Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
It appears that you are using ad block :'(
Hey, we get it. However this website is run by and for the community... and it needs ads in order to keep running.
Please disable your adblock on Smashboards, or go premium to hide all advertisements and this notice. Alternatively, this ad may have just failed to load. Woops!
Im aware that it's tied to the shiekah. But the shiekah themselves are never actually expounded upon and in fact the amount of information given for them is barely existent. Like if you're not paying super close attention(aka arent a huge zelda fan like I assume most people in this thread are) you'd never even see it.
I guess it's sort of the reverse problem of the Spirit Temple/Gerudo Fortress for me. Kakariko Village is hugely important so it feels like they just sort of threw the temple there and tacked on a bit to make it seem like it had a reason to be there.
The discussion you guys are having sort of reminds me why I wish Nintendo would go ahead and expand on the lore of the game. There are so many awesome things they could have us find, but asking Nintendo to do that is pretty lulzy.
OoT probably has the worst case of "Not really explained" in it, though there's kind of a bit of that in every Zelda game, with the exception of MM and MAYBE WW. I think SS was actually a really good step in the right direction in that sense since it at least gives a solid(if somewhat inconsistent) base for the entire series and it's story.
Also Mura you're entirely right about the Water Temple. I always just sort of equated it to the Zora because Water = Zora but there really is nothing to link the two together. There's literally less for Lake Hylia/Zora than there is for Shadow Temple/Kakriko.
Hmm, all this Zelda talk makes me want to go back and play the best zelda game. Majora's Mask
Im aware that it's tied to the shiekah. But the shiekah themselves are never actually expounded upon and in fact the amount of information given for them is barely existent. Like if you're not paying super close attention(aka arent a huge zelda fan like I assume most people in this thread are) you'd never even see it.
I guess it's sort of the reverse problem of the Spirit Temple/Gerudo Fortress for me. Kakariko Village is hugely important so it feels like they just sort of threw the temple there and tacked on a bit to make it seem like it had a reason to be there.
You're looking at it the wrong way, and missing one of the greater strong points of OoT's story telling and lore. The game makes it clear multiple times that the Sheikah are a mysterious, hidden race. The lack of information on them is by design, and is integrated into a lot of the gameplay. The link between the Sheikah and Kakariko village is made clear long before you even know about.
In the grave yard there's a grave that says -
R.I.P. Here lie the souls of those who swore fealty to the Royal Family of Hyrule: The Sheikah, guardians of the Royal Family and founders of Kakariko, watch over these spirits in their eternal slumber.
A guard in Kakariko village says -
"This village used to be a Shiekah [sic] village, but the great Impa opened it to everyone."
An old man in Kakariko Village says -
Have you heard the legend of the "Shadow Folk"? They are the Sheikah...the shadows of the Hylians. They say they swore allegiance to the King of Hyrule and guarded the Royal Family...
Impa herself says -
At the foot of Death Mountain you will find my village, Kakariko. That is where I was born and raised.
All of this information is accessible long before you even know the Shadow Temple exists, and the game even clues you in beforehand on the whereabouts of the temple by letting you see the cliff above the graveyard early in the game. So clearly, the reason for the Shadow Temple's inclusion is not tacked on. Nintendo went to great lengths to make sure that the player knew that the Sheikah were important.
Furthermore, the example of the connection between Kakariko Village, the Sheikah, and the Shadow Temple is an example of one of the many areas of immense depth that OoT has. Nintendo could've actually tacked on the Shadow Temple without any affiliation to the Sheikah or Kakariko at all. There could've also been no connection of the Sheikah to Kakariko village either. However, Nintendo took the time to develop this part of the game and connect these crucial storyline elements to the lore of the fictional world. It's completely unnecessary, but it enhances the experience of the game so much. That type of depth is present with a lot of the elements of OoT's storyline. That's the type of creativity I was talking about when I said that Nintendo got lazy with SS.
Speaking of lore, I think it'd be cool if Zelda pulled a Metroid Prime and had locations around the game where you can read lore written by certain people of the past. Whether this be physically written down or spiritually tied to Link, it'd be badass.
