Shadowloo Showdown V - August 29-31! Congrats to all winners! Comments and Shoutouts please!

[Leeyam]

Awesome video, but seems to be a little lacking in some NZ footage

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2JT3MFsRPw8

 

[Basty]

dat trailer good and all but i think we need to show the trash talk we got here in australia and i think this video shows about the perfect amount of trash we have in aus

Ladies and gentlemen, the australian trash talk trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5WwOZgPQwyU

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

what people perhaps don't understand is that in america, major tournaments are held over 3 days
we get 1 and a half. bracket pools it is.

Way to research.
Zenith is 2 days. Pools R1 saturday. R2+bracket sunday.
I think we should be more ambitious about our tournament formats
I will gladly help out with the preparations but am keen to maximise my performance so would rather not be involved on the day much

 

[Dekar289]

zenith also didn't have brawl singles, brawl teams, or project m teams
again, they had 2 full days (which often start super early and run super late, which we don't want)

they also only had 45 for PM, which we will no doubt blow out of the water

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

They did have 64. Still seems comparable considering the size of their melee singles.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cKuSWXAyxrS2Tduc26M5000x_y3_3Xec0Dh9OtZWJ4Q/edit#gid=0

 

[Dekar289]

i just see time we don't have
i too would generally rather round robin and/or amateur brackets, but as this is biggest smash tournament in aus history, we playing it safe yo

 

[TakFR]

If mario party is involved then gg. Give me the money now.

OH IT'S ON SON MARIO PARTY MM FEATURING DEKAR aka the most bull**** mario party player ever, and BUS GET HYPE

 

[Dekar289]

expect a big dump of info on rulesets, payouts and schedule after this sunday's SLHQ tournament.

 

[Meredy]

i just see time we don't have
i too would generally rather round robin and/or amateur brackets, but as this is biggest smash tournament in aus history, we playing it safe yo

Could we at least get top 4 going through to bracket? Seeing as it's the biggest tournament in aus history, it'd be great for more people to go through and experience it fully, plus a bigger bracket for a more hyped day 2.

 

[Dekar289]

it's already a 32-man bracket, that's certainly large enough

 

[Gords]

I guess the biggest question is how many setups do you expect?
for each game, and total TVs.

also to what time on Saturday are we wanting to run to? 7pm? 8pm? late?
similarly for Sunday?

 

[Hughie]

I guess the biggest question is how many setups do you expect?
for each game, and total TVs.

also to what time on Saturday are we wanting to run to? 7pm? 8pm? late?
similarly for Sunday?

expect a big dump of info on rulesets, payouts and schedule after this sunday's SLHQ tournament.

As for TVs I'm sure there'll be an equipment thread of the sorts in the coming weeks.

 

[Splice]

zenith also didn't have brawl singles, brawl teams, or project m teams
again, they had 2 full days (which often start super early and run super late, which we don't want)

they also only had 45 for PM, which we will no doubt blow out of the water

rekt PCG
Way to research, dickhed 8)

 

[NanoHologuise]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PP52PZRMdE8

And the trailer is done.

Soz no pm or brawl, but man im happy with my like 1.5 hours work

@Redact what's the bgm for the trailer? I feel like I've played it/heard it somewhere. And I might try my hand at making a trailer if I have some spare time.

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

rekt PCG
Way to research, ****hed 8)

Yeah m8. 200 entrants between 32 8 man pools ez because of a few extra hours Sunday and no pm teams and 64 instead of brawl

 

[Basty]

yo can i enter my dog so i dont come last. or maybe my cat, or a comic book. anything so i dont come last?

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

It's okay you can be first of all the equal last people

 

[Splice]

Yeah m8. 200 entrants between 32 8 man pools ez because of a few extra hours Sunday and no pm teams and 64 instead of brawl

so a -40 man 64 bracket takes the same amount of time as Brawl teams and Brawl Singles? We might have smaller numbers for the Brawl tournament overall but remember that only their top 8 for 64 would be streamed and I assume same for us with Brawl. Brawl takes up the most stream time per match streamed.
+ I don't know if Amateurs are confirmed for us but Zenith aren't running that either and I think that's more of an experience than just having Round Robin pools.

While they're running 8 pools at a time for each game within 2 hours (would be pretty comfortable to do with 24-32 setups) the point is that we want to try to get crews in and provide the most professional streaming experience we've attempted so far.
Considering our planned events are quite different to Zenith and our amount of setups are not confirmed and likely not going to be as large as Zenith's, pulling it up as an example is a joke. Additionally, our tournament running crew are key contenders in the games they play and there's honestly no need to strain this mental tax further by trying to make the stretch of ambitious tournament formats in an attempt to imitate AlexStrife's tournament hosting ability.

 

[Gords]

Even though I would much prefer Round Robin pools I can see why they are electing for bracket pools.
Just some numbers guys.

