Samus Winning a Major Tourniment?

[Cherry64]

I think it's a good read. I think people share this same mentality with Samus.

I'd love to agree, buddy, you know I would. But as good a char she is, she ain't going to be able ot solo it in tourniments. Her kill moves are RETARDEDLY hard to hit with making her fighting a lucario super Stupid. Meta is WAY to fast for her to even get attacks in. His priority cancels out the few physical attacks we do get in (Nair, Jabs, Side Tilts, Ect.).

it is a bit different than peach, but if her F smash had more range she'd be better. if her U tilt was the same as it was in Melee she'd be better. Those are my only Gripes with her those two moves, if she had those better she'd EASILY be a better char.

See you around on the Samus boards Lance

So to sum this all up. there is a thread in User blogs about an argument Dark.Pch had with hova.
hova asked if a Peach main who only used peach could take a Major tournament title, LanceStern replied that it's similar with samus, I'm not ripping into you Lance I just respectfully disagree

Anywho I was wondering what you all though about Samus winning a Major tournament if there Was no MK and also about What she would need to win a major tournament in terms of Boosting a few attacks.

Link to Original Thread

/Discuss

 

[Hive]

I don't think she will be ever able to win a major tourney, or rather that its very unlikely. when she gets to the upper parts of the bracket she starts to hit nothing but pro players, and its very hard to get around falco, mk, ddd and marth and its relatively hard to get around other matchups (olimar, sonic, sheik...). Getting around them once is hard enough, but twice, three times? you'd have to be amazingly lucky and very good imo. ^^

 

[-Crews-]

ya im going to have to agree with hive on this one. i dont think she can do it alone. i truly believe that with her current metagame, she deff needs a higher tier char to compliment her. im mean there is a tier list for a reason. its to show both how chars are doing in tourneys and to show how many people are using that char. it doesnt accuratly show how many people are using her but the current char rankings show her with like only 4 wins and like 2 top 8's (figures aren't exact but they are close) showing that either not many people arent using her, or they are just doing really crappy. and without people to advance her metagame, there can be no advancment. but all in all, i dont think she has to tools to do it all alone when there is always going to be the chars hive mentioned.

 

[LanceStern]

I believe she has a 1% chance of doing it alone, because as Dark Pch. says, we still don't have a PERFECT Samus.

The developers however, seemed determined to make her as weak as possible. I want to make a separate thread that talks about the weaknesses of Samuses, and why it's so hard to use her. And I know it's in Xyros' guide, but maybe we could discuss it more here. In the format:

(Name her weakness)
(Name a way we can find to get around it)

1. She needs a reliable, quick, KILLING aerial (maybe even disjointed):
This, imo, is one of her main problems and why she gets beat so badly. She doesn't have an aerial move that can do damage as badly as top tier, or other characters in general. It really is sad how the programmers did that to her too.

Nair - Quick and can set up combos if you fast fall it. But that's it. It doesn't kill which is the main problem. It doesn't ahve the best of aerial knockback so opponents can come back in and hit you. Marths sends you flying, Diddy Kong puts you in the air for combos, Metaknight sends you flying, Falco sends you in the air for combos, Peachs' sends you flying etc...

Uair - Quick, can set up combos if you fast fall it. But that's it again. It CANNOT kill and it's not disjointed.

Bair - Really one of our best powerful moves and can kill. The problem is that it's startup time is slow, and the hit box is so messed up (as in it's where it should be and is not disjointed) that it's super hard to hit on anyone with a fast aerial. And don't even try it much on grounded, short foes or you're asking for a beating.

Dair - Powerful. But not quick enough.


How do we get around these weaknesses? That would be the start of creating a great Samus that can go big (even though we have some here already that can go big).

Doing it alone would be ridiculously hard, almost suicide.... but that could be what it takes.

She can beat Snake, just outcamp him and gimp.
She can beat Dedede, just don't fall in his inifinte grab and watch out for bairs. Start spamming.
She can beat Wario, Falco, Luigi etc.

Her obstacles... The short characters with super-fast aerials and ground smashes that kill her. I'm talking:

Metaknight
Diddy Kong
Olimar
Kirby

 

[LanceStern]

Stop double posting!

 

[Xyro77]

Lance, take that stuff to my guide or the correct place. Please.

However i will say, metaknight being banned will improve our results.

 

[Ravin]

There is no "Perfect" anything. Dark. Pch's logic fails regardless of how you look at it. I am not a fan of dark peach and have seen and been victim to many of his highschool emo moments when he quit brawl or talked trash about you.


Soooo. Anything relating to Dark.Pch ideologist makes me Lol hard.

You cant have a perfect anything. Unless your another KDJ.

 

[Cherry64]

LOL @ Dryn telling him to stop his double posting ways.

Yeah I agreed the same as you guys lol. there's no effing way She can take a huge title. There are so many stupid match-ups for her. But honestly if her range on her F smash was longer, she'd be doing WAY better.
Honestly how many times have you ever fought someone and F smashed, then they F smashed after and you die because the range on that thing is Crap.

