Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Will]

But still, Minecraft is owned by a competitor. Including him would be free advertising for the XBox One. In order for him to get in, Microsoft must completely pull out of the console market and become a third party developer.

Damn, guess Smash Bros. lost to the PS4 for promoting FFVII Remastered. You're thinking way too hard into this though, especially when Minecraft already has an appearance on Nintendo consoles including the Switch.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

But still, Minecraft is owned by a competitor. Including him would be free advertising for the XBox One. In order for him to get in, Microsoft must completely pull out of the console market and become a third party developer.

Not really, Minecraft is available on everything and still got put on the Switch after Microsoft bought the game. If it were Master Chief or some dumb bear then yeah it'd be free Xbox One advertising. Besides, Brawl advertised MGS4 which wasn't on Nintendo systems

 

[BrytonJ]

Hey forget Samus v Master Chief or Samus v Mega Man...

We finally get a proper Samus v Ridley in Smash Bros!!

please, as if that even holds a candle to the true ultimate rivalry that can now play out in Smash, Snake vs. Young Link

 

[RileyXY1]

I can see Steve getting in a Microsoft version of Smash Bros, if they ever decide to do that.

 

[NextChannelGames]

I'm with the Minecraft idea. It would bring a new younger audience to Smash Bros series as well selling more Nintendo Switch systems.

That would be pretty crazy Idea to have Steve battle it out with the likes of Mario, Sonic, Pac-Man, Mega Man and more. Boy, love to see Steve vs Link!

 

[Will]

I can see Steve getting in a Microsoft version of Smash Bros, if they ever decide to do that.

But the actual Smash Bros. is more likely than them trying to gather what little diverse IPs Microsoft has. It's just a matter of daddy Sakurai wanting to get those rights or not.

 

[RileyXY1]

I'm with the Minecraft idea. It would bring a new younger audience to Smash Bros series as well selling more Nintendo Switch systems.

That would be pretty crazy Idea to have Steve battle it out with the likes of Mario, Sonic, Pac-Man, Mega Man and more. Boy, love to see Steve vs Link!

No. It would drive people away from Smash given the reputation that Minecraft has.

 

[splat]

Are you trying to tell me Dr. Mario is not an important character in DR. MARIO? Game & Watch isn't noteworthy in the GAME & WATCH series?.

Honestly, Dr. Mario is nothing more than a UI element in his game. Not the person you’re responding to, but no, I wouldn’t consider him important in the game. He’s as important as the coin counter in Super Mario.

Mr. Game & Watch didn’t even exist prior to Smash and is an amalgation of various characters. So in that sense: no, he isn’t noteworthy either.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

This interests me.

Characters with pretty much bull **** made up Movesets:
Characters whose Movesets take inspiration from the little available to them:

I haven't played all games represented in Smash, but I think this is a pretty good representation of Sakurai being able to make up **** or fill gaps if needed.

I would place the current form of Pit in the “moveset inspiration” group

No. It would drive people away from Smash given the reputation that Minecraft has.

Waluigi obsession would drive people away before Minecraft, besides...Banjo Kazooie before both

 

[Deleted member]

As much as I love Minecraft, I think I'd probably prefer Banjo & Kazooie if we were to get a Microsoft character. Considering Banjo & Kazooie's origins, them being in Smash would be more impactful for fans than Steve would, I think.

 

[PsySmasher]

I'm fine with Minecraft being represented in some capacity in Smash. But Steve as a playable character? I'm not sold on the idea.

 

[RileyXY1]

If a Microsoft character would make it into Smash, it would probably be Banjo & Kazooie.

 

[Will]

No. It would drive people away from Smash given the reputation that Minecraft has.

Seriously, why are you so pessimistic about Minecraft?

 

[Jedisupersonic]

Your audience should never hold you back from being rightfully represented. Never.

Yeah we haven't had much Sonic eye color discourse for instance since his announcement back in Brawl! Like when for some reason a lot of Sonic fans went nuts about it with his redesign in Adventure 1

(Bad example but I just like ribbing on the Sonic fanbase despite being a huge dork of it myself.)

 

[Bradli Wartooth]

No. It would drive people away from Smash given the reputation that Minecraft has.

