Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[Inoj]

Has anyone compared the amount of fan art for Shantae and Shovel Knight on Pixiv? While by no means a guaranteed metric it could be a fun diversion. Also compare tags in both English and Japanese.

 

[perfectchaos83]

Has anyone compared the amount of fan art for Shantae and Shovel Knight on Pixiv? While by no means a guaranteed metric it could be a fun diversion. Also compare tags in both English and Japanese.

Shantae has a lot. Shovel Knight has barely anything.

 

[Grimacebsx]

A point i don't think gets brought up enough is back when the dsi shop was trying to get on its feet shantae risky's revenge kind of helped carry that service by being the bestand most sought after game on there when the dsi ware didn't have much to offer

 

[Teeb147]

Well. Quite some stuff to return to. But I'm glad and proud of a lot of you for responding respectfully to neon.
I think that it's normal for people to carry assumptions, so we can't hope for everyone to be open to some of the stuff we know. And that's normal for any fanbase, I think.

.. so many quotes..

I feel like putting this here for the first and last skit.

Hey characters we know, neat!

So here’s the thing, I plan on recreating most of not all of these palette swaps that I made before back when I was on here during the Smash 4 area, back when I was basing it of the Pirate's Curse design:

Spoiler: Ancient drawings, look at your own risk!

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Quite the difference from what I’m doing now huh? This time I'm actually a bit more competent in my work.

(Nega Shantae's on there twice because of the differences in their eyes, and yes that last one is Sharha from Secret Rings, I threw that one in there for fun)

I like these. and youre right youre a lot more skilled now, i saw the earrings and all that, good job and looking forward to seeing more from you

i cant be the only one who finds it comically ironic that Shantae fans get pegged incoherent, illogical, conspiracy theorists but her detractors will grasp at straws like this in attempt to prove her "deconfirmation" (even though there's a very very low chance simply liking a tweet of a drawing that just has smash bros tagged is completely unlikely, especially considering it was reported that Adam Howden, the voice of Shulk, liked numerous tweets explicitly related to super smash bros. and that NDA very clearly wasn't broken despite it being even more explicit and obvious than what wayforward has done here http://i.imgur.com/bcNhM99.png )

but let's not even think about that bit of irony and focus on this:



https://twitter.com/TyroneDunn8/status/1054553433104101376?s=19

VERY IRONIC how Shantae supporters get labeled as a terrible, toxic, and irritating fanbase (literally just because we want a character we like in a video game, mind you) but people have the audacity to be unapologetically cruel to someone and ridicule them and their art to the point of making them feel bad about themselves, purely because they don't like Shantae or her "toxic fanbase".

i love smash like you wouldn't believe, but sometimes i'm just left speechless at this game's community.

This is normal, esepcially on the internet, but youre right. And it's called building strawmen (as per a strawman argument), where people create weak claims of an opponent (or something they dont like) and then argue against it to break it, to then claim having won the argument (or feel like they have the 'up'). And often by rubbing in faces to feel superior, and all that jazz..

As one of the posters cited in this thread, I think dissenting voices can be helpful to discussion. I really do like Shantae, I just don’t think her chances are all that great. She still has a chance mind you, and I wish you all the best of luck, but I don’t personally believe it’s a particularly high one.

Dissenting voices are fine. But we know things that you dont about our character, just like you know things about your character that we dont. I'm not going to go and say that isaac has little chance to you when I know less than you do. It's more respectful for you to inform yourself from us first, and then you can see which assumptions you made dont apply, rather than pushing them and making people have to counter. We think she has good chances for some good reasons. It's ok if she's an AT (even if obviously there'll be disappointment or whatever, it happens.)

These are solid counter-arguments. I do think she has a chance still, but I don't quite agree with WayForward being silent just because they lost the Ballot. I say that because the Wii U and 3DS versions HAD to be on parity with one another, and since the 3DS couldn't handle transforming characters, that's why she wasn't picked.

I do believe she's going to be in Ultimate. I'd LOVE to see her make it as a Fighter, but an Assist is looking more and more likely as we inch closer to the launch of the game.

Toy, you're kinda flakey. You have high hopes and then you have low hopes. She has good chances, just trust and try not to also lose faith over what some people say. It's ok if she's an AT, but that doesnt mean we can't hope for better.

Oh, im not saying it isn't important to have dissenting voices, or remembering to acknowledge shortcomings. Its just that it, even if it was unintentional, feels like simple negativity. Im not saying that was the intention, but considering many of us already know about the shortcomings and have almost every reason under the book why she may be unlikely, it is sort of "rubbing salt in the wound" before anything happens.

