Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Dr. James Rustles]

"Hi, I'm Hideo Kojima, the new director for Super Smash Bros. 5."

 

[Opossum]

I didn't mean as it replacing the chance of getting Chrom. Or that they are the same character. But in that their fighting styles outside of stats and techniques learned are basically the same. They both use the Falchion and had it and their fighting styles passed down from Marth. Lucina even tries to pass off as Marth and uses a fighting style that makes her believable to be him. A style she learned from Chrom. That is what I meant.

Chrom doesn't use Marth's style of swordplay. Marth's style is much more focused on quick stabs and slashes while Chrom's is much more of "bash it with your sword and throw your whole body into it." Lucina never meant to emulate Marth's style, only his appearance.

 

[Bowserlick]

What do we think the odds are on Fire Emblem having a new character for Smash Switch (first not including DLC, and then including)?

 

[Dr. James Rustles]

What do we think the odds are on Fire Emblem having a new character for Smash Switch (first not including DLC, and then including)?

Guaranteed in both cases. Sm4sh was used to sell the real product, Amiibos. Sma5h will be the same. The question is which Amiibo we are getting.

 

[korokuro]

What do we think the odds are on Fire Emblem having a new character for Smash Switch (first not including DLC, and then including)?

6 characters from Fire Emblem, Marth is Melee veteran, Ike is Brawl veteran, Roy is Melee veteran (I think he is considered a veteran), Corrin is new, Lucina is a new clone, Robin is new. Since there were 3 new Fire Emblem characters in Smash 4 alone, I think it is highly likely that one or two new Fire Emblem characters are coming .

 

[NintenRob]

6 characters from Fire Emblem, Marth is Melee veteran, Ike is Brawl veteran, Roy is Melee veteran (I think he is considered a veteran), Corrin is new, Lucina is a new clone, Robin is new. Since there were 3 new Fire Emblem characters in Smash 4 alone, I think it is highly likely that one or two new Fire Emblem characters are coming .

Couldn't the opposite also apply? Because they got so much this time, they focus elsewhere next time?

 

[Super Fawful]

I'm really hoping it's a new game instead of a MK8Deluxe-style port. A port just wouldn't have the same hype around it as the same game did when it was pre-release. And an announcement of a new game this E3 wouldn't be far off from how old the Wii U was when its Smash game was announced.

As for characters I want. Mostly from Mario since that's pretty much the fandom that links me to the SSB series.

-Paper Mario (with a moveset taken mostly from the first three games since not only are they more popular they've been getting so many shafts by the current devs of the series and even the SSB4 stage was 2/3 Sticker Star, and if Color Splash had existed then I'm sure they wouldn't have hesitated to have that replace the TTYD portion. I'd like partners to feature in some way in his moveset, with more available as custom movesets, for example Bombette could be used by default but you can have Bobbery or Boomer for different effects, and there's no shortage of Special Moves in the series that would work as a Final Smash)

-Fawful (about as likely as hell freezing over but then again Sakurai cares more about the Mario RPG side of the fanbase than the EAD devs who do stuff like Mario Kart as shown by having Geno as a Mii costume. He'd be cool playable too but I do prefer Fawful, and he wouldn't even take licensing issues either, not to mention a recent remake of his debut game)

-Waluigi (Was surprised he was never promoted after Brawl introduced Wario. It's about time we complete the square of mustachioed guys. Also impossible if it's a port because he'd be an assist trophy again, seriously we need a new game lol)

-Wreck-it Ralph (yeah I know, not Nintendo nor gaming, but was created as a tribute to gaming and Nintendo was referenced in his movie with Bowser and a mushroom, with implications that Mario will be in the sequel so I don't think he's too unreasonable. He did appear in Sonic's racing game after Sonic also cameo'd in his film so there could be something similar here)

 

[Deleted member]

I can't believe it was this obvious....

....move over, Bandana Dee.....

