Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Well, Lucas too, but that's stretching it since it's only PK Freeze, haha.

Yeah, I know what your're saying. I just mean a full blown ice character. If Sakurai could at least find one ice character and even a third party character at that, it must be Sub-Zero. Though that may be a bit difficult since Mortal Kombat is from the West, and Sakurai only sticks to characters that were from represented Japanese companies like Capcom or Sega, which is kinda disappointing. :/

 

[Opossum]

Yeah, I know what your're saying. I just mean a full blown ice character. If Sakurai could at least find one ice character and even a third party character at that, it must be Sub-Zero. Though that may be a bit difficult since Mortal Kombat is from the West, and Sakurai only sticks to characters that were from represented Japanese companies like Capcom or Sega, which is kinda disappointing. :/

Honestly I think a western third party could happen in Smash 5. Most of the really big names left are either with Konami, with one of the companies already in the game, or are from the west.

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Honestly I think a western third party could happen in Smash 5. Most of the really big names left are either with Konami, with one of the companies already in the game, or are from the west.

I could think of examples of western third party characters like Doomguy or Doom Marine from Doom, Crash Bandicoot, Sub-Zero from MK, maybe Abe from Oddworld, and maybe an EA rep like Commander Shepard from Mass Effect or... I dunno, Star Wars or Titanfall, but that's really, really stretching.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Was Square western or not? Cause I kept hearing that only Diddy and Cloud are Smash characters designed and created by western game developers. I would very much like to have this changed too. Even if Cloud's inclusion was the very exact opposite of my reaction to Diddy's inclusion.

King K.Rool or Dixie might bring a change in this, they are reasonably popular for Nintendo characters not yet in Smash. For third parties, anything could happen. My thoughts on what characters could be included tend to shift a lot. But for now am thinking it's quite likely we get characters from third party developers who already have a character in Smash. I think that was the very reason they opted for Ryu and Bayonetta as DLC characters. The negotiations must've been way easier than for Cloud.

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Was Square western or not? Cause I kept hearing that only Diddy and Cloud are Smash characters designed and created by western game developers. I would very much like to have this changed too. Even if Cloud's inclusion was the very exact opposite of my reaction to Diddy's inclusion.

King K.Rool or Dixie might bring a change in this, they are reasonably popular for Nintendo characters not yet in Smash. For third parties, anything could happen. My thoughts on what characters could be included tend to shift a lot. But for now am thinking it's quite likely we get characters from third party developers who already have a character in Smash. I think that was the very reason they opted for Ryu and Bayonetta as DLC characters. The negotiations must've been way easier than for Cloud.

Square is obviously Japanese, so Cloud isn't really western, Diddy on the other hand, is Western because DKC was done by a British company(Rare).
To be honest, I didn't really understand why Ryu was in the game when we got Mega Man as a definitive Capcom rep. Just off the top of my head.

"edit" Yes people I know, Ryu was in Smash, because he represents fighting games, I get it, I just think he was a bit "unnecessary" even if he's DLC to say the least, but that's just me. If you like Ryu, that's fine. He is an icon and I know an icon like him would be expected in Smash.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

To be honest, I didn't really understand why Ryu was in the game when we got Mega Man as a definitive Capcom rep.

Because Ryu reps traditional fighting games.

 

[Blue_Sword_Edge]

The thing about Sub-Zero from Mortal Kombat is that there are two of them, story wise. The original character to be Sub-Zero is named Bi Han, who later took up the name "Noob Saibot" after he got killed. The current Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang, Bi Han's brother.

I'd rather have Kuai Liang since he's done more as Sub-Zero, is the current one, and has more Nintendo appearances than Bi Han has under the same moniker.

To be honest, I didn't really understand why Ryu was in the game when we got Mega Man as a definitive Capcom rep. Just off the top of my head.

Ryu is from Street Fighter, a very popular 2D fighting video game franchise. Plus, Sakurai doesn't seem to have any misgivings on the situation for Capcom and later Sega having more than one character.

 

[A Distant Demon]

Because Ryu reps traditional fighting games.

And, much more importantly, is a super cool, popular, and iconic character with plenty of potential for a moveset

Not everything is about "reps" goddammit

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

The thing about Sub-Zero from Mortal Kombat is that there are two of them, story wise. The original character to be Sub-Zero is named Bi Han, who later took up the name "Noob Saibot" after he got killed. The current Sub-Zero is Kuai Liang, Bi Han's brother.

I'd rather have Kuai Liang since he's done more as Sub-Zero, is the current one, and has more Nintendo appearances than Bi Han has under the same moniker.

If it happens, I could see a Noob Saibot palette to reference Bi-Han.

