Shantae, the Half Genie Protector of Scuttle Town! (A Switch To A New WayForward)

[RetrogamerMax]

I don't think they will be the final 2 newcomers unfortunately, but I would love to have Crash Bandicoot.

Well, Sakurai worded it in the Pyra/Mythra Presentation like the last 2 Fighter's Pass 2 characters are Ultimate's last newcomers. But I honestly think this is it.

 

[Dukefire]

Whatever happens, the storm is going to get worse from here on out. No plans for more DLC means more mudslinging and salt (no surprise there) will appear more frequently.

Watch your backs and try to stay clear from the line of fire often as you can.

Also found this image from someone on twitter.

 

[dlewis53]

Well, Sakurai worded it in the Pyra/Mythra Presentation like the last 2 Fighter's Pass 2 characters are Ultimate's last newcomers. But I honestly think this is it.

I don't know, I still think we could see a potential Fighter's Pass 3 announced around E3.

 

[Schonberg]

I don't know, I still think we could see a potential Fighter's Pass 3 announced around E3.

Remember, Brawl is the last game Sakurai is going to work on.

...What I’m saying is, it ain’t over till the fat lady sings. We really won’t know if there won’t be any more characters after pass 2 until pass 2 ends.

Actually, even more Mii intrigue; if they DO make DLC after the pass, since there aren’t any Mii costumes left to bring back, that means either all new Miis across a new fighters pass, or standalone DLC fighters wont necessarily have Miis releasing alongside them.

 

[dlewis53]

Remember, Brawl is the last game Sakurai is going to work on.

...What I’m saying is, it ain’t over till the fat lady sings. We really won’t know if there won’t be any more characters after pass 2 until pass 2 ends.

Actually, even more Mii intrigue; if they DO make DLC after the pass, since there aren’t any Mii costumes left to bring back, that means either all new Miis across a new fighters pass, or standalone DLC fighters wont necessarily have Miis releasing alongside them.

Yeah, basically what I was saying.

I mean, keep in mind that we didn't know that more DLC would be happening after Fighter's Pass 1 until the reveal of Terry, the second-to-last fighter for FP1. So I imagine that if we DO get a third Fighter's Pass, the earliest it'll be announced is alongside the reveal of Fighter #10, which I also imagine is going to happen sometime around E3.

Also, regarding that Newcomer Spectrum, I'd say I'm a "Chill Wanter"; I'd most certainly want Sora and Shantae in Smash, but as long as the fighters are unique and fun to play as, I'll be satisfied!

 

[meleebrawler]

That would be pretty sweet, not going to lie! Shantae or not, I hope they end on a high note instead of the sort of "well, okay" that Smash 4 did. Not that I don't like Corrin (I do) and Bayo's fine too.

Friendly reminder that for some people, namely those outside of this little bubble here, that a Shantae ending would be a "well, okay" ending. May as well say they should have saved Sephiroth for last, since few can match his mass appeal, not even Crash.

Everyone is entitled to how they feel about any given character, you just have to keep in mind how subjective hype levels are for any given character.

 

[Schonberg]

Also found this image from someone on twitter.
View attachment 305969

Chill wanter and acceptor. I have my favorites, and the ones I want to see more than others, but I’m still down for anyone.

 

[Inoj]

Also found this image from someone on twitter.
View attachment 305969

I'd place myself as a Chill Wanter mostly.

 

[zferolie]

i honestly havent even turned on smash in months, but did so today thanks to pyra and mythra. they are fun as heck.

Also, still surreal to see Shantae as a spirit and a fighter icon.

 

[Shinuto]

Hmm I wonder if Rex not being developed as a fighter might be why he doesn't have a player tag online icon but Pyra and Mythra do.

 

[SneakyLink]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

 

[Destinylegend]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

Not sure if on it, but if not I'd like to be added

 

[Scamper52596]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

Me, please! Would absolutely love to see Shantae make it in.

 

[Schonberg]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

Pretty sure I joined way after the thread started so stick me on there; gotta be on the list for my #1 want!

 

[dlewis53]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

If I'm not on the list already, then I'd like to be added please!

 

[MeteoRain]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

Yo!

