Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[Sabrewulf238]

Maybe I'm in the minority here, but Cloud's reveal didn't excite me all that much. Yeah, he's super iconic and all, but I, just like many others, was under the impression that DLC would be pure fan favorite picks. Once I saw Cloud, I was like, "Who asked for this guy?"

Well, I know that people wanted him...

but Cloud getting in didn't do much for me either. To be honest a lot of the big name third parties that have gotten in I don't have a huge amount of nostalgia for so my reaction was often pretty muted. (I feel like that's blasphemous to say in the Smash community )

I never owned a mega drive. So I mostly watched my cousin play Sonic. I didn't play much Pac- Man as a kid. The only Mega Man games I've played were the Battle Network games (a different mega man) and I also don't have much history playing Metal Gear or Street Fighter.

Bayonetta is the main one I was happy to see though it wasn't because of nostalgia since she was so new.

Banjo & Kazooie getting in would be the first time my third party nostalgia itch gets scratched. (and Isaac if we're talking purely Nintendo)

 

[Blargg888]

to see if he unlocks King K. Rool.

How would you react if Smash Ultimate released without K Rool being announced for it, and then suddenly while playing, without any warning, a very familiar silhouette appeared?

 

[KMDP]

My reactions to all the reveals have been pretty muted, but that's because I'm just not an outwardly excitable person, not because of lack of hype.

Speaking of VAs and Sephiroth: If Sephiroth were to get in, between him and Lucario we could have a proxy battle for Goku vs. Superman.

Gasp! I almost forgot! is Vegeta!

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Once I saw Cloud, I was like, "Who asked for this guy?"

Oh man.

You must not have been here for the Brawl days.

Cloud in Smash became a meme because that many people wanted him and we thought it would never happen.

 

[Shroob]

Oh man.

You must not have been here for the Brawl days.

Cloud in Smash became a meme because that many people wanted him and we thought it would never happen.

I still remember the argument that Megaman would be a clone of Samus "Because they both have arm cannons"

Bad times, my friend. Bad times.

 

[Radical Bones]

How would you react if Smash Ultimate released without K Rool being announced for it, and then suddenly while playing, without any warning, a very familiar silhouette appeared?

Man, that'd be so hype. I haven't played a Smash game without knowing who was in it since Melee.

Unlocking 'dorf and Falco without knowing they were in the game was so crazy. I remember fighting the invisible Falco in that event match and being so excited.

 

[Deleted member]

My fondest memory of any reveal trailer has got to be Greninja.
I didn't watch it live, so I wasn't aware of it until a few days later.
It was very early in my life as a Nintendo fan, and I was just getting into Pokemon, with Y being my first game and Froakie being my starter.
One day, for whatever reason, I looked at the Bulbapedia article for Sm4sh (I was familiar with the concept of Smash and thought it sounded cool so I was planning on getting it), and was confused when I saw Greninja in the playable character section.
Then I watched the trailer and lost my mind. I couldn't believe Greninja, my first Pokemon that was seemingly no different than any other starter Pokemon, got a chance to fight Mario and Sonic. I never thought he had a chance, but I was certainly not complaining.
I was 13 at the time. Now I'm 17, and to this day Greninja remains my favorite addition in Smash history, and will likely remain in that position forever.

 

[osby]

My fondest memory of any reveal trailer has got to be Greninja.
I didn't watch it live, so I wasn't aware of it until a few days later.
It was very early in my life as a Nintendo fan, and I was just getting into Pokemon, with Y being my first game and Froakie being my starter.
One day, for whatever reason, I looked at the Bulbapedia article for Sm4sh (I was familiar with the concept of Smash and thought it sounded cool so I was planning on getting it), and was confused when I saw Greninja in the playable character section.
Then I watched the trailer and lost my mind. I couldn't believe Greninja, my first Pokemon that was seemingly no different than any other starter Pokemon, got a chance to fight Mario and Sonic. I never thought he had a chance, but I was certainly not complaining.
I was 13 at the time. Now I'm 17, and to this day Greninja remains my favorite addition in Smash history, and will likely remain in that position forever.

Also Smash 4 trailers were really well done. I hardly knew any of the newcomers previously but they are my favourites because of this.

