Shooters

[The Halloween Captain]

Thoughts?

I can't figure out why there are so many of these for the Xbox 360. Don't get me wrong, Gears of War 2, Fallout 3, Halo 3, Call of Duty 4, and Grand Theft Auto 4 are all fun, but that's 5 extremely highly rated games in the past year alone, all shooters. Why so many?

EDIT: Also, why so few Wii shooters?

 

[GodAtHand]

The majority of gamers in the U.S. enjoy playing mindless shooters more than any other type of game. It is just companies making more of the same in order to sell more to the casual gaming masses.

 

[Pr0phetic]

In the West, the majority of people like Co-op/MMO Shooters due to the thrill of killing others with the help of others.

In Asia, they like killing other and Monsters. Relation?

 

[hectichobo]

I've noticed this to.
Must be the works of sainten. :O

 

[F8AL]

Alot of gamers like shooting stuff, nuff said.

 

[Pr0phetic]

Alot of gamers like shooting stuff, nuff said.

Being immortal, and killing stuff while maintain a stable mind and reality is awesome imho.

 

[Cashed]

Sales. People just buy buy buy when it comes to shooters.

 

[GodAtHand]

Sales. People just buy buy buy when it comes to shooters.

I dont! >.< they are easily my least favorite of video game genre.

Actually it depends on what kind. I HATE first-person shooters. I can usually enjoy 3rd person shooters. Side scrolling shooters are find. I really really hate first-person shooters.

 

[Cashed]

You're in the minority then. When sales figures are released, as well as when you look at the top Xbox Live activity, you see tons of shooters. People buy 'em. They don't get sick of 'em. At least, they have yet to get sick of them. Most genres eventually fall out of the limelight, and it's bound to happen to shooters.

You can count on that day being far away, too, if Call of Duty World at War sells well. Freaking WW2 shooters.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

It's actually odd that I am a fan of the genre. My only problem is the gameplay is always the same. Sure, enemy and ally HP might vary, and there might be variations to the auto aim/manual aim systems, but it seems like the Market is getting oversaurated. Call Of Duty is not the only epic shooter, but Super Mario Galaxy might be the only epic 3-D platformer right now.

 

[Kaabi]

If you just want to let off some steam, killing something is the best choice.
It just gets more thrilling with people as enemies.
I also think many people nowadays don;t want to thnik a lot, but hey want some quick merciless action.
That's why FPS is the prominent genre now.
It's also a good way to showcase the graphic abilities

 

[Darkslash]

You can count on that day being far away, too, if Call of Duty World at War sells well. Freaking WW2 shooters.

Did you rang? I just played Zombie Co-Op today and man is it awesome

Well to be honest Fallout 3 is a RPG, Grand Theft Auto 4 is a sand box game so you can go Melee instead of shooter. Well to put it in simpler terms

The FPS Genre is comparable to the Platforming Genre back in the 80's to 90's. It was so popular that no one knew what could overthrow it. Then came the PSX and the N64 and it was apparent that platforming was dying out, it so happens the only company making good platformers today is the original company that made platforming famous.

Spoiler

I think

Now this may be the same fate that the FPS genre may fall too, but i don't see that coming for a LONG TIME. I like the Genre and if its like CoD 4/5's Multiplayer i'm gonna keep on playing it.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Did you rang? I just played Zombie Co-Op today and man is it awesome

Well to be honest Fallout 3 is a RPG, Grand Theft Auto 4 is a sand box game so you can go Melee instead of shooter. Well to put it in simpler terms

The FPS Genre is comparable to the Platforming Genre back in the 80's to 90's. It was so popular that no one knew what could overthrow it. Then came the PSX and the N64 and it was apparent that platforming was dying out, it so happens the only company making good platformers today is the original company that made platforming famous.

Spoiler

I think

Now this may be the same fate that the FPS genre may fall too, but i don't see that coming for a LONG TIME. I like the Genre and if its like CoD 4/5's Multiplayer i'm gonna keep on playing it.