For example, Link shows up to Lanayru for the first time. He approaches Lake Hylia and he finds a certain landmark, building, stone, whathaveyou. He gets some kind of prompt saying there's lore available, such as physical writing or spiritual availability, and he gets a message about the past from somebody. For a more specific example actually, if we get a game that approaches the area that used to be the sealed grounds again, there could be lore that is 'written' by Impa and it could just contain her thoughts and would explain why she used to be there, what happened, et cetera.
I liked the idea of revisiting areas in concept...but it wasn't really executed in the most exciting way to me. The areas of the world felt more like Mario 64 levels than actual places that would conceivably exist in a populated fantasy land. That, coupled with all the collectathons the game really reminded me of N64 era platformers/adventure games. Which is okay I guess, but that's not Zelda, to me. For instance, I thought it was pretty awesome when Faron flooded, but then what do we do? Collect 8 red coins- I mean, collect 30 something tadpoles in the same exact area we were in in the beginning of the game...where we were walking around collecting Kikwis!
I dunno, I just don't find collecting a bunch of tokens or "please find X amount of my friends to advance!" all that engaging anymore. It was cool in Banjo Kazooie and related games, but not so much 15 years later.
Speaking of lore, I think it'd be cool if Zelda pulled a Metroid Prime and had locations around the game where you can read lore written by certain people of the past. Whether this be physically written down or spiritually tied to Link, it'd be badass.
For example, Link shows up to Lanayru for the first time. He approaches Lake Hylia and he finds a certain landmark, building, stone, whathaveyou. He gets some kind of prompt saying there's lore available, such as physical writing or spiritual availability, and he gets a message about the past from somebody. For a more specific example actually, if we get a game that approaches the area that used to be the sealed grounds again, there could be lore that is 'written' by Impa and it could just contain her thoughts and would explain why she used to be there, what happened, et cetera.
Fighting Ghirahim and the Imprisoned over and over again actually had a purpose, though I can clearly see how they could have handled it better. It was basically just the same thing slightly altered in each case. The only rematch that had me interested was the third Ghirahim match because it was drastically different and intense. Second Ghirahim was just a harder version of the first and the Imprisoned just got a new body addition and you had to do the same thing in the same place with each one anyhow. I understand it is suppose to familiarize you with each one, but it only actually worked with Ghirahim, and I think we could have went without the second Ghirahim boss fight and perhaps had him fight you outside of Boss Key Room, either interrupting your adventure or the progress of a dungeon. The only thing actually good about the second Ghirahim fight was the cutscene right before. We didn't need him as a half-***** Dungeon boss for it though.
As for the water segment, it was dumb. It is an interesting idea to flood an area temporarily, I admit, but the reasoning for it was thoughtless, the task that had to be carried out was kind of meh, and that was all the flood added. It's addition wasn't justified. But that wasn't as bad as what was passed off as extra content in the Eldin Province. To get to the second dungeon you did a few frog things with a bottle of water and got to the next dungeon. Then to get the song there you had to do the typical Nintendo thing and collect all of your stuff and then just go to this one area that you had to walk by before. Granted, it was a little fun collecting the items again, but it didn't add anything to the game. At least Lanayru (or however it is spelled) had an extra little area in both revisits to travel through and one gave access to the Boss Rush mode.
What Gwjumpman suggested about getting lore prompts is a great idea, they should do even more than that in my opinion. Fans would go crazy for that crap. Crazy. I myself would find it irresistible.
Another thing I'd add is making all items have a use in combat or adds a new dynamic to it. In most Zelda games a lot of items you get whether they are in your inventory or they are earrings you wear, only are useful to advance through the story and/or terrain. This is absolutely boring, it does not make me very excited to get items half the time and I hate seeing my stash of items and never selecting almost any in a fight. It is either the sword, arrow, or bombs, and it seems that way in most games. I would love to have more things involved that you can use or have equipped like the item in Wind Waker that reduced damage or revealed health bars (I'm pretty sure that game had those two things, been too long). Add in armor that does different things other than allow story development (and I do not mean that dreadful thing you get in Twilight Princess that sucks up all of your unused Ruppees at the end of the game that you hardly even need. I used it against the final Ganondorf segment just to do it without losing a single heart.)
Give me lore and more interesting equipment. I want Link to have a lot of battle options and even be somewhat customizable for your preferences. It would literally jump leagues above other games, it would be way too easy.
