Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Deleted member]

also in Odyssey you can fly from Peach's Castle to New Donk City which definitely puts them in the same universe at some point

of course this is all if you want to even believe Mario does / should have any canon at all

I don't think there should be any canon for the mario universe, to be honest. I mean, the stories rarely extend beyond 'Peach is gone; go get her', so there's not much Lore to really create a universe with. Every time Bowser and/or minions kidnap her, Mario's got to traverse a bunch of different 'Kingdoms' that are always different, yet the same type (Desert, Ice, Water, etc), so I mean, without actually expounding on the story, there isn't enough Lore to create a really canon universe with. As far as I know, there's never been a 'true' sequel in which events of the previous game are directly referenced or used (except for Maybe Galaxy 2; I dont know...never played the Galaxy games).

EDIT: Random thought.....Why is Peach a Princess if she's the sole Monarch of the Mushroom Kingdom?

 

[yeahmattm8]

Prediction list -
Geno
Skull Kid
Bandana Dee
Isaac
Ray Man
Steve with Alex echo
Other echos - Ken, Shadow, Isabelle, Ninten and Black Shadow

 

[Justin Little]

Where does it say that in Mario +Rabbids?

In the opening for Donkey Kong Adventure, it says "Somewhere in another dimension..." So I guess that means they share a universe, but it's an alternate universe. What I can surmise is that there is a split timeline in this universe: One where Mario saves Pauline and one where Cranky "saves" Pauline (because we all know in my head that Cranky believed to be the hero of that game. He even refers himself as one).

 

[Deleted member]

The only canon Mario lore is the fact Bowser disowned 7 of his 8 children

Prediction list -
Geno
Skull Kid
Bandana Dee
Isaac
Ray Man
Steve with Alex echo
Other echos - Ken, Shadow, Isabelle, Ninten and Black Shadow

Who the **** is Alex?

 

[Rie Sonomura]

My predictions:
- Elma
- Incineroar
- Bandana Waddle Dee
- Chorus Kids
- Isaac
- Isabelle (Villager Echo)
- Ken (Ryu Echo)
- Lloyd Irving
- Square-Enix unique fighter that isn’t Geno, Agnès or another FF character (my money’s on my boi Neku)
- Dixie Kong (Diddy Echo if base roster; unique if DLC)
- surprise third party (Crash, Rayman or Banjo & Kazooie)

 

[Pacman High Tier]

The only canon Mario lore is the fact Bowser disowned 7 of his 8 children

Who the **** is Alex?

Alex is the female version of Steve introduced in later updates. Though she would probably be a skin and not an echo, like how PokemonTrainer does it.

 

[Llort A. Ton]

Prediction list -
Geno
Skull Kid
Bandana Dee
Isaac
Ray Man
Steve with Alex echo
Other echos - Ken, Shadow, Isabelle, Ninten and Black Shadow

2 MineCraft characters but still no Banjo? Man, you sure want to see this place burn, dont ya?

 

[Deleted member]

The only canon Mario lore is the fact Bowser disowned 7 of his 8 children

Maybe he didn't abandon them, but adopted them. Perhaps they were all the children of other Koopa lords competing for the role of 'King' and when they failed their respective families, were abandoned and subsequently adopted by King Koopa who then rebranded his Kingdom, became 'Bowser', and introduced 'Bowser Jr' as he and his new family renewed their efforts to rule all lands under a newer, stronger Family Banner.

 

[osby]

Alex has a better design than Steve, I wouldn't oppose to her.

 

[kylexv]

Predictions:

5 Newcomers
* Geno
* Isaac
* Elma
* Skull Kid
* Incineroar

5 Echoes
* Impa
* Dixie
* Isabelle
* Shadow
* Ken

 

[TMNTSSB4]

The Mario franchise is like the MCU (Marvel Cinematic Universe), they all come together when needed (kart racing, party games, olympics, Smash), but also do their own thing (fighting Bowser/K Rool, taking money from innocent gamers, tax fraud)

 

[Deleted member]

Might as well make some predictions.

• Geno
• Isaac
• Gen 7 Pokemon, personally banking on Primarina
• Isabelle
• Rayman
• Ken(Echo)
• Shadow(Echo)
• Impa(Echo)

These would be considered safe(except Primarina over Incineroar), now for some out there "I could see happening but I'm not gonna hold my breath for them and I don't see more than one making it in"

• Bandana Dee
• Dixie Kong(Echo or not)
• Wonder-Red(let me dream)
• Another Square character
• Tails
• Black Knight(Echo)
• Hector(unique, yes)
• Alolan Trainer
• A Rhythm Heaven character
• Skull Kid

Alex is the female version of Steve introduced in later updates. Though she would probably be a skin and not an echo, like how PokemonTrainer does it.

