Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[KMDP]

Some taglines I just came up with.

• Isaac shakes the Earth!
  • Felix lucks out!
• Bandana Dee pokes his way in!
• Isabelle sorts it out!
• Shadow brings the Chaos!
• Tails flies into Battle!
• Dixie whirls in!
• Medusa petrifies the crowd!
• Roll cleans up!
• Vaati blows everyone away!
• Celica shines bright!
• Geno is the Star!

 

[MainJPW]

They have the same context, just different sounds.

I’m surprised no one ever mentions the “Oof” from Super Mario 64.

 

[CroonerMike]

I really don't think we are getting anything at Gamescom. I mean, we just had a direct this month guys.

 

[DarkFalcon]

Triple A stuff has to move around very quickly, and even game development in general. A week sounds like little time, but when you have anywhere between 500-1000 people all touching their hands on the game, and you only have less than 100 weeks, stuff is bound to happen, and it's bound to happen very quickly. During the Melee era, it's been stated that 7 clones were easier to do than just 1 newcomer, and while the tools have definitely improved for adding a newcomer, by that logic, they've also improved for adding echo's/glorified alt costumes as I like to call them.

source: hi I'm a game dev

Huh. Today I learned. Though I still would guess some echoes would take longer than others depending on how many animation changes there are, and Melee clones had different weight and properties compared to clones nowadays. As an example, Falco in Melee shared all his animations with Fox, but had different speed and weight compared to him. While Lucina shares basically everything with Marth but doesn't have the tipper mechanic. Meaning Lucina should have been easier as a clone than Falco was back then.

 

[Nazyrus]

Oh god please… if the pokemon talk is gonna be about the SAME choices over and over again, there are character speculation threads specifically made for those at this time for sure… But feel free to talk about new options here if you want, just don't add up to 10 pages of it, lol.

 

[Will]

If we need new topics of discussion I vote we argue whether or not Alpharad is actually funny

Name one YouTuber that specifically only plays Nintendo games that's funny.

come on don't be shy

 

[MamaLuigi123456]

People try to bring up "oh, you could show any random joe a picture of X and they'll know them right away, but show them character Y and they won't recognize them."

But like... Ultimate is not being made for the average joe. It's being made specifically for the Smash fanbase as "EVERYONE IS HERE" and high-demand characters like show.

 

[DarkFalcon]

According to Sakurai, the six Melee clones altogether didn't equal the work of one unique newcomer, and while the Echoes can have adjusted animations, they still don't appear to be as different gameplay-wise as the Melee clones were. Based on that quote regarding the Melee clones, for a rough estimate I think Echoes require somewhere around the 5-15% range of the work of a unique newcomer, with the likes of Dark Pit and Richter being in the lower end while the likes of Dark Samus are in the higher end.

Yea that was my thought process as well. Because for a while I thought something like "well if they add a ton of echoes, that would have to eventually lead to the development time of a character right?"

I didn't realize that even Melee style clones were that easy with adjusted speed and properties.

 

[Nazyrus]

I really don't think we are getting anything at Gamescom. I mean, we just had a direct this month guys.

I mean… we thought so about EVO and here we are… also, the closer we get to the game release, the more characters have to be revealed until they have revealed them all. After all Sakurai said they would be all shown before release. Two things can happen… there will be a reveal not so distantly from the last one from here and on… or they are all gonna be saved for one smash focused direct around october or november… i doubt the latter, as they will want to keep this game hyped every month considering it's going to be one of those that sells like crazy, so i think constant reveals (like one or two per month) is not far from reality. Of course, it depends on how many newcomers are left to be revealed… if many, then constant reveals, if not many… then very distant reveals. Those are the two ways i think it can go. And let's remember… just 3 months now

 

[prowler12]

smash has always been a game for nintendo fans

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

If we need new topics of discussion I vote we argue whether or not Alpharad is actually funny

How about discussing Miyu and Fay's chances? Seeing as Krystal can barely get into Smash as is.

I really don't think we are getting anything at Gamescom. I mean, we just had a direct this month guys.

Yes, if anything we should wait and see if there's an ordinary Direct next month.