You've been caught in the anti-minecraft internet vacuum, apparently. It wouldn't be so popular if the crap you heard people say about it actually represented world views of it I don't like the art style and wouldn't really want Steve to be playable, but to say he would cause more harm than good is just laughable.

 

[Staarih]

Nah, E3 is the biggest gaming event of the year.

With Nintendo having established the Nintendo Direct as their major news outlets, I feel like E3 is merely just another chance to showcase one among many others. Whenever a Direct is announced, they know the audience is there. So it wouldn’t surprise me if we got big character reveals in Direct’s to come. Obviously Ridley was the one they wanted to show first.

 

[Will]

As much as I love Minecraft, I think I'd probably prefer Banjo & Kazooie if we were to get a Microsoft character. Considering Banjo & Kazooie's origins, them being in Smash would be more impactful for fans than Steve would, I think.

I'm fine with Minecraft being represented in some capacity in Smash. But Steve as a playable character? I'm not sold on the idea.

If a Microsoft character would make it into Smash, it would probably be Banjo & Kazooie.

Nothing's wrong with Banjo for a Microsoft rep since it'd please the older fans, it'd be the most kino choice, but nothing really stops Steve from taking that crown instead either. Minecraft just as impactful and important as Banjo & Kazooie is to the nostalgia haven of older fans. I'd want Grant Kirkhope to compose an original Smash theme too, tbh.

 

[PsySmasher]

Nothing's wrong with Banjo for a Microsoft rep since it'd please the older fans, it'd be the most kino choice, but nothing really stops Steve from taking that crown instead either. Minecraft just as impactful and important as Banjo & Kazooie is to the nostalgia haven of older fans. I'd want Grant Kirkhope to compose an original Smash theme too, tbh.

You've got a good point. I'm not saying that Minecraft doesn't deserve a rep because it's not influential or it's a bad game. I just have other characters that I prefer in Smash over Steve. I wouldn't be upset if he makes it in, especially if he has a good moveset.

 

[SlickWylde]

I thought I'd share what I think the remaining fighters might be at this point (the two on the bottom right are echo fighters). View attachment 149412[/spoiler]

You accidentally included a picture of fighters who are not going to be in Smash...

(Just teasing you. Though I think I'm right... unfortunately :/)

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Y'know, I'm thinking that around 7-8 unique newcomers (meaning Echo Fighters don't count) isn't a farfetched amount since it's not without precedent

Melee, if you remove the clones, had 8 newcomers (counting Sheik) and the entire game took around 13 months to develop, iirc.

Smash 4's DLC also had 7 characters between the original reveal of Mewtwo in 2014 and Bayonetta's release in 2016, which is around 16 months.

Granted, three of them are veterans with an existing moveset (one even being a semi-clone of Marth), but that doesn't change anything regarding the Melee argument. Not to mention some newcomers could work as semi-clones too, like Dixie Kong.

 

[Slavic]

If we got a Minecraft and Steve trailer and half way through it was interrupted by Banjo & Kazooie wandering into the shot, I'd be pretty okay with that

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Not to mention, didn't even Phil Spencer himself want to have the bear and bird duo in Smash? Even if some clause within Microsoft prevents major collaborations with Nintendo, this seems like a fair loophole.

You know... since this is Super Smash Bros. Ultimate.... and we are getting all the characters and possibly all the stages... what if we got all (or at least some) the trophies from the past Smash games, including both Wii U and 3DS versions?

It would be nice to see Daisy and Pit trophies from Melee and it could be titled "Daisy (Super Mario Land)" and "Pit (Kid Icarus)" since that's how Daisy and Pit looked in their debut games. And I want to see that Meowth's Party trophy in glorious HD.
View attachment 149386

Well, I do want to see Plum come back in some capacity...

Oh I just remembered

That interview the source that source gaming translated

I need to remind everybody first or final proposal it still proves the ballot characters were likely chosen as the base roster newcomers either way

Simply because the roster was finalized back in 2016 the interview furthers that evidence it's ballot over promotion this time around

That depends, would Sakurai just pick voting choices that are actually legally likely/plausible? Plus it makes me wonder if characters with the least votes would get the AT treatment like Bomberman did.