Oh, OH. Man, it has been a long time since I last played Minecraft, hasn't it? But yeah, she seems more likely as a skin considering her and Steve are non-characters.

Maybe he didn't abandon them, but adopted them. Perhaps they were all the children of other Koopa lords competing for the role of 'King' and when they failed their respective families, were abandoned and subsequently adopted by King Koopa who then rebranded his Kingdom, became 'Bowser', and introduced 'Bowser Jr' as he and his new family renewed their efforts to rule all lands under a newer, stronger Family Banner.

I like this and it's really wholesome but this implies Super Mario World is the furthest in the Mario timeline where Bowser Jr. is nowhere to be seen

 

[ThatGuyWhoKnowsNothing]

The only canon Mario lore is the fact Bowser disowned 7 of his 8 children

Who the **** is Alex?

Alex is the female skin of Steve, it's completely unnessecary to make her an echo, alt costume at most, but she could be an echo, if you really wanted, though I'd go with herobrine over Alex as a Steve echo
Darn it, almost, but I got beat to it

 

[BlueMagician]

Yoshi’s series is a strange vestigial appendage in Smash because Yoshi actually had good non-Mario games when 64 released. At least they had the decency to kill F-Zero when they ran out of ideas.

Not true, they tried to get the Burnout/Need for Speed team to make a new F-Zero game in the series for the Wii U. F-Zero being dormant is unintentional.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Not true, they tried to get the Burnout/Need for Speed team to make a new F-Zero game in the series for the Wii U. F-Zero being dormant is unintentional.

I like to think Nintendo is actively trying to put out a new F-Zero game but keeps running into obstacles along the way.

Now, Mother/EarthBound, that one is finished. At least, Itoi said he wouldn’t make any more Mother games himself. He did iirc say anyone else is free to take up the reins, but it just wouldn’t be the same without him.

 

[yeahmattm8]

The only canon Mario lore is the fact Bowser disowned 7 of his 8 children

Who the **** is Alex?

It's the three pixel wide armed version of a minecraft skin Alex represents it like how Steve does the traditional 4 pixel armed model

Alex is the female skin of Steve, it's completely unnessecary to make her an echo, alt costume at most, but she could be an echo, if you really wanted, though I'd go with herobrine over Alex as a Steve echo
Darn it, almost, but I got beat to it

Didn't realise you already got to it lol, also both Alex and Herobrine would be good alts if not echos.
Does Microsoft even acknowledge Herobrine though?

2 MineCraft characters but still no Banjo? Man, you sure want to see this place burn, dont ya?

Skin or alt doesn't bother me, just thought they might receive the Ritcher treatment

 

[Llort A. Ton]

Didn't realise you already got to it lol, also both Alex and Herobrine would be good alts if not echos.
Does Microsoft even acknowledge Herobrine though?

I remember Herobrine made cameos in artwork back in the day, and the devs always joked about "removing Herobrine" in the patch notes everytime a update came out, but I dont thunk he was ever in the game itself.

 

[CosmicQuark]

While all speculation, even fantasy speculation, is fun, it's hard to speculate about Steve as he's not even a character.

My predictions have changed over time, though I'm keeping my old speculation in my signature intact as I feel it would be disingenuous to change mine all the time, even when new information arrives. It's set in stone, even though I no longer think it's the case.

Predictions as of Aug 31:
1. Incineroar
2. Skull Kid
3. Isaac
4. Banjo & Kazooie
5. Geno
6. Dixie Kong (echo)
7. Isabelle (echo)
8. Ken (echo)
9. Shadow (echo)

EDIT: Forgot Felix, though again, it's hard to fit him in without getting rid of obvious/rumored characters. I think if Isaac's in, Felix seems likely as an echo. Though it could very well be that Isaac's not, and someone like Bandana Waddle Dee is in.

My predictions are pretty safe, and nothing out there from typical speculation. It's just I really think we're only getting 8-9 more characters, including echoes, and it's getting more difficult to sort through rumors with how many potential newcomers we have left. I definitely expect, and hope, that one or two rumored characters are replaced with someone who's genuinely surprising, like Richter was.