4 TVs is the ideal number for an 8 person pool.
assuming a game takes 5min to play
time taken for a bracket pool to complete could take up to 1hr 15min
best of three round robin could take up to 1hr 35min
for ACL I made the compromise here to cap pools at 2 games each match to give players more games
2 game round robin here would take about 1 hr 10min
2 game round robin with 3 TVs/pool would take about 1hr 35min

assuming 24 available setups
running 2 waves of 8 ppl 2 game round robin pools would take about 3hrs 10min.
so if you are planning to allocate 4hrs for pools to complete this is doable

however if we look at bracket pools
running 5 waves 8ppl bracket pools would take about 2hrs 45min
this is possible since after R2 & R4 of the brackets setups become available to start more pools.
(#of pools per wave would go 6-3-3-2-2 at time intervals 0-30-60-75-90 min)
this time also assumes that each match goes to game 3, which is highly unlikely during this part of the tourney.

I think a big problem will be players entering multiple games which pretty much forces running round robin pools of different games at different times, but with good communication between those running each game you could have some overlap when running bracket pools since players free up when they get eliminated.
With bracket pools, assuming the same 128 entrants for 3 games, all pools could be easily done within 7hrs. 2 game Round Robin pools would take over 9hrs 30min. Obviously they dont expect these numbers, but they also want to run doubles. No brainer imo

+ I don't know if Amateurs are confirmed for us but Zenith aren't running that either and I think that's more of an experience than just having Round Robin pools.

Amateur brackets and pools dont interact. so this doesnt really make sense with regards to pools format. Amateurs run at the same time as the pro bracket and with enough setups amateur and pro brackets dont interfere with each other either. the problem for SS is how many do you allow into Amateur. If its anyone not in pro bracket then we could have a 70+ amateur bracket, not possible. 3rd & 4th from pools would mean a 32 man bracket run the same way as pro. Again assuming 24 setups you could start this bracket 15min after the pro bracket without effecting anything else, (with 18 setups, 30min after pro starts)

(@ Splice the only reason why amateur and pro brackets interfered with each other at ACL was that I miss counted the melee setups, apparently one setup was melee 20XX, which had fox only on CSS and FD only on SSS, which nobody was playing on and rightly so. I didnt know this till after you came and told me you had to wait for a setup to play your match and i went looking for what went wrong)

 

[Splice]

Amateur brackets take time and pool matches take time. The thing is that they both interact with the tournament itself, Gords.

It has nothing to do with ACL, it's just common sense that the more events you are running the more stress there is on getting them all to finish.

If you have 5 hours and bracket pools take 2 while round robin pools take 3, and pro bracket will take 2 hours unless you use some of the setups for amateur bracket in which case it'll take 3 hours, then you cannot have RR pools and amateur comfortably because you'll exhaust too much time doing round robin pools earlier in the day to have multiple events later on.

With enough setups, amateur theoretically doesn't slow down pro-bracket but formally running the event can lead to practical issues that aren't solved just because you can do maths good. For example I highly doubt all the bracket matches will start at the same time.

 

[Dekar289]

Yeah m8. 200 entrants between 32 8 man pools ez because of a few extra hours Sunday and no pm teams and 64 instead of brawl

126 entrants, not 200
zenith appears to be smaller than shadowloo....

 

[Gords]

Amateur brackets take time and pool matches take time. The thing is that they both interact with the tournament itself, Gords.

if your pools and brackets are on separate days then it doesnt matter what format the pools are since they dont interact at all. I do agree if they are on the same day then there is some interaction with the tournament itself, but this interaction can be small if you are still running a pro bracket with more than optimal amount of setups

If you have 5 hours and bracket pools take 2 while round robin pools take 3, and pro bracket will take 2 hours unless you use some of the setups for amateur bracket in which case it'll take 3 hours, then you cannot have RR pools and amateur comfortably because you'll exhaust too much time doing round robin pools earlier in the day to have multiple events later on.

you do realise that my post was in support of Dekars decision to run bracket pools dont you, for similar reasons as described here. Except where your pro bracket is replaced with pools for the other games and/or doubles brackets.

With enough setups, amateur theoretically doesn't slow down pro-bracket but formally running the event can lead to practical issues that aren't solved just because you can do maths good. For example I highly doubt all the bracket matches will start at the same time.

these number are theoratical maximums with the assumption that a game takes 5min. (games at CEO averaged 4min). R1 matches should start at the same time, so if matches start at different times it probably means that they started earlier than scheduled, i.e. from a set only going to game 2.

It has nothing to do with ACL, it's just common sense that the more events you are running the more stress there is on getting them all to finish.

I only told you about ACL since you were the only one that expressed concern that my amateur bracket slowed down the event. Amateur bracket didnt cause any delays. biggest delays were from people out at lunch when I needed then to play, with you and dekar being the biggest cause of delay. whether it was directly your fault or not, you returning 30min after I had asked delayed the doubles bracket by over an hour. If you had returned when i had scheduled you to it would have been likely that all events would have finished without sacrificing any games. I dont blame you entirely for this though and I still hold mostly responsible. This is becasue I probably should have gotten you to play your WS doubles match against Jbirds & Spup before I sent either of your teams to lunch, especially considering it was Spups group and you and dekar that were the only ones that actually checked with me if it was ok to go to lunch.

