[insert crying wojak here]
[insult]

 

[Deleted member]

Why does CoroCoro usually know about new Pokemon ahead of literally anyone else though? There isn't always a reason.

But that's exclusive info they are given and are supposed to reveal themselves. It just seems odd to me 108 stages is literally the only thing that's not directly from the Smash Direct, esoecially when it's clear they are not supposed to reveal that.

The fact 108 fits perfectly in the current SSS is a strong point in its favor but still, I'm gonna keep my expectations in check.

I'll wait on Push updates, if it's a misprint, it likely refers to 103 in other sections. If not... well then...

 

[Zinith]

If by any chance it's a misprint, would they correct it with later prints or make a statement about it?

 

[Nethermoosen]

If we're getting 108 stages, there's no room for it unless the're no DLC button.


They could expand to another row, of course, and not do the 2nd tab for DLC.

Training stage would just be in training mode anyways.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I mentioned the 2nd SE stage being one of the five.


HOWEVER, Dante theory says Geno is NOT in and it's another SE rep.



We can't confirm or deny it until November, frustratingly enough.

I'm not going to believe a random post on /v/ that had a 1/3 shot of guessing the newcomer based on Verg's picks and just replacing the Square rep with Dante.

There were probably a MILLION posts about incineroar being the one revealed, and there were probably tons of other posts saying Isabelle was going to be revealed.

 

[Shroob]

Wait why does this specifically line up with the Dante theory?

Mostly because we know 103 isn't the final number, meaning we can expect a new franchise at the very least IMO,

That's it really, but Danteleak already lines up(or is piggybacking off of Verg).

 

[Dixie Kong]

I’m just soo happy we won’t be hearing any more “only 103” stages anymore. That was sooo annoying and lacked reasoning.

 

[vaanrose]

I'm gonna say it's a misprint cause Corocoro have been known to screw up before.

...Well, magazines in general do.

It frustrates me that this was more or less my first thought, that I can't even trust that the info's not just wrong. I'd be curious to see if the issue has any other new info in it, because it would be weird to me if they only knew one new thing. If there's anything else that's completely new, then I'd say it's trustworthy.

 

[Will]

And just don't put in any background shenanigans?

Then why bring the stage back? Just make a new one?

This is what brings in the big money.

 

[Hinata]

Wait why does this specifically line up with the Dante theory?

That's what I'd like to know. Mostly because I wanna know if I should actually have hope for Dante.

 

[Starbound]

Training stage would just be in training mode anyways.

But it would still have to be selectable somehow in training mode, right?

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

The fact that this lines up with Dante theory is kinda gut wrenching.

You all know it in your heart of hearts to be true:

Dante will be in Smash Brothers.

Also I'm telling you all our second Square Enix rep if we get one is going to be Erdrick or Hero from Dragon Quest 11. Dragon Quest is the highest selling Japanese series not represented in Smash, Nintendo has published multiple games in the series personally, and it's more popular in the west than Metroid is in the east.

Our last stages will likely be:

• Golden Sun/Rhythm Heaven
• Battle Royale Stage/Mt. Kunikala/Alola Pokemon League
• Minecraft
• Dragon Quest
• Devil May Cry

If this is true, holy **** that'd be hype.

Imagine if we get Dante, Erdrick, and Banjo in the final Smash Direct alongside Shadow and Ken as echoes?

That'd be so ****ing hype.

 

[Bestmand902]

The fact that this lines up with Dantetheory is kinda gut wrenching.

I forget, what's the Dante Theory?

 

[AugustusB]

Well as soon as things were getting good, it's time to turn in for the night.

Happy Speculating and Good Morning, Good Evening and Good Night.

 

[KMDP]

108 stages, very very interesting. I wonder what they'll be.

108... Guys I've got it, Suikoden confirmed! (108 Stars)

The number 108 is a common thing in Buddhist Mythology (also Hinduism, but Buddhism is more relevant to Japan).

 

[Will]

I'm gonna say it's a misprint cause Corocoro have been known to screw up before.

...Well, magazines in general do.

That's less being neutral and just straight-up pessimism.

 

[monadoboy]

Excuse me, but how do you mistake a 3 for an 8?

Bigger misprints have happened. It's unlikely, but possible.

 

[Knight Dude]

Aight Shish, I see your game.

Mario:
Yoshi: /Kamek/Poochy
Zelda:
F-Zero: /Black Shadow/Samurai Goroh
Metroid:
Pokemon:
MOTHER: /Porky
Star Fox:
Kid Icarus:
Animal Crossing: /Isabelle/K.K. Slider
Xenoblade: /Elma/Lora & Jin
Splatoon: /Octoling/Sisters
Punch-Out!!: /Glass Joe/King Hippo
Pikmin:/Louie/Alph
Fire Emblem: ultike:
Sonic: /Tails/Eggman or Shadow (can't choose but leaning Shadow)
Metal Gear: /Raiden/Liquid
Mega Man: /Zero/Bass.exe
PAC-MAN:/Ms Pac Man/ ????? The ghosts I guess
Street Fighter: /Ken/Chun-li
Final Fantasy:/Black Mage/Noctis
Bayonetta: /Jeanne/Rodin
Castlevania: /Alucard/Soma Cruz

New franchises:
King of Fighters: Kyo Kusanagi/Iori Yagami/Terry Bogard
Tales of: Lloyd Irving/Yuri Lowell/Dhaos
Shin Megami Tensei: Nanashi/Joker/Jack Bros