 

[Deleted member]

Might as well make some predictions.

• Geno
• Isaac
• Gen 7 Pokemon, personally banking on Primarina
• Isabelle
• Rayman
• Ken(Echo)
• Shadow(Echo)
• Impa(Echo)

These would be considered safe(except Primarina over Incineroar), now for some out there "I could see happening but I'm not gonna hold my breath for them and I don't see more than one making it in"

• Bandana Dee
• Dixie Kong(Echo or not)
• Wonder-Red(let me dream)
• Another Square character
• Tails
• Black Knight(Echo)
• Hector(unique, yes)
• Alolan Trainer
• A Rhythm Heaven character
• Skull Kid

Any particular reason you're banking on Primarina out of ALL options, or is your thought process literally just "**** Incineroar"? :/

Because not going to lie, it's heavily coming off as the latter since you're "banking" on one that makes little sense to begin with. Decidueye and Incineroar would really be the only two Starters that would be given serious consideration, so if the fighter in Smash is neither of them, it logically wouldn't be Primarina either....

 

[Fenriraga]

Predictions? Wheeeeeee.

*Geno (The fact that I feel like I can say that without bias feels SO GOOD)
*Elma
*A Namco Rep, I'm thinking either Hehachi or Lloyd
*Gen 7 Mon
*Shadow (Echo)
*Isabelle (Echo)
*One more, less expected "suprise" echo

 

[MasterOfKnees]

If we're doing predictions I'm going:

Newcomers:
Tapu Koko
Bandana Dee
Skull Kid
Geno

Echoes:
Isabelle
Impa
Ken
Shadow

But I fully expect to be wrong, the general consensus is probably going to change once more after the next reveal. I'm also trying to be on the cautious side when it comes to the amount of characters we're yet to see, I could still see us getting one or even two more characters in each category.

 

[ThatGuyWhoKnowsNothing]

Predictions? Wheeeeeee.

*Geno
*Elma
*A Namco Rep, I'm thinking either Hehachi or Lloyd
*Gen 7 Mon
*Shadow (Echo)
*Isabelle (Echo)
*One more, less expected "suprise" echo

Sakurai as a Bayoneta echo?
You know you want to see it now

 

[Cosmic77]

I like to think Nintendo is actively trying to put out a new F-Zero game but keeps running into obstacles along the way.

Now, Mother/EarthBound, that one is finished. At least, Itoi said he wouldn’t make any more Mother games himself. He did iirc say anyone else is free to take up the reins, but it just wouldn’t be the same without him.

EarthBound is dead, but not in the sense of "It's gone forever".

As much as I love the series, I can't deny that it would be a very difficult franchise to revive. Past sales haven't been the best, the creator is officially done, and most of the studios Nintendo owns would rather work on different franchises or do something original. That being said, I'm positive it'll return one day. Might be years from now until that happens, but Ness being in Smash ensures that EarthBound is saved from falling into complete obscurity.

 

[yeahmattm8]

A

If we're doing predictions I'm going:

Newcomers:
Tapu Koko
Bandana Dee
Skull Kid
Geno

Echoes:
Isabelle
Impa
Ken
Shadow

But I fully expect to be wrong, the general consensus is probably going to change after the next reveal. I'm also trying to be on the cautious side when it comes to the amount of characters we're yet to see, I could still see us getting one or even two more characters in each category.

Who's Tapu Koko?
Also not that I necessarily want him in but does anyone else think Elecman could be Megaman's echo?
Since Zero's the new assist and he's wasn't in Megaman's final smash like Proto and Bass

 

[MSmariosonic]

Sure why not

My prediction:

Pure Newcomers:
Skull Kid
7th gen rep
Geno
Namco rep
Isaac

Echoes:
Shadow
Ken
Dixie Kong
Impa
Isabelle

 

[yeahmattm8]

Sakurai as a Bayoneta echo?
You know you want to see it now

Sakurai should be a Falcon echo

 

[Zathura]

A


Who's Tapu Koko?
Also not that I necessarily want him in but does anyone else think Elecman could be Megaman's echo?
Since Zero's the new assist and he's wasn't in Megaman's final smash like Proto and Bass

Don't really see how that would work, elecman doesn't have all the other robot master powers

 

[Androobie]

Here are my predictions as of now:

1. Isaac
2. Geno
3. Skull Kid
4. Isabelle (echo)
5. Shadow (echo)
6. Ken (echo)

 

[Deleted member]

Any particular reason you're banking on Primarina out of ALL options, or is your thought process literally just "**** Incineroar"? :/

Because not going to lie, it's heavily coming off as the latter since your "banking" on one that makes little sense.

