Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Will]

To be honest, it's not the same to me. While I understand where some people are coming from, there's nothing supporting the idea that the back of the box would have the OG 8, or any other claims. Those are arguments thrown around with no basis.

I'll even go a step further and show a mockup of a scenario in which the OG 8 aren't included on the sides:
View attachment 164358

It doesn't come close to lining up equally. It would take 8 to fill it in completely, and I simply don't see us getting 8 additional characters when we've been clearly told by the lead director that he "Hopes we aren't expecting as many newcomers as previous games.

Also, based on that last part...why would we be speculating on anything then? Based on what you said, everything is meaningless. You and I both know that's simply not true.

When I mean "I don't believe the box theory", I don't believe either your claims or anyone who says the OG 8 aren't on the sides. I just don't believe we can garner who we have left from the box. This to me is like using the CSS to determine roster size all over again, but not on the design of a box. A box that could easily be redesigned.

I'm not opposing you, I'm opposing anyone who thinks the box means something.

 

[Potato_]

Back in the day we used to argue about the shape of clouds in cut scenes so this is pretty minor by comparison.

IT'S RIDLEY OKAY HE'S FINALLY IN

 

[Noipoi]

I don't believe the theory, but just to be safe, my expectations for newcomers are now at rock bottom.

That said, looking forward to hearing about Spirits, All-Star, Events and all of the other cool modes in store. This hype train doesn't stop.

Yeah dude! Of course i'm invested in who'll get in next, but I want some info on spirits mode asap.
I hope Spirits mode is really meaty. I don't get friends over to play as much as i'd like, so i'd like something to do while by myself.

 

[Mega Bidoof]

Someone else mentioned this, but I just want to point out the fact that the major topics of recent speculation surrounded furniture and now a box.

I'm just saying guys.

I know it’s a joke but you can’t compare the furniture in Sakurai’s room to the official box art posted online.

 

[SmashChu]

The box doesn’t look like a real box. Zoom in on it. It looks perfect.

It looks like a template for designing a box. Not a box itself. As in, they could just add things or remove things digitally. It doesn’t have a shadow, doesn’t look like it actually opens and looks like the corners and seams are perfect.

Do they not use computers to design box art on a template before applying it?

If its not final, they'll say "final design subject to change," or somewhere along that. I can't find the original image so I don't know.

I does line up with some things. Two spots on the site make it fit the three wide set-up. The math does check out. What I find silly about it is the box may not be final for obvious reasons. Also, wasn't this box shown off around when Isabelle was announced? Wouldn't see be there?

It's not impossible but its a little silly. I don't know. I might just bounce from these threads again. Feel like these kind of conversations take away from the fun of just speculating and talking Smash.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

 

[Aurane]

Back in the day we used to argue about the shape of clouds in cut scenes so this is pretty minor by comparison.

I'd say they're all on the same level honestly.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

This right here is the glass is half full outlook

 

[Captain Shwampy]

What? That doesn’t even make sense.
You decide to make a reaction video before you know the character.

“Wow that’s a cool character, let me get in my ****ing time machine so I can record myself reacting to it!”

What are you talking about lol

 

[Pyra]

I know it’s a joke but you can’t compare the furniture in Sakurai’s room to the official box art posted online.

Did we ever check if the chairs also had the characters listed off on the sides? I don't think we ever saw the back of them.

 

[Noipoi]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

It's finally Cooking Mama's time.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

You must not have been in the Spectulation Thread during the time up to Smash 4's release, there were a ton of people expecting her to be in the base game due to Nintendo bankrolling Bayonetta 2.

I didn't mean as badly as Crash, but unlike Sonic, Cloud, Mega Man, Snake, Ryu, etc, she didn't really stay part of gaming pop culture. Her popularity as a gaming icon faded. There's a reason we see names like Cloud and Sora thrown around for Smash newcomers but not Lara's.

Not to mention, as I said, the reception of a 3rd Party character should probably be big worldwide and not just in the West.

Up until dlc happened, most people only expected Mega Man and Pac-Man to have joined (the latter having way more support than the others due to Namco), and if Bayo was requested by lots of people before her dlc inclusion then they died out/got quiet once the Ballot came to play.

As for the popularity thing, Sonic is a much bigger star in the West than in Japan (for some strange reason), Castlevania is a bigger deal outside of Japan (and Richter...oof), Cloud and Final Fantasy (or just 7 at the least) are more popular in the West than in Japan compared to something like Dragon Quest, and Bayonetta is neither iconic (yet) nor a big deal in gaming like the other 3rd parties (yet...cause we all know it’ll happen soon...or atleast that **** better happen). Also Metal Gear Solid being more popular here than there, but it was still a big deal there.

