Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[Paragon-Yoshi]

And thats the thing. I'm not saying its a rule, but so far Sakurai himself seems to like to put in a retro character. He's done it every game, so he may want to do it again this time. I think its a safe bet that Sakurai wants to put a retro in.

And if he doesn't, then he doesn't.

Fair enough.

It's really just taking trends that Sakurai has exhibited in the past and trying to tie them to Ultimate's character selection philosophy. You're right, we have no way of knowing who he'll pick and for what reasons. But we do have the release cycle of the previous Smash games to try and extrapolate some ideas.

And what do you hope to achieve with that?

 

[Deleted member]

Is anyone cool? is anyone ok? no one stressing out from that awesome tweet?

What I’m saying is....are you all recovered?

 

[DoctorFate]

Fair enough.


And what do you hope to achieve with that?

I mean, what does anyone hope to achieve with any of this speculation? That's literally all any of us are doing: trying to extrapolate meaning from previous trends we've seen.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Wait What?

Christina Vee made a Tweet I think? And I can't tell if it's a good thing or not?

 

[DoctorFate]

Wait What?

Christina Vee made a Tweet I think? And I can't tell if it's a good thing or not?

It's, likely, either neutral or good. Doesn't hurt Shantae's chances though. It was a vague tweet that didn't mention the project by name. So, either she's recording for a separate project, which, fair enough, she has to work. Or, she just finished up Smash VA work, which aligns nicely with the timeframe of Western dubbing for Japanese games since both Anime and Japanese games do voice work after the animations are finished.

Either way, no need to be worried.

 

[Mango The Magician]

Spoiler

Although it is good to remain reserved, I think it's pretty safe to assume that she is involved in some way.

Jammies mode released shortly after the world found out that the net Smash game would be called Ultimate and that it's main tag line would be "Everyone is here"

That means that they conceived, scripted, coded and tested it all before anyone new anything about Smash Ultimate other than that Inklings would be in it. Yet they release a game mode in which the main character sets out to host the "Ultimate" slumber party and "everyone" is invited. Had she used just one of these words it might have meant nothing, but both were used and highlited or emphasis. That means one of three things...


1) It wasn't a reference to Smash and ended up being an amazing coincidence.

2) it was a reference, but they only new the game was coming out because of the Inkling tease and how no other knowledge, making their use of Ultimate and Everyone an impossibly lucky guess. Or...

3) A legitimate tease with knowledge of the Smash game that the general public didn't have.

To me, the third seems far more likely as it is the only one that doesn't rely on astounding odds.

So, we can assume she is in the game to some degree. Everything else is less solid, but with a little more assumption we can suspect that she is in the game to a greater degree than Shovel Knight is because of the whole indie fighting game situation. So, in the game, probably more than an assist trophy. It wouldn't make sense for a hero character to appear as a boss in a crossover game, so that can be ruled out.

After all that, fighter seems like the only option left that makes sense.

Now, it is entirely possible that Shantae not being in the indie fighter games isn't because of a NCC imposed by Nintendo, but rather discretion on part of WF or the Bozons. However that seems unlikely. I can understand for games that don't look terribly impressive (Like I totally see them saying no to Indi Pogo, sorry that game looks very uninteresting and a bot too silly) But Blade Strangers from a developer like Nicalis seems right up the alley on the kinds of games they do let Shantae guest star in.

Having her in Blade Strangers would be good publicity, good exposure, and money with no effort on their part, but they still haven't let her in the game.

It's important to keep guard of your expectations, but it is in no way unreasonable to see how all of this points to a very possible outcome.

To be fair all of this is evidence that relies on speculation on stuff that is happening outside of the game and could all just be coincidences. Not that I'm saying her chances are diminished by any means just that like Isaac or Dixie Kong, or even Ken, there's no actual in-game evidence that would suggest that she may appear in the game at all.

Even those characters are circumstantial, though. Any hype is, realistically, unwarranted. We have nothing on shadow except a missing AT and a free bundle added to a sonic game (Isaac proved in Smash 4 missing AT means nothing and he could still be revealed as an AT) and Skull Kid has very little to go off of too, the AT thing and Zelda still having some musical to reveal (same as above). There's more for each and I'm not saying don't get hype, but the only thing that's definite is the 72 characters who have been revealed so far.