 

[Bowserlick]

People here actually thought that Pac-Man was a nobody and surely did not see him as a gaming icon. Naive whelps.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

My fondest memory of any reveal trailer has got to be Greninja.
I didn't watch it live, so I wasn't aware of it until a few days later.
It was very early in my life as a Nintendo fan, and I was just getting into Pokemon, with Y being my first game and Froakie being my starter.
One day, for whatever reason, I looked at the Bulbapedia article for Sm4sh (I was familiar with the concept of Smash and thought it sounded cool so I was planning on getting it), and was confused when I saw Greninja in the playable character section.
Then I watched the trailer and lost my mind. I couldn't believe Greninja, my first Pokemon that was seemingly no different than any other starter Pokemon, got a chance to fight Mario and Sonic. I never thought he had a chance, but I was certainly not complaining.
I was 13 at the time. Now I'm 17, and to this day Greninja remains my favorite addition in Smash history, and will likely remain in that position forever.

The Smash Direct was too late at night for me so whe I woke up I saw "Greninja Smash live reaction" in my subscription box and thought it was just a meme and watched the Smash direct

 

[KMDP]

People here actually thought that Pac-Man was a nobody and surely did not see him as a gaming icon. Naive whelps.

'High Level' Gaming Icons IRL: PAC-MAN, Mario, Donkey Kong, Sonic, Pikachu, (possibly) Charizard
"Lower Level" Gaming Icons IRL: Luigi, Peach (/Daisy), Bowser, Yoshi, Link (possibly as "Zelda"), Tails, Dr. Robotnik, Megaman, Cloud, Snake, Lara Croft, Master Chief, "That guy from Minecraft"
"Meme Level" Gaming Icons (related solely to Smash): Marth, Roy
Gaming Icons according to Smash Fans: King K. Rool, Ridley, Isaac... etc.

 

[Fenriraga]

Brawl Speculation was an entirely different beast from anything Smash 4 or Ultimate Speculation ever was/will be.

And I mean 'beast' very literally.

 

[Shroob]

As sad as it is, the Smash fanbase is basically the only thing that even keeps the notion of K.Rool alive.

Modern DK has basically abandoned the Kremlins, which I understand why, but otherwise, he's basically been dead in the water. His last actual appearance in a game was Mario Super Sluggers, no?


We build up K.Rool as this character that's a "Nintendo icon" and ****, but the truth is his last actually 'major' role was in DK64, King of Swing too if you count that, I guess.


IF K.Rool gets into Smash, it'll be due to nothing more than fan demand alone, not 'because he deserves it' or the fact that he's even iconic to the DK series(Dixie and even FUNKY are more iconic than him nowadays).

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Brawl Speculation was an entirely different beast from anything Smash 4 or Ultimate Speculation ever was/will be.

And I mean 'beast' very literally.

Brawl was....insane.

I think it was cause of Snake and Sonic that every damn character seemed feasible to people.

 

[Smooth Criminal]

My reaction to Cloud was thus:

Right down to the detail. All at work, too. At first I was like, my friends in this chat on mobile have gotta be ****ing with me, there is no way in Hell that Cloud Strife of Final Fantasy fame is in Smash. This is one big meme. Sure as ****, I was wrong, and boy I could not have been happier. The reality set in and I was just floored by this, absolutely floored. Ryu's inclusion made absolutely perfect freaking sense considering Capcom's storied history with Nintendo and all the various games that have been on their platform (though despite my foreknowledge of Ryu's inclusion thanks to the datamine, I was positively AMAZED at his execution and remain so to this day), but CLOUD? A character that popped up on an entirely different platform with very little crossover to anything Ninty-related aside? Absolutely BONKERS.

(I'll talk about the sentimentality that FF7 has to me another time, but I will say that it did play its role somewhere here, even if a little bit.)

Smooth Criminal

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

As sad as it is, the Smash fanbase is basically the only thing that even keeps the notion of K.Rool alive.

Modern DK has basically abandoned the Kremlins, which I understand why, but otherwise, he's basically been dead in the water. His last actual appearance in a game was Mario Super Sluggers, no?


We build up K.Rool as this character that's a "Nintendo icon" and ****, but the truth is his last actually 'major' role was in DK64, King of Swing too if you count that, I guess.


IF K.Rool gets into Smash, it'll be due to nothing more than fan demand alone, not 'because he deserves it' or the fact that he's even iconic to the DK series(Dixie and even FUNKY are more iconic than him nowadays).

You'd probably get **** from the K.Rool fans that have been holding onto that dream since Melee, but you're not wrong.

It isn't relevancy that would get K.Rool into smash that's for certain, and I can't blame Sakurai for at least being confused as to why western audiences have wanted him so badly in the first place.