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

Because Ryu reps traditional fighting games.

Well, now I know. lol. Street Fighter is a popular franchise so I guess Ryu had to get that piece of the Smash pie.

 

[Blue_Sword_Edge]

If it happens, I could see a Noob Saibot palette to reference Bi-Han.

To go for more references, they can use the different colors from the MK "ninjas" to reference the palette swaps of the early MK days.

Netherrealm Studios has done the palette swapping to Noob before, both pre-Warner Brothers Games and the Warner Brothers Games eras.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

To go for more references, they can use the different colors from the MK "ninjas" to reference the palette swaps of the early MK days.

Netherrealm Studios has done the palette swapping to Noob before, both pre-Warner Brothers Games and the Warner Brothers Games eras.

Not to mention Sub-Zero also has that in Injustice 2

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

And, much more importantly, is a super cool, popular, and iconic character with plenty of potential for a moveset

Not everything is about "reps" goddammit

I believe one rep per franchise is the easy way in my opinion, two reps from two franchises is possible (I mean look at Sega's Sonic & Bayonetta). Honestly, it just depends on who is the most popular & well deserved.

 

[Blue_Sword_Edge]

Not to mention Sub-Zero also has that in Injustice 2

Not only that, Injustice 2 has also shown that he can be toned down, which helps out Sub-Zero a bit here.

 

[Diddy Kong]

And, much more importantly, is a super cool, popular, and iconic character with plenty of potential for a moveset

Not everything is about "reps" goddammit

It just helped his cause tremendously that he was created by Capcom.

Am cool with Ryu now though.

Still think a character from Namco is super likely..

 

[FantasticMr.StarPit]

It just helped his cause tremendously that he was created by Capcom.

Am cool with Ryu now though.

Still think a character from Namco is super likely..

Possibly Klonoa or Nightmare from Soulcalibur.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

You can have your Second Bamco Rep when I get my Snake.

I don't think another Namco rep is likely. Honestly, at all.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Nightmare from Soulcalibur.

SoulCalibur is pretty much dead for the moment so I doubt we'll see it in Smash for now.

And even if they did bring a character from it, they'd probably pick Siegfried or Patroklos before Nightmare because protagonists.

 

[Deleted member]

Nightmare is the mascot for the franchise, though.

It'd be like saying we'd get Jin over Heihachi for Tekken, when we already know Heihachi would've been the one picked.

 

[Wolfie557]

Can totally see another Square Enix character before any other 3rd parties....only cos Rayman is western.

 

[PeridotGX]

Changing the topic (But not really, as I'm discussing a Fighting Game) , has Pokken DX altered any character's chances of getting in? Personally, I think it

A: Increased Decidueye's chances by a small amount. It may make Sakurai more keen to use it over a Gen 8 mon.

B. Marginally increased the chances of a Pokken based fighter. It not being a 1-and-done deal may make Sakurai interested in making a character that uses it's mechanics ala Ryu.

Can totally see another Square Enix character before any other 3rd parties....only cos Rayman is western.

Do we have any conclusive proof Sakurai has stuff against western games getting in smash? After all, we do throw Sylux around a lot, and he was created by a Western company (Retro). I see a Ubisoft rep happening way before a second SE one, because of the trophys in 4.

 

[Deleted member]

Changing the topic (But not really, as I'm discussing a Fighting Game) , has Pokken DX altered any character's chances of getting in?

None whatsoever.

And no, Opo, I'd be saying the exact same thing if Pokken had Incineroar instead of Decidueye, so don't even start.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Changing the topic (But not really, as I'm discussing a Fighting Game) , has Pokken DX altered any character's chances of getting in?

Not really, considering Decidueye is the only new character and was already popular enough to have good chances without it anyway.

 

[Diddy Kong]

New characters from Nintendo series not named Mario, Pokemon or Fire Emblem; likely or not?

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

New characters from Nintendo series not named Mario, Pokemon or Fire Emblem; likely or not?

100% likely because of Splatoon's Inklings.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Can totally see another Square Enix character before any other 3rd parties....only cos Rayman is western.

Another Square Enix character doesn't seem all that likely to be honestly. Aside from Final Fantasy is there a series that has a genuine character that can actually be an interesting character. Tomb Raider, Dragon Quest, and basically any other aquired through Eidos character I feel are of the table.

Not that that matters. They've literally got the best character they could possibly get from Square.

Geno is a totally different story because he's a literal Mario character that just happens to be owned by Square. Then again, I wouldn't say Geno is likely either.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

And, much more importantly, is a super cool, popular, and iconic character with plenty of potential for a moveset

Not everything is about "reps" goddammit

Reps, the biggest word that can trigger any Smash fan in a heartbeat.