Last I checked, Call of Duty 5 is being made by the makers of Call of Duty 3, not the makers of 4. I don't get the licensing, but apparently Call of Duty alternates between two developing companies.

EDIT: NVM, but Fallout IS a RPG shooter hybrid. And GTA's sandbox does focus strongly on shooting. I do like the genre, but it seems like there are too many great shooters. For me, at least, if you have too many games that follow the same basic style of gameplay, the genre grows a little stale, and anything less than the most excellent games are kinda less than the many other superb options. Too many great releases in a row, I guess, not that that's a bad thing...

The genre's great, and I'm not worried about it falling any time soon. However, seeing as I'm not a sports fan, any advice for some variety for my Xbox?

 

[Firus]

NVM, but Fallout IS a RPG shooter hybrid. And GTA's sandbox does focus strongly on shooting. I do like the genre, but it seems like there are too many great shooters. For me, at least, if you have too many games that follow the same basic style of gameplay, the genre grows a little stale, and anything less than the most excellent games are kinda less than the many other superb options. Too many great releases in a row, I guess, not that that's a bad thing...

I mostly agree...except I feel more that so many of them are coming out that fewer and fewer are "great". Then again, I'm not a huge FPS fan. Don't get me wrong, I do like some shooters, I own and love Rainbow Six Vegas 2 myself (and if you'd consider the Metroid Prime series to be a FPS (I personally wouldn't), there's that too), but generally I'm just an action/adventure/platforming kind of guy with some RPG every so often.
Also not a big fan of GTA...just seems so...pointless and violent. But that's just me.

But yeah, whether you like the genre or not, consider the shooters coming out interesting or stupid, the genre is very overused these days, and it's getting stale.

The genre's great, and I'm not worried about it falling any time soon. However, seeing as I'm not a sports fan, any advice for some variety for my Xbox?

This is bordering a little bit on the "What Game Should I Get?", but I'll answer it nonetheless.

One game I would definitely look into if I were you is Mirror's Edge. I don't own the game myself yet, but from playing the demo a ton of times, watching gameplay videos, and reading reviews, it sounds like a solid game. It's a first-person action/adventure game, with minimal shooting mixed in (there's actually an Achievement you can get for not shooting an enemy once throughout the game, so clearly they're not a huge part). To me, it almost feels like a first-person platformer. Ultimately it feels and looks awesome, so I'd recommend checking it out.

 

[M.K]

Last I checked, Call of Duty 5 is being made by the makers of Call of Duty 3, not the makers of 4. I don't get the licensing, but apparently Call of Duty alternates between two developing companies.

EDIT: NVM, but Fallout IS a RPG shooter hybrid. And GTA's sandbox does focus strongly on shooting. I do like the genre, but it seems like there are too many great shooters. For me, at least, if you have too many games that follow the same basic style of gameplay, the genre grows a little stale, and anything less than the most excellent games are kinda less than the many other superb options. Too many great releases in a row, I guess, not that that's a bad thing...

The genre's great, and I'm not worried about it falling any time soon. However, seeing as I'm not a sports fan, any advice for some variety for my Xbox?

I suggest the following game:

-Little Big Planet

Seriously, I want to play this game so badly, but I don't own a PS3, so I can't. It looks like uber, uber fun. Check out the thread we have to get people's opinions on the game.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Whoops, I forgot, there's already a thread for "what game should I buy." Although awesome, Little Big Planet is a PS3 game, unfortunately. Not Xbox. I'd buy a PS3 in an instant if it didn't cost more than twice the price of my Wii.

Back on topic, Shooters, first person or otherwise - thoughts?

Personally, I find it humerous that there are so few first-person shooters on the Wii, seeing as it arguably has the best control set-up for the genre imaginable. The Wii-mote would be perfect for some shooter-sword fighting hybrid game.

 

[Cashed]

Personally, I find it humerous that there are so few first-person shooters on the Wii, seeing as it arguably has the best control set-up for the genre imaginable. The Wii-mote would be perfect for some shooter-sword fighting hybrid game.