 

[Xyro77]

honestly, if her super missles KOed like in melee. she would be better.
if the shield system stayed the same like in melee, she would be better.
if you could crouch cancel in like in melee she would be better.

 

[Ravin]

"That aint Melee"

Seriously, she just needs a tad longer Fsmash, or even a bit more hitstun or better Bair and shed place better.

Her only real downside is you have to work for your kill.

 

[LanceStern]

I can't tell how many times I've hit forward smash to have her arm inch right near their face. Then they punish me.

She needs more hitstun, and her moves need knockback. So many other characters hit me when I'm in my shield and I can't punish because of it, unless it's pwoershielding. But definitely would be great to talk about her weaknesses and what we can do to overcome them.

Playing against Kirby, a lot of our moves go over his head. So I've been slowly disciplining myself to til all her tilts and smashes, and saving dtilt and up tilt to kill him.

I am a double poster. I will work on being better at not double posting.

 

[harriettheguy]

quit talking about the crap fsmash

z-air skill kills will win us major tournaments


Also, what do you guys think of samuses placing top 3 in major teams?

she can "prolong" her stocks sorta by camping the ledge...but (answer here)

 

[Cherry64]

quit talking about the crap fsmash

z-air skill kills will win us major tournaments


Also, what do you guys think of samuses placing top 3 in major teams?

she can "prolong" her stocks sorta by camping the ledge...but (answer here)

...What? zair skills will get us kills eh?
Sounds like Xyro. and Speak of the devil, I'd like to say I really enjoy the Shield in brawl better than melee.
I'm bias however because in Melee I cannot missile cancel to save my life. and I'm used to Perfect Shield Dashing which doesn't work in melee. nor does the shield pop up in the same frames so I can't perfect shield in Melee now either lol.

Samus is a beast in Teams if played right IMO

 

[SpongeBathBill]

Even if she were the worst character in the game, I see no reason to believe that a ridiculously amazing player could suddenly pick her up and own everyone else....

 

[Excellence]

That ridiculously amazing player, for you guys, is Xyro and she hasn't one a major tournament so its not going to happen.

 

[Trela]

That ridiculously amazing player, for you guys, is Xyro and she hasn't one a major tournament so its not going to happen.

*ehem* umm Xyro is a male human organism, not a "she".

GOSH.

MK's banned down here @ HOBO 16, so Xyro will probably place even higher than he usually does.

=Trela=

 

[Xyro77]

quit talking about the crap fsmash

z-air skill kills will win us major tournaments


Also, what do you guys think of samuses placing top 3 in major teams?

she can "prolong" her stocks sorta by camping the ledge...but (answer here)

i have got 2nd and 3rd in teams ALL the time. Tudor and his amrio friend does also. Its very possible. Teams is WAAAAAY diff than 1vs1. Meta is no longer the best once teams are involved.

...What? zair skills will get us kills eh?
Sounds like Xyro. and Speak of the devil, I'd like to say I really enjoy the Shield in brawl better than melee.
I'm bias however because in Melee I cannot missile cancel to save my life. and I'm used to Perfect Shield Dashing which doesn't work in melee. nor does the shield pop up in the same frames so I can't perfect shield in Melee now either lol.

Samus is a beast in Teams if played right IMO

samus is OK in teams. I wouldnt say OMG amazing.

That ridiculously amazing player, for you guys, is Xyro and she hasn't one a major tournament so its not going to happen.

as a girl i can only do so much. I highly doubt samus will win a MAJOR event in brawl. Well assuming you have good players there.

*ehem* umm Xyro is a male human organism, not a "she".

GOSH.

MK's banned down here @ HOBO 16, so Xyro will probably place even higher than he usually does.

=Trela=

im a girl. always have been

 

[Cherry64]

i have got 2nd and 3rd in teams ALL the time. Tudor and his amrio friend does also. Its very possible. Teams is WAAAAAY diff than 1vs1. Meta is no longer the best once teams are involved.



samus is OK in teams. I wouldnt say OMG amazing.



as a girl i can only do so much. I highly doubt samus will win a MAJOR event in brawl. Well assuming you have good players there.




im a girl. always have been

Whaa! good mind games therr, I got pretty flustered by the slight hypocracy. Took me a moment to recover from that. Also, Lies! what the hell was the M2K and some other Meta goign double Meta and ****** *** in doubles of Whobo?

Eh , I do decent with her in teams, I prefer using pit for that though.

And you? a girl? didn't know allen was a girls name :\

 

[Xyro77]

Whaa! good mind games therr, I got pretty flustered by the slight hypocracy. Took me a moment to recover from that. Also, Lies! what the hell was the M2K and some other Meta goign double Meta and ****** *** in doubles of Whobo?

Eh , I do decent with her in teams, I prefer using pit for that though.

And you? a girl? didn't know allen was a girls name :\

its allan.

and yea, if the USA can be dumb enough to elect obama as a president then allan can be a girl name.

 

[Ravin]

<.< Because McCain is so much better.