 

[Paperchampion23]

According to Sakurai, the six Melee clones altogether didn't equal the work of one unique newcomer, and while the Echoes can have adjusted animations, they still don't appear to be as different gameplay-wise as the Melee clones were. Based on that quote regarding the Melee clones, for a rough estimate I think Echoes require somewhere around the 5-15% range of the work of a unique newcomer, with the likes of Dark Pit and Richter being in the lower end while the likes of Dark Samus are in the higher end.

This is why I wouldn't be shocked if there are a hell of a lot more echoes than we think.

I mean, why introduce the concept of echoes, give options like hiding them in the corner of the character select, and more if you are only going to introduce a small population of them. Even 10 Echoes seems too small to me.

 

[DarkFalcon]

I don't expect a new reveal. We just had the direct. At the very most, I could maybe see an Echo revealed.

 

[Nazyrus]

How about discussing Miyu and Fay's chances? Seeing as Krystal can barely get into Smash as is.



Yes, if anything we should wait and see if there's an ordinary Direct next month.

I wouldn't be surprised if at gamescom there is an announcement for an announcement, just like it happened at EVO. A general nintendo direct has been needed for quite a while now. God knows some bunch of weirdos disliked the idea of a smash focused direct after E3, those weirdos probably are desperate for a general nintendo direct right now, and rightfully so, we do need one for the upcoming games in holiday season and such.

 

[Will]

smash has always been a game for nintendo fans

hell yeah dude nintendo all the way

 

[CroonerMike]

I mean… we thought so about EVO and here we are… also, the closer we get to the game release, the more characters have to be revealed until they have revealed them all. After all Sakurai said they would be all shown before release. Two things can happen… there will be a reveal not so distantly from the last one from here and on… or they are all gonna be saved for one smash focused direct around october or november… i doubt the latter, as they will want to keep this game hyped every month considering it's going to be one of those that sells like crazy, so i think constant reveals (like one or two per month) is not far from reality. Of course, it depends on how many newcomers are left to be revealed… if many, then constant reveals, if not many… then very distant reveals. Those are the two ways i think it can go. And let's remember… just 3 months now

Yeah, I agree with you except the fact that e3 was in June and Evo was early August. I would expect something more in September. Hey, I'd rather be wrong.

 

[SquashiniKun]

I mean… we thought so about EVO and here we are… also, the closer we get to the game release, the more characters have to be revealed until they have revealed them all. After all Sakurai said they would be all shown before release. Two things can happen… there will be a reveal not so distantly from the last one from here and on… or they are all gonna be saved for one smash focused direct around october or november… i doubt the latter, as they will want to keep this game hyped every month considering it's going to be one of those that sells like crazy, so i think constant reveals (like one or two per month) is not far from reality. Of course, it depends on how many newcomers are left to be revealed… if many, then constant reveals, if not many… then very distant reveals. Those are the two ways i think it can go. And let's remember… just 3 months now

I'm expecting a character reveal at Gamescom, we've seen Nintendo reveal content there before.

 

[Paperchampion23]

People try to bring up "oh, you could show any random joe a picture of X and they'll know them right away, but show them character Y and they won't recognize them."

But like... Ultimate is not being made for the average joe. It's being made specifically for the Smash fanbase as "EVERYONE IS HERE" and high-demand characters like show.

Really starting to wonder if "Everyone is here" will truly stretch to newcomers as well. For most people, Geno, Isaac, Banjo and a few others are what truly would make this the most complete Nintendo fighting rep game for them.

On top of this, we have no idea how many Echoes will be made or considered, which can fill a slew of other requests.

Really think we are getting played in some way ("not too many new characters") but we'll see.

Edit: And what I mean by "Complete", I mean by having most of the top popularity characters like the ones mentioned finally joining. This is by far the only smash game taking character choices from fans to heart. This hasn't happened before.

 

[Will]

I'm expecting a character reveal at Gamescom, we've seen Nintendo reveal content there before.

Did a Smash reveal ever happen at Gamescon?

 

[Nazyrus]

I'm expecting a character reveal at Gamescom, we've seen Nintendo reveal content there before.

