Official Smash Ultimate Discussion

[True Blue Warrior]

I wonder if Emily Rogers getting the Pokémon Let’s Go leak completely right gives her Smash comments anymore credit. Thoughts?

No, absolutely not, given how meaningless and subjective her hints were.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Lucina being cut just seems like fake news to me.

Out of all the clones. She's easily the most popular Nintendo character of the 3.

The only reason I could see for a Lucina cut is that Sakurai didn't want to invest in completely reworking her to justify her staying and take away from real newcomers, but in terms of her popularity in her home base game? She certainly would deserve that attention.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

I wonder if Emily Rogers getting the Pokémon Let’s Go leak completely right gives her Smash comments anymore credit. Thoughts?

Yes, but unfortunately she didn't say much. She couldn't even confirm for sure there were no cuts.

Maybe she'll come out with more info sooner since her source seems to be right?

 

[?????????????]

If they bring back Dark Pit, I want the ability to kick as him.

...Maybe it could even be a special move.

 

[Diddy Kong]

Lucina being cut just seems like fake news to me.

Out of all the clones. She's easily the most popular Nintendo character of the 3.

The only reason I could see for a Lucina cut is that Sakurai didn't want to invest in completely reworking her to justify her staying and take away from real newcomers, but in terms of her popularity in her home base game? She certainly would deserve that attention.

I think she warrants her stay even if she remains unchanged honestly. A non-tipper Marth is surprisingly liberating to play as.

 

[T-Donor66]

Yes, but unfortunately she didn't say much. She couldn't even confirm for sure there were no cuts.

Maybe she'll come out with more info sooner since her source seems to be right?

That is if it’s the same source. Has ever she mentioned if she has multiple different sources, or one very high profile source? If it’s the same source that gave her the Let’s Go info, then I’d say her Smash knowledge could also be accurate.

 

[StrangeMann]

With all this discussion about the imgur leaks, what is everyone’s opinion on the Vergeben leak it’s based on? What about comments from ResetEra mods hunting about Ridley (which would corroborate the Vergeben leak)? I know ridley is a divisive character, but do people here think this leak is likely enough for him to be a viable choice in prediction lists? Would likely be the biggest turnaround by Sakurai in recent memory though.

 

[Yoshi-Thomas]

Yes, but unfortunately she didn't say much. She couldn't even confirm for sure there were no cuts.

Maybe she'll come out with more info sooner since her source seems to be right?

I would say that if it really is a dream roster, no cuts is a minimum.
No one deserves to be cut. Yoshi, Dark Pit, Lucas, Mewtwo, DeDeDe, every single character has a following.
That's why I believe the Simon/Ridley leak a bit more. While not directly related, having Ice Climbers coming back, Ridley as a newcomer and no cut fits the bill of roster satisfying a lot of people. And with Simon in it, it could imply that Snake has a chance coming back, thus meaning that the other cut veterans (Pichu, Young Link, Squirtle, Ivysaur, Wolf) also get a shot.
I will probably be disappointed but my perfect roster includes all the cut characters.

With all this discussion about the imgur leaks, what is everyone’s opinion on the Vergeben leak it’s based on? What about comments from ResetEra mods hunting about Ridley (which would corroborate the Vergeben leak)? I know ridley is a divisive character, but do people here think this leak is likely enough for him to be a viable choice in prediction lists? Would likely be the biggest turnaround by Sakurai in recent memory though.

I believe this leak at 95%. I am bready to die.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

*shrugs* Maybe they weren't planned for Smash Switch? I mean Pichu and Young Link weren't planned for Brawl so it's not that farfetched. Not that I believe in this fake rumour but this argument of "it's fake because of cut character Y" usually doesn't work since none of these guys are shoo-ins.

Young Link was replaced with Toon Link, and Pichu is just kinda generally disliked and maybe they thought 7 pokemon in brawl was overkill. At this point there's no real reason not to bring those 3 back, they're probably even easier to make than the melee clones tbh and 2/3 are popular characters and one is a 2 time veteran

I mean...
What would be the point of having Roy, Pichu, Dr.Mario, Young Link cut?
Or Wolf and Lucas being Cut?
Clones seems to be low priority, maybe a "Sonic case" could happen for smash switch were a character joined after the roster was decided and they had to cut clones?