My Turn

Mario: (R.I.P Peach and Rosa though)
Zelda: (Zelda and Ganon can stay the same but Link is now TP Link)
Metroid: (Semi-Clone/Wolf Style character)
Star Fox: (EZ)
Pokemon:
Kirby: (EZ)
Wario: (Captain Syrup) (Mona?)
DK: (EZ)
Kid Icarus: (See Dark Samus)
Animal Crossing: , Tom Nook
Pikmin: , Alph, Louie
F-Zero: , Black Shadow, Samurai Goroh
Punch-Out!!: , Doc Louis, King Hippo
FE: :ultrobin(EZ)
Xenoblade: , Fiora, Elma
Earthbound: , Ninten
Yoshi: , Poochy, **** it....Raphael the Raven
Splatoon: , Octoling, DJ Octavio
Mega Man: , Mega Man X, Zero(MMZ style) (EZ, though I had to resist adding Mega Man EXE instead of Zero)
Street Fighter: , Chun-Li, Akuma
Sonic: , Tails, Knuckles (EZ)
Bayonetta: , Jeanne, Rodin
Metal Gear: , Raiden, Gray Fox
Castlevania: , Alucard
Pac-Man: , Ms. Pac Man, The ghosts, working as a team
Final Fantasy: , Terra, Black Mage
Wii Fit: Male, Female, A ****ing Balance Board

New franchises
ARMS: Spring Man, Dr. Coyle, Barq and Byte
Tekken: Heihachi, Jin(Semi-Clone) Nina
Fatal Fury: Terry, Mai, Geese
Golden Sun: Issac, Mia, Ivan
Final Fight: Mike Haggar, Cody, Guy(EZ)

8/10 game, made me actually think.

 

[Shroob]

I forget, what's the Dante Theory?

Everything's Verg has said but Geno isn't the 2nd SE rep, and Dante's in.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

I forget, what's the Dante Theory?

The Dante theory is basically just Verg's characters except replace the Square Enix rep with Dante.

It had Isabelle, Ken, Incineroar, and Dante

The reason it's believed is because the person said "As proof Isabelle will be revealed in the direct"

 

[Deleted member]

You guys really need to keep your expectations in check, there's really no harm in being skeptic about this, I'm getting tired of these "lol stop being such a pessimist" posts when it's this exact thought process that prevents disappointment.

But it would still have to be selectable somehow in training mode, right?

Is it possible it would either be a different selection for it or replace the random button though?

 

[Shroob]

The Dante theory is basically just Verg's characters except replace the Square Enix rep with Dante.

It had Isabelle, Ken, Incineroar, and Dante

The reason it's believed is because the person said "As proof Isabelle will be revealed in the direct"

*Replace


No, Dante is Capcom, not SE.


He said the SE rep WOULDN'T be Geno.

 

[CyberHyperPhoenix]

For those who still aren't buying the 108 stage thing, it's legit.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

*Replace


No, Dante is Capcom, not SE.


He said the SE rep WOULDN'T be Geno.

He didn't say there would be a Square Rep at all

Nothing in the post indicates there will be a Square rep

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Bigger misprints have happened. It's unlikely, but possible.

However, if it is a misprint we'll probably be informed as soon as possible by the big N themselves. Which would confirm the number of stages one way or another

 

[Shroob]

He didn't say there would be a Square Rep at all

Nothing in the post indicates there will be a Square rep

He said the Square rep wasn't Geno.


That more or less says there's a 2nd Square rep that's not Geno.

 

[PsychoIncarnate]

He said the Square rep wasn't Geno.


That more or less says there's a 2nd Square rep that's not Geno.

No he didn't

 

[Shroob]

View attachment 164594

No he didn't

Fair enough, but if Dante leaker is right, then Verg is wrong, so consider that.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

I forget, what's the Dante Theory?

Two 4chan users have predicted Dante and have gotten other information about Smash and/or DMCV right so far.

As others have said they also claim no Geno

 

[Bestmand902]

He said the SE rep WOULDN'T be Geno.

Well **** me, that's a bummer. Something tells me it ain't gonna be something else I care about either, like Terra Branford or Lara Croft or hell even Gex
Though Geno for DLC would be hype as hell

 

[Exalt4747]

This guy should have considered his "proof" better, unless he just didn't hear about Vergeben.

 

[Hydrualic Hydra]

I try to bid fond farewells and this crazy **** happens

I won't get my hopes up until we have all the information from CoroCoro (whether it's consistently 108 for the whole article, whether they have any other new information, whether there's some kind of statement on it), but I will be lurking in the shadows for clarification.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Fair enough, but if Dante leaker is right, then Verg is wrong, so consider that.

He didn't say there wasn't a Square Rep, he said Geno wasn't in

 

[Angelglory]

Don't forget that there's two Dante leaks. One with actual chances via DMCV leaks and one that just claims it with what is probably a lucky guess.

 

[Luigi The President]

And we're back to the Dante theory.
Reminder that numerous people, including some in this very thread, predicted Isabelle would be the next newcomer. In this Direct.

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

Fair enough, but if Dante leaker is right, then Verg is wrong, so consider that.

???

Verg isn't wrong if Dante leaker is right. The two coexist right now. Unless I'm getting something wrong...

And we're back to the Dante theory.
Reminder that numerous people, including some in this very thread, predicted Isabelle would be the next newcomer. In this Direct.

Then please point me to those posts. Posts that specify that Isabelle is

• A unique character
• Will have her own reveal trailer
• And will be the ONLY character revealed in the Direct.

No, you can't point to GameXplain.