I agree but it's not really rubbing salt in the wounds if we have higher confidence about her than they do right? We just need to be sturdy enough with ourselves to let others have their opinion and we have ours (usually based on more info cuz of everything we've looked at). That said, there's tired arguments from people who dont know or dont care, so I get not liking it.

Hey, Connor? Listen to this!

I wonder who he's referring to, eh?

Dylly, you're free not to like someone. But what you're doing is bordering on harassment, and that's one of the offenses of forum rules that can get you indefinitely banned, so try to understand that it's not good, for you or for others, to push with negative feelings. There are better ways to deal with feelings, and better ways to express things. I understand that it's frustrating, and I'm sorry you feel bad about some things. It's easier when you can learn to ignore some things that you dont like, too.

This isn't the first time my response has been met with claims that I've never played Shantae games, as if playing the games inherently correlates to believing she has a good chance. In fact I have played the first three, I backed the fourth, I like the character, she'd be cool in Smash, you can see I think as much on the first page of this thread, yet having said that, it doesn't mean I believe she has a good chance, because I don't. It's not for a lack of familiarity.

And I get where you're coming from about negativity. Wallowing in it doesn't help anyone, and I would never stick around here to just belabour my difference of opinion. But hearing contrasting beliefs now and again is probably good to prevent echo chambers from forming.


It's because Shantae and Shovel Knight have more in common with each other than any other regularly-discussed character, as far as criteria for Smash. For better, but more for worse. They both have similar deficits that stem from being western indie characters fighting for inclusion in a triple-A, Japanese crossover that focuses on Japanese characters, and therein their paths to inclusion would, ostensibly, be quite alike.

The difference is Shovel Knight has a stronger standing in several notable categories such as popularity, impact, and ties to Nintendo, and he still only made AT. The areas in which Shantae may prove superior, which I believe is mostly just a greater number of titles, seems to be of lesser merit as criterion. So including Shantae over Shovel Knight seems like forgoing the hierarchy of qualities Smash historically values.


You're right, WayForward is quiet about the ballot because that **** ended three years ago. Like every other company who pushed for a character in the ballot, including Yacht Club, who actually had their character included, the silence is simply because the campaign is over.


I would think simple negativity is negativity that doesn't justify or explain itself. It would be negativity that exists just to be negative. The outlooks of those posts may not have been positive, but they all at least elaborated on why they came to that conclusion.

I know that you said you're a fan of shantae at some point. And I believe you. But a lot of what you said were tired arguments that dont look very far. There are some here that are patient enough to talk with you. I think being able to look at the positives for chances of a character counts for support too. We've heard plenty of times the 'contrasting beliefs' you shared, so your thinking that it's good to say that stuff is not well placed in this case. Anyway, I dont think it's a good idea that I talk with you about shantae, but I feel there's others here who are better for it right now


...I think maybe there can be too many quotes in one post lol..;p

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Has anyone compared the amount of fan art for Shantae and Shovel Knight on Pixiv? While by no means a guaranteed metric it could be a fun diversion. Also compare tags in both English and Japanese.

That's not even a fair fight! It's essentially like the G-Man throwing Freeman into a fight with no weapons!

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Dylly, you're free not to like someone. But what you're doing is bordering on harassment, and that's one of the offenses of forum rules that can get you indefinitely banned, so try to understand that it's not good, for you or for others, to push with negative feelings. There are better ways to deal with feelings, and better ways to express things. I understand that it's frustrating, and I'm sorry you feel bad about some things. It's easier when you can learn to ignore some things. and more.

Um, sure. I mean, you can deal with him yourself, if you would like, because I'm afraid I won't get any better, if things aren't drastically changed.

Good luck with that though, he's one stubborn bugger.

 

[Deleted member]

Goodnight everyone I hope we all don’t end up like today tomorrow

Also all of you are right the Steve model is disturbing as f***

 

[Shadowknight1]

You guys sure are a lively bunch at times! It's hard to keep up sometimes when I'm away from my computer or other internet capable device. Good night all!

 

[Dyllybirdy]

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Goodnight everyone I hope we all don’t end up like today tomorrow

Also all of you are right the Steve model is disturbing as f***

Good riddance!

 

[Teeb147]

Um, sure. I mean, you can deal with him yourself, if you would like, because I'm afraid I won't get any better, if things aren't drastically changed.

Good luck with that though, he's one stubborn bugger.