We need some Chef Kawasaki.

He'd even have Kirby's old Final Smash!

 

[Deleted member]

Could Crash Bandicoot become as requested, if not more so than Mega Man?

In Brawl, Sonic was by far the most requested character ever and the only character outside of DLC to be added after the main roster was decided on. With Smash 3DS & Wii U, all third-parties except Pac-Man were added because of fan demand with Mega Man being noted by Sakurai as being the second most wanted third-party on the Brawl poll. With all except two third-parties being added because of the fans, it's clear that fan demand is a large factor in including characters not owned by Nintendo. Third-parties are going to remain an important part of Smash from here on out (barring possibly a hard reboot of the roster) so it is important that Nintendo picks choices that are iconic or have really high fan demand. Crash happens to fall under the former.

Crash Bandicoot was the mascot of Sony during the first PlayStation console before going third-party. He was essentially Sony's Sonic and Naughty Dog made four critically acclaimed games with the franchise before the sales and critical performanced dipped with the successive generation. But the N-Sane Trilogy has been met with a positive response and high sales and brought back Crash Bandicoot into relevance. Now there are rumors of the trilogy coming to the Switch. If the game gets new installments too, that will only make the franchise more relevant assuming the games are good too. It's also important to keep in mind that Crash Bandicoot as a franchise has sold more than the entirety of Mega Man, showing that it has reached a much broader audience and with that, more people likely to ask Crash Bandicoot for Smash.

I've said before that I doubt fan demand will influence the next game's roster because there would be no one that needed it anyway but if a character ends up as requested if not more so than Mega Man, that could influence their inclusion. Crash Bandicoot could someday be in that league and if he does, it will be the best shot a western third-party has on the roster.

 

[LittleMissEevee]

I’d enjoy seeing pichu in ssb5 and a better ganondorf oh and megaman yesss

 

[N3ON]

I can't believe it was this obvious....

....move over, Bandana Dee.....

We need some Chef Kawasaki.

He'd even have Kirby's old Final Smash!

Chef Kawasaki seems like a character that was supposed to be more important, but then they just forgot to do it.

 

[soviet prince]

Remake or new? Which do you perfer?

I think a new one would be best since the 3ds is not here to hold the game back. It can have more interesting final smashes, characters like ice climbers and pokemon trainer would not need to be cut ect.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

A new game is more likely to make the drastic changes necessary to more resemble Melee, so I would prefer it.

 

[Geno Boost]

If Geno becomes playable in the next Smash game do you think he would finally have a voice?
It's hard for to imagin how he will sound like since he is Star spirit being that possess a doll.

 

[korokuro]

Couldn't the opposite also apply? Because they got so much this time, they focus elsewhere next time?

That is true.

 

[Cosmic77]

What do we think the odds are on Fire Emblem having a new character for Smash Switch (first not including DLC, and then including)?

This is actually tougher to predict than what people think. The six FE characters we have right now () already do a decent job of representing the franchise, so besides a character from FE Switch, I don't think any FE character is close to having "practically guaranteed" odds. Some might be more likely than others, but overall, the chances of any of them being added range from mediocre to low.


I'm going to be a little more critical on FE DLC characters and say it's probably not happening unless...

(1) FE characters from Smash 4 are cut.

(2) A new FE game is released during the development of Smash DLC.

 

[Deleted member]

The six FE characters we have right now () already do a decent job of representing the franchise

ERROR: REASONING / LOGIC NOT FOUND

\(°|°)/

 

[Cosmic77]

ERROR: REASONING / LOGIC NOT FOUND

\(°|°)/

Well, it's true. Even if the protagonist changes with every game, it's not reasonable to expect representation from EVERY FE game. Since most of the successful and/or important FE games are already being represented in Smash, I think the list of FE characters we have right now is fine.