The thing is, the Wii doesn't have the best control setup for a shooter, because if it did, we'd see endless shooters coming out for that console and we'd see people raving about them. The reality? Nobody is raving about them. People prefer dual analog control. Developers want to keep dual analog control over motion.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

The thing is, the Wii doesn't have the best control setup for a shooter, because if it did, we'd see endless shooters coming out for that console and we'd see people raving about them. The reality? Nobody is raving about them. People prefer dual analog control. Developers want to keep dual analog control over motion.

That is actually really odd, although I understand it. Theoretically, motion should be obviously superior, because with dual analog you aren't actually shooting, but just quite literally twiddling your thumbs.

Although have you heard about the nerf dart wii game? sound like the worst idea ever.

Incidently, how was the shooting aspects of the Wii Metroid game? I haven't tried it yet, and I was wondering what the main flaws with wii targetting were.

 

[Darkslash]

Incidently, how was the shooting aspects of the Wii Metroid game? I haven't tried it yet, and I was wondering what the main flaws with wii targetting were.

Main flaw that there isn't alot of targets to shoot at. Spoilers ahoy

Spoiler

Dispite the Pirate Homeworld being called the Pirate Homeworld is completely devoid of Pirates.

The thing is, the Wii doesn't have the best control setup for a shooter, because if it did, we'd see endless shooters coming out for that console and we'd see people raving about them. The reality? Nobody is raving about them. People prefer dual analog control. Developers want to keep dual analog control over motion.

The thing may be that no one has "Nailed" The control system for the Wiimote yet. I assume they did that with the dual anolog sticks in the 5th and 6th gens which is why the 360 and the PS3 get a salvo of shooters every month.

 

[Firus]

Incidently, how was the shooting aspects of the Wii Metroid game? I haven't tried it yet, and I was wondering what the main flaws with wii targetting were.

Honestly, I think the controls of Metroid Prime 3 were very smooth, and I don't have any complaints about it, really. Then again, I didn't have a problem with the control scheme of the first two either, which gets a lot of complaints, so I may not be the right person to give an opinion.

 

[Cashed]

The thing may be that no one has "Nailed" The control system for the Wiimote yet. I assume they did that with the dual anolog sticks in the 5th and 6th gens which is why the 360 and the PS3 get a salvo of shooters every month.

Halo set the standard for dual analog FPS controls. Halo came out the day the Xbox launched. Man, that sure didn't take long to perfect at all. Now here we are, over two years after the Wii came out, and developers still can't come up with a uniform control setup that works well.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Halo set the standard for dual analog FPS controls. Halo came out the day the Xbox launched. Man, that sure didn't take long to perfect at all. Now here we are, over two years after the Wii came out, and developers still can't come up with a uniform control setup that works well.

Actually, that is not surprising at all. In fact, I really wouldn't trust a third party with ANY motion-based controls for a Wii game. Motion controls seem tough to perfect.

 

[Darkslash]

Halo set the standard for dual analog FPS controls. Halo came out the day the Xbox launched. Man, that sure didn't take long to perfect at all. Now here we are, over two years after the Wii came out, and developers still can't come up with a uniform control setup that works well.

Now the thing is that aiming with a Anolog stick has been around the 5th gen days with games like Golden Eye or Perfect dark, plus bungie could of taken the elements from there.

But then as you said Halo set the standard. The Wii doesn't and most likely will ever get a standard. The devs will be constantly be competing them selves to get the honor of "Best IR pointer ever" which may as well last for 2 months to 1 year. In my opinion i just think Dev's that work on Xbox360 shooters don't want to go out of that comfort zone of Halo's Dual Analog stick standard.

-Ahem-

 

[Cashed]

The N64 had a single joystick. Aiming was completely changed when two sticks were thrown in. So I'm throwing your first line out the window.