I mean he has to know, they made him and Geno Mii skins. He's aware they're some of the most requested characters.

He probably just doesn't know why.


EDIT: His recent statements on Waluigi (if they actually happened, I never confirmed them or not) would indicate that he is, in fact, completely confused as to why the smash community would likely implode over DK's villain who hasn't been seen in years

 

[Zinith]

Having Internet problems. Typing this on mobile. **** I was gonna wrap up my "who got neglected the most" analysis tonight...

 

[osby]

Brawl was....insane.

I think it was cause of Snake and Sonic that every damn character seemed feasible to people.

I'm too new in Smash scene to remember it but... I know some people were seriously thinking they'll get, like, a hundred fighters and ten of them will be from FF and Sonic.

 

[Shroob]

You'd probably get **** from the K.Rool fans that have been holding onto that dream since Melee, but you're not wrong.

It isn't relevancy that would get K.Rool into smash that's for certain, and I can't blame Sakurai for at least being confused as to why western audiences have wanted him so badly in the first place.

I mean he has to know, they made him and Geno Mii skins. He's aware they're some of the most requested characters.

He probably just doesn't know why.

I want him too, but K.Rool is in this odd spot where basically, he's been abandoned by his own franchise, and they don't seem intent on bringing him back anytime soon.

 

[papagenos]

Brawl hype was best hype.

Brawl itself was a smack in the face with reality though... and yet then somehow that kept my expectations in check and smash4 blew me away while this next game is already beyond what i ever thought smash would be.

 

[Jetsurge]

Updated my roster predictions. What do you think?:

Yellow = Confirmed
Blue = Brand new fighter
Green = Semi-clone
Red = Echo fighter

 

[Shroob]

Another thing about K.Rool which may be pretty damning for him in general was, outside of DK64, the only times you ever even SAW him was the final bosses fights.

Now look at someone like Bowser, who even a newbie at Super Mario Bros could make it to 1-4 and see the first fake Bowser.

Look at Ganondorf, who played major parts in Ocarina of Time's plot, giving him ample screen time.

Look at Ridley, who. one of the very first things you ever see in Super Metroid IS a boss fight with him.


You wanna see K.Rool? You have to beat an *arguably* hard as nails SNES platformer to completion.


This is K.Rool's problem.

Unlike all these other villains who got into Smash, the fact that you never even SAW him until the very end of the game never cemented him into the public conscious.

We know about him and campaign for him because we want more DK and villain characters, but the average Nintendo fan in this day and age has NO clue who he is, and Nintendo themselves doesn't really help with them basically sweeping him under the rug.

 

[Jetsurge]

Another thing about K.Rool which may be pretty damning for him in general was, outside of DK64, the only times you ever even SAW him was the final bosses fights.

Now look at someone like Bowser, who even a newbie at Super Mario Bros could make it to 1-4 and see the first fake Bowser.

Look at Ganondorf, who played major parts in Ocarina of Time's plot, giving him ample screen time.

Look at Ridley, who. one of the very first things you ever see in Super Metroid IS a boss fight with him.


You wanna see K.Rool? You have to beat an *arguably* hard as nails SNES platformer to completion.


This is K.Rool's problem.

Unlike all these other villains who got into Smash, the fact that you never even SAW him until the very end of the game never cemented him into the public conscious.

We know about him and campaign for him because we want more DK and villain characters, but the average Nintendo fan in this day and age has NO clue who he is, and Nintendo themselves doesn't really help with them basically sweeping him under the rug.

He had a pretty good presence in DK 64 appearing at the start of the game, in cutscenes in between worlds and in the game over screen.

 

[KMDP]

Another thing about K.Rool which may be pretty damning for him in general was, outside of DK64, the only times you ever even SAW him was the final bosses fights.

Now look at someone like Bowser, who even a newbie at Super Mario Bros could make it to 1-4 and see the first fake Bowser.

Look at Ganondorf, who played major parts in Ocarina of Time's plot, giving him ample screen time.

Look at Ridley, who. one of the very first things you ever see in Super Metroid IS a boss fight with him.


You wanna see K.Rool? You have to beat an *arguably* hard as nails SNES platformer to completion.


This is K.Rool's problem.

Unlike all these other villains who got into Smash, the fact that you never even SAW him until the very end of the game never cemented him into the public conscious.