 

[Splice]

There's no need to be defensive, I'm just trying to get a single point across to you. I don't understand what supporting Dekar has to do anything, everything I said was just an example to try to help you understand. There's no need to explain why you mentioned ACL, it's irrelevant and I just wanted to assure you that it is irrelevant to the point I'm trying to get across to you.

What you don't get finished on Day 1 you have to make up for on Day 2, and it's likely we'll be using all our extra time with crew battles and such, so fattening up the time of the pools event will likely leave less events for singles. I'm not sure if we can guarantee optimal setups and perfect organisational skills, so it's very likely Amateurs could cause some delays in the start-up period of the bracket. There's no need to leave things up to such chance anyway and I don't believe it's the biggest sacrifice to cut out RR pools especially if we are opting for amateurs (which is still not confirmed afaik). This is more a matter of common sense than trying to optimize tournament theory so there is little need to over think it.
My original post about amateurs was only supposed to convey how different Zenith is to our tournament anyway, it's definitely a waste of everyone elses time for us to discuss it further.

 

[Basty]

lol i have no f***ing idea wat u guys are talking about LMAO

 

[Gords]

my apologies Splice, it seemed as if your point was "We are not Zenith and RR robin pools may eat up to much time and put additional strain on this tournament" which is close to my point, hence the numbers to show people the significant difference bracket pools can make and how an amateur bracket may be possible instead.
I guess your mention of bracket and pool times interacting with the tournament directed at me and showing me an example, which is pretty much exactly what my post is about, also a comment that sounds as if I may of missed other issues just because I did some math, where my math takes into consideration your example of matches starting at different times. All this made it look as though you didnt consider me switched on

My only complaint with the event was that you ran an amateur bracket when we were clearly behind schedule; several times I had to wait to play matches on TV's because the Melee setups were being used for Amateur bracket matches. I believe without this than doubles for all events would have finished.

This is the reason why i mentioned ACL, and that I only directed it toward you. probably should have posted that seperately in the other thread in retrospect

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

Had a good chat with Dave about set ups and available space at SS, we can stop the debate now. Thanks for the read though

 

[Splice]

Had a good chat with Dave about set ups and available space at SS, we can stop the debate now. Thanks for the read though

On whose authority? Has the cease of this debate been authorized? Are you sure this is allowed?

 

[kelots]

disappointed at double Elim but understand the challenges. We gonna bring some gcs from nz if it helps (although does anyone know how playable the the non crts are?)

question though, I thought when I booked flights this was a 3 day tourney? fri-sun? is it now 1.5 days??

 

[S.D]

The tournament proper will be Saturday and Sunday, Friday will be exhibitions/crew battles etc (possibly some kind of small side tourney). It's a 3 day "event" 2 day tournament. 1.5 refers to Sunday being reserved for finals and needing to fit in with the main stream schedule (I assume). Anyway, don't fret you will get a LOT of smash in regardless of how deep you go in the tournament.

Edit: non CRTS will not be used for smash (afaik)

 

[1ampercent]

I think we need a thread for SSV setups and other misc things.
It's expected that a lot of people will show up, perhaps more setups will be available?

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

I was talking to Dave and space seems like it will be the limiting factor not the number of set ups people can bring

 

[Bu$]

I was talking to Dave and space seems like it will be the limiting factor not the number of set ups people can bring

Yeah i think i would agree thinking about how many tables and power points we can actually use. May be a stuggle to fit around 100 people around the smash area.

 

[S.D]

Venue will be fit to bursting.

 

[DD_]

Yeah i think i would agree thinking about how many tables and power points we can actually use. May be a stuggle to fit around 100 people around the smash area.

Something to note in regards to space is that for previous SS events at CQ (before smash was involved) the guys have hired out the whole room. This is opposed to BAM where half the function room is walled off and they still have like dining room tables and stuff there. If SS is going to use up the whole area again this year there will be quite a bit more room. If smash will actually be allocated anymore room thought is anyones guess.

 

[PrettyCoolGuy]

Something to note in regards to space is that for previous SS events at CQ (before smash was involved) the guys have hired out the whole room. This is opposed to BAM where half the function room is walled off and they still have like dining room tables and stuff there. If SS is going to use up the whole area again this year there will be quite a bit more room. If smash will actually be allocated anymore room thought is anyones guess.

Since we're so ****ing huge and are a big help covering their venue hire I think we deserve some TLC from SL

 

[Basty]

does anyone know if you can bring crts on planes we got god like ones here in tas

 

[woodsta]

Australia better catch up to that Tasmanian CRT meta

 

[kelots]

ah i gotcha! thanks S.D.

 

[Blue2ez]

Hey guys, im a **** tier qld player flying to SS. Ive entered doubles but cant seem to find a partner, would anyone be down to team with me?

 

[Splice]

you should team with Basty, I think he's looking for a partner too