Not really though. Isabelle was an AT, wasn't shown off for Ultimate, and then Kapn' was shown off, and then she was announced; I mean sure you could make the argument that they're just getting replaced but unlike Isaac, Shadow and Skull Kid are Very well known characters, and would have no real reason to be replaced in Smash or removed considering ones a first party and the other is from Sonic, a series that get's along extremely well with Nintendo.

I'm not trying to say that Shantae isn't happening, just that it's important to not "expect" any characters other than the ones that seem to follow this pattern and have hints in game that would support their inclusion. For an example of a character in a similar boat to Shantae, just look at Isaac, there's nothing to suggest he will come back in Smash and his plain removal from Brawl to 4 actually hurts his chances more than it helps.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

Either way, no need to be worried.

Nah, I wasn't.

Just curious.

 

[GoldLiger]

Sakurai's "slowing down the pace of reveals" comment can be taken with the same amount of seriousness as his "not that many new fighter reveals" had. We got 2 in one Direct to 5 in another to a single one in the third. I think his comment is just his way of saying "prepare to get your socks knocked out".

So guys anything he says take it with the opposite effect. So I expect an increase in character reveals. Remember he said he wanted ALL the characters revealed prior to Ultimate's release date and we have October and November to go so... get hyped.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

He could also be pulling at us and when he says that he means unique fighters. Food for thought.

 

[DoctorFate]

It's always opposite day with Sakurai

 

[Deleted member]

It's always opposite day with Sakurai

I pretty much take everything Sakurai says with a grain of salt. He has lied to us before.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

I mean, what does anyone hope to achieve with any of this speculation? That's literally all any of us are doing: trying to extrapolate meaning from previous trends we've seen.

It becomes a problem, when we start believing it to be the truth. Even though it's something we cannot possibly know.
(Heck, there are still so many people in this world, who think they know exactly what God thinks and act on it. Like how can a mortal possibly grasp the ways of an omnipotent?!)

And then we force these things on other people, telling them the character they wish for will never get in, because "Rule X".
Even though it's not something Sakurai told us, but just something we made up.
That's what I hate and what I want to stop.


Enjoy speculating to your heart's content.
But as soon as you start thinking it's the absolute truth, without any sort of decisive evidence or word from the creator, you're losing it!

 

[Kirbeh]

Sakurai's "slowing down the pace of reveals" comment can be taken with the same amount of seriousness as his "not that many new fighter reveals" had. We got 2 in one Direct to 5 in another to a single one in the third. I think his comment is just his way of saying "prepare to get your socks knocked out".

So guys anything he says take it with the opposite effect. So I expect an increase in character reveals. Remember he said he wanted ALL the characters revealed prior to Ultimate's release date and we have October and November to go so... get hyped.

Taking it the opposite way is not the best idea or interpretation of what he said. Telling people to hype themselves up and setting their expectations high when's there no indication that that's the case is just going to lead to disappointment.

He said not too many new fighters. True we've gotten a decent amount of characters revealed so far, but many of those were Echoes and we don't know if he strictly meant unique fighters. After all, why do they have the distinction of Echoes now in the first place? Because many fans didn't understand their inclusion or refused to accept them as separate characters. And they still don't, but the thing is that as Echoes, they're technically not "counted" as separate either and that's enough for people to suddenly have a change in heart because these characters are now labeled in a way that conforms to and validates their previous hangup on clones.

Mini clone/echo ramble aside, people always say Sakurai "lied to us", but is he really lying or are people just misinterpreting what he says to fit their own wants or expectations. Sakurai does of course like to be tricky, I'm never going to deny that. However, a lot of the time people take what he says and proceed to dissect it until they find a new meaning behind it be that in favor or against whatever point they're trying to push.

tl;dr - hype responsibly

 

[DoctorFate]

I mean, it's not like we're trying to give definitive *fact* to something birthed from heresay and speculative belief. It's *just* Smash Bros. We're all just having fun bouncing theoretical ideas off each other based on some slightly weird behaviour and trends that Sakurai has, up to this point, not broken. If someone takes it too seriously, thats on them. But I feel like the majority of us here are just trying to have a bit of fun with a neat fighting game and a cool potential character

 

[zferolie]

Taking it the opposite way is not the best idea or interpretation of what he said. Telling people to hype themselves up and setting their expectations high when's there no indication that that's the case is just going to lead to disappointment.