Actually, I have no idea if I've already been added. Where is this list exactly?

 

[Teeb147]

Yo!

Actually, I have no idea if I've already been added. Where is this list exactly?

It's on the first page post. That's where people put the supporter's list. You're not on it ;p

 

[GoldLiger]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

If I am not on there then please add me. Thanks.

 

[Comedic Comrade]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

I would like to be on the list.

 

[GoldLiger]

Man you just have to love this Pneuma art. To think it took 3 years to done. Smash Bros really is the Ultimate Fighting Game.

 

[MattX20]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

I would like to be added

 

[GoldLiger]

In celebration of us finally getting the art we have been asking for 3 years I will use it as my profile Pic. Yeah.

Pneuma FTW!!!

 

[kazoka122]

Hey everyone.

I see the supporters list hasn't been updated in a while. Let's fix that.

If there's anyone who wishes to be added to the supporters list, let me know.

Not sure if I'm there but add me too

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

Does anyone here find it odd that we didn't get a new indie Mii costume at all this time?

On a side note, hyped about the upcoming third BMZ game coming on my birthday.

 

[Schonberg]

Does anyone here find it odd that we didn't get a new indie Mii costume at all this time?

On a side note, hyped about the upcoming third BMZ game coming on my birthday.

I’ve put this theory up a few times; the fact that there’s only 1 returning Mii costume yet to be rereleased (Lloyd) means that one or potentially both of the unreleased fighters has to have only new Mii fighters with them. And since there’s been no “indie with a music track” miis in FP2, I’ve predicted one of the remaining characters could be an indie character bringing a whole host of indie/music Miis with them, and then having all the indie music available on their stage. Double dip on Undertale to get Mettaton with Death by Glamour, Shovel Knight could finally bring Strike the Earth, classics like Quote or Curly Brace as gunners, maybe even some recent indie superstars like Zagreus from Hades since Mii costumes can be made muuuuuch faster than a fighter, so it’s release date isn’t an issue... and of course the fighter being Shantae

Nothing more than a theory of course, but with how much Nintendo’s supported the indie scene this and last generation, and the huge support the last two indie Miis got, every new challenger pack we get without an indie Mii puts another point in its favor...

Also happy not-yet-birthday!

 

[KirbyWorshipper2465]

I’ve put this theory up a few times; the fact that there’s only 1 returning Mii costume yet to be rereleased (Lloyd) means that one or potentially both of the unreleased fighters has to have only new Mii fighters with them. And since there’s been no “indie with a music track” miis in FP2, I’ve predicted one of the remaining characters could be an indie character bringing a whole host of indie/music Miis with them, and then having all the indie music available on their stage. Double dip on Undertale to get Mettaton with Death by Glamour, Shovel Knight could finally bring Strike the Earth, classics like Quote or Curly Brace as gunners, maybe even some recent indie superstars like Zagreus from Hades since Mii costumes can be made muuuuuch faster than a fighter, so it’s release date isn’t an issue... and of course the fighter being Shantae

Nothing more than a theory of course, but with how much Nintendo’s supported the indie scene this and last generation, and the huge support the last two indie Miis got, every new challenger pack we get without an indie Mii puts another point in its favor...

Also happy not-yet-birthday!

I'd settle for Jason Frudnick and Gunvolt being Miis if it meant that Shantae got in. Win-win overall in that kind of scenario (plus Inti and WF are established as having been friendly with each other).

Also, don't forget about a Hollow Knight character! That's been rumored in the costume rumors for a good while, seeing as we have yet to see Silksong release.

 

[Schonberg]

I'd settle for Jason Frudnick and Gunvolt being Miis if it meant that Shantae got in. Win-win overall in that kind of scenario (plus Inti and WF are established as having been friendly with each other).

Also, don't forget about a Hollow Knight character! That's been rumored in the costume rumors for a good while, seeing as we have yet to see Silksong release.

Oh yeah, I have a whole host of indie Mii ideas, those were just a taste. The Knight from Hollow Knight and The Drifter from Hyperlight Drifter as Swordfighters, Juan from Guacamelee or anyone from Skullgirls as Brawlers, Gunvolt or Jason as Gunners...

