Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[lordvaati]

Mona was Among my most wanted back in ye olde days so I can dig her. I could even see a bunch of flexible options for moves playing on her different roles from all the part time jobs she had in the series.

 

[prowler12]

Isabelle easily. As the only Nintendo A-lister aside from Inkling made in the Wii U/3DS gen, she'll definitely be one of the first characters considered

isabelle is a pacifist

 

[Dragoncharystary]

Anyone else think people in Japan speculate on a Grand Theft Auto character getting into Smash due to western popularity in the same way we speculate on Reimu because of Japanese popularity?

 

[Mc.Rad]

https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/1022647762591141889
You know what?

Never mind what I just said, I think that we'll just have a random tweet pop out for an announcement for a Smash Bros character.

 

[KMDP]

Isabelle easily. As the only Nintendo A-lister aside from Inkling made in the Wii U/3DS gen, she'll definitely be one of the first characters considered

isabelle is a pacifist

This.

Also, someone countered my point about Isabelle being a pacifist a few days ago with characters like Villager, Wii Fit Trainer and Duck Hunt; that's not the same thing (Villager and WFT don't have characters to go against, the Dog is a Hunting Dog).

 

[Radical Bones]

isabelle is a pacifist

She wouldn't be the only one on the roster.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

isabelle is a pacifist

So is

Smash likes to make characters who don't usually fight into fighters.

 

[Aeronite's Kiseki]

Would anyone want Saki Amamiya as a playable?

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Let me cover just about every answer.

Celica

Fire Emblem: Echoes was coming out when Sakurai was making the project plan.​

Elma

Same as Celica, Xenoblade Chronicles X was the most recent XB game.​

Isabelle

Most pupular Animal Crossing character.​

Ashley

Very popular Wario Ware character.​

Tifa Lockhart

Along with Sephiroth, she almost always follows Cloud in spinoffs (especially sequels); see: Ergheiz, Kingdom Hearts 2, Dissidia 012 Final Fantasy.​

EDIT: forgot someone
Dixie Kong

Very popular DKC character, recently reappeared in Tropical Freeze, so is in the same boat as Celica and Elma.​

Where the hell is the GOAT Boom Amy Rose?

Anyone else think people in Japan speculate on a Grand Theft Auto character getting into Smash due to western popularity in the same way we speculate on Reimu because of Japanese popularity?

A GTA character in Smash would be so weird...but interesting

Nintendo and Microsoft have been very close to one another in recent years, especially on Twitter. In fact recently they have now been supporting cross-play with each other...and guess which game was used to showcase that

And they have worked on smaller projects before in the past, as stated by Phil Spencer- to be specific the small things being a Banjo-Kazooie game on the GBA, MechAssault on the DS and getting the DKC games on the eShop. There is even rumors that a Rare collection port almost was finalized for the Wii-U.

And as for Indies...lest we forget Commander Video did get a trophy in Smash 4. I'm not saying it's gonna happen, but it's far above never happen tier.

The Nintendo/Sega/Microsoft love triangle alone is why Banjo Kazooie should join Smash before any Microsoft owned characters like Steve...or Master Chief

 

[KMDP]

So is

Smash likes to make characters who don't usually fight into fighters.

I have to disagree with this argument. But I don't want to repeat myself literally on the same page.

Where the hell is the GOAT Boom Amy Rose?

Amy in any form wouldn't come before Tails, Shadow and Eggman.

Cloud, Tifa and Sephiroth are the go-to FF7 characters in every spinoff. If Cloud is in a game, chances are the other two are or will be eventually.

 

[prowler12]

what would isabelle's moves consist of

 

[Knight Dude]

No one said Dixie Kong yet? She probably did pretty well on that ballot.

 

[92MilesPrower]

*AUX CALL PUSH SELECT*

Snake: Gahh... My back is killing me all of a sudden, Mei Ling. It feels like a Metal Gear is stepping on me! Wait a minute, isn't that one of the exercise trainers from Wii Fit over there?

Mei Ling: I think maybe it's because you've been sneaking around the place too much for no good reason, but a person like them should definitely be able to help. They're a master at whipping people back into shape, and I'm pretty sure they can help you fix your posture issue.

Snake: What in the world do you think I even do when I'm not fighting? For what reason would I be "sneaking around?"

Mei Ling: I mean, it's pretty clear that you have somewhat of an interest in a certain bounty hunter...

Snake: ...Really? I'm just gonna change the topic and try to figure out how to approach the Wii Fit Trainer and ask them to help me with my back, I just want this pain to finally go away. As long as I don't have to use their dumb Balance Board thing...

 

[Murlough]

This.

Also, someone countered my point about Isabelle being a pacifist a few days ago with characters like Villager, Wii Fit Trainer and Duck Hunt; that's not the same thing (Villager and WFT don't have characters to go against, the Dog is a Hunting Dog).

So, Villager doesn't count as a pacifist because he has no opponents to go against canonically......how exactly is that different from Isabelle?

Those two are in the exact same boat.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

https://www.smashbros.com/it_IT/index.html

Captain Falcon is the character update today. I'm no translator, so I can't really say what the post says in English. Hopefully the English site is updated soon.