Sure, it matters enough to steer things in a direction we like.
The thing is, everyone is free to express themselves. And besides basic rules and respect, It's about also learning to deal with things, not just change them, because relying only on trying to change things or others leads to not being able to deal with things in life unless they're a certain way.
Life is dynamic. We can do what we can do steer things in a better direction, but there are always things we cant change, so living happily is also about being flexible, and making the most of what's liked, and letting by what's not liked. The more you press against something you don't like, the more you keep struggling with it rather than managing yourself for the better.

I mean, it's just a very basic life lesson. And I hope there's a seed of it that keeps growing in you and others (including myself)
It's helpful in these cases and lots too

 

[Wwlink55]

Is there an official Discord for Shantae support?

 

[ActualGarbage]

Sure, it matters enough to steer things in a direction we like.
The thing is, everyone is free to express themselves. And besides basic rules and respect, It's about also learning to deal with things, not just change them, because relying only on trying to change things or others leads to not being able to deal with things in life unless they're a certain way. Life is dynamic. We can do what we can do steer things in a better direction, but there are always things we cant change, so living happily is also about being flexible, and making the most of what's liked, and letting by what's not liked. The more you press against something you don't like, the more you keep struggling with it rather than managing yourself for the better.

I mean, it's just a very basic life lesson. And I hope there's a seed of it that keeps growing in you and others (including myself)
It's helpful in these cases and lots too

I was gonna make a joke about this being like an after school special, but the music just makes it straight up an after school special.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Is there an official Discord for Shantae support?

Yes it definitely does! And, oh, what's this I hear... Connor hasn't infected that place yet!

Well, looks I'm gonna have to get a Discord, and leave all you Connorb0t fangirls behind. Cheerio.

 

[Wademan94]

I like these. and youre right youre a lot more skilled now, i saw the earrings and all that, good job and looking forward to seeing more from you

Thank you very much! I’m glad you’re liking what I’m doing.

...I think maybe there can be too many quotes in one post lol..;p

Now what on earth would make you say that?

 

[Wwlink55]

Yes it definitely does! And, oh, what's this I hear... Connor hasn't infected that place yet!

Well, looks I'm gonna have to get a Discord, and leave all you Connorb0t fangirls behind. Cheerio.

You are so absolutely mean to Connor...

 

[Dyllybirdy]

You are so absolutely mean to Connor...

Well, he was the one who went and asked me what was wrong with me, first.

And, anyway, this has been going on for a long time...

 

[Wwlink55]

Well, he was the one who went and asked me what was wrong with me, first.

And, anyway, this has been going on for a long time...

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)


I would love Shantae and the new Zelda, myself. Shantae and Kirby seem rather popular as well.

 

[ActualGarbage]

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)

I mean, there's the obvious Bayonetta pair up because of hair.

 

[Wwlink55]

I mean, there's the obvious Bayonetta pair up because of hair.

It might get a bit weird when they find out Bayonetta's clothes are made of her hair...

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)

It's not just because of Captain N that she'd Megaman and Shantae would make a pretty good pair, she does have other connections to Capcom. Her first game was published by them.

Also, I'd like to see how she'd interact with the Inklings. It's be fun, seeing them bond over transformations, and squids.

 

[hassoutobi]

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)


I would love Shantae and the new Zelda, myself. Shantae and Kirby seem rather popular as well.

near immediately when i saw the ninja costume in half genie heroes, i imagined shantae perching on a wall with shiek and greninja. i'd commission an artist to draw it for me if she ever got in. shantae in her bathing suit wouldn't be too out of place relaxing with zero suit samus either.

 

[Grimacebsx]

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)


I would love Shantae and the new Zelda, myself. Shantae and Kirby seem rather popular as well.

It's always fun to see what pit and palutena have to say to other characters. They would be ideal for that reason.

 

[Teeb147]

Well, he was the one who went and asked me what was wrong with me, first.

And, anyway, this has been going on for a long time...

There are better ways to deal with things. Don't keep posting mean things. We can talk in pm if there's some things you need to express.
I'll leave it at that for now. Moving on too...

 

[ActualGarbage]

near immediately when i saw the ninja costume in half genie heroes, i imagined shantae perching on a wall with shiek and greninja. i'd commission an artist to draw it for me if she ever got in. shantae in her bathing suit wouldn't be too out of place relaxing with zero suit samus either.

Shantae, Samus and Shulk hanging out at the beach in their bathing suits, bam. Perfect.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Shantae, Samus and Shulk hanging out at the beach in their bathing suits, bam. Perfect.

Don't forget Mario, sticking his nips in everyone's faces.