Absolutely, Arms got one, I don't see why Smash wouldn't, specially to promote the game more and more slowly. Also they have the attention of fans outside nintendo there, so 3rd party characters are a great option to be revealed at such event, imo.

 

[PlugMeister]

Did a Smash reveal ever happen at Gamescon?

Last year, they revealed Lola Pop for ARMS at Gamescom. Who knows what's possibly next, if anything?

 

[Nazyrus]

Really think we are getting played in some way ("not too many new characters") but we'll see.

Yeah i never believed the "don't expect too many new characters" from Sakurai. The man was clearly joking cause he knows that's what we love and he even made the comedic pause after he said that. Anyone who took that phrase seriously needs a sarcasm detector, lol

 

[Rie Sonomura]

Maybe not a full on direct, but a Direct Mini and/or surprise stream with a reveal or two...?

I’m kinda expecting it to be

Spoiler: Xenoblade 2 Datamine Spoiler

Elma - there’s an upcoming patch for Xenoblade 2 that adds her as an enemy Blade that can be recruited upon defeat. Perhaps a Smash reveal for her at the same time could be expected...?

 

[Will]

Last year, they revealed Lola Pop for ARMS at Gamescom. Who knows what's possibly next, if anything?

nonononononononononononono.

SMASH direct. S-M-A-S-H, not ARMS. Unless Gamescon wasn't alive 4 years ago, that doesn't answer my question.

 

[Omega Tyrant]

Also you have way too much confidence in your own intuition, you keep bringing up how you have been "doing smash speculation for nearly two decades" or whatever and look, I don't give a damn lol.

Hey don't diss JohnKnight's superior Smash speculation experience, because of him we knew Ninka Kiwi's Smash 4 leak was fake as Duck Hunt Dog was just a joke character and Sakurai would absolutely never add him to Smash..........oh wait.

 

[Nazyrus]

Yeah, I agree with you except the fact that e3 was in June and Evo was early August. I would expect something more in September. Hey, I'd rather be wrong.

I know there's the thing between E3 and August… but like i said, the closer we get to the release of the game, the less time they have to reveal characters. Depending on how many, they will either spread the reveals oftenly… or not so often. The worst part is that… we don't know how many are left, lol, so it's difficult to predict really…

 

[DarkFalcon]

Yeah i never believed the "don't expect too many new characters" from Sakurai. The man was clearly joking cause he knows that's what we love and he even made the comedic pause after he said that. Anyone who took that phrase seriously needs a sarcasm detector, lol

We had like 14 newcomers for Smash 4. We're 4 months away from launch and have 4 unique newcomers. Echoes are cool and all, but they don't equal 1 unique newcomer. He wasn't lying.

 

[Deleted member]

Hey don't diss JohnKnight's superior Smash speculation experience, because of him we knew Ninka Kiwi's Smash 4 leak was fake as Duck Hunt Dog was just a joke character and Sakurai would absolutely never add him to Smash..........oh wait.

I dunno what game you've been playing this whole time, but the Chorus Kids are seriously ruining Smash 4. Our only hope is the Chrom players. He's so much fun to watch. If we had Duck Hunt Dog in the game, things would be different.

 

[Nazyrus]

Maybe not a full on direct, but a Direct Mini and/or surprise stream with a reveal or two...?

I’m kinda expecting it to be

Spoiler: Xenoblade 2 Datamine Spoiler

Elma - there’s an upcoming patch for Xenoblade 2 that adds her as an enemy Blade that can be recruited upon defeat. Perhaps a Smash reveal for her at the same time could be expected...?

Wasn't there a leak or two supposedly saying we would get a Nindies direct? or is that highly unlikely? I can't remember... I know i read it sometime paaaaages ago. DaybreakHorizon should know.

 

[PlugMeister]

Yeah i never believed the "don't expect too many new characters" from Sakurai. The man was clearly joking cause he knows that's what we love and he even made the comedic pause after he said that. Anyone who took that phrase seriously needs a sarcasm detector, lol

I still really take the "don't expect too many newcomers" thing to heart, because Sakurai said the most focus is being put on polishing all of the returning veterans instead of newcomers this time around. Heck, I thought that Ridley was going to be the only newcomer besides Inkling, and I wouldn't be surprised if we only got one more newcomer before release (there are only 4 months left, ya know) and no future DLC.