Yes

Serious answer, I just don't see what Incineroar brings over other Pokemon when his whole thing can be replicated by many other characters. The only thing he has over others currently is Verg saying it's none of the three that were most discussed and one of his sources explicitely saying Incineroar.
Besides, I wanna make some bold predictions instead of the boring ones I see all the time.

 

[yeahmattm8]

Like everyone's list have at least 3-6 of the same characters
Honestly makes me think most will be in

 

[Fenriraga]

Random thought.....Why is Peach a Princess if she's the sole Monarch of the Mushroom Kingdom?

Because Princesses are more relatable and less imposing than Queens, especially for young girls.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I like to think Nintendo is actively trying to put out a new F-Zero game but keeps running into obstacles along the way.

We technically already had a new F-Zero game

Spoiler

 

[New_Dumal]

My predictions:

• Dixie (Echo)
• Shadow (Echo)
• Isabelle (Echo)
• Banjo & Kazooei
• Geno
• Ken (Echo)
• Isaac

DLC:

• Sora
• A new Pokemon
• Travis Touchdown (please Sakurai)
• Rayman

I'd be so happy with this roster and I think it's possible.

 

[osby]

I want to make interesting predictions but I'm pretty sure we'll get nothing but ballot characters so it's not really possible.

 

[yeahmattm8]

Don't really see how that would work, elecman doesn't have all the other robot master powers

I don't know much about Megaman so I'll go with you on that and as I said couldn't care less about him

I want to make interesting predictions but I'm pretty sure we'll get nothing but ballot characters so it's not really possible.

I hope Sakurai does at least one joke or unsuspected newcomer

 

[domriver]

Like everyone's list have at least 3-6 of the same characters
Honestly makes me think most will be in

It certainly what comes to mind if you think about it. Sakurai could always and probably will throw a curve ball somewhere. jeje

 

[CosmicQuark]

My predictions:

• Dixie (Echo)
• Shadow (Echo)
• Isabelle (Echo)
• Banjo & Kazooei
• Geno
• Ken (Echo)
• Isaac

DLC:

• Sora
• A new Pokemon
• Travis Touchdown (please Sakurai)
• Rayman

I'd be so happy with this roster and I think it's possible.

I actually think Travis Touchdown has a high chance at DLC. Many people want indie representation, Travis Touchdown was featured in the Switch's reveal presentation, and I feel like if Sakurai would break a barrier like having playable indie fighters it would be someone heavily requested in Japan.

 

[Zathura]

My predictions I guess:

Geno
Isaac
Skull Kid
Bandana Dee
7th Gen Pokemon
Chorus Kids/ Rhythm heaven rep (still can't believe nobody says them anymore, honestly seem extremely likely to me)

Idk about echoes any is fine

I don't know much about Megaman so I'll go with you on that and as I said couldn't care less about him

fair enough, I thought you might not

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

My predictions are all pretty standard

• Bandana Dee (This one I'm sure of)
• Dixie Kong (maybe I'm biased but my gut says unique/semi-clone, even if she was planned as an echo I could see her being further differentiated as development went on, plus she was planned for brawl after all. Could be an echo though, but I'm sure she's in in some form)
• Geno
• Elma (I was unsure but after Xenoblade 2 and no Xenoblade updates or Xenoblade X content period I think it's gonna happen)
• A gen 7 pokemon
• Isaac
• Possibly Skull Kid

4 more echoes sounds good to me, giving us 10 total

• Isabelle (villager echo)
• Impa (Sheik echo)
• Shadow (Sonic echo)
• Ken (Ryu echo)

10 unique characters and 8 new echoes sounds like a good amount imo.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh wait, I forgot to add Yu Narukami to my predictions. I really think we'll see a Persona rep on this game and their moveset potential is just too good to pass up. No, and not Joker, he hasn't appeared in a Nintendo console yet.

I want to make interesting predictions but I'm pretty sure we'll get nothing but ballot characters so it's not really possible.

Simon and Richter were certainly not high in the ballot so I don't think so.
I do think it'll be mainly popular characters but not necessarily popular in the ballot(Simon), or even within the Smash fanbase(Richter).
I also severely doubt either Chrom and Dark Samus ranked as highly as characters like K.Rool so we may get some characters who didn't even break into the Top 10