^ Agree 100%. In SS all the items were pretty much puzzle tools. I know they wanted to focus on swordsmanship and maybe z-targeting items would detract from that, but I'm sure they could have figured something out.
And lores would be a great idea. Specially in SS and MM, where you know absolutely nothing of the land.
I enjoy many aspects of Skyward Sword more than OoT. But both games are good, and revolutionary in their own way. SS did improve on TP a lot, but I cannot help but miss some elements TP had as the enormous overworld, sword skills (these two especially) and swimming with the Zora Armor >>> swimming with the Water Dragon Scale. Clawshots where more enjoyable in TP to.
Then again, if I would replay both games, I would enjoy SS better. Modern doesn't mean better, as for example, I enjoyed the SNES Donkey Kong Country games more than DK Country Returns for Wii, but Skyward Sword just like OoT feels like a new direction for the series. Whereas most of us thought it was impossible after Wind Waker and Twilight Princess (and it resembling OoT a lot gameplay-wise, not improving on it much). Skyward Sword just did that, and therefore I enjoyed it a lot. Skyward Sword imo used the Wii controlls the best out of any Wii games I played. Whereas OoT was easily rivalled by Mario 64, Banjo-Kazooie, and Majoras Mask.
Oh and while I'm at it, I like Ganondorf better than Ghirahim, but Impa clearly beats Sheik.
I'm currently on my second play-through of SS (on the third dungeon now), and it has been extremely painful at most parts
(and I don't just mean my back). I just dislike the overall feel of SS.
Skyloft, the one actual town in the game, is boring. There's very few extra things to do, and many of them are lame.
The characters look dull (I got the same feel from TP, but not from OoT, MM or WW).
The Sky is way too spread out, and it's not like sailing where you can just sit back and relax while you travel.
Faron, Eldin, and Lanayru just don't seem to have the LoZ feel, and neither do the characters inside them.
Fi NEVER has anything useful to say, and yet she talks so much (or at least it seems that way because of how painful it is to sit there and watch her talk).
Nothing is really hard so far, except for some frustration with the controls. Mainly when fighting bokoblins and I try to bait them to defend the right,
and I quickly want to move the remote left and swing right, but if I do it too fast it'll register as a leftward swing instead.
If I'm too slow, the bokoblin then defends the left side. This is particularly frustrating against electric bokoblins.
Oh and fighting those 3-headed monsters is ridiculous. I even stun them so their heads are all lined up in a row,
I do a horizontal swing and it ALWAYS misses one head and I have to start over.
I recently did my second playthrough of MM, which I got last Christmas (same time I got SS). And I enjoyed pretty much the whole game.
Zero complaints. It was just as good as, if not better than my many OoT playthroughs. Here's how I would rank these three games.
MM>OoT>>>>>SS
There's just something terribly lacking in these new Zelda games. It started in TP and was significantly emphasized in SS (I still enjoy TP playthroughs).
Heck, I even enjoyed my second playthrough of Other M a heck of a lot more than I am my current one of SS.
when fighting bokoblins and I try to bait them to defend the right,
and I quickly want to move the remote left and swing right, but if I do it too fast it'll register as a leftward swing instead.
If I'm too slow, the bokoblin then defends the left side. This is particularly frustrating against electric bokoblins.
Man, Skyward Sword was hyped so much, but when I played it I was disappointed.
I mean, it is a good game. The story was probably second only to Majora's Mask, and the sword controls were pretty fun.
But I just could not get over the fact that the exploring was extremely limited, which is pretty much THE thing in any Zelda game. It was also annoying that everything was motion. Why did you move with the control stick, and then move with the remote when you mounted the Loftwing...
Imo, MM>OoT>TP>WW>SS, based on how much I personally enjoyed them. I'm only comparing the ones in 3D, too, since the gameplay is different than the classics.
Skyward Sword dungeons were too short and easy. Not to mention there was really nothing special about them.
Most of the bosses were lame. Koloktos I think is one of the coolest Zelda bosses but yet, all the other bosses in SS were lame. Just look at Tentalus' design, ughhhh.
No field. The sky was a lame idea and felt even less free than the Ocean. Not to mention there were barely any places worth going to. The sky was just lazy.
All the NPC's in Skyward Sword were useless. Most of them had no purpose at all other than to make Skylofts hollowness fell more lively. Also for some reason, the majority of them were REALLY ugly.