But you are right. The character and potential matters the most.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

SoulCalibur is pretty much dead for the moment so I doubt we'll see it in Smash for now.

And even if they did bring a character from it, they'd probably pick Siegfried or Patroklos before Nightmare because protagonists.

Nightmare's the face of the franchise. Also isn't Heihachi Tekken's antagonist? Sakurai has said he wanted to make him playable but found him difficult to work with iirc

 

[Godzillathewonderdog]

Another Square Enix character doesn't seem all that likely to be honestly. Aside from Final Fantasy is there a series that has a genuine character that can actually be an interesting character.

Sora is the best option.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

Sora is the best option.

Too bad the wonderful corporation of Disney is very strict and never knows how to have fun.

 

[Schnee117]

Beyond another FF character (Kefka, Sephiroth or Noctis) I really want Adam Jensen. Dude has some fantastic tools to use.

A Bravely character would be cool (preferably Ringabel) and Octopath's demo left a good impression so a character from there would be nice (at the moment I'm all for Olberic).

 

[Blue_Sword_Edge]

Beyond another FF character (Kefka, Sephiroth or Noctis) I really want Adam Jensen. Dude has some fantastic tools to use.

A Bravely character would be cool (preferably Ringabel) and Octopath's demo left a good impression so a character from there would be nice (at the moment I'm all for Olberic).

Noctis can be eligible if Square Enix follows through with a Switch release of Final Fantasy 15 or one of his game lands on a Nintendo platform, which is fluctuating between somewhat likely and somewhat unlikely. I am still pushing for Bartz as far as another Final Fantasy character.

As for the rest of Square Enix, I am pushing towards Dragon Quest because that's so huge in Japan. It's also an instance where Akira Toriyama styled characters actually has a chance of getting into Smash.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Oops, my apologies. Sorry for the confusion there.

Only ice character we got are the Ice Climbers.

There are a few other fighters with attacks that have a freezing effect. Opossum already mentioned Lucas's PK Freeze, but there's also Giga Bowser's d-smash, along with Mr. Game & Watch's #8 Judge.

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

There are a few other fighters with attacks that have a freezing effect. Opossum already mentioned Lucas's PK Freeze, but there's also Giga Bowser's d-smash, along with Mr. Game & Watch's #8 Judge.

Yeah, but those are just one move for those characters.

 

[Bowserlick]

Ice Climbers are good ice characters. Put them back.

If you want to represent a franchise, go for the character that best represents the franchise. I think Scorpion is the face of MK more than Sub-Zero. He has the more brutal moveset overall than Subby and his classic harpoon.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Yeah, but those are just one move for those characters.

Ironically, the Ice Climbers didn't have all that many freezing effect attacks either; only three at most, with one of the attacks being a Final Smash.

 

[Deleted member]

Ironically, the Ice Climbers didn't have all that many freezing effect attacks either; only three at most, with one of the attacks being a Final Smash.

Makes sense, considering they were a duo that climbed ice peaks rather than cryokinetics.

Someone like Sub-Zero would be the first true cryokinetic.

 

[Opossum]

None whatsoever.

And no, Opo, I'd be saying the exact same thing if Pokken had Incineroar instead of Decidueye, so don't even start.

You sure do think highly of me.

Honestly the chance of any Alola Pokémon getting into Smash gets lower and lower the longer we go without news of a Smash 4 port. The fact that Gen VIII is in development now pretty much kills any shot of one getting into a full Smash 5. We'd get a Gen VIII Pokémon if anything.

 

[Deleted member]

You sure do think highly of me.

Considering you've gone out of your way to accuse me of trying to "praise Incineroar" when discussing of Rowlet having a better chance of all things in the past, I really don't when it comes to this subject.

So better I clarify that it's not just because Decidueye's involved that I'm saying Pokken DX won't affect Smash in any way than leave you any room for accusation.

Honestly the chance of any Alola Pokémon getting into Smash gets lower and lower the longer we go without news of a Smash 4 port. The fact that Gen VIII is in development now pretty much kills any shot of one getting into a full Smash 5. We'd get a Gen VIII Pokémon if anything.

This, we are in agreement about.

 

[Luminario]

Honestly the chance of any Alola Pokémon getting into Smash gets lower and lower the longer we go without news of a Smash 4 port. The fact that Gen VIII is in development now pretty much kills any shot of one getting into a full Smash 5. We'd get a Gen VIII Pokémon if anything.

We could feasibly get both gen 7 and 8 in Smash 5. The most pushed Gen 5 pokemon was Zoroark right? Was it's popularity remotely close to the levels of Decidueye or Mimikyu?