We know about him and campaign for him because we want more DK and villain characters, but the average Nintendo fan in this day and age has NO clue who he is, and Nintendo themselves doesn't really help with them basically sweeping him under the rug.

It doesn't help that Retro made a point not to use Kremlings (and K. Rool by extension) because they wanted to leave their own mark on the franchise.

Confession: I never beat Donkey Kong Countryyyyyyyy...! (said like Pit's "I never learned how to reeeaaad!") I've also never played Donkey Kong Country 2.
I have played (and beaten) all three of the Donkey Kong Land games, though.

 

[Shroob]

He had a pretty good presence in DK 64 appearing in cutscenes in between worlds and in the game over screen.

To be fair though, Nintendo themselves likes to forget DK64 even happened outside of the DKrap.

Chunky Kong never has appeared since, and the only times Lanky and Tiny have ever shown up again is in that racing game no one played.

 

[Dukeofdeath5]

Another thing about K.Rool which may be pretty damning for him in general was, outside of DK64, the only times you ever even SAW him was the final bosses fights.

Now look at someone like Bowser, who even a newbie at Super Mario Bros could make it to 1-4 and see the first fake Bowser.

Look at Ganondorf, who played major parts in Ocarina of Time's plot, giving him ample screen time.

Look at Ridley, who. one of the very first things you ever see in Super Metroid IS a boss fight with him.


You wanna see K.Rool? You have to beat an *arguably* hard as nails SNES platformer to completion.


This is K.Rool's problem.

Unlike all these other villains who got into Smash, the fact that you never even SAW him until the very end of the game never cemented him into the public conscious.

We know about him and campaign for him because we want more DK and villain characters, but the average Nintendo fan in this day and age has NO clue who he is, and Nintendo themselves doesn't really help with them basically sweeping him under the rug.

What you're saying is that the true DK villain that deserves a rep...


Is Jumpman

And I completely agree, it's been a long time coming, the true retro rep

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

Updated my roster predictions. What do you think?:
View attachment 149378
Yellow = Confirmed
Blue = Brand new fighter
Green = Semi-clone
Red = Echo fighter

You think we'll get semi-clones? I'd just put dixie with the brand new fighters tbh, might as well go all the way to make her unique, I can't see her sharing much of anything with Diddy anyway tbh given how different their fighting styles and personalities are. I also don't think Medusa will happen as an echo, feels like one of those cases where it would be a disservice to her character and the unique things she could do, also, shield.

 

[MysticKnives]

to see if he unlocks King K. Rool.

He’ll unlock Cranky, the best Kong

 

[Captain Shwampy]

https://youtu.be/bjoF9a7P-GM

Y'all are sleeping on how cool of a villian Dr coyle is. It's to bad we likely won't get any arms rep this time around.

All current smash villians + k rool, captain syrup, dr eggman, Medusa, and dr coyle would make a great villians trailer.

 

[MysticKnives]

https://youtu.be/bjoF9a7P-GM

Y'all are sleeping on how cool of a villian Dr coyle is. It's to bad we likely won't get any arms rep this time around.

All current smash villians + k rool, captain syrup, dr eggman, Medusa, and dr coyle would make a great villians trailer.

Dr. Coyle would be great. Throw in Porky and or Geigue and I’m in

 

[SirCamp]

'High Level' Gaming Icons IRL: PAC-MAN, Mario, Donkey Kong, Sonic, Pikachu, (possibly) Charizard
"Lower Level" Gaming Icons IRL: Luigi, Peach (/Daisy), Bowser, Yoshi, Link (possibly as "Zelda"), Tails, Dr. Robotnik, Megaman, Cloud, Snake, Lara Croft, Master Chief, "That guy from Minecraft"
"Meme Level" Gaming Icons (related solely to Smash): Marth, Roy
Gaming Icons according to Smash Fans: King K. Rool, Ridley, Isaac... etc.

I feel like this is a little misleading. Mostly because not all of the Nintendo characters included in Smash are as iconic as third party characters and nor are they meant to be. It's a Nintendo game after all. I don't think anyone who wants Isaac has any illusions about how iconic, or rather not, he is in a broader sense. But that doesn't stop him from being a compelling character from a compelling Nintendo series that isn't yet represented in Smash.

Also, the lack of Bomberman on your list of gaming icons is offensive. ;P

 

[Cutie Gwen]

The solution to K.Rool's problem is obvious. Add Lord Frederik.