 

[Wademan94]

I know this borders on romantic, but I recently rediscovered this comment I left on the SSB4 Shantae thread back in 2015, and I feel like it’s relevant to this regardless:

I do think Shantae and Pit would work on a few levels: they have a few things in common-both are magic guardians with big handicaps that they want to overcome (Shantae only having half a genie's power, Pit being an angel who can't fly) both have quirky personalities, have similar senses of humor, similar moral standings as they both clearly value the lives of their allies more than their own lives, can be pretty intelligent at times but be complete goofballs in other times. Both of them are showoffs and pretty cocky, but don't look down on others. Both are able to singlehandedly take down entire armies but themselves and have fought dark duplicates of themselves that were created from them. And both of them have optimistic natures and believe in the good of everyone. And I feel they'd be a positive influence on each other, with Shantae being a social influence on Pit as well as being someone close to his (mental) age that he can be with while Pit's strong spirit and confidence helps Shantae in her own times of self doubt.

I just wanted to ask your guys’ thoughts on this and if this statement holds

 

[ProtoTwi]

As I classify the shantae games as "Metroidvania Lite" its obvious she would be paired with samus and simon

 

[Teeb147]

I know this borders on romantic, but I recently rediscovered this comment I left on the SSB4 Shantae thread back in 2015, and I feel like it’s relevant to this regardless:



I just wanted to ask your guys’ thoughts on this and if this statement holds

Oh, so we're back on shippings huh. I dont usually add much to these topics, but just to finally add something of my own, totally personally biased,
Shantae x Palutena. k?

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Oh, ships. Great fun. I'll just say, Shantae x Inkling again.

 

[Deleted member]

As I classify the shantae games as "Metroidvania Lite" its obvious she would be paired with samus and simon

SAKURAI IS FUFILLING THE PROPHECY!!!!!!

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Alright.


New discussion... If Shantae were to get into Smash, what sort of character pairings would there be? (not necessarily romantic, but something like Simon Belmont, Pit, and Megaman because of Captain N, or King K.Rool and Ridley.)


I would love Shantae and the new Zelda, myself. Shantae and Kirby seem rather popular as well.

Well, if they both get in I see her and Dixie Kong getting along well what with their pony tails and Shantae often turning into s monkey.

We've already gone over her many links Daisy, so I'm sure they would get along well. And I think it would be funny to see her interacting with Wario, like a begrudging alliance.

Tho with her history with squids... I kind of hope she doesn't meet the inklings...

 

[Inoj]

Team (ex-)Capcom: Shantae, Ryu an Mega Man.

Team Fourth Wall Break: Shantae, Pit and Palutena.

Team Metroidvania: Shantae, Samus Aran, Simon and Richter Belmont.

Team Cute: Shantae, Isabelle and Kirby.

 

[Wademan94]

Even though that comment on context was in trying to explain my reasoning for Shantae X Pit, I wasn’t trying to go back into ship territory (really should’ve thought that one through) I just wanted to see if anyone agreed with what I said back then, and even so I think that stuff could apply to them becoming friends or in a platonic relationship.


Still kinda ship them though.

 

[Teeb147]

Even though that comment on context was in trying to explain my reasoning for Shantae X Pit, I wasn’t trying to go back into ship territory (really should’ve thought that one through) I just wanted to see if anyone agreed with what I said back then, and even so I think that stuff could apply to them becoming friends or in a platonic relationship.


Still kinda ship them though.

Oh well. too late now ;p

I didnt want to comment on the pit thing myself, just cuz i dont like that shipping, but i do think they would ..get along at least, yes

 

[Grimacebsx]

Well, if they both get in I see her and Dixie Kong getting along well what with their pony tails and Shantae often turning into s monkey.

We've already gone over her many links Daisy, so I'm sure they would get along well. And I think it would be funny to see her interacting with Wario, like a begrudging alliance.

Tho with her history with squids... I kind of hope she doesn't meet the inklings...

Shantae: It was just a boss fight. They always go that way!... Just remember I'm watching always watching!

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Shantae: It was just a boss fight. They always go that way!... Just remember I'm watching always watching!

I was more worried about what she did to the heart squids...

 

[Dyllybirdy]

I was more worried about what she did to the heart squids...

Don't blame Shantae for that! The Squidsmith performed the deed.

 

[LaBeteNoire]

That was the only thing I didn't like about Pirate's Curse... They looked so happy...

 

[Dyllybirdy]

That was the only thing I didn't like about Pirate's Curse... They looked so happy...

I have a similar kind of problem with Half-Genie Hero, instead involving the Slimegals. I mean, would you hurt her?

 

[Grimacebsx]

I was more worried about what she did to the heart squids...

8 legs. That's a lot of legs. A lot of knees. Accidents happen don't they? It would take a pretty big one to thwart all that science. Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!