Smash UK Discussion Thread - Check first post for tournaments, facebook info and videos!

[Professor Pro]

Tryed my hardest to watch but it just got too boring.

Yeah I know, I would rather watch repetitive videos of you going around the same track over and over again and then sliding on the grass and slowing down so you have to reset it and do it again....so interesting

Nice development in your game by holding records for years btw

Edit - Also you said that like 13 minutes after I posted when the videos weren't even up lol....Mario Kart producing players with disabilities???

 

[Heartstring]

I find I can interrupt most 10-hitters with a uf3 launcher (which can get you a **** load of damage lol) once I figure out when they're going to do a low hitter :S

And yeah 313 is an amazing bound combo lol
Wish db4 was a bit quicker though, it's really easy to block once you figure it out, it's her only low hitting launcher, and it's like ****ing unsafe at -24f on block or something. At least she's crouching the whole time so you can go for CH I guess :S

EDIT: What's penguin?

ill let you know now, i'm absolutely balls at tekken currently, it gameplay revolves around 10-hit combo's and i use 3+4 as my panic button XD
also, the penguin, as in her projectile
oh come on you must know what the penguin is XD. try doing d+1+2 sometime. if it doesnt work normally, it might be a costume thing, in which case put the devil clothing on XD
oh yeah, to fire it after you summon it, do D+1+2

 

[B.Mack]

too old

seriously dude, what the actual ****.

 

[rustediron]

ill let you know now, i'm absolutely balls at tekken currently, it gameplay revolves around 10-hit combo's and i use 3+4 as my panic button XD
also, the penguin, as in her projectile
oh come on you must know what the penguin is XD. try doing d+1+2 sometime. if it doesnt work normally, it might be a costume thing, in which case put the devil clothing on XD
oh yeah, to fire it after you summon it, do D+1+2

Ah, that's probably it, none of my friends play lili very much so none of them have unlocked anything extra for her :S

I tend to mix up ff4, df2 and db4 as oki mixups anyway

 

[VA]

This sounds boring.

Are we set for the monthly then?

Top 8 automatically proceed through to bracket.

Top 8
Fuzzy
Prof
Myself
Edwin
Tamoo
Frost
j3ly
smakis

reserve list
deathgazer

Depending on the amoutn of entrants we will have a 24 or 18 man bracket? Suppose 30 or more, we have either really big pools or lots of smaller ones. I think big pools are a good idea because more people get to play each other.

And doubles is normal, whoever I team with gets nice free win.

 

[Jolteon]

I thought it was top 4? I don't think anyone past that really deserves an auto-pools win.

 

[B.Mack]

I still cant get over the fact that there are more Melee players than brawl players. what is this.

Also, I agree with Alex. noone past top4 should get an auotowin for pools... unless its like a 100-man tourney, lol.

 

[Retroking2000]

i cant go to this now sorry guys

 

[rustediron]

I think a 16 man bracket is fine, I don't think anyone outside the top 16 are likely enough to beat anyone in that list to warrant a 24 man bracket.

Are we still doing teams first? Because I'm fairly sure we could have a lot of the pool matches done by the time teams finishes, especially considering almost the players on VA's list are probably going to make up at least half the teams in the teams bracket.

EDIT: Alex, it's not really about what people deserve, it's what's reasonable given the time constraints. And to be perfectly honest, it's far to unlikely that those 8 players aren't going to make brackets to make entering them into pools worthwhile.

 

[X1-12]

I we have time to do a 24 man bracket we probably should do it

 

[Jolteon]

if that's the case Hugo, then you could easily argue for more to automatically get through, since I know more than those 8 are guaranteed to get through pools, but that's pretty ridiculous. That's why I think we should stick with 4 since they're the only ones that are really miles better than the rest.

 

[Tamoo]

So yeah, what happens if Edwin doesn't come, can't be top 4 as no one else really deserves it

 

[Professor Pro]

It would be either Smakis or J3ly.

More likely J3ly.

 

[Fuzzyness]

:/ why are we even doing pools at a monthly?

 

[Professor Pro]

Cos then some people would only play two tournament sets and then it would be done.

By adding in this new system then the lower people (which is actually more people then the higher people) get to play more matches and have something to aim for in their level as a lot of people don't really have much of an aim except place decent which still isn't really that motivating.

Plus monthlies are ideal for experimenting different systems so I think this one should be used for that.

 

[Tamoo]

Prof: The point is he wouldn't deserve it, the reason we'd ever do top 4 is because you lot are meant to be 'untouchable' and there's no point even playing the games to prove who's better.

J3ly is not one of those players.

 

[Yeniths]

It's pretty stupid anyone out of Prof VA and Fuzz get a free auto-win out of pools. No one else should be able to have this whatsoever, Maybe Edwin yes, but if hes not coming then it's just pretty unfair and will be bias who gets the 4th spot =/

Anyway I'll prob be at this so look forward to playing all of you once again, and I need to play you X1-12, still havn't LOL

Pools are prob a good idea as Prof said, also helps to limit (limit) the rubish seeding that happens time and time again.

 

[Jolteon]

It's pretty stupid anyone out of Prof VA and Fuzz get a free auto-win out of pools. No one else should be able to have this whatsoever, Maybe Edwin yes, but if hes not coming then it's just pretty unfair and will be bias who gets the 4th spot =/

Anyway I'll prob be at this so look forward to playing all of you once again, and I need to play you X1-12, still havn't LOL

Pools are prob a good idea as Prof said, also helps to limit (limit) the rubish seeding that happens time and time again.

yeah this is pretty much why I think top 8 is wayyy too much, no one else except the top 4 really deserve an auto-win. :|

 

[Fuzzyness]

if were doing pools im doing a small bracket and require assistance making people play their games with that new rule + t.v assigning

 

[Dopl-G]

Anaky/Andy Says:

Fuzz as usual il run Brawl on my laptop, and get Singles + Side Event done in time.

 

[Fuzzyness]

you realise there's gonna only be like 5 t.vs for each game

 

[Dopl-G]

Anaky/Andy Says:

Shiz will get done i can promise you.

 

[Kill The Beast]

It's VA.

5 TVs per game?

In that case I think this idea should be put back in the hat for now and maybe brought back out for another time. Edwin is not making it, it's complex etc etc.

And the point isn't because the top players are 'untouchable' Tamoo. It's more to do with giving more players a chance of making bracket and doing it faster. You probably don't feel this but there are players who know they can't win certain pools match ups and that puts them off.

It's not ANYTHING to do with how good the top 4 is. It's an added bonus for me that I wouldn't play pools, but literally I don't care either way.

 

[rustediron]

if that's the case Hugo, then you could easily argue for more to automatically get through, since I know more than those 8 are guaranteed to get through pools, but that's pretty ridiculous. That's why I think we should stick with 4 since they're the only ones that are really miles better than the rest.

The reason I suggested top 8 is that it leaves a further 8 from the amateur pools to win their spots, and these 8 have a chance to show how much they've improved or whatever and get top 8 themselves for an auto-pools win.

To be honest, auto-win in pools is not a big deal, those top 8 are almost guaranteed to come top of their pool anyway, I don't understand what all the complaining about 'what they deserve' is about :S

 

[Tamoo]

Everytime I play fuzzy I get that feeling

Still wanna play him though

But yeah I hear what you're saying, just really wanted to make a point that J3ly or anybody for that matter past Edwin shouldn't be getting auto passes to bracket.

But yeah, with 5 tvs, this things gonna be tight. Gotta make the most of the time ppl. If there are significantly more melee entrants than brawl, would it be sensible to designate one more tv to melee?

 

[Jolteon]

The reason I suggested top 8 is that it leaves a further 8 from the amateur pools to win their spots, and these 8 have a chance to show how much they've improved or whatever and get top 8 themselves for an auto-pools win.

To be honest, auto-win in pools is not a big deal, those top 8 are almost guaranteed to come top of their pool anyway, I don't understand what all the complaining about 'what they deserve' is about :S

Yes, I understand, but more than 8 people in our community consistently get out of pools, so why would you stop at 8 with that reasoning?

 

[Retroking2000]

so i guess i have to make time and go to this then

loooooool

if people are arguing that much xD

 

[Tamoo]

Lool you're such a tool edwin

just come already!

 

[SwizzyUK]

RE: Warming up
Just get there earlier (as per your own suggestion ;D) and play friendlies to warm up lol

Will do, but it's hard to practice the tournament mindset outside of tournament. I think the extra tournament games help everyone outside the top 4 - and Tamoo pretty much agreed with that. I know I can't speak for them all, but I know personally that I want my matches, even if I make top 8.

Still think top 4 could go through without pools, and I think j3ly could go through instead of edwin if j3ly wants to, and edwin flakes...

 

[rustediron]

Yes, I understand, but more than 8 people in our community consistently get out of pools, so why would you stop at 8 with that reasoning?

Because we want a decent number of people who have the chance to win up from the amateur league (i.e. everyone outside the top 8, though the top 8 of the amateur league will be entered into the pro bracket) so that there's a good incentive to make anyone outside the top 16 try and get at least top 16. It also stops the top 16 from becoming an inaccessible clique that divides the community into purely 'pros' and 'amateurs' :S

 

[Heartstring]

5 tv's per game? why so little? did some chav come in and nick half the tv's?

 

[Jolteon]

Because we want a decent number of people who have the chance to win up from the amateur league (i.e. everyone outside the top 8, though the top 8 of the amateur league will be entered into the pro bracket) so that there's a good incentive to make anyone outside the top 16 try and get at least top 16. It also stops the top 16 from becoming an inaccessible clique that divides the community into purely 'pros' and 'amateurs' :S

Yes but none of this describes why it has to be 8 people (since with this logic it should be more).

 

[Retroking2000]

loool at GP

i think a while ago fuzzy said he has 14 tvs now 10 xD

unless he only wants to give 5 to brawl if thats the case then looooool

 

[Heartstring]

loool at GP

i think a while ago fuzzy said he has 14 tvs now 10 xD

unless he only wants to give 5 to brawl if thats the case then looooool

he said 5 per game silly

someone been thieving those darn tv's all the time

edit: been told to remove this bit XD

 

[Jolteon]

with regards to tvs: half of them are stuck in birmingham so charles has some tvs from NE, he says they're all really fat so he can't fit any more in there lolz.

but i dunno we've managed to finish a brawl tournament before with 4 setups lolz

 

[rustediron]

Yes but none of this describes why it has to be 8 people (since with this logic it should be more).

Because it strikes a balance between the pragmatic need to maximise time by reducing pool matches, but allows people to still progress into the pro bracket from the lower levels by splitting it into an obvious 50-50 divide, this is like the 4th or 5th time I'm saying this :S

 

[Jolteon]

Because it strikes a balance between the pragmatic need to maximise time by reducing pool matches, but allows people to still progress into the pro bracket from the lower levels by splitting it into an obvious 50-50 divide, this is like the 4th or 5th time I'm saying this :S

so why is 8 our "magic number" for balance?

if the idea is to reduce time and give lower-skilled people a chance for a quality bracket experience then we will need more than 8 people for it to achieve its purpose.

 

[rustediron]

I'll throw in some stats for you for the hell of it as well if you want:

supposed outcome of 32 players, 8 players auto-win pools and we are left with 24 players, in 4 pools of 6. This means a total of something like 21 sets per pool, making a total of 84 sets.

16 man double-elim pro bracket works out to about 30 sets
16 man single-elim amateur bracket works out to about 16 sets.

My system means a total of roughly 130 sets being played.

Take a look at alternatives:

top4 go through:

32 total, so 28 players in pools, meaning 4 pools of 7, which is 28 sets per pool, which is 112 sets total.
if we add on the brackets as well, that comes to 158 sets total.

what we have now:
32 total, 32 players in pools, meaning 8 pools of 4, which is 10 sets per pool, which is 80 sets total.
24-man double elim bracket means about 46 sets total.

this gives us roughly 126 sets being played; the top 8 auto-win cuts just enough time down that we can actually do 2 brackets in almost the same amount of time it takes to do one!

so why is 8 our "magic number" for balance?

if the idea is to reduce time and give lower-skilled people a chance for a quality bracket experience then we will need more than 8 people for it to achieve its purpose.

Because when you optimise things, there's a specific point at which you have an optimal amount of x and an optimal amount of y. 8 just happens to be that point.

 

[Heartstring]

cant we simply decide depending on the turnout on the day? yknow, and use the one which is msot efficient

 

[Jolteon]

I'll throw in some stats for you for the hell of it as well if you want:

supposed outcome of 32 players, 8 players auto-win pools and we are left with 24 players, in 4 pools of 6. This means a total of something like 21 sets per pool, making a total of 84 sets.

16 man double-elim pro bracket works out to about 30 sets
16 man single-elim amateur bracket works out to about 16 sets.

My system means a total of roughly 130 sets being played.

Take a look at alternatives:

top4 go through:

32 total, so 28 players in pools, meaning 4 pools of 7, which is 28 sets per pool, which is 112 sets total.
if we add on the brackets as well, that comes to 158 sets total.

what we have now:
32 total, 32 players in pools, meaning 8 pools of 4, which is 10 sets per pool, which is 80 sets total.
24-man double elim bracket means about 46 sets total.

this gives us roughly 126 sets being played; the top 8 auto-win cuts just enough time down that we can actually do 2 brackets in almost the same amount of time it takes to do one!


Because when you optimise things, there's a specific point at which you have an optimal amount of x and an optimal amount of y. 8 just happens to be that point.

A number of things here:

1) You can't really compare purely by sets, this neglects the fact that many sets are run at the same time.

2) Let's just for the sake of argument count it via sets anyway, 8 is still not a magic number by any means. More people automatically winning will always make it quicker, this should be very obvious as it directly reduces the amount of sets necessary to play. The only restraint is getting pools with the same amount of players.

32 players
12 auto win

20 players remaining, 4 pools of 5. 10 sets per pool (40 overall) rather than 15 sets per pool (60 overall). Top players go through.

By comparing 8 people going through to 4, you are not saying very much. I am arguing that more than 8 is better if this is the goal. In this example: More people reach bracket automatically, pools are smaller, less sets, an example of why 8 is not necessarily more efficient.

3) 32 attending is a *very* ideal number for your example, the top 8 automatically going through would otherwise not be very efficient at all in comparison.

Which actually just gives me a better solution, why not make the top x vary depending on the turn-out? However many people are necessary to have 24 remaining will be given wins automatically.