 

[KMDP]

If "Giant Donkey Kong" specifically is a fight in whatever Classic Mode Ultimate has, I'm really hoping a remix of this...

...is the fight music, like how Metal Mario had his own music.

Edit:

I feel like this is a little misleading. Mostly because not all of the Nintendo characters cincluded in Smash are as iconic as third party characters and nor are they meant to be. It's a Nintendo game after all. I don't think anyone who wants Isaac has any illusions about how iconic, or rather not, he is in a broader sense. But that doesn't stop him from being a compelling character from a compelling Nintendo series that isn't yet represented in Smash.

Also, the lack of Bomberman on your list of gaming icons is offensive. ;P

I wasn't referring to likelihood of getting into Smash, I was referring specifically to who are and are not Gaming Icons outside of the general gaming sphere (I probably should have been more specific about that). I probably (definitely) missed a few.

"High Level Icons": pretty much everyone has heard of these guys.
"Low Level Icons": you'll probably have heard of these guys, either tangentially as a related character to a High Level Icon or as a casual gamer.

 

[SirCamp]

Also speaking of DK64... I loved it =( I've even gone back and played it again as an adult and I still enjoy it. Sometimes I think I'm the only one who likes collectathons. lol I'd totally be down for another DK64 esque game. but yeah that'll never happen unfortunately.

 

[Dragoncharystary]

I have little to no experience with the Donkey Kong games but would do any of you think K. Rool making it into Smash would bring about his return into the DK franchise?

 

[Arcanir]

Oh man.

You must not have been here for the Brawl days.

Cloud in Smash became a meme because that many people wanted him and we thought it would never happen.

Ah, I remember those days. I still think about that old Brawl Taunts video mocking the suggestion, which didn't age well.

As sad as it is, the Smash fanbase is basically the only thing that even keeps the notion of K.Rool alive.

Modern DK has basically abandoned the Kremlins, which I understand why, but otherwise, he's basically been dead in the water. His last actual appearance in a game was Mario Super Sluggers, no?


We build up K.Rool as this character that's a "Nintendo icon" and ****, but the truth is his last actually 'major' role was in DK64, King of Swing too if you count that, I guess.


IF K.Rool gets into Smash, it'll be due to nothing more than fan demand alone, not 'because he deserves it' or the fact that he's even iconic to the DK series(Dixie and even FUNKY are more iconic than him nowadays).

The funny thing about Dixie and Funky is that they had the same issue K. Rool had until recently. If you look at their history, both of them were also inexplicably absent after Sluggers as neither of them made any major game appearances. Funky did appear in Mario Kart Wii, but that came out the same year, so functionally both were dormant for about six years until TF gave them life again.

And really, that's kind of the problem with DK's characters as a whole as of late: In general they've been pretty underutilized after their peak. Even ignoring the Kremlings (who have the most vocal outcry), most of the characters weren't really used that much past the Rare buyout, and after Sluggers we haven't seen anything of characters like most of the animal buddies. They all just... disappeared, left in limbo until something happens with them to bring them back to the spotlight. Thankfully Dixie and Funky have gotten their turns now, but a number of characters are still waiting to do the same.

 

[SirCamp]

I have little to no experience with the Donkey Kong games but would do any of you think K. Rool making it into Smash would bring about his return into the DK franchise?

It's certainly possible. In fact I'd say it would be fairly likely given that his inclusion would likely be due to popular demand and that seems like as good a reason as any to include him in a new game going forward.

That's honestly the biggest reason I want Captain Syrup in Smash. Ultimately I want a new Wario Land game and her inclusion could possibly help that.

 

[KMDP]

I have little to no experience with the Donkey Kong games but would do any of you think K. Rool making it into Smash would bring about his return into the DK franchise?

That's a strong... maybe.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I have little to no experience with the Donkey Kong games but would do any of you think K. Rool making it into Smash would bring about his return into the DK franchise?

Maybe, but it feels like one of those cases where if Retro wanted to bring him back they would've done it in returns tbh, they seem to just wanna do their own thing tbh. But if the demand is big enough I could see them doing it, although they didn't for tropical freeze so I guess the demand wasn't quite big enough back then. It's a shame they didn't bring him back for returns though tbh, we could've got him in smash 4 and then dixie in ultimate and everything would've been great, not to say we can't get both now but this situation is giving me anxiety lmao.

 

[Noipoi]

So who are you going to play the most from the original 12 at the start of Smash Ultimate?

As for me: , and .

probably, gotta represent my favorite series!