 

[Xyro77]

<.< Because McCain is so much better.

of the two, yes.

 

[Beetle Juice]

IMO, if samus can simply jump lower, fast fall, and stronger B specials (up up is good as it is) then she would probably win a tournament lol

 

[Ravin]

Hardly, hes is going to be dieing soon, I dont want Palin as president.

 

[Xyro77]

Hardly, hes is going to be dieing soon, I dont want Palin as president.

george washington was older than mc cain and served 2 terms in an era of HORRIBLE medical practices. Mc Cain would be fine.

 

[Ravin]

<.< LOL Have you looked at McCains medical record? He cant come in direct contact with light for a prolonged period of time.

 

[Pi]

I think samus as a character would greatly improve if you were to spam three things
Zair
UB & Nair OOS
& Missile camp


There are a great many ways samus would be a better character if some of the melee mechanics were kept, especially bombing.


Which is why I play melee

 

[Xyro77]

<.< LOL Have you looked at McCains medical record? He cant come in direct contact with light for a prolonged period of time.

Do you know what hes BEEN through to get where hes at? And america voted an a person who has accompished NOTHING in his political career.

 

[Excellence]

*ehem* umm Xyro is a male human organism, not a "she".

GOSH.

MK's banned down here @ HOBO 16, so Xyro will probably place even higher than he usually does.

=Trela=

I know Xyro is a male. I made a type-o.

i have got 2nd and 3rd in teams ALL the time. Tudor and his amrio friend does also. Its very possible. Teams is WAAAAAY diff than 1vs1. Meta is no longer the best once teams are involved.



samus is OK in teams. I wouldnt say OMG amazing.



as a girl i can only do so much. I highly doubt samus will win a MAJOR event in brawl. Well assuming you have good players there.




im a girl. always have been

Again, I apologize, it was a type-o.

Do you know what hes BEEN through to get where hes at? And america voted an a person who has accompished NOTHING in his political career.

I hope you aren't serious. Obama is far more intelligent for McCain. The only thing that McCain has going for him is his age and military experience, none of which people want to see now. Age does nothing for McCain when all that it represents is decades of what wasn't working or what people want to change. McCain being an older face who is much less of a new impression really doesn't do him much good. McCain's war experience is also for nothing because we're currently in a war that people don't want to be apart of. We don't need gun right now, what we need is a pen. Guerilla tactics never fail.

 

[Crystanium]

How did I let this thread go off topic?

Um, if you people want to debate about politics, there's the Debate Hall. No more debating politics, please. Thanks.

 

[Xyro77]

I hope you aren't serious. Obama is far more intelligent for McCain. The only thing that McCain has going for him is his age and military experience, none of which people want to see now. Age does nothing for McCain when all that it represents is decades of what wasn't working or what people want to change. McCain being an older face who is much less of a new impression really doesn't do him much good. McCain's war experience is also for nothing because we're currently in a war that people don't want to be apart of. We don't need gun right now, what we need is a pen. Guerilla tactics never fail.

argh. dryn made me edit my post.


sorry dryn but they dont like me in the debate hall. liberals hate to be proven wrong

 

[Ravin]

QQ.

I dont see Samus winning a major tounry.

 

[Xyro77]

QQ.

I dont see Samus winning a major tounry.

I dont see Samus winning a major tounry.

 

[Ravin]

Nowai.

I mean. If she had just a bit more going for her. And maybe MK was less exposed out to the world, maybe if you had a good secondary like... Wario or Falco. But Samus by herself. It isnt gonna happen.

 

[Xyro77]

Nowai.

I mean. If she had just a bit more going for her. And maybe MK was less exposed out to the world, maybe if you had a good secondary like... Wario or Falco. But Samus by herself. It isnt gonna happen.

i honestly will NEVER use anybody other than samus in tournament. SO ive reset my goals. top 7 is my goal and i think its possible if a person goes ALL samus in an event.

 

[Ravin]

Well my tounry ont he 16th i plan to go all Samus. but if i went to genesis ect, id be mixing it up more, maybe even go Samus/MK

 

[Cherry64]

Well my tounry ont he 16th i plan to go all Samus. but if i went to genesis ect, id be mixing it up more, maybe even go Samus/MK

Just want to let you know, you broke my heart.
Secondly yeah small tourni's I would go ALL samus, but if any larger ones I'd have to start pilling out Pit and hope he's not as rusty as I think he is.

 

[Xyro77]

u kids make me sad. btw. i added my article on falco to the log book. go read please

 

[Cherry64]

Haha, Thanks Xyro, I did that just a few minuets ago actually, and have to say that the counter picks and bans are my thoughts exactly, other than that good info.

Sometimes if I'm ballsy enough I'll take a falco to Rainbow cruise Because it's like gimp central there.

 

[Ravin]

But everyone uses MK why not me :D

It was a joke. I if I used MK in a tounry Id tell xyro to kill me in the nuts.

 

[Cherry64]

Lol Because you main Samus! as long as it's not MK it's all good
there's too many of 'em anyway