He said not too many new fighters. True we've gotten a decent amount of characters revealed so far, but many of those were Echoes and we don't know if he strictly meant unique fighters. After all, why do they have the distinction of Echoes now in the first place? Because many fans didn't understand their inclusion or refused to accept them as separate characters. And they still don't, but the thing is that as Echoes, they're technically not "counted" as separate either and that's enough for people to suddenly have a change in heart because these characters are now labeled in a way that conforms to and validates their previous hangup on clones.

Mini clone/echo ramble aside, people always say Sakurai "lied to us", but is he really lying or are people just misinterpreting what he says to fit their own wants or expectations. Sakurai does of course like to be tricky, I'm never going to deny that. However, a lot of the time people take what he says and proceed to dissect it until they find a new meaning behind it be that in favor or against whatever point they're trying to push.

tl;dr - hype responsibly

I always assumed when Sakurai said not to many new fighters, I thought that meant unique fighters, not counting echos. SO I can see 4-6 more unique fighters coming, and just as much echos, and Sakurai is only considered those 4-6 as not to many more newcomers.

 

[Paragon-Yoshi]

I mean, it's not like we're trying to give definitive *fact* to something birthed from heresay and speculative belief. It's *just* Smash Bros. We're all just having fun bouncing theoretical ideas off each other based on some slightly weird behaviour and trends that Sakurai has, up to this point, not broken. If someone takes it too seriously, thats on them. But I feel like the majority of us here are just trying to have a bit of fun with a neat fighting game and a cool potential character

Fair enough.

Just be sure to keep it at that level and don't let it get the best of you.
After all, all of these arbitrary rules and barriers people believe in, start with speculation.

 

[Michael the Spikester]

I pretty much take everything Sakurai says with a grain of salt. He has lied to us before.

This. That's why I believe he could be pulling at us once more.

 

[Kirbeh]

I mean, it's not like we're trying to give definitive *fact* to something birthed from heresay and speculative belief. It's *just* Smash Bros. We're all just having fun bouncing theoretical ideas off each other based on some slightly weird behaviour and trends that Sakurai has, up to this point, not broken. If someone takes it too seriously, thats on them. But I feel like the majority of us here are just trying to have a bit of fun with a neat fighting game and a cool potential character

And that's perfectly fine, my post was for the most part for said people who get a bit too carried away. A lot of fans in general fit that description and a few in this thread are very quick to jump from delight to despondency every time there's a "leak" or any little detail drops.

It was just a friendly (at least I hope it came off that way) if possibly unnecessary (and probably poorly worded/structured) reminder not to take the hype too far.

I'm bad at being concise if it wasn't apparent enough.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

It's always opposite day with Sakurai

Which means that it's never opposite day with Sakurai, because that would be the opposite statement to that.

 

[DoctorFate]

Which means that it's never opposite day with Sakurai, because that would be the opposite statement to that.

My God, what have we stumbled upon?

 

[Wademan94]

Which means that it's never opposite day with Sakurai, because that would be the opposite statement to that.

 

[DoctorFate]

Mine too Mr. Gumby. Mine too...

 

[SoupCanMafia]

Dr. Fate: Predictor of the fates of everyone in the DC Universe, Brains scrambled to "MY BRAIN HURTS" over Smash Speculation.

 

[DoctorFate]

Dr. Fate: Predictor of the fates of everyone in the DC Universe, Brains scrambled to "MY BRAIN HURTS" over Smash Speculation.

Gotta have some weakness Smash Speculation is like my Kryptonite or my color yellow.

 

[Deleted member]

In case you don’t know James Twitter retweets are nothing but a sea of super crowns

 

[DoctorFate]

In case you don’t know James Twitter retweets are nothing but a sea of super crowns

Good. Just as God intended.

 

[Wademan94]

In case you don’t know James Twitter retweets are nothing but a sea of super crowns

Geez, at this rate it would not surprise me if we saw a reference to this whole debacle in the next WayForward game

 

[Dyllybirdy]

In case you don’t know James Twitter retweets are nothing but a sea of super crowns

And that means... what exactly?