 

[Rie Sonomura]

https://twitter.com/NintendoAmerica/status/1022647762591141889
You know what?

Never mind what I just said, I think that we'll just have a random tweet pop out for an announcement for a Smash Bros character.

...Labo confirmed...?

 

[lordvaati]

isabelle is a pacifist

She wasn't exactly throwing words of encouragement at dudes in Mario Kart 8 now was she?

 

[KMDP]

what would isabelle's moves consist of

Good question!

I don't know.

I saw someone suggest a "secretarial" variant of Villager's moves (e.g. replacing tripping with the flower pot with tripping with a stack of papers), but... eh...

She wasn't exactly throwing words of encouragement at dudes in Mario Kart 8 now was she?

Racing against people in Go-Karts (no matter how ungodly dangerous the Go-Karts are) is not the same as beating the crap out of people.

 

[Enderwoman]

It's not the basis, But It's definitely a Factor, And Bayo didn't get in because she was available, She got in Because fans wanted her, and Nintendo had the rights.

Nintendo doesn't own the rights to Bayonetta, that is something completely different from the rights to publish something. However, the fact that Sakurai easily has connections to Platinum games through Nintendo makes it a simple negotiation.

And some of us still dislike Cloud being included. Just for the record.

For some of us who like to debate character inclusions, it still matters personally.

lol

Well, whether you believe it or not, Sakurai pretty clearly lays out the situation with Cloud unfolded something like this: (1) People wanted something from Final Fantasy, a series very important to Nintendo, (2) Sakurai saw Cloud was the most popular in that series, (3) Sakurai at least considered Nintendo based FF characters, but is ultimately concerned with global recognition of the Nintendo console FF characters (since the series really exploded into mainstream with FFVII), (4) Sakurai used Nintendo appearances to legitimize Cloud's appearance, implying that he still considers Nintendo appearances a major concern.

you are interpreting that quote so selectively that you are missing the entire point of it, that being it makes more sense to include a popular character rather than obsess over one that is on Nintendo. they never even MENTION Final Fantasy's significance to Nintendo systems. like, dude, cmon

 

[KMDP]

So, Villager doesn't count as a pacifist because he has no opponents to go against canonically......how exactly is that different from Isabelle?

Those two are in the exact same boat.

I meant Villager doesn't have a personality, Murlough. You can read whatever traits you want into them because they are a blank slate.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

I have to disagree with this argument. But I don't want to repeat myself literally on the same page.

Amy in any form wouldn't come before Tails, Shadow and Eggman.

Cloud, Tifa and Sephiroth are the go-to FF7 characters in every spinoff. If Cloud is in a game, chances are the other two are or will be eventually.

Well tbf, those guys aren’t females

 

[Blargg888]

So is

Smash likes to make characters who don't usually fight into fighters.

Being a pacifist means that you are opposed to or against war and violence, not that you aren't capable of or do not practice violence.

We don't actually know if Dr. Mario is a pacifist, it's just that being a Doctor isn't really a job that requires violence.
Villager is a silent, characterless MC, so he doesn't have an opinion in that regard, and WFT just practices Yoga, and never really does anything else. But it's never stated that they are pacifists if I remember correctly.

As far as Isabelle's pacifism goes, I'm pretty sure she never literally says that she's a "pacifist" , though I believe that she mentions that she doesn't particularly like confrontation and fighting, which is where the claim comes from.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Obviously this is why this factor needs to be weakened. As well as have him not drop like a brick. Otherwise it won't be balanced enough.

But yeah, that was my point. He needs less super armor/weight, but still should have a lot of weight to represent the original boss well enough.

In the end, there's a good reason why Metal Mario is not a separate character. And besides, the game can just give Mario a permanent metal status if it wants to recreate the Smash 64 match.

 

[PSIGuy]

Doctors can be violent? Whatever happened to First do no harm?

 

[Radical Bones]

She wasn't exactly throwing words of encouragement at dudes in Mario Kart 8 now was she?

Friendly competition does not equal violence and war.

Little Mac could be a boxer who does not believe in militarism or using violence to achieve a means.

I.E Bowser has an army, so he is not a pacifist.

 

[staindgrey]

She wasn't exactly throwing words of encouragement at dudes in Mario Kart 8 now was she?

I dunno. Couldn't hear her from all the way back there.

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Which female character do you think has the best chance of being included as a fighter?

I'd say Shantae has it pretty good, since she may have done decently on the ballot and her main "competition" Bayonetta is in already.

After seeing Warioware Gold, I honestly want Mona over Ashley.

This is fair. She has a much more prominent role in the series. Plus that scooter is too cute.

Mona was Among my most wanted back in ye olde days so I can dig her. I could even see a bunch of flexible options for moves playing on her different roles from all the part time jobs she had in the series.

My brethren! She honestly needs more Western support.

 

[KMDP]

Doctors can be violent? Whatever happened to First do no harm?

"First do no harm" refers to "given an existing problem, it may be better not to do something, or even to do nothing, than to risk causing more harm than good." This is as a medical practitioner, and does not have any effect on that person learning, say, karate and jujitsu and beating people up.