 

[Comedic Comrade]

Where did the rumours of Hollow Knight getting a Mii Costume come from?

 

[Schonberg]

Where did the rumours of Hollow Knight getting a Mii Costume come from?

Just standard rumormill fare over other indies getting Mii costumes and Hollow Knight being a game with similar acclaim, mixed with peoples hopes.

 

[Comedic Comrade]

Just standard rumormill fare over other indies getting Mii costumes and Hollow Knight being a game with similar acclaim, mixed with peoples hopes.

Thanks.

By the way, has anyone seen this? https://youtu.be/Htds9qaCNJw

 

[Dukefire]

Best part for Pyra and Mythra's reveal trailer. It was ALL made by Monolithsoft without the script made by sakurai. So this is the first character trailer without Sakurai's guidance.

Plus, to ignite the small speculation spark to begin the 3 month waiting period again. What do you think the last 2 characters figures sakurai is holding? (I know it is a vague topic, but just a try.)

 

[LaBeteNoire]

Best part for Pyra and Mythra's reveal trailer. It was ALL made by Monolithsoft without the script made by sakurai. So this is the first character trailer without Sakurai's guidance.

Plus, to ignite the small speculation spark to begin the 3 month waiting period again. What do you think the last 2 characters figures sakurai is holding? (I know it is a vague topic, but just a try.)

I mean, it could really be anyone. There is no shortage of video game characters with figures or other 3D merch out there. I would say that it does limit older characters who are slightly obscure as back in the day a video game character didn't usually get a lot of physical merch unless they were really big. So if it's an older character they would have to have been popular enough back then, or one that has continues on till today where lesser known franchises can still get some love in the collectible market.

Honestly tho I feel both of the two remaining will probably be more modern reps. So far all the ones from this pass are pretty relevant characters, who had all had some kind of game in the recent past. And if we build on the logic that most if not all of this pass where characters who just barely missed on getting into base game, then we can push that window back to characters who were relevant or hot back at the time of Ultimate's development as well.

 

[Shinuto]

Best part for Pyra and Mythra's reveal trailer. It was ALL made by Monolithsoft without the script made by sakurai. So this is the first character trailer without Sakurai's guidance.

Plus, to ignite the small speculation spark to begin the 3 month waiting period again. What do you think the last 2 characters figures sakurai is holding? (I know it is a vague topic, but just a try.)

Crash and Shantae

 

[MattX20]

You think Sakurai would've used the Charagumin figure of Shantae for potential reference?

 

[RetrogamerMax]

So imagine they end Ultimate's newcomer lineup off with a Indie rep like Shantae proving that almost any gaming character can make it into Smash's roster. Shantae's inclusion would be an amazing finale and closing for Ultimate. I would be so damn satisfied if Ultimate closes out with Shantae. I literally could wait 10 years for another Smash game if that happens.

 

[Comedic Comrade]

You think Sakurai would've used the Charagumin figure of Shantae for potential reference?

I think it's certainly a possibility. It's the only real figure of Shantae we have right now. The Totaku figure has still yet to be released.

 

[Jorichi]

I'd settle for Jason Frudnick and Gunvolt being Miis if it meant that Shantae got in. Win-win overall in that kind of scenario (plus Inti and WF are established as having been friendly with each other).

Also, don't forget about a Hollow Knight character! That's been rumored in the costume rumors for a good while, seeing as we have yet to see Silksong release.

I'd love to have Jason and Sophia as a fighter, being a two in one character with drastic differences. Sadly that mechanic has now gone to Pyra and Mythra.
I do feel Blaster Master deserves some kind of representation though, anything. And Jason would be a perfect fit for a Mii gunner in all honesty, definitely would make me take a serious approach at trying Mii gunner, heh.
With the game releasing in July, it might line up nicely to see him appear as a Mii actually...
And if we get that alongside Shantae as a fighter, I'll be over the moon for sure! Gunvolt would also be great to see. Inti Creates honestly deserves it.

On another note, or question rather;
Do you guys think Sakurai's talk about the limitations regarding Ice Climbers and Pyra and Mythra is a bit of a point against Shantae?
I've been thinking her animal transformations might further complicate things in that department...