And yes, I did say that Halo set the standard (and I'm missing why you underlined and italicized that). I'm also saying the Wii needs a standard, otherwise it's never going to be attractive for gamers. As for the developers that you find are comfortable with dual analog controls and afraid to leave their comfort zone, hey, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

The N64 had a single joystick. Aiming was completely changed when two sticks were thrown in. So I'm throwing your first line out the window.

And yes, I did say that Halo set the standard (and I'm missing why you underlined and italicized that). I'm also saying the Wii needs a standard, otherwise it's never going to be attractive for gamers. As for the developers that you find are comfortable with dual analog controls and afraid to leave their comfort zone, hey, if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

The wii wasn't exactly designed to set standards. It was more designed as a developer's sandbox to expiriment with the next generation of controls. Although, I would think the standard would be motion controls with the nun-chuck, aiming and turning with the wii-mote. All that would be left would be working on the precision of the aiming, and figuing out the best way to differentiate from aiming and turning. That would be hard to figure out, but it would be what is expected from a Wii shooter.

Heck, you could use the Link Bow and Arrow aiming system from Twilight Princess with Nun-chuck movement, and I would be happy.

EDIT: I just realized that Call of Duty: World at War was a wii game. I'm going to check some videos, but I am curious if anyone who owns the game has an opinion. Naturally, the thread on the game is also available in this forum, but anyone who noticed the major flaws with the wii version's shooter controls, please bring it up here as well.

 

[Darkslash]

EDIT: I just realized that Call of Duty: World at War was a wii game. I'm going to check some videos, but I am curious if anyone who owns the game has an opinion. Naturally, the thread on the game is also available in this forum, but anyone who noticed the major flaws with the wii version's shooter controls, please bring it up here as well.

The main problem was its customization level and lack of custom button mapping. There where 4 levels of Bounding box's (From Red steel's bounding box size to very small) but then the turning speed was also a problem. Insane was pretty slow to me, even though other owners said it was too fast.
Iron sights were kinda hard to make circles with, unlike Heroes 2. I kinda got attached to the Alpha control set up and find its my favorite set up in general. Yea haven't played it in 2 weeks so kinda hard to remember how it plays out.

 

[Wolfgang457]

The N64 had a single joystick. Aiming was completely changed when two sticks were thrown in. So I'm throwing your first line out the window.

Actually Goldeneye and Perfect Dark had dual analog control schemes. What you'd do is plug in two controllers and use them to control a single player. It wasn't too far off from Halo's control scheme in terms of moving and firing, but it admittedly wasn't perfect but I liked it for what it was. Not to mention that for display, the game had widescreen mode which surprised me when I booted it up recently. While many people do regard Goldeneye for being revolutionary, I think it was revolutionary in more ways than people might've known about.

 

[Cashed]

Didn't know about that feature. Don't think a single person I've ever played Goldeneye or Perfect Dark with even knows about that. Could you explain the controls in detail?

 

[Darkslash]

Rare's Jet Force Gemini had a control setup similar to Dual Anolog Sticks.

You would aim with the R button, then you would control Juno,Vela or Lupus with the C buttons, then use the anolog stick to aim. It was a obvious start to Dual Anolog Sticks.

Pretty much I think I'm part of a dying breed. A breed of Nintendo shooter fans. I always enjoy my shooters best on a nintendo system, call it fanboyism but i don't call it that.

 

[Wolfgang457]

Didn't know about that feature. Don't think a single person I've ever played Goldeneye or Perfect Dark with even knows about that. Could you explain the controls in detail?

Can't really say I'm surprised very few people know about it, I think rare should have tried to make it more known or at least obvious.

Alright, I haven't used the dual controller setup in a while since I usually boot Goldeneye up for multiplayer and I only have two controllers so I booted it up to go through it.

First I adjusted my axis to not inverse since it just feels weird to me now. After that I went to control setup page and hit one button on each controller which starts up the dual controller setup.