 

[ColietheGoalie]

Honestly, Dr. Mario is nothing more than a UI element in his game. Not the person you’re responding to, but no, I wouldn’t consider him important in the game. He’s as important as the coin counter in Super Mario.

Mr. Game & Watch didn’t even exist prior to Smash and is an amalgation of various characters. So in that sense: no, he isn’t noteworthy either.

True.

I think the fact remains that the examples he listed are clones/retro/wtf picks. If you're going to go through the work of licensing a Third-Party character and creating a unique newcomer, I'd expect/hope that they'd go for someone who's actually a character, not just the default skin from a popular game.

 

[Noipoi]

If a Microsoft character would make it into Smash, it would probably be Banjo & Kazooie.

I want Banjo Kazooie. I REALLY want Banjo Kazooie. But there's no chance in hell they get in over Steve.
(If a Microsoft character gets in)

 

[Arcadenik]

Well, I do want to see Plum come back in some capacity...

Me too. I would love to see her show up regularly in Mario sports spin-off games.

 

[Pacack]

I have reconsidered, and still stand by what I said.


Are you trying to tell me Dr. Mario is not an important character in DR. MARIO? Game & Watch isn't noteworthy in the GAME & WATCH series?

Dr. Mario is a menu element in his game and nothing more.

Game and Watch games have no main character - Mr. Game and Watch is an amalgamation of different games and nothing more. So, yes, I am telling you just that.

Plus rules for third parties are a little different than Nintendo clones/retros so far.

Cool, fair.

Could you honestly tell me that Steve from Minecraft is less well-known than Mega Man, Snake, Ryu, or Bayonetta?

Hell, if we accept "Minecraft" or "the minecraft guy" as answers, he's more recognizable than Cloud.

Minecraft is the second best selling game of all time, behind only Tetris. it sold more than Wii Sports, for crying out loud. People recognize the character.

Honestly, Dr. Mario is nothing more than a UI element in his game. Not the person you’re responding to, but no, I wouldn’t consider him important in the game. He’s as important as the coin counter in Super Mario.

Mr. Game & Watch didn’t even exist prior to Smash and is an amalgation of various characters. So in that sense: no, he isn’t noteworthy either.

Thank you for echoing my sentiments perfectly.

 

[Sharkarat]

I don't really see any reason that Steve would decrease Banjo & Kazooie's chances. If anything it would help because it means microsoft already got it's foot in the door. Banjo isn't particulary relevant and isn't that important either, so i think he would be more of a popularity pick really, so Steve wouldn't be what's blocking him.

 

[Opossum]

I'm gonna nerd out and say Marth does have some inspiration from both his games animations and FE4/5 Swordmaster animations, he's kind of an interesting FE SNES animation hodgepodge. His stabs and ftilt being from his own game animations in Dark Dragon and the Sword of Light and Mystery of the Emblem

His recovery (Dolphin Slash) is even the critical animation that Swordmasters do among several other basic swings, Dancing Blade could be infered to be a nod to a skill like Astra or having a Brave/Master Sword, counter being a universal FE mechanic because of how the games work, shield breaker being part of his own afformentioned animations in Mystery.

The rest of his kit is made by Sakurai though.

Plus Marth's whole spacing design reflects how important unit positioning is.

 

[Untouch]

I want Banjo Kazooie. I REALLY want Banjo Kazooie. But there's no chance in hell they get in over Steve.
(If a Microsoft character gets in)

Mincrosoft themselves have vouched for BK though, and Sakurai has stated that third-party reps need history with nintendo. (Cloud was picked as a FF rep, they felt that Cloud represented the series the best.)

 

[Pacack]

Plus Marth's whole spacing design reflects how important unit positioning is.

And tippers are critical hits.

Marth's design is flawlessly representative of his series.

 

[Jedisupersonic]

please, as if that even holds a candle to the true ultimate rivalry that can now play out in Smash, Snake vs. Young Link

I'm still holding out for Echo Shadow so we can truly have the ultimate battle...

Dark Pit vs Shadow the Hedgehog.

 

[Pacack]

True.