 

[meleebrawler]

I'd love to have Jason and Sophia as a fighter, being a two in one character with drastic differences. Sadly that mechanic has now gone to Pyra and Mythra.
I do feel Blaster Master deserves some kind of representation though, anything. And Jason would be a perfect fit for a Mii gunner in all honesty, definitely would make me take a serious approach at trying Mii gunner, heh.
With the game releasing in July, it might line up nicely to see him appear as a Mii actually...
And if we get that alongside Shantae as a fighter, I'll be over the moon for sure! Gunvolt would also be great to see. Inti Creates honestly deserves it.

On another note, or question rather;
Do you guys think Sakurai's talk about the limitations regarding Ice Climbers and Pyra and Mythra is a bit of a point against Shantae?
I've been thinking her animal transformations might further complicate things in that department...

The limitations were about Rex running around with his blade friends causing too many models at once. Pyra & Mythra transforming was the less taxing option, I don't see how any theoretical transformations Shantae would use would be any different.

If anything, they might not be full ones just to differentiate Shantae.

 

[Jorichi]

The limitations were about Rex running around with his blade friends causing too many models at once. Pyra & Mythra transforming was the less taxing option, I don't see how any theoretical transformations Shantae would use would be any different.

If anything, they might not be full ones just to differentiate Shantae.

Ah so it's more about several more models being out on the field at once, not how many would need to be preloaded for a match or anything like that.
Yeah that actually makes a lot of sense. Noted.

 

[Schonberg]

Ah so it's more about several more models being out on the field at once, not how many would need to be preloaded for a match or anything like that.
Yeah that actually makes a lot of sense. Noted.

Not just that, but also the AI involved with it. Nana has her own AI the system has to run every time the Icies are in a match, regardless of who is playing her. In short, a CPU Ice Climbers would need two AI controlling it, while say, a CPU Pokemon trainer still would only need one.

So if you had an 8 Player Smash of any other CPU character, the game has to run 8 character AI, but ice climbers would have to double that at 16. And even if it was all human players, it would have to be reading 8 sets of inputs and then running 8 sets of AI to match them. ...I’m grossly oversimplifying it. The point is, there’s a lot of complicated reasons why the Icies are difficult to work with, and why most duo characters transform into eachother or are just two models programmed in unison like Duck Hunt.

The limitations were about Rex running around with his blade friends causing too many models at once. Pyra & Mythra transforming was the less taxing option, I don't see how any theoretical transformations Shantae would use would be any different.

If anything, they might not be full ones just to differentiate Shantae.

Actually, seeing how Pyra and Mythra work made it way easier for me to picture how Shantae would play. Since the Aegis duo share normal attacks but alter their hitboxes and frame data, that lets two characters effectively share a moveset while still feeling distinct AND reducing the amount of work to make them.

So, instead of fully transforming for Shantae’s special moves, stick all of her combat moves from the GBC game and some familiar spells like fireball and storm puff to fill up her normals and Smash attacks. Then, make her down special her Transformation dance, which she can cycle between 3-4 forms. That makes it so they only have to animate new special moves, like Pyra and Mythra, and only bring in the new models on those moves. Then, let the new forms just change her frame data on her normals so you don’t have to reanimate everything, just assign some hitboxes and speed up or slow down some animations.

-Monkey form makes her attacks much faster but much weaker, and makes her special moves Monkey Bullet for Neutral, probably a high jump or monkey acrobatics for an up and side special.
-Elephant form makes her slower and heavier, but makes her attacks hit like a truck. Her specials are now Elephant Stomp for neutral, Elephant Charge for the side, and a slight jump with a heavy plummet for an up special.
-Harpy makes her way lighter and gives her better air mobility and additional jumps (or if model swapping just for additional jumps is too much, just higher jumps?) at the cost of lots of attack power. Harpy feather neutral special, maybe a charging side special based on the Harpy’s run, and Harpy Flight up special.
-Spider... uh... Not sure what special properties spider would bring. Spider Venom neutral special, maybe a web slinging command grab side special, Spider Silk tether recovery up special.

And as an added bonus, Kirby would always have Shantae’s hair when transformed, but depending on what form she’s in when he copies her he takes on that special move!