The controls for 1st controller are:
analog- look
z button- aim
a button- switch weaponry
b button- perform action

As for the 2nd controller:
analog- move
z button- fire
a button- switch weaponry
b button- perform action

I tried it at its default for a bit but I kept getting mixed up, so I switched the controllers in my hands and you pretty have a control scheme VERY close to what most modern console FPSs have. If anyone still has the means to play the game on the N64 this way I highly recommend trying it through the campaign. It actually holds up remarkably well.

As for Perfect Dark however I no longer have my old cart so I couldn't really tell you how that was but I can't imagine it straying too far from this.

 

[The Halloween Captain]

Are Super Mario Sunshine and Super Mario Galaxy technically 3rd person shooters?

 

[Darkslash]

Not really. As the main basis is platforming i really wouldn't call them 3rd person shooters.

 

[Banjodorf]

I'm not a huge shooter fan, more a fighter/platformer guy, but I do enjoy the hell out of Halo 3.

It's easy to play, fun, and I love the story of Halo period. That's prety much it for me, oh, and I love TF2.

 

[Vulcan55]

TF2 is probably the best competitive (or not) Multi player First-person shooter game out there.
On the PC, that is. The Xbox got stuck without updates, and that is likely what is going to happen to L4D as well.

 

[Darkslash]

On the PC, that is. The Xbox got stuck without updates, and that is likely what is going to happen to L4D as well.

If the devs are personally challenging Xbox360 players then any thing is possible

 

[The_Blue_Bomber]

Shooters sell lots, so gaming companies make lots of them. Personally I don't see why people have such an obsession with shooters, give me Advance Wars where I actually have to think over Halo where I mindlessly kill things any day.

 

[Darkslash]

Shooters sell lots, so gaming companies make lots of them. Personally I don't see why people have such an obsession with shooters, give me Advance Wars where I actually have to think over Halo where I mindlessly kill things any day.

So wait have you played alot of shooters lately? Left 4 Dead makes you think. Sure it seems like mindless shooting but you got to know when to shoot and when not to shoot. Plus Call of duty needs some stratagy. Sure it linear but some levels just ask for tactical thinking.

 

[RedPeppers]

Can't really say I'm surprised very few people know about it, I think rare should have tried to make it more known or at least obvious.

Alright, I haven't used the dual controller setup in a while since I usually boot Goldeneye up for multiplayer and I only have two controllers so I booted it up to go through it.

First I adjusted my axis to not inverse since it just feels weird to me now. After that I went to control setup page and hit one button on each controller which starts up the dual controller setup.

The controls for 1st controller are:
analog- look
z button- aim
a button- switch weaponry
b button- perform action

As for the 2nd controller:
analog- move
z button- fire
a button- switch weaponry
b button- perform action

I tried it at its default for a bit but I kept getting mixed up, so I switched the controllers in my hands and you pretty have a control scheme VERY close to what most modern console FPSs have. If anyone still has the means to play the game on the N64 this way I highly recommend trying it through the campaign. It actually holds up remarkably well.

As for Perfect Dark however I no longer have my old cart so I couldn't really tell you how that was but I can't imagine it straying too far from this.

That is just freaking cool; I had no idea you could do that! I'm gonna have to try it sometime. Also, Rainbow Six for the N64 had you use the C-buttons to control movement, and the analog stick to controling looking. I'm suprised no one mentioned that, it's a pretty cool game.

 

[notftomearth7]

Each gaming console has its favored genre. PS3 seems to favor platforms and shooters, the Wii manages to get by by praising family fun, and of course, the XBox 360 has its shooters that it simply loves.

 

[Rigor Mortis]

Are Super Mario Sunshine and Super Mario Galaxy technically 3rd person shooters?

Sorry I couldnt fix my saracasim detector, but I dont believe anyone played both those games because its a shooter. Its like calling mgs4 a shooter first, adventure later. It just doesnt make sense


And also shooters are prominent in teh sexbox360 and playstation 3 because of the same reasons wii has 900087987987 minigame games. IT SELLS