 

[Deleted member]

Well, it's true. Even if the protagonist changes with every game, it's not reasonable to expect representation from EVERY FE game. Since most of the successful and/or important FE games are already being represented in Smash, I think the list of FE characters we have right now is fine.

That has nothing to do with the point you were making.
They way I see it, "X series is perfectly represented" is basically a synonym for "X series doesn't need any more characters". It's a subjective statement that people use in order to say that they don't want any more characters of a certain series.
Sakurai doesn't share this mindset. It's not about "reps", it's about what new things they can bring to the roster.
Also, coming from someone who doesn't believe in "reps".... seeing as only 3 of the weapon types in the series have been covered in Smash, I think it's far from "perfectly represented".

\(°|°)/

 

[Chron]

seeing as only 3 of the weapon types in the series have been covered in Smash, I think it's far from "perfectly represented".
\(°|°)/

*cough* Felicia

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

seeing as only 3 of the weapon types in the series have been covered in Smash, I think it's far from "perfectly represented".

Do you mean one of the three weapon types in the weapon triangle?

 

[Cosmic77]

That has nothing to do with the point you were making.
They way I see it, "X series is perfectly represented" is basically a synonym for "X series doesn't need any more characters". It's a subjective statement that people use in order to say that they don't want any more characters of a certain series.

Didn't I just say that a character from FE Switch was likely? You're misinterpreting my response to a question about the odds of certain FE characters getting in Smash as me complaining about the number of FE reps.

Sakurai doesn't share this mindset. It's not about "reps", it's about what new things they can bring to the roster.
Also, coming from someone who doesn't believe in "reps".... seeing as only 3 of the weapon types in the series have been covered in Smash, I think it's far from "perfectly represented".

There's also 18 different Pokemon types and over 800 different Pokemon, many of whom could bring many spectacular elements to Smash. Do we need to include a Pokemon from every Gen and a Pokemon of every type before it's "perfectly represented"?

Even though you're arguing that being unique is important, you're focusing more on the weapon mechanics of the FE series than the actual movesets. There's absolutely no way Sakurai could ever perfectly represent the series, and if he ever tried, FE would swallow all of the development time and cause equally unique characters from other franchises to be excluded. The best he can do is pull out certain ones that stand out who he thinks will do the franchise justice.

Right now, I'd say the six he's chosen so far are fine.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

What do we think the odds are on Fire Emblem having a new character for Smash Switch (first not including DLC, and then including)?

Very likely likel to the point of guaranteed with Echoes and Fire Emblem 16 on Switch.

Well, it's true. Even if the protagonist changes with every game, it's not reasonable to expect representation from EVERY FE game. Since most of the successful and/or important FE games are already being represented in Smash, I think the list of FE characters we have right now is fine.

It is about the games released around the design process each Smash as that helps dictate new characters. And Fire Emblem easily fits into that as it has gotten at least one new character each game since Melee. You just replace characters as you go.

This is actually tougher to predict than what people think. The six FE characters we have right now () already do a decent job of representing the franchise, so besides a character from FE Switch, I don't think any FE character is close to having "practically guaranteed" odds. Some might be more likely than others, but overall, the chances of any of them being added range from mediocre to low.


I'm going to be a little more critical on FE DLC characters and say it's probably not happening unless...

(1) FE characters from Smash 4 are cut.

(2) A new FE game is released during the development of Smash DLC.

The six FE characters we have now represented the series well enough for Smash 4 but it wont forever. New games come out all the time. And that applies to all the franchises. To keep the roster we have now say 20 years from now when we are around Smash 8 doesn't work when that is totally forgetting all the FE games released in that timeframe.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

I think the issue is whether the representation is adequate, not whether it's perfect. I think adequate representation would involve more than a bunch of sword fighters and a guy with magic.

 

[Deleted member]

Do you mean one of the three weapon types in the weapon triangle?

Fire Emblem weapons:
Sword
Axe
Lance
Bow
Tome
Bow
Dagger
Dragonstone

Fire Emblem weapons used by playable characters in Smash:
Sword (All)
Tome
Dragonstone

That was what I meant.