All the levels on the ground felt cramped and that it made the world feel even more unihabited and hollow.
Demise ended up being lame in the end and just felt like he came out of nowhere (which he did) There was no build up to make him feel cooler. All you did was fight this big blobby monster 3 times. He also made Ganondorf no longer a stand alone villain. I wish I didn't have to associate Demise with Ganondorf.
Fi was the most annoying sidekick of any Zelda game so far. She had no character and was robotic, very very robotic. Stated the obvious making it feel like Nintendo that the players had no brains. The game did that in general. To say Navi is annoying is just obnoxious. She says "Hey!" once then you never have to actually talk to her.
Wii Motion Plus got really annoying and was glitchy. I constantly had to recalibrate the controller just so I could play the game right.
There were no fun Side Quests, or even any memorable ones. There was nothing to do on Skyloft and Nintendo claimed that Skyloft was going to be a lot like Clocktown. It was far from it.
It didn't have any new innovative items. Most of them we're from previous Zelda's or they just weren't interesting. The Lyre was also the worst instrument in a Zelda game. You could only use it at specific times. It was useless. Treasure was also annoying how every time you started the game over, the description would pop up for them when you picked them up again.
It had the most unmemorable music of all the 3D console Zelda's. Nintendo said it was going to have orchestrated music yet it still felt like I was listening to midi files half the game.Not only does OoT/MM music blow SS out of the water, Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 both had better music than SS.
SS Final Boss music is just ear **** and doesn't sound good.
Even though I've complained a LOT about SS, I still like it. I have barely any complaints with OoT though. Nothing bothers me with it. Skyward Sword, I just have so much complaints.
SS' soundtrack was probably too ambitious if anything, 383 tracks, there are a few gems in there but the rest is largely unfocused. just like a lot of zelda's overall design flaws for the past decade really, everything has to be HUGE but a lot of that space is empty...though some of that was scaled back in SS otherwise, I thought the game was largely a step in the right direction after WW and TP but just had a few fatal errors(fi hassling you every other second...)
Also, I don't see the music issue. I didn't like SMG's music you provided much better than SS's. SMG's was just more "epic". SS's felt more relaxing. Also, I liked the final boss theme you linked for SS.
Also, Fi > Navi. There's a light emotional bond between Fi and the player at the end and her statistic "jokes" were at least fairly humorous.
I thought demise was just alright, he didn't really detract from the game at all but he didn't add much either
fi is a better character than navi but is more annoying because of game mechanics and not being able to skip her constant interruptions even on new game+. from a story perspective I like fi, but nintendo's insistence on treating players like mentally handicapped apes makes her pretty obnoxious
Also, I don't see the music issue. I didn't like SMG's music you provided much better than SS's. SMG's was just more "epic". SS's felt more relaxing. Also, I liked the final boss theme you linked for SS.
Also, Fi > Navi. There's a light emotional bond between Fi and the player at the end and her statistic "jokes" were at least fairly humorous.
My point about the music was that Skyward Sword's was of lower quality. The final boss music of SS was of same quality of SMG but, well, like I said, I found it ear ****
Also, IMO, FI's statistics were funny when she first did them. Then she did them again....and again..and again...andagainandagainandagainandagainandagainandagainandagainandagainandagain. It got the point where I thought it was just stupid.
But this is all my opinion. So, do what you want with it
Man, Skyward Sword was hyped so much, but when I played it I was disappointed.
I mean, it is a good game. The story was probably second only to Majora's Mask, and the sword controls were pretty fun.
But I just could not get over the fact that the exploring was extremely limited, which is pretty much THE thing in any Zelda game. It was also annoying that everything was motion. Why did you move with the control stick, and then move with the remote when you mounted the Loftwing...
While I agree that there is less exploration than in OoT (and certainly less than in MM), SS is by no means a small game. There's plenty to do and see, especially with the new bug/item collection system. Each environment drastically different from the next. And, even though I know that most people have a problem with SS's art style (for whatever reason), I thought it was gorgeous for a Wii title.
I'd gladly make that concession for a better story in exchange.