Well tbf, those guys aren’t females

I listed females who are likely/have a chance, not all females. XD

 

[RandomAce]

Would anyone want Saki Amamiya as a playable?

I would rather have Isa instead, but a gunblade character would be rad, and Isa in my opinion can do more than what Saki does (Also I like his design more, but someone called him a male WFT with guns).

Also Sin and Punishment should get shown off more in Smash, and the play style Isa and/or Saki can offer is much different than a lot of others.

 

[WaxPython]

You realize that Goku is an anime character first before he's playable in a video game? The odds of him even appearing is slim to none

Yeah. I'd still rather seen him than Steve I'm not even saying the ones I picked are likely just that I would much rather see them than Steve who i think is an awful character for a fighter. Put him in as an assist trophy or make a Minecraft stage and I'm happy. Anything more than that has a 0% chance of happening.

Is Minecraft even big in Japan? I know Halo isn't but dragon ball is huge there.

I'll say with complete confidence that Goku has a higher chance of being a fighter in smash than Minecraft Steve does, he's appeared in 42 games on Nintendo platforms. If he's DLC that would spur people to buy the game just to play as Goku his marketing value is insane. Who would buy smash to play as Minecraft Steve?

 

[Radical Bones]

Isabelle isn't some anti-war protester guys, she's just a friendly, non-confrontational character.

Pacifist doesn't just mean 'oh they don't fight', it's more a belief system that there are no moral grounds where we can justify the use or war and violence for international disputes.

Animal Crossing isn't that complex.

She can be in Smash lol.

 

[KMDP]

Isabelle isn't some anti-war protester guys, she's just a friendly, non-confrontational character.

Pacifist doesn't just mean 'oh they don't fight', it's more a belief system that there are no moral grounds where we can justify the use or war and violence for international disputes.

Animal Crossing isn't that complex.

She can be in Smash lol.

For the record, I'm not technically against Isabelle in Smash. I just think that, as a character with an established, non-confrontational personality, Sakurai will probably keep her where she was in Smash 4, as an Assist Trophy who gives you healing items.

 

[King Sonnn DeDeDoo]

what would isabelle's moves consist of

Animal Crossing Mechanics not covered by Villager.
- Fishing!
- Fashion
- Flower gardening
- Fruit collecting
- Building public works
- Emotes
- Coffee

Also the whole pacifist thing is untrue and comes from an out of context line. I'll let Slylock do the talking for me.

she's not actually a pacifist by definition; She doesn't like confrontations, but when you instruct her to deal with a troublesome townie she'll buckle down and do it. Also see: Isabelle having absolutely no qualms about throwing bombs at people in Mario Kart. Two, when she says she doesn't like "fighting" she clearly means that she doesn't like divisive arguing.

 

[Iridium]

There was a problem fetching the tweet

So, can gimp us with us with his trampoline, but we can stop him too (pay attention to when uses Spring Jump)! Yeah, the changes to his trampoline are really a double-edged sword.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

"First do no harm" refers to "given an existing problem, it may be better not to do something, or even to do nothing, than to risk causing more harm than good." This is as a medical practitioner, and does not have any effect on that person learning, say, karate and jujitsu and beating people up.

I listed females who are likely/have a chance, not all females. XD

Damn that’s cold...calling Amy an unlikely female Sonic character...Rogue it is then

 

[Enderwoman]

Doctors can be violent? Whatever happened to First do no harm?

corporate lobbying

 

[Knight Dude]

I need to see more Mega Man gameplay, He looks like he has some buffs, but I'm just pretty curious of what he can do overall.

 

[prowler12]

the reason I said isabelle is a pacifist is that she goes against fighting

 

[monadoboy]

This whole "Minecraft artstyle" or "Ugh, fanbase" debate gave me an idea for a discussion topic...

Are there any characters you support because of how they look, or their concept, or fanbase, or whatever, but you have never touched their respective games or have any knowledge of the character outside of their wiki page? By the same token, are there any Smash characters you like a lot but don't know anything about more than their trophy?

For me, Spring Man is the big one. I've know basically nothing about ARMS, but I really started to like the concept and I'd love to see him in since he looks fun. I also really like Azura despite not having played Fates (or any Fire Emblem) just based on the idea of a waterbender/spear/dancer moveset.

As for the Smash characters I like to play but don't have experience in their games...ultroy:

I really want Isaac only because I've loved every sword wielder in Smash so far. I'll probably get to play GS one of these days...

 

[The Animator]

Since everyone is talking about Steve, here is my stance. It should not get in because its an ugly unappealing character design that will be nothing but an eyesore in Smash Bros. and its a waste of development time when there is a myriad of better characters to choose from.

But why I see Steve getting in, because Nintendo could squeeze some extra DLC cash out of the parents of 8-13 year old's that bug there parents to buy them any crap with the Minecraft logo slapped on it. Plus its a character that only requires limited animation and could easily use assets from characters already in the game.

I really hope I'm wrong and Minecraft stays out of Smash, but I think there is a fairly high chance it could be included.