Didn't I just say that a character from FE Switch was likely? You're misinterpreting my response to a question about the odds of certain FE characters getting in Smash as me complaining about the number of FE reps.

That wasn't clear in your post.

There's also 18 different Pokemon types and over 800 different Pokemon, many of whom could bring many spectacular elements to Smash. Do we need to include a from every Gen and a Pokemon of every type before it's "perfectly represented"?

Even though you're arguing that being unique is important, you're focusing more on the weapon mechanics of the FE series than the actual movesets. There's absolutely no way Sakurai could ever perfectly represent the series, and if he ever tried, FE would swallow all of the development time and cause equally unique characters from other franchises to be excluded. The best he can do is pull out certain ones that he thinks will do the franchise justice.

I didn't say it's feasible, I was just pointing out that you're wrong by saying that it's "perfectly represented".

\(°|°)/

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

My predicted Fire Emblem roster for Smash 5 as of now:

-Marth
-Ike
-Corrin
-Celica (with reworked Robin moveset)
-FE16 Protagonist
-FE16 Antagonist

And if we only got one FE16 character then you could keep Roy.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

Fire Emblem weapons:
Sword
Axe
Lance
Bow
Tome
Bow
Dagger
Dragonstone

Fire Emblem weapons used by playable characters in Smash:
Sword (All)
Tome
Dragonstone

That was what I meant.


That wasn't clear in your post.


I didn't say it's feasible, I was just pointing out that you're wrong by saying that it's "perfectly represented".

\(°|°)/

What's with the attitude?

 

[Deleted member]

What's with the attitude?

What attitude?

\(°|°)/

 

[Cosmic77]

The six FE characters we have now represented the series well enough for Smash 4 but it wont forever. New games come out all the time. And that applies to all the franchises. To keep the roster we have now say 20 years from now when we are around Smash 8 doesn't work when that is totally forgetting all the FE games released in that timeframe.

This was literally the exact point I was trying to make. No new mainstream FE characters have been introduced since Fates, and from my perspective, what we have now is fine. Once more games like FE Switch come out, we can add newer characters.

Me arguing that these six characters should be the permanent representation for FE would be like me arguing that Pokemon doesn't need anything else.

I didn't say it's feasible, I was just pointing out that you're wrong by saying that it's "perfectly represented".

I never used the words "perfectly represented". You brought that up in your post.

 

[Al-kīmiyā']

"That was what I meant."
And w/e tf this is: \(°|°)/

 

[Deleted member]

I never used the words "perfectly represented". You brought that up in your post.

I misinterpeted that, my bad then.

Al-kīmiyā' I highlighted that for the sake of clarification. \(°|°)/ is meant to represent Chandelure, I use it in the end of my posts.

\(°|°)/

 

[Deleted member]

Chef Kawasaki seems like a character that was supposed to be more important, but then they just forgot to do it.

There's at least the anime, where he runs the only restaurant in town. :V

Though he strangely is one of the three Figurines that represents a character not present in Rainbow Curse, the other two being Meta Knight and King Dedede....

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Celica (with reworked Robin moveset)

Why cut Robin for Celica?

Their sword and magic styles aren't very similar.

Celica would make for a better stand alone newcomer and Robin is best keeping his niiche.

 

[AwesomeAussie27]

Ninten had won the poll fair and square. Giygas had somewhat of a following and so did Flying Man, then there's Lloyd. lol

But yeah, next up will be mostly Mother 3 with a certain Assist Trophy that should had never forgotten. Your choices are Porky Minch, Kumatora, Jeff, and Masked Man.

There was a problem fetching the tweet

Good luck.

 

[Edgelord_197]

If they really are going to add more FE characters, I think the choices they have are from the first Choose Your Legends poll(Lyn, Ephraim, or Hector etc), Echoes(Alm or Celica), FE Switch Lord, or even an OC from Heroes.