Also, I'd say that the motion controls were executed flawlessly in SS. I keep hearing that it's clunky or there's too much of it, but I never felt that. It made the menus easy to navigate, it was ALWAYS responsive to me (even when I'd lost my sensor bar and was using candles to play) and the slightly increased complexity of the enemies was welcome over the previous B-the-hell-out-of-them approach to fighting foes in Zelda. Your gripe with the controls on the loftwing changing from the controls on foot actually has a legitimate explanation; your plane of movement is different on the loftwing than on foot. Left, Right, Up, and Down aren't the same in the air.
I disagree, especially if comparing them to OoT dungeons. There was an adequate amount of difficulty, imo. The only reason I'd even consider calling OoT's puzzles any more difficult would be because I was far younger when I'd first tried them.
Even the Water Temple is simple in OoT if you remember to check every room.
Most of the bosses were lame. Koloktos I think is one of the coolest Zelda bosses but yet, all the other bosses in SS were lame. Just look at Tentalus' design, ughhhh.
Again, compared to OoT's bosses? I have to disagree. Ghirahim was fantastic. Koloktos was fantastic. The only one I didn't like was that silly Scaldera. It was underwhelming compared to what preceded it. Though I agree with you in regards to Tentalus' design being a little...uninspired...the atmosphere of the battle makes up for it, in my opinion. The fight isn't braindead easy, either.
No field. The sky was a lame idea and felt even less free than the Ocean. Not to mention there were barely any places worth going to. The sky was just lazy.
Why separate the sky from the rest of the world though? Though there may be no official field to connect the areas, Faron Woods, Lanaryu Mines, and Eldin Volcano all were pretty large and full compared to OoT's environments. Like I said above, each was new and had different ways to traverse them,
especially when you have to return later
and they were gorgeous.
I agree, the sky by itself was rather barren. That's because it was supposed to feel that way though. That way, when you finally GET to the ground and see the vibrant colors and surroundings, the vast contrast from the sky gives you the urge to explore. At least, it sort've did for me.
All the NPC's in Skyward Sword were useless. Most of them had no purpose at all other than to make Skylofts hollowness fell more lively. Also for some reason, the majority of them were REALLY ugly.
That's something that all of the Zelda games share, unfortunately, imo. At least where it counts, in the important characters, SS breathes life into them. Groose, Zelda, Link, and even the main villains have REAL personality...motivation.
There's none of that in OoT outside of Ganondorf and Sheik, to a degree.
I disagree. I would've preferred for them to be connected on the ground rather than needing to fly back and forth between them, but they didn't feel hollow or uninhabited to me.
Demise ended up being lame in the end and just felt like he came out of nowhere (which he did) There was no build up to make him feel cooler. All you did was fight this big blobby monster 3 times. He also made Ganondorf no longer a stand alone villain. I wish I didn't have to associate Demise with Ganondorf.
I wholeheartedly disagree here. There was build-up for this the entire game. It's all Ghirahim ever talked about. You had to fight it 3 times for a reason too...each time stronger than last time. Growing evil that you inevitably had to face at some point. Demise was just that evil incarnate...on par with WW's Ganon to me, imo. I wasn't blown away by the final battle though. I will definitely give pretty much every game outside MM the nod on that one. It didn't suck, but I wanted more.
Fi was the most annoying sidekick of any Zelda game so far. She had no character and was robotic, very very robotic. Stated the obvious making it feel like Nintendo that the players had no brains. The game did that in general. To say Navi is annoying is just obnoxious. She says "Hey!" once then you never have to actually talk to her.
Navi was far more annoying. You must not have played OoT recently if you don't remember her actually FORCING you to stop and listen to what she had to say at some points. It didn't help that everytime you turn on the game, she would say the same annoying 'HEY! LISTEN!', and actually TAKE AWAY your ability to look around until you listened to her. Remember? You can't press up C until you listen to whatever she had to say. And she ALWAYS had something to say. To make things worse, OoT's dialogue scrolled notoriously slow when you couldn't just B through it.
Fi did the same thing, but there was usually at least SOME meaningful information buried in what she had to say. And, unless she was stopping you completely, she didn't constantly flash her little Fi icon until you listened to her. She'd do it exactly twice, then stop. Navi was good for initially pointing you in the right direction after you'd just completed a dungeon, but had no purpose afterward other than to annoy. Her enemy hints were normally pretty vague, and she was completely silent in most dungeons where she'd actually be needed if you were lost.