That I unfortunately agree with you- but let's say it was the first one gaining attention for whatever reason?
Honestly me it's just that discussing leaks are more fun than normal circle discussion we had for 1200 pages. Beside it's the pre-E3 the best and likely last time we can talk about them before they all get deconfirmed-

Those guys probably take far more time to make than those 3 tho since they're practically identical, and brawl had little dev time to add more characters thanks to SSE

 

[SquashiniKun]

I hope they bring back those Newcomer posters that they would have on the website of Smash 4.

 

[T-Donor66]

With all this discussion about the imgur leaks, what is everyone’s opinion on the Vergeben leak it’s based on? What about comments from ResetEra mods hunting about Ridley (which would corroborate the Vergeben leak)? I know ridley is a divisive character, but do people here think this leak is likely enough for him to be a viable choice in prediction lists? Would likely be the biggest turnaround by Sakurai in recent memory though.

Honestly, not buying it yet. Simon Belmont doesn’t feel like an E3 announcement character to me. Ridley and Ice Climbers are also safe bets and get lots of people excited. I’m not really adamant about my opinion but it’s not something I’m really paying too much attention to.

 

[ErenJager]

We are talking about that leak because is a fun one, because we are bored of talking over and over about fire emblem and pokemon, if you have other fake leaks to share go ahead and we talk about them too.
Because REALLY, the only reason I talk about it is because boredom and I would talk about any leak, the more characters they say the more is to talk.

I don't want to encourage fake leaking any further.

 

[Garteam]

With all this discussion about the imgur leaks, what is everyone’s opinion on the Vergeben leak it’s based on? What about comments from ResetEra mods hunting about Ridley (which would corroborate the Vergeben leak)? I know ridley is a divisive character, but do people here think this leak is likely enough for him to be a viable choice in prediction lists? Would likely be the biggest turnaround by Sakurai in recent memory though.

At this point, I think Ridley is kinda inevitable. He keeps on being brought up by reputable sources like Dasvergeben (who had two sources claiming he was in) and the ResetEra mods. Generally, the more people bring up a singular idea the more likely that leak is to be true (look at how many people leaked Mario + Rabbids and Let's Go Pikachu/Eevee). I still think there's a chance the rumours may not be true, as Ridley in Smash is a pretty popular idea in fake leaks, but right now I'll put him at about 90% chance of being in the game.

 

[T-Donor66]

I don't want to encourage fake leaking any further.

Then simply don’t engage in the discussion or look at any leaks. Let people have their fun. I’ll take leak speculation over 1200 more pages of “I think Smash 5 will have Decidueye and a fire emblem switch rep”.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Young Link was replaced with Toon Link, and Pichu is just kinda generally disliked and maybe they thought 7 pokemon in brawl was overkill. At this point there's no real reason not to bring those 3 back, they're probably even easier to make than the melee clones tbh

I mean, if you are going to make that kind of argument, then Dark Pit also gets the same level of dislike as Pichu so that argument doesn't support him at all.

Those guys probably take far more time to make than those 3 tho since they're practically identical, and brawl had little dev time to add more characters thanks to SSE

No way, the time taken to implement Toon Link and Wolf could have been used to add Roy, Dr. Mario, Pichu and Young Link as Melee-style clones if they wanted to. They just didn't.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Medusa, Porky and Goroh just make it seem fake to me too.

''I shall over look the likes of some really iconic new characters like Captain Toad, Isabelle, Waluigi, actually requested forgotten Nintendo characters of recent yesteryear like Isaac/Chibi Robo and add someone I helped make

And a villain from a dead franchise, where he's the villain in a game not released internationally, and someone who is just from a dead series in general."

Medusa would make people scream bias on his part and we know he doesn't like that feeling.

Porky and Goroh break his trend of adding people who are relevant.

I don't know that leak just doesn't seem real to me.

 

[Zeox]

I don't want to encourage fake leaking any further.

Then don't talk about any leak, not even Vergeben's leak, because is as fake as any other leak.
But let us talk about that bull****, because I am honestly bored of the same pokemon and fe talks

 

[IntelliHeath1]

Yeah, I'm glad that Koopalings got in as alt costumes. I will never thought they would ever get in Smash Bros. Hopefully they remains in Smash Switch and get their alt colors as well.

 

[MrRoidley]

Some rumor piggybacking the rumor that's Piggybacking Vergeben? lmao

In any case, if the clones are indeed cut, that would disprove Vergeben. He said "the entire SSB4 roster is returning including the guests", I'd reckon the clones are in regardless if they were planned or not.

I don't buy it tho. Plus I don't want my main Doc to be cut ;-;

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Then don't talk about any leak, not even Vergeben's leak, because is as fake as any other leak.
But let us talk about that bull****, because I am honestly bored of the same pokemon and fe talks

Don't forget all the Xenoblade discussions as well.

 

[MoonlitIllusion]

I hope they bring back those Newcomer posters that they would have on the website of Smash 4.

okay but fr imagine

I wanna see the other smash characters in these styles

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

I have no doubts that Wolf will get in Smash, at this point I'm more worried about Krystal's chances getting in.

Unfortunately, Wolf's return isn't guaranteed, and Krystal doesn't even exist in the third Star Fox timeline.

 

[Imadethistoseealeak]

Speaking of faults in the imgur leak does anyone else think the Geno & Mallow team up is really out of left field? Just doesn't seem like something Sakurai would do, and I have no clue why the leaker put it there.

They were vauge so maybe Mallow just appears for a couple moves? I'm not familiar enough with the game to know how this would work.

 

[?????????????]

I’ll be more interested in Porky if
MOTHER 3 finally gets an international release.

...Even then, I’d actually prefer Masked Man.

 

[ErenJager]

Then don't talk about any leak, not even Vergeben's leak, because is as fake as any other leak.
But let us talk about that bull****, because I am honestly bored of the same pokemon and fe talks

If you're that bored, go outside.

 

[?????????????]

Speaking of faults in the imgur leak does anyone else think the Geno & Mallow team up is really out of left field? Just doesn't seem like something Sakurai would do, and I have no clue why the leaker put it there.

They were vauge so maybe Mallow just appears for a couple moves? I'm not familiar enough with the game to know how this would work.

No, you’re right. It’s really weird, and I highly doubt it.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Is it bad if I totally see the Champions either as AT, or as background characters for a BoTW moving stages but not as playable characters?

Join the club. I too don't see the four Champions doing any better than receiving the assist trophy role, or just being mere trophy cameos.

 

[Zeox]

If you're that bored, go outside.

I said I am bored, don't you think that if I am bored is precisaly because I am on the outside?
stupid outside world, I want to comeback to my cave and hide from the light.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Speaking of faults in the imgur leak does anyone else think the Geno & Mallow team up is really out of left field? Just doesn't seem like something Sakurai would do, and I have no clue why the leaker put it there.

They were vauge so maybe Mallow just appears for a couple moves? I'm not familiar enough with the game to know how this would work.

Actually?

This does seem like something Sakurai might do. RPG's are about party members. No RPG rep we have thus far does this concept.

However the fact Mallow hasn't been requested as heavily as Geno is what makes me think it unlikely, but I can certainly see a Sakurai thought pattern going on in that idea.

 

[MrRoidley]

About the clone talk, kinda unrelated but: these days I saw many people mentioning that the SSE in Brawl did not allow time for the cloneish characters to be added. Is there a source for this or is it just an assumption? Because I always felt those characters were cut because of them suddenly having to add Sonic in 2007

 

[P.Kat]

That leak just doesn't feel right at all, three clones getting cut (one of which, is Lucina who's easily one of the most popular clones) while the rest stays seems pretty bias to me and I don't how to feel about Porky and Goroh being I feel that there are better picks than those two but that's just me.

 

[True Blue Warrior]

About the clone talk, kinda unrelated but: these days I saw many people mentioning that the SSE in Brawl did not allow time for the cloneish characters to be added. Is there a source for this or is it just an assumption? Because I always felt those characters were cut because of them suddenly having to add Sonic in 2007

It's just an assumption. Sonic delaying Brawl saved Jigglypuff, Toon Link and Wolf.

 

[T-Hell]

They could give him a new moveset and if someone misses his old moveset, they can add samurai goroh or another f-zero character and have him the moveset.

As a matter of fact I've always thought Black Shadow would make a perfect user of Ganondorf's moveset, especially because of the purple auras and the feeling of more power and strenght.

 

[osby]

As a matter of fact I've always thought Black Shadow would make a perfect user of Ganondorf's moveset, especially because of the purple auras and the feeling of more power and strenght.

Wasn't Black Shadow super fast?

Also, I don't think any character will or should inherit another's moveset, they are not separate things.

Unless they are spiritually same character, like two younger Links.

 

[SlickWylde]

I think it's weird how surprised people act that some of us dislike clones. I'm more "meh" about them, but I'd prefer not to have clone characters on the roster. I already know the "They're just dessert and don't take up development time" so I don't get mad and think they're taking up a "slot", but I'd still rather not have literal spaces taken up by them. Just a preference though.

I would much rather see a clone character cut than a unique character, even if I didn't like the character. But it also really depends on how "cloney" they are.

Dr Mario is barely a clone at this point. Lucina is my least favorite one. I understand she is a popular character, but when she's running across the stage, it just looks like Marth with longer hair. I know Sakurai explained why he didn't just make her an alt...but she could've just been an alt and I think it would've been fine.

Regardless of how "little effort" it takes to put clones in, it's still effort and development time, and when there are issues with balance and game mechanics, it'll always make people think "x clone" character took time away from fixing those issues.

 

[Tree Gelbman]

Also Sora sort of sticks out to me.

But Sakurai has made the seemingly impossible task of getting rights to difficult characters before.

My question would? Donald and Goofy?

 

[Zeox]

Also Sora sort of sticks out to me.

But Sakurai has made the seemingly impossible task of getting rights to difficult characters before.

My question would? Donald and Goofy?

that would be getting too close of characters that are not from videogames.

 

[SirCamp]

Honestly I think the only reason people are talking about the imgur leak more than any other random text leak is because its presentation is more compelling. There's a reason the "leaker" chose to make a game/riddle out of the supposed leak. It draws more attention and it's more interesting for those speculating and thus it becomes more memorable. We just forget about all the other random text leaks that pop up everywhere else.

Having said that I'd be a little disappointed in the roster if it were true for two reasons.

No new Zelda character at all (regardless of whether it's the ones I'm pulling for or not) would make me pretty sad. I'd really like to see another one added.

And this is less reasonable to be fair, but no Bomberman would be pretty sad as well in my opinion. He really strikes me as the the 3rd party character with the strongest relationship to Nintendo's history and to see him passed over again would be heartbreaking to me. This is not to say that I expect him, but that won't stop me from being a bit disappointed if he isn't included.

On the other hand getting both K. Rool and Dixie would be a dream come true, so I suppose you win some and you lose some.

 

[Mario & Sonic Guy]

Also Sora sort of sticks out to me.

But Sakurai has made the seemingly impossible task of getting rights to difficult characters before.

My question would? Donald and Goofy?

Considering that Mickey, Donald, and Goofy are not video game characters, I would think that their chances are very slim, if not impossible.

 

[MopedOfJustice]

I think it's weird how surprised people act that some of us dislike clones. I'm more "meh" about them, but I'd prefer not to have clone characters on the roster. I already know the "They're just dessert and don't take up development time" so I don't get mad and think they're taking up a "slot", but I'd still rather not have literal spaces taken up by them. Just a preference though.

I would much rather see a clone character cut than a unique character, even if I didn't like the character. But it also really depends on how "cloney" they are.

Dr Mario is barely a clone at this point. Lucina is my least favorite one. I understand she is a popular character, but when she's running across the stage, it just looks like Marth with longer hair. I know Sakurai explained why he didn't just make her an alt...but she could've just been an alt and I think it would've been fine.

Regardless of how "little effort" it takes to put clones in, it's still effort and development time, and when there are issues with balance and game mechanics, it'll always make people think "x clone" character took time away from fixing those issues.

Smash 4's clones make the concept look bad, but remember that was a thing.