 

[DoctorFate]

And that means... what exactly?

He's retweeting a bunch of Bowsette related posts.

 

[Kirbeh]

Geez, at this rate it would not surprise me if we saw a reference to this whole debacle I the next WayForward game

They'll another monster girl enemy like the Nagas, but make them half dragon or something and also make it a new transformation. And tying this back to the discussion of giving transformations more utility she could breathe fire to burn things for puzzles. Well except that'd probably have to replace the fire magic stuffs which I doubt they'd ever do. Then again we had Pirate's Curse which did fine with dropping transformations altogether, so there might be a possibility they'd experiment and merge some of the other items and magic into future transformations.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

He's retweeting a bunch of Bowsette related posts.

Yes, no **** Sherlock.

But I don't see how this information benefits anyone here in anyway, or the discussion.

 

[Deleted member]

Yes, no **** Sherlock.

But I don't see how this information benefits anyone here in anyway, or the discussion.

because we need a Boloette drawing.

 

[DoctorFate]

Yes, no **** Sherlock.

But I don't see how this information benefits anyone here in anyway, or the discussion.

It's tangentially connected to Shantae, I guess?

 

[Wademan94]

They'll another monster girl enemy like the Nagas, but make them half dragon or something and also make it a new transformation. And tying this back to the discussion of giving transformations more utility she could breathe fire to burn things for puzzles. Well except that'd probably have to replace the fire magic stuffs which I doubt they'd ever do. Then again we had Pirate's Curse which did fine with dropping transformations altogether, so there might be a possibility they'd experiment and merge some of the other items and magic into future transformations.

I don’t mean referencing actual Bowsette, I mean like a crown or some magic macguffin turning some average nonhuman enemy into a hot human-like enemy. Tell me that wouldn’t be something you’d see in a Shantae/WayForward game.

Spoiler: Kid Icarus Uprising spoiler

For those who’ve played this game, remember when this:

turned into this?

That’s basically what I mean, except imagine this happening somewhere in a WayForward game

 

[Dyllybirdy]

because we need a Boloette drawing.

Whoa, okay.

No need to be like that. Everything's just gone south in the past week or so.

Connorbot's hideous regime of trying to kick anyone out, who he thinks has the slightest of doubts of her making it in as a fighter. The fact that nobody cares about me anymore, and may never have. Oh and Teeb's gone, which is really hard to handle.

 

[zferolie]

I don’t mean referencing actual Bowsette, I mean like a crown or some magic macguffin turning some average nonhuman enemy into a hot human-like enemy. Tell me that wouldn’t be something you’d see in a Shantae/WayForward game.

Spoiler: Kid Icarus Uprising spoiler

For those who’ve played this game, remember when this:
View attachment 166759
turned into this?
View attachment 166760
That’s basically what I mean, except imagine this happening somewhere in a WayForward game

Given how much Wayforward loves sexy girls, I'm surprised this hasn't happened yet.

Squid Baroness?

 

[Wademan94]

Given how much Wayforward loves sexy girls, I'm surprised this hasn't happened yet.

Squid Baroness?

I didn’t want to say at first, but my mind went to that exact same place and I’m kinda glad you beat me to it. Yeah, apologies if this puts some disturbing images in your head, but just imagine if Squid Baron got his mitts on a magical tiara and it ends up transforming him into a body on par with the Squidsmith?

 

[KingofUSA85]

In case you don’t know James Twitter retweets are nothing but a sea of super crowns

Cant these people get it through their thick skulls that Nintendo Clearly and specifically stated that the Crown only applies to Toadette and no one else. Thus making "Bowsette" impossible.

 

[Kirbeh]

I didn’t want to say at first, but my mind went to that exact same place and I’m kinda glad you beat me to it. Yeah, apologies if this puts some disturbing images in your head, but just imagine if Squid Baron got his mitts on a magical tiara and it ends up transforming him into a body on par with the Squidsmith?

Forget the magic macguffin, when's Squidsmith Mode? Her design is too good to just be a minor role in one title.

 

[DoctorFate]

Cant these people get it through their thick skulls that Nintendo Clearly and specifically stated that the Crown only applies to Toadette and no one else. Thus making "Bowsette" impossible.

You bite your tongue, good sir!