Fi was also supposed to sound robotic. That was her thing. She was also somewhat humorous at times and had far more helpful features for more novice players than Navi ever did. To say that Fi was more annoying that Navi is blasphemy...I don't see how anyone could even begin to think that.
I never had this problem...not once. I only needed to recalibrate if my controller turned off (inactivity or batteries died).
The only problem I had with the motion controls as far as how responsive they were was rolling bombs. It was an awkward motion to perform. To a lesser extent, I think the flying was a tad clunky. Other than that, it was perfect.
There were no fun Side Quests, or even any memorable ones. There was nothing to do on Skyloft and Nintendo claimed that Skyloft was going to be a lot like Clocktown. It was far from it.
OoT didn't really have much in way of side quests either in comparison. MM, WW, and TP all stomp SS and OoT in this department.
I never heard that Nintendo said that, but I'll take your word for it. That's definitely something they should answer for; the two towns are nothing alike.
It didn't have any new innovative items. Most of them we're from previous Zelda's or they just weren't interesting. The Lyre was also the worst instrument in a Zelda game. You could only use it at specific times. It was useless. Treasure was also annoying how every time you started the game over, the description would pop up for them when you picked them up again.
All of the 3D Zelda games are guilty of this though. At least with SS, they brought innovation to the way you use the Bow and Arrow (which I thought was amazing, btw), bombs (the ability to roll, while awkward to use, was a good idea) and the beetle was cool and useful throughout the game. SS thwomps OoT in this arena either way though due to the ability to upgrade each item, including your shield. Upgrading the item's damage, some of its features, the ammo, the design...all of that is MUCH more preferable to just running up to the Bazaar and buying it. That system in itself is entirely new to Zelda afaik, and a welcome addition, imo.
The Lyre was w/e to me, tbh. I don't really NEED an instrument in every Zelda game. I don't get why everyone else does. I have no qualms with Nintendo for giving them a lesser purpose in the more recent Zelda games. It was a cool feature in OoT, but it has been growing stale to me.
As far as the treasures? There's no defense for that. They need to have a feature to turn that off...that's so ****ing annoying. WW did the same thing with rupees, IIRC.
It had the most unmemorable music of all the 3D console Zelda's. Nintendo said it was going to have orchestrated music yet it still felt like I was listening to midi files half the game.Not only does OoT/MM music blow SS out of the water, Super Mario Galaxy 1 and 2 both had better music than SS.
Even though I've complained a LOT about SS, I still like it. I have barely any complaints with OoT though. Nothing bothers me with it. Skyward Sword, I just have so much complaints.
I love all of the 3D Zeldas, but OoT has its fair share of problems too, imo. The inventory interface hasn't aged well... Remember needing to constantly switch your boots on and off in the Water Temple whenever you needed to rise or fall in the water? What about being able to hold only 3 items at a time before you needed to pause, switch, then switch back whenever that item's usefulness is over? Both TP and SS alleviated that, which made the game soooo much smoother, to me.
What about how simple the battle system is in OoT? Shield up = invulnerable for all intents and purposes. Certainly not the case in SS. A little more strategy is involved, especially when fighting an enemy like Koloktos, which makes for a far more fulfilling victory whenever you win. Same goes for the hack-n-slash manner that every boss is fought in OoT. Use the item (likely the one that you recieved in the dungeon), then mash the B button until they're dead. In SS, there was a little more swordplay involved...times where you needed to stab instead of slash, horizontal instead of vertical, and use the finishing blow instead of just B-ing the hell out of everything you see.
And also, how about the fact that the game has far less direction than the rest? I know the game's not supposed to hold your hand through everything, but, in many cases, they don't indicate when and where you should be going somewhere. You have no way of knowing that, sometimes, you just can't go to an area yet because you don't have the right item or song, or whatever. Later games have fixed this problem by removing SOME of the open-world aspect of the game and facing you in the right direction before setting you off on your adventure. It was a flaw that came with being the first 3D Zelda, but a flaw nonetheless.
Edit: It's also like...impossible for you to die in OoT if you don't want to. Fairies replenish damn-near all of your health.