 

[CroonerMike]

Yeah i never believed the "don't expect too many new characters" from Sakurai. The man was clearly joking cause he knows that's what we love and he even made the comedic pause after he said that. Anyone who took that phrase seriously needs a sarcasm detector, lol

What happens when he's telling the truth? What are you going to do? lol

Not that I wouldn't want more characters and what not. I personally believe we are getting 4-5 more fully newcomers and at least 5 more echo characters.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Huh. Today I learned. Though I still would guess some echoes would take longer than others depending on how many animation changes there are, and Melee clones had different weight and properties compared to clones nowadays. As an example, Falco in Melee shared all his animations with Fox, but had different speed and weight compared to him. While Lucina shares basically everything with Marth but doesn't have the tipper mechanic. Meaning Lucina should have been easier as a clone than Falco was back then.

Indeed! Weight and stuff is still easier to change as well; the hard changes are making like, completely new moves.

Also I messed up, in this case, less than 150 weeks.

 

[prowler12]

hell yeah dude nintendo all the way

with GUEST STARS

 

[Pakky]

Spoiler: Naruto

I'm sorry, I'm sorry, this was mean but I had to.

Spoiler: Mr.Pants

 

[Nazyrus]

I still really take the "don't expect too many characters" thing to heart, because Sakurai said the most focus is being put on polishing all of the returning veterans instead of newcomers this time around. Heck, I thought that Ridley was going to be the only newcomer besides Inkling, and I wouldn't be surprised if we only got one more newcomer before release (there are only 4 months left, ya know) and no future DLC.

If there is something i know of Sakurai… is that he focus on everything, every aspect of his games. But you're right, maybe we only have one newcomer left for all we know. We won't ever know how many are left until the game actually releases or Sakurai himself says that they all are finally revealed (and even so… i wouldn't believe that would be it, lol. He always has something more… but can't be too greedy I guess).

 

[Rocket Raccoon]

If we need new topics of discussion I vote we argue whether or not Alpharad is actually funny

At first, then after he cancelled How To X 101 I unsubscribed.

 

[Deleted member]

Spoiler: Naruto

Naruto! Naruto!
Believe it! Believe it!
Here I am with my Ninja Clan!
Ninja Clan, here we stand!
Naruto, I'm on my way,
Naruto, I'll be okay!
Getting ready to fight on set!
Come on best friends by my side!
Sasuke, is really cool!
Sakura, the beautiful!
Kowagaruna Naruto
Saoto mamore~

 

[MainJPW]

If there is something i know of Sakurai… is that he focus on everything, every aspect of his games. But you're right, maybe we only have one newcomer left for all we know. We won't ever know how many are left until the game actually releases or Sakurai himself says that they all are finally revealed (and even so… i wouldn't believe that would be it, lol. He always has something more… but can't be too greedy I guess).

Pretty sure Sakurai said there are a few more characters to be announced later on.

 

[Will]

with GUEST STARS

What is Bayonetta exactly a star of? Beat 'em ups?

 

[P.Kat]

Spoiler: Miyu (Star Fox)

Spoiler: Morrigan Aensland

Spoiler: Cranky Kong

So, I got to thinking, what if Morrigan was in Smash and revived DarkStalkers

Silly I know but as a follow up to what I said early.

The sea of video games is vast with icons being made every day, adding aliens to the medium is not only a meme but an insult.

Goku (From Dragonball) is a Japanese manga icon, not a video game one.





Gil is BIG I mean REALL BIG, I didn't even know. He has his own anime or rahter the game series did, back in like '09.

Great Miyu design, I wouldn't mind getting her, or Fay, as newcomers or echoes in Smash for Star Fox.

Partially why I wouldn't be surprised if he was the Bamco Character Sakurai chose (if there is another Bamco character in the game).
He fits the bill as a Retro character to me.

Valkyrie would also be a good choice.