Also this my first post

Edit: if a character really needs to get cut, I say Corrin

 

[Chandeelure]

I misinterpeted that, my bad then.

Al-kīmiyā' I highlighted that for the sake of clarification. \(°|°)/ is meant to represent Chandelure, I use it in the end of my posts.

\(°|°)/

That's a Chandelure?

I thought it was a Waddle Dee with a butt face or something hahaha.

 

[Mr. Game + Watch]

I don't know much about mother 3 but I would pick porky because of the boss battle in brawl

 

[CrusherMania1592]

I made a visual representation of my speculation for the next smash bros installment.

Man, no need to bring back my feels from that night. Had my stomach turning even though I knew he was gonna die

I didn't mean as it replacing the chance of getting Chrom. Or that they are the same character. But in that their fighting styles outside of stats and techniques learned are basically the same. They both use the Falchion and had it and their fighting styles passed down from Marth. Lucina even tries to pass off as Marth and uses a fighting style that makes her believable to be him. A style she learned from Chrom. That is what I meant.

I really cannot see Chrom as a Marth clone at all. Chrom has to be a mix of Marth and Ike where he's faster than Ike, but slower than Marth. Not to mention more of an "I'm getting in your face" kind of sword fighting would work well for him

This is actually tougher to predict than what people think. The six FE characters we have right now () already do a decent job of representing the franchise, so besides a character from FE Switch, I don't think any FE character is close to having "practically guaranteed" odds. Some might be more likely than others, but overall, the chances of any of them being added range from mediocre to low.


I'm going to be a little more critical on FE DLC characters and say it's probably not happening unless...

(1) FE characters from Smash 4 are cut.

(2) A new FE game is released during the development of Smash DLC.

The way I look at it, it's fine the way it is. Unless they can do some tweaks like give Lucina a couple of moves involving a lance/bow, that would make her stand out more than a full clone of Marth

Now if my boy gets cut again, Imma go rage

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Why cut Robin for Celica?

Their sword and magic styles aren't very similar.

Celica would make for a better stand alone newcomer and Robin is best keeping his niiche.

I would like to keep Robin as he/she was one of my top desired characters for Smash 4 but I am trying to find room for both Echoes to be repped and Fire Emblem 16. Quite frankly the easiest choices are dropping Roy and Lucina but am not sure yet.

If they really are going to add more FE characters, I think the choices they have are from the first Choose Your Legends poll(Lyn, Ephraim, or Hector etc), Echoes(Alm or Celica), FE Switch Lord, or even an OC from Heroes.

Also this my first post

Edit: if a character really needs to get cut, I say Corrin

Moveset originality will be what saves Corrin.

 

[Bowserlick]

Thoughts on Fire Emblem Characters

1. My OCD appreciated Sakurai's three swords approach to Marth, Roy & Lucina. Power at the point, power at the base and even power along the full blade. However, I do not think this has to be carried over into another Smash. Roy is an easy cut. Lucina could return either as an alt or an easy version of Marth if time permits.

2. Ike and Robin should stay. Ike is a good foil to Marth (precision versus strength) with more differences than Roy had to Marth. Robin is an example of how Fire Emblem could be represented in the future. Break the addiction of counters and showcase other parts of the game.

3. Corrin can stay or be replaced with a new character. Corrin's mutable weapons, stylish Side B and ability to soft cover their weakness at close range with revolving blades offer enough uniqueness in a series with sword-wielding characters. I would love if if the counter was replaced. Too repetitive, outclasses other counters, and covers a weakness too well.

4. While I am fine with another Fire Emblem character, I'd rather see sword characters from another franchise over them. A different franchise has more opportunity to break the Fire Emblem mold of similar moves and counters. Fire Emblem characters seem to lend themselves to DLC. They can be mass produced, saving time and resources.