To be honest I only beat OoT like 2 years ago and had a lot of trouble with the temples. In fact I am so bad that I get stuck at almost every single temple in any Zelda game. TP took me 6 months for me to beat because of this as I got stuck a lot. Then again SS I just ran through every single temple just like that.
I've still never beaten the original LoZ. not my favorite game in the series but I have a lot of respect for it destroying me repeatedly since I was 4 years old, a 4 year old these days is now playing a zelda game that basically beats itself :/
To be honest I only beat OoT like 2 years ago and had a lot of trouble with the temples. In fact I am so bad that I get stuck at almost every single temple in any Zelda game. TP took me 6 months for me to beat because of this as I got stuck a lot. Then again SS I just ran through every single temple just like that.
portal 2 was really bad about that because there's much less surfaces where you can even put portals, you never really have to think too hard because they literally take most possible wrong answers away from you from the start
my beef with SS isn't that the puzzles are super easy to begin with, it's fi telling you the answer to things before you even get a chance to try it yourself, and suggestive camera zooms informing you of what to do the moment you enter a room. doesn't matter if it was easy or hard to begin with, but I HATE the game just butting in and treating you like an imbecile like that
Come on guys, I got stuck in literally ever temple in TP except for the Temple of Time. I'm just bad at these. While in SS I might have gotten stuck too, Fi told me where the damn switch is before I even had the chance to look for it. What's the point of puzzles if you aren't allowed to think?
I gotta disagree with the contention that OoT not telling you where to go all the time is a "flaw" (i.e. in Matador's post). That is the magic that made me fall in love with the series to begin with, having to figure out things for myself but being given the freedom to scratch at the window of obstacles that I've yet to have the equipment to bypass. It's really boring the way you're basically on a conveyor belt for the majority of Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword.
and besides, OoT isn't even that cryptic. Every single spot you could possibly get stuck on has NPC dialogue that tells you what to do, you just have to actually look for it. Play Zelda 1/2 if you think OoT is too vague, and get back at me.
I think they hit the happy medium during the LTTP-MM era, NES zelda may have been too far in the other direction although as I said, I have a hell of a lot more respect for it than the conveyor belt doctrine of game design that nintendo has practiced for the past decade
I gotta disagree with the contention that OoT not telling you where to go all the time is a "flaw" (i.e. in Matador's post). That is the magic that made me fall in love with the series to begin with, having to figure out things for myself but being given the freedom to scratch at the window of obstacles that I've yet to have the equipment to bypass. It's really boring the way you're basically on a conveyor belt for the majority of Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword.
and besides, OoT isn't even that cryptic. Every single spot you could possibly get stuck on has NPC dialogue that tells you what to do, you just have to actually look for it. Play Zelda 1/2 if you think OoT is too vague, and get back at me.
I think they hit the happy medium during the LTTP-MM era, NES zelda may have been too far in the other direction although as I said, I have a hell of a lot more respect for it than the conveyor belt doctrine of game design that nintendo has practiced for the past decade
I suppose it's a matter of preference, but I'm personally not a fan of segments of games where I'm looking for what I should be doing at a particular time. I know so many people that completely gave up playing SotC FAR too early because they got lost looking for a particular colossus. That shouldn't be a part of the game, imo. The player shouldn't be wasting travel time figuring out that the light isn't pointing them through a cave but around it (bad example, but hopefully you get my meaning). To me, that's bad game design. You can HAVE that kind of thing in a game, but there's a proper way to do it.
Plenty of other great games maintain their aspects of exploration and difficulty and manage to avoid that annoying issue. By at least leaving a means for the player to figure out their destination on their own, there's constant progression. Yes, I'm sure there's a sense of accomplishment for figuring out where the game wanted you to go without clues, or randomly stumbling upon the answer where others have struggled, but I feel that it's a bit of a waste. Obviously, since I completed OoT and it's still one of my favorite games, I don't have THAT much of a problem with it. It just urks me that people overlook the fact that I shouldn't have to trial and error my way to the actual GAME part of the game.
I'll even play through the game again myself tonight/tomorrow to give specific examples of what I'm referring to.
What!!!!?!?!?
Most fans and critics prefer Twilight Princess to Skyward.
The only thing SS has over TP is some characters are more interesting (Girahim > Zant, SS Town folk > TP town folk............ but Midna >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Fi) and the Wii motion technology improved the gameplay a little bit.