I think the fact remains that the examples he listed are clones/retro/wtf picks. If you're going to go through the work of licensing a Third-Party character and creating a unique newcomer, I'd expect/hope that they'd go for someone who's actually a character, not just the default skin from a popular game.

Are you going to unironically try to convince me that Miis are a wtf pick?

 

[splat]

True.

I think the fact remains that the examples he listed are clones/retro/wtf picks. If you're going to go through the work of licensing a Third-Party character and creating a unique newcomer, I'd expect/hope that they'd go for someone who's actually a character, not just the default skin from a popular game.

With the vast amount of merchandise Minecraft has been getting I feel like Steve is has grown way past the default skin definition. The dude is the main character and has shown up a lot. I mean, he has tons of figurines and such and is frequently featured in trailers.

 

[Slavic]

Marth has always been my absolute favorite designed moveset in Smash Bros., which makes me glad he's fun to play as too.

 

[Zerp]

Yeah we haven't had much Sonic eye color discourse for instance since his announcement back in Brawl! Like when for some reason a lot of Sonic fans went nuts about it with his redesign in Adventure 1

(Bad example but I just like ribbing on the Sonic fanbase despite being a huge dork of it myself.)

Saddest part is that Sonic's eye color changing isn't even the only pair in Smash people went crazy about, I've seen multiple flamewars on /v/ dedicated to the color of 's eyes.

 

[TMNTSSB4]

Not to mention, didn't even Phil Spencer himself want to have the bear and bird duo in Smash?

He has talked about wanting them in Smash

I'm still holding out for Echo Shadow so we can truluy have the ultimate battle...

Dark Pit vs Shadow the Hedgehog.

Battle of the Edge

I want Banjo Kazooie. I REALLY want Banjo Kazooie. But there's no chance in hell they get in over Steve.
(If a Microsoft character gets in)

They can get in over Steve if they’re more requested/wanted by the overall crowd than he is...and if Sakurai finds them to be more useful to Smash and representation of their company (like how Cloud got in over every other FF character or how Mega Man joined before Ryu did)

 

[EnthusedPanda]

What's your most wanted game mode, aside from another subspace emissary? For me, I'd definitely love a multiple character stock mode. Also, I saw somebody mention a king of the hill mode where you fight to hold a zone, that'd be fun too. Capture the flag on a big stage would also be awesome.

We clearly need a Payload Race mode for Temple, New Pork, etc.

 

[Phaazoid]

All personal feelings aside, he's really not that important of a character in the grand scheme of things, even in his own game. He's the blocky avatar in the game equivalent of playing with LEGO.

You are severely underestimating the breadth and reach of Minecraft. I would say it's probably the most important game launched past the year 2000. Name one that reached a bigger audience? The only thing I can think of is maybe Wii Sports. Minecraft is playable on pretty much everything that plays games.

I will grant you that, in terms of importance to minecraft itself, Steve isn't super high up there. But that's a different argument entirely.

I'm not saying that I think Steve is a shoo-in for smash or anything. I just don't think Minecraft's maaaaasive popularity can be ignored.

 

[BrytonJ]

I'm kind of torn on Steve. On one hand he's got some pretty cool moveset possibilities what with all the different tools and weapons he can use. On the other hand minecraft always looks really gross when someone tries to animate it smoothly and with bending arms and stuff and I feel like it'd be really hard to get around that for smash so he'd just end up looking like trash.

 

[StrangeMann]

You are severely underestimating the breadth and reach of Minecraft. I would say it's probably the most important game launched past the year 2000. Name one that reached a bigger audience? The only thing I can think of is maybe Wii Sports. Minecraft is playable on pretty much everything that plays games.

I will grant you that, in terms of importance to minecraft itself, Steve isn't super high up there. But that's a different argument entirely.

I'm not saying that I think Steve is a shoo-in for smash or anything. I just don't think Minecraft's maaaaasive popularity can be ignored.

Man, imagine if the Creeper were playable (easily the most famous mine craft character on it's own)? What moveset would it even have? Or the Endermen as an honorable second mention (with teleportation).
But with Steve (who has far less of a reputation than either), there's so many more move set options. I really don't know how it would work out.