Samus vs falco, who do you think really has the favor?

[ADHD]

Who Has The Favor!!!!

 

[0RLY]

Falco. Didn't already make a match-up thread? Shame on you.

 

[Coldfront]

Falco without a doubt. Lasers, chainthrows, and combos, oh my.

 

[Orichalcum]

Chainthrow? you fail

 

[Hylian]

IMO Falco is Samus's worst match-up.

 

[Coldfront]

Chainthrow? you fail

Why is that dude?

 

[Serris]

IMO Falco is Samus's worst match-up.

Maybe, but at least she can hit Falco.

Short characters can give Samus a lot more trouble.

 

[Orichalcum]

Why is that dude?

samus is so floaty falco got even more chance to grab lucario with his chain grab, you can easily jump out or nair when over 35%

 

[Coldfront]

samus is so floaty falco got even more chance to grab lucario with his chain grab, you can easily jump out or nair when over 35%

I don't understand how me mentioning chain throws argues any of that.

At low percents, such as right after Samus loses a stock, Falco can combo her past 50% using his chainthrow. Two dthrows to dair to another dthrow to nair takes Samus past 50%.

In my original post I mentioned, in order, lasers, chain throws, and combos. Laser's for approaching, and his dthrow sets up that combo I mentioned. But I didn't mean to imply that if Samus is at 80% she can fall victim to being chain thrown from one side of the stage to the next.

 

[Zodiac]

Samus is amazing, she wins everything. Case closed.

 

[Gum]

I don't understand how me mentioning chain throws argues any of that.

At low percents, such as right after Samus loses a stock, Falco can combo her past 50% using his chainthrow. Two dthrows to dair to another dthrow to nair takes Samus past 50%.

In my original post I mentioned, in order, lasers, chain throws, and combos. Laser's for approaching, and his dthrow sets up that combo I mentioned. But I didn't mean to imply that if Samus is at 80% she can fall victim to being chain thrown from one side of the stage to the next.

No, Falco's chain grab doesn't work on Samus period. I play against Falco non stop and I know this for a fact. The best follow up Falco has after a d-throw on Samus is a short hop aerial.

I've mentioned this a thousand times before, but if you take Falco to the edge, you win. Its gg. Falco can't take Samus at the edge and if he does its because YOU ****ed up. Camping the edge means that lasers mean nothing, and you make him come to you. as soon as he goes below the edge to hit you its a stock. Falco only has the advantage if you stand their eating lasers to the face all day.

 

[Coldfront]

No, Falco's chain grab doesn't work on Samus period. I play against Falco non stop and I know this for a fact. The best follow up Falco has after a d-throw on Samus is a short hop aerial.

I've mentioned this a thousand times before, but if you take Falco to the edge, you win. Its gg. Falco can't take Samus at the edge and if he does its because YOU ****ed up. