Smash 4 Speculation Chart [WE UPDATE NOW]

[Deleted member]

*cough* Lyn'sthesecondmostpopularlordinthewest *cough cough*

Dat spring pollen man... Gives me a nasty cough.

>Implying Sakurai gives a flying **** over who's more popular in the West.

Give it up man. All you're doing is wasting your breath.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Sometimes it seems like we're underplaying the West's influence on character choices. What about Pit, wasn't he a popular request on West?

And Lyn was still noted over like many other Lords enough to be an AT. Bonus points for being OH-KO too instead of worthless or annoying or impotent like most ATs are. Also shows Sakurai notes her, whatever the reason is.

And why isn't Lyn in the chart, there's almost all we have speculated to be in this game but you can't include Lyn? Is she not worthy like any of those in the chart already?

 

[Deleted member]

It

>Implying Sakurai gives a flying **** over who's more popular in the West.

Give it up man. All you're doing is wasting your breath.

's cool man I'm only teasing. It's your thread bro, it's up to you who gets in and who doesn't.

I agree with Horsetail in that we do underplay western importance. If Ninty was Japan biased. Ike wouldn't have made Brawl. And Samus wouldn't have been in the original. Especially considering there were no Metroid games for the 64, and Metroid doesn't sell too well in Nipponland.

 

[FlareHabanero]

This Lyn crap again? Meh...

Also just to change the subject, but I'd suggest removing Starfy from the chart mainly due to the statement regarding to the lack of feasible fighters between the release of Pikmin and Brawl.

 

[Opossum]

I think Starfy can stay on the chart. Others between the era of Pikmin and Brawl are on there, so I don't see why he can't.

He's sort of in that place between unexpected and expected, ie, possible, but more of a dark horse. Just how I see things, anyway. But yeah, it's Golden's chart. I'll leave it up to him.

/EndStarfyDefenseRant

 

[Sharkarat]

What do you think about Vaati's chances?

 

[Swamp Sensei]

What do you think about Vaati's chances?

He lost his chance with Brawl.

Unless he starts appearing again, it ain't happening.

 

[Sharkarat]

Ok, was just wondering.

 

[FalKoopa]

How about adding Captain Syrup to the chart?

 

[BluePikmin11]

He lost his chance with Brawl.

Unless he starts appearing again, it ain't happening.

Well there was the anniversary edition of four swords he appeared in, 2 years ago

 

[Deleted member]

Sometimes it seems like we're underplaying the West's influence on character choices. What about Pit, wasn't he a popular request on West?

And Lyn was still noted over like many other Lords enough to be an AT. Bonus points for being OH-KO too instead of worthless or annoying or impotent like most ATs are. Also shows Sakurai notes her, whatever the reason is.

And why isn't Lyn in the chart, there's almost all we have speculated to be in this game but you can't include Lyn? Is she not worthy like any of those in the chart already?

Pit was also popular in Japan. Sakurai mentioned that he was a character with popularity in both regions. And while Sonic was mentioned to have most of his requests in the West, that doesn't mean he had little request in the East, especially since Sonic is said to have been the most wanted character worldwide.
There has yet to be a character influenced solely on Western popularity (though that may change with the likes of Ridley and Little Mac, who's Western popularity is notable within Japan).

I also (as I said repeatedly) do not add characters just because they were ATs.
Andross was noted over the likes of Krystal and Slippy enough to be an AT. Does that mean he should be on the chart if they are? He isn't worthless or impotent of an AT, either. Annoying, maybe, but for the opponent, not the summoner. (And annoying is subjective, anyway). He's even got importance as a major part of a Co-Op Event Match, where he's permanently on the stage.
It's not like he can't work, either. He can be given a body; he wasn't always a giant head. Since he isn't a pilot, he'd unlikely be another semi-clone of Fox as he'd more than likely have Specials based on his boss fights.

It
's cool man I'm only teasing. It's your thread bro, it's up to you who gets in and who doesn't.

I agree with Horsetail in that we do underplay western importance. If Ninty was Japan biased. Ike wouldn't have made Brawl. And Samus wouldn't have been in the original. Especially considering there were no Metroid games for the 64, and Metroid doesn't sell too well in Nipponland.

Maybe I went a little too harsh with that last post; I apologize.
However, these examples don't work.
Ike was not added for any sort of popularity; he was added upon IS' suggestion for a newer character when Sakurai asked them. Sakurai then took the chance to make a complete contrast to Marth's style by making Ike a slow and heavy hitter.
As for Samus, seeing as Smash 64 wasn't initially planned for a Western release, I don't think her Western popularity had much to do with her inclusion.

Also just to change the subject, but I'd suggest removing Starfy from the chart mainly due to the statement regarding to the lack of feasible fighters between the release of Pikmin and Brawl.

I have considered that, but there is the fact that Starfy is one of the more requested characters in Japan and the series managed to get an international release since Brawl, which might give Sakurai more incentive to make him feasible.
Though at the same time....the latest game hasn't really changed Starfy that much model-wise....

I think Starfy can stay on the chart. Others between the era of Pikmin and Brawl are on there, so I don't see why he can't.

Actually, Starfy's the only one. Golden Sun, Animal Crossing, and Sin & Punishment came before Pikmin.
If you're talking about characters, Sakurai didn't say that; he said there were no series since Pikmin that offered a suitable character.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Yuui: Well I could say then that Lyn isn't unpopular though in Japan, even she doesn't rank high. Wasn't she between 5-7nth in the poll anyway for JPN Rekka No Ken Poll anyway?

But overally, I just find it weird you're not keen to add Lyn while you have most of potential FE-reps included (even Micaiah): I mean, she has support too like other characters in the chart and she actually made an appearance in Smash-game nonetheless. (And I don't get why you brought Andross when I specifically referred at FE-representation when mentioning Lyn.)
Not to mention her supporters (especially Manly) proved that she could be an interesting addition, so you could let us debate or even mark her if she actually ends up appearing in Smash Bros 4 (in any form, whether AT or something more.)

You could still give some thought on her, just saying.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Why don't we split the difference and just have 4 Fire Emblem slots, one for Roy returning, one for a FE Awkening rep and one for Anna and one for another FE rep in general.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

^ Roy, Chrom, Anna and Micaiah/Lyn?

Could work. Now we should just vote for the last choice.

 

[Frostwraith]

You know how Sakurai may care more about the West?

Five letters: S-O-N-I-C

 

[Guybrush20X6]

^ Roy, Chrom, Anna and Micaiah/Lyn?

Could work. Now we should just vote for the last choice.

The Point is the last one is intentionally vague to cover more choices, and the second one is wide enought to cover what takes up about 5 slots currently. I know Anna is a reoccurring character in the FE-verse and Roy was in Melee so thaty get their own slots.

 

[Deleted member]

Yuui: Well I could say then that Lyn isn't unpopular though in Japan, even she doesn't rank high. Wasn't she between 5-7nth in the poll anyway for JPN Rekka No Ken Poll anyway?

When specifically ranked to the characters within her game, that doesn't really mean much. This is why I discount Roy being the most popular character from his game as reasoning to show his overall popularity.
The only one it'd really mean anything when compared to the rest of the characters from their game would be Lucina, who has proven to be more popular than Chrom in both the East and the West, which can possibly influence her addition in Smash alongside Chrom in a tag-team or even instead of Chrom given that she's arguably just as major of a character as him if not more (as I've heard, anyway).
Aside from that, she's 6th place compared to Eliwood and Hector, who are 2nd and 3rd, respectively. (1st place is Nino) If popularity meant anything, we would have had Nino or Eliwood as the AT instead of Lyn, or even Hector, since he appeared in Roy's game as well. So when it boils down to it, Lyn was likely chosen as the AT because her ninja flash Critical Hits were interesting to Sakurai.

But overally, I just find it weird you can't add Lyn while you have most of potential FE-reps to included (even Micaiah): I mean, she has support too like other characters in the chart and she actually made an appearance in Smash-game nonetheless. (And I don't get why you brought Andross when I specifically referred at FE-representation when mentioning Lyn.)
Not to mention her supporters (especially Manly) proved that she could be an interesting addition, so you could let us debate or even mark her if she actually ends up appearing in Smash Bros 4 (in any form, whether AT or something more.)

1. It's been stated numerous times (so it's clear you haven't read previous posts) that Micaiah is being removed on the next major chart update due to essentially losing the support she had post Brawl roster finalization in Japan. Same goes for Midna. There is a reason why they are sepia colored.
2. Just having support isn't enough when compared to the other characters within the series she hails from (which is again, another indication you did not read previous posts, as I repeatedly said that characters are only compared with other characters in their series aside from special cases such as Retros). Lyn's support for Smash in the East is near non-existent, and her support in the West has drastically died down since her AT reveal. The only reason it isn't completely dead yet is because Manly's attempts to revive it.
3. Made an appearance in a Smash game? So did Andross. So did Metroid. So did Helirin. As I said before, I don't add characters solely on the grounds of being an AT. As for your questioning why I brought up Andross, it's because he is in the exact situation; AT in Brawl, not on chart while others from his series are despite being an AT.
4. Can be an interesting addition? Why don't I just add Shake King while I'm at it; I can make a bunch of reasons why he'd be interesting, especially far more than any other Wario character. Being "interesting" is a moot point.

You want to debate about how Lyn would be or any character for that matter (whether they are on the chart or not)? Do it in their own threads or in the Roster Discussion thread. This is not a thread about discussing how characters would be like. The only debates in this thread should be whether or not someone should be added to the chart. And the decision for Lyn is final.

You could still give some thought on her, just saying.

I already have. You are starting to make me hate her, though, just like Ove made me hate Adeleine.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Well better stop here then. Should have read more in this thread, I apologize?

I already have. You are starting to make me hate her, though, just like Ove made me hate Adeleine.

I guess I should then move on then before I get called a fanboy at this rate, eh? (-l´l-)

 

[LaniusShrike]

Honestly... I hope they just make Roy an alternate costume of Ike. In no way does the game need two fire-themed sword users from Fire Emblem. Having four sword wielding Fire Emblem characters is obviously over representing the series... if they add a third FE character to the roster, I really hope it's either a magic user or at least an axe user. Even though Ike pretty much wields his sword like an axe and the sword users already deal more damage near the end...
Y'know what, I'll just say this. FE only deserves a new character if it's a magic user. As far as I can tell, Micaiah is a popular mage that wields fire, dark, and light magic. Also, she's female, further differentiating her form the other FE characters. Seems like a great rep.

Roy's Awakening design does look pretty cool, wouldn't mind seeing it as an alt costume.

Spoiler

Anyway, that's all I have to say about FE.

Out of curiosity, are there any characters that are popular in Europe/Australia but not very popular in Japan and America?

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Micaiah only uses Light magic in RD. She later gets a staff that lets her heal but thats it.

 

[Opossum]

Actually, Starfy's the only one. Golden Sun, Animal Crossing, and Sin & Punishment came before Pikmin.
If you're talking about characters, Sakurai didn't say that; he said there were no series since Pikmin that offered a suitable character.

Huh. My mistake; I could swear there were others on there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Jill from Drill Dozer on there at one point? I may be mixing the chart up for a roster I saw today, and if that's the case, pardon my ignorance.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Huh. My mistake; I could swear there were others on there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Jill from Drill Dozer on there at one point? I may be mixing the chart up for a roster I saw today, and if that's the case, pardon my ignorance.

Jill was never on the chart to my knowledge.

 

[Deleted member]

Huh. My mistake; I could swear there were others on there. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't Jill from Drill Dozer on there at one point? I may be mixing the chart up for a roster I saw today, and if that's the case, pardon my ignorance.

Nope. Sweet Jill's was never on the chart.

 

[Opossum]

Okay. I must have mixed two entirely different things up.

 

[Pazzo.]

*FE Awakening Spoilers*

Personally I think Lucina will be an alt costume of Marth. I know the implicatiosn but hey, who here was surprised to find Marth was a dude? I know I wasn't suprised when Masked Marth's voice was real feminine.

Hades: Uh, SPOILER ALERT!!!!

That was an Idea of mine.... but Lucina and Marth have VERY similar outfits. It would just be throwing a mask on Marth. (EPIC!!!)

 

[Deleted member]

Hades: Uh, SPOILER ALERT!!!!

That was an Idea of mine.... but Lucina and Marth have VERY similar outfits. It would just be throwing a mask on Marth. (EPIC!!!)

No, it would be adding a slight padding in the chest area, eyelashes and long hair as well as a femenine voice.

I'd main her. I like flat/small-breasted chicks.

Would you a Noel?

 

[FalKoopa]

Nobody answered my question. :/

How about adding Captain Syrup to the chart?

 

[splat]

Captain Syrup would be the most logical pick from the Wario Land series. Brawl's Wario mainly represents WarioWare though, as seen by his moveset - which lacks Wario Land moves such as the shoulder bash, but uses the Wario Bike - and his erratic movement.

I don't think the Wario series is 'worthy' of a second rep, but if there will be a second one, it'll be one from the WarioWare series.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Captain Syrup would be the most logical pick from the Wario Land series. Brawl's Wario mainly represents WarioWare though, as seen by his moveset - which lacks Wario Land moves such as the shoulder bash, but uses the Wario Bike - and his erratic movement.

I don't think the Wario series is 'worthy' of a second rep, but if there will be a second one, it'll be one from the WarioWare series.

Well technically the Shoulder bash is his side-Smash but yeah. Personally I think if there were a Warioland Rep it would be another Wario himself with a WL moveset before Captain Syrup.

 

[Pazzo.]

No, it would be adding a slight padding in the chest area, eyelashes and long hair as well as a femenine voice.

I'd main her. I like flat/small-breasted chicks.

Would you a Noel?

Point taken.

 

[Deleted member]

Sakurai seems to be in a WarioWare kick (I don't blame him though, WarioWare is much more successful and one of Nintendo's most unique franchises compared to Wario Land), though with Shake It being released after Brawl's time, I do see possibility in a little more Land influence.
However, I heavily doubt Syrup would be a character, especially when she didn't really do anything in Shake It.

It could happen though, so I'm considering adding her to the chart.

 

[AEMehr]

UPDATE

Removed
Michiah
Midna
Added
LttP Link
Ridley (Evolution Gimmick)
Lucina
Viridi

 

[FlareHabanero]

Lttp Link? Seriously?

No seriously, I'm being serious here. Seriously dude?

 

[Guybrush20X6]

Lttp Link? Seriously?

No seriously, I'm being serious here. Seriously dude?

With LttP 2 coming out there is a possibility, however slight that he may replace Toon Link or with Link to the Past and LttP2's unique items to make a new moveset. And the tab says 2nd New Link so it covers a wider set of possibilities, like Majora Link or Wolf Link.

 

[FalKoopa]

LttP Link wasn't needed. Toon Link is way more important than him to the franshise, and seeing that LttP link had body proportions close to Toon Link makes him all the more likely to be an alt for Toon Link instead.

Viridi's addition was surprising, given that Golden himself said that Viridi would not be on the chart.

I was actually considering adding Viridi as well, due to Chrono mentioning the idea of Viridi being added as a last minute semi-clone of Palutena (like my idea for Medusa) due to Sakurai's liking of the character, but I figured since Sakurai went out of his way to make sure you don't fight her in Uprising, I don't think he'd want her in Smash Bros.

Same with Lucina.

As for Lucina by herself.....really hard to see "Marth" coming in when we have Marth already. Kind of like how Ninten is unlikely to be added with Ness in Smash already.

 

[HylianHeroBigBoss]

LttP Link wasn't needed. Toon Link is way more important than him to the franshise, and seeing that LttP link had body proportions close to Toon Link makes him all the more likely to be an alt for Toon Link instead.

To be fair they have been in close to the same amount of games, and they have nowhere near the same proportions in their designs.

 

[Yomi's Biggest Fan]

DragonSniperNintendo would be displeased with these new results.

 

[AEMehr]

I will give the reasons Golden shared with me.

-Add Lucina . There is a possibility for her to get in over Chrom due to being overall more popular than him as a character worldwide.
-Add Viridi. Like Medusa, she can be a late semi-clone, and may have more reasoning behind her, possibly being Sakurai's new "pet" like how Meta Knight was before.
-Add a new Ridley for the Other M evolution system, seeing as that's a concept of Ridley that is a possibility given Sakurai's love of gimmicks.
-Add a slot for this Link: http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-WIa5mk-okaA/Tcg1NV7QEEI/AAAAAAAACp4/2kp5naZ2pm8/s1600/link.jpg With the name "New 2nd Link", as he can theoretically replace Toon Link due to LttP2.

 

[Guybrush20X6]

If we wanna argue about LttP Link take it here.

I wonder if the room where the team decided on the roster had as many arguments as us.

 

[FalKoopa]

I will give the reasons Golden shared with me.

I see. Rather surprised to see Golden backing down on what he said earlier.