Then you got Mega Man who’s split down the middle (even if Capcom Japan thinks it’s more we’ll known there), same with Pac-Man and Street Fighter

So I don’t think a 3rd party’s reception will be much of an affect on a character’s chances

This Right here. Everyone assumes that the final character will be a big one like Geno or Isaac. If that's the Case, wouldn't The Final Smash 4 Direct have had more hype inducing characters like Isaac or Geno? And wouldn't the final Brawl character have been Sonic? All in all, i'm pretty sure the final characters are like dessert. You just had a big meal with Inkling, Ridley, Simon, And K. Rool. Then you get Some Dessert Free of charge consisting of Isabelle, Ken, and Incineroar. You would want that free dessert wouldn't you? Sakurai also used this comparison when discussing Lucina, Dr Mario, and Dark Pit, and I think it also works really well here.. So if anything, be happy. We've already be spoiled with some insane reveals... What is wrong with a couple small ones for a change?...

Isabelle was a whole damn meal

 

[Will]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

Well let's see here.
>Rex
>Springy boy
>obligatory fire emblem
>could be anyone past this point

 

[PeridotGX]

Can someone quickly summarize the box theory I missed the discussion.

People thinking some box revealed there are only two more newcomers.

 

[Paperchampion23]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

Additionally, I'm just confused why people are saying only 2 more characters (Incineroar and Ken) the it's a promotional box art that was digitally created. I think we have so much more to expect come november but yes I'm super excited for potential DLC

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Mental illness

Even if you don't agree with the idea, can you not be a dickwad?

 

[Chrono.]

I'll be pulling for Tails and Shadow for DLC more than ever now lol.

 

[Opossum]

"A Nintendo crossover game that has its Special Edition boxart spoil the remaining additions? That'd never ha-"

"Oh."

 

[Aurane]

I know it’s a joke but you can’t compare the furniture in Sakurai’s room to the official box art posted online.

Its all the same straw grasping hoopla to me. *shrug*

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

Additionally, I'm just confused why people are saying only 2 more characters (Incineroar and Ken) the it's a promotional box art that was digitally created. I think we have so much more to expect come november but yes I'm super excited for potential DLC

Ikr.. Yes Verge said Incineroar and Ken were in, but he also said theres gonna be a Square character too!

 

[Noipoi]

There's no rule stating a character that's an AT can't become dlc is there?

I'm asking for a friend...
who lives in a haunted mansion...

 

[Will]

Even if you don't agree with the idea, can you not be a dickwad?

Says the man who stated people who don't believe in the box are in denial.

"A Nintendo crossover game that has its Special Edition boxart spoil the remaining additions? That'd never ha-"

View attachment 164362
"Oh."

That's not really the same category of spoiling though.

There's no rule stating a character that's an AT can't become dlc is there?

I'm asking for a friend...
who lives in a haunted mansion...

You'd better know her name because she probably won't have it on the playable list.

 

[DraginHikari]

IT'S RIDLEY OKAY HE'S FINALLY IN

The cloud theory was true, only took 10 years to come truth.

 

[Pyra]

Even if you don't agree with the idea, can you not be a dickwad?

I think we all know there are people here specifically just to be jerks and literally no other reason lol
There are a few people that just pop in here to insult people and then pop back out

 

[TeamFlareZakk]

There's no rule stating a character that's an AT can't become dlc is there?

I'm asking for a friend...
who lives in a haunted mansion...

Let me guess.. You want Waluigi time..

 

[HyruleHero]

To be honest, it's not the same to me. While I understand where some people are coming from, there's nothing supporting the idea that the back of the box would have the OG 8, or any other claims. Those are arguments thrown around with no basis.

I'll even go a step further and show a mockup of a scenario in which the OG 8 aren't included on the sides:
View attachment 164358

It doesn't come close to lining up equally. It would take 8 to fill it in completely, and I simply don't see us getting 8 additional characters when we've been clearly told by the lead director that he "Hopes we aren't expecting as many newcomers as previous games.

Also, based on that last part...why would we be speculating on anything then? Based on what you said, everything is meaningless. You and I both know that's simply not true.

Well if cloud gets moved to be two spaces forward then the box makes a little more sense in that case we can say their are two echoes before him (Dixie Kong, Shadow/Tails, Black Knight, Medusa, Ninten, Louie, Hilda).
In that case we would have 6 more unique fighters which is equal to 12 which is the number of fighters introduced in the first game. Unfortunately though I'm starting to lean more toward their only being 2 more fighters.

 

[LetterO]

There's no rule stating a character that's an AT can't become dlc is there?

I'm asking for a friend...
who lives in a haunted mansion...

You'd better know his name 'cause he's Wa-Luigi!

 

[Omega Tyrant]

I already got everyone I most wanted with the roster, so there's nothing more left I could really want with the roster that's realistic, but regardless I'm more inclined to believe Vergeben than a theory based on a promotional incomplete mockup of the bundle box, whose leaks are incompatible with the box theory on the amount of remaining newcomers.

 

[ChocolatGelgato]

If the box thing is real, and you assume verge is gospel outside of 1 character, then The SE character is more likely than roar.

The guy who informed verge of SE having 2 characters is the same as the one who said simon belmont. He said one unkown source said roar. And i think every faker would try and guess alolan mons as good fakes to feed verge.

I dont want to fight tinfoil with tinfoil, i think this discussion is a waste of time, but nowhere did verges statements imply roar was ever a lock

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Says the man who stated people who don't believe in the box are in denial.

There's a difference between saying people are in denial and straight up insulting them.

Into the trash it goes.

 

[BluePikmin11]

I hope Sakurai is well aware of his decision to reveal the boxart for the special edition today and what it means for the fanbase for the next few months.

He better have something good ready for the lack of newcomers, I think this kind of speculation is gonna cause the hype for Ultimate to go south, it might even affect sales.

 

[Deleted member]

Last thing I'll say before leaving for the night is that no matter what happens, I'm okay with it. I've softened my opinion on Incineroar (partly because I got Isabelle, which is making me accept most things at this point) and while I...dislike Ken (like, a lot) I'll be happy for people who want him.

Also, for anyone who might be sad about not getting their favorites, as long as they don't show up as a boss or an assist, they are fair game for DLC. Base game isn't the end, it's just us getting halfway there.

Assuming there's DLC, that is.

 

[Noipoi]

I'm gonna keep the box theory in mind for purely selfish reasons.
If we do get more characters than Kenny McCormick and Tony the Tiger i'll be pleasantly surpised!
Especially if one of them is a wooden puppet.

 

[SchAlternate]

So, I've heard a box caused everyone to enter panic mode. What's up?

 

[DaybreakHorizon]

I'm just gonna say this and call it for today... I'm not gonna say names, but some of you are saying that this theory is based on proof…
AGAIN... there is NO proof of what the other side of the box shows. STOP making it as evidence when there is NONE. You're assuming the other side is the same and calling it solid proof to go along with the theory. Good night.

proof
pro͞of/
noun

1. evidence or argument establishing or helping to establish a fact or the truth of a statement

Look dude, ConnorEatsPants lays it out pretty clear, and it's difficult to argue with his logic. For you to completely deny evidence from the opposing side and assert your opinion as fact is ignorant.

Whatever happened to "they could add anyone and I'd be happy," huh?

Did we forget that Sakurai and the team also added Young Link, Squirtle, Ivysaur, Wolf, and Snake on top of our current newcomers? Or that they've made thousands of changes to the veterans to make them unique? What about the new gameplay system or modes? Or the already amazing set of newcomers???

I understand being disappointed that Incineroar and Ken is all we get, but lets think with our heads instead of our hearts here.

 

[Potato_]

If the box thing is real, and you assume verge is real. The SE character is more likely than roar.

The guy who informed verge of SE having 2 characters is the same as the one who said simon belmont. He said one unkown source said roar. And i think every faker would try and guess alolan mons as good fakes to feed verge.

I dont want to fight tinfoil with tinfoil, i think this discussion is a waste of time, but nowhere did verges statements imply roar was ever a lock

You talking about Imran? Yeah he's definitely someone to consider IMO.

 

[Shyy_Guy595]

Okay, so what about the other side of the box?

How do we know that side doesn't depict the same stuff with missing slots too?

 

[Will]

There's a difference between saying people are in denial and straight up insulting them.

Into the trash it goes.

For what isn't equal in degrees of spite is definitely equal in levels of being passive aggressive and just in general being a **** move.
you stole my ****ing meme

 

[Slavic]

God damn guys I am so ****ing excited for DLC. I am so damn excited. Think of the possibilities. Aside from the obvious ones like Isaac and Geno, if they're really not in. The possibilities are endless.

I am praying, PRAYING, that DLC will be timed in such a way that we can get Addam or maybe even Jin from Xenoblade over Pyrex, I know I'm going to be disappointed but it sure does give me something to look forward to

 

[Omega Tyrant]

If the box thing is real, and you assume verge is gospel outside of 1 character, then The SE character is more likely than roar.

The guy who informed verge of SE having 2 characters is the same as the one who said simon belmont. He said one unkown source said roar. And i think every faker would try and guess alolan mons as good fakes to feed verge.

I dont want to fight tinfoil with tinfoil, i think this discussion is a waste of time, but nowhere did verges statements imply roar was ever a lock

Vergeben has claimed all three of his primary Smash sources say a new pokemon is in (just it being specifically Incineroar is from one source only), while he also attributed Ken and the SE character to these sources.

So one cannot believe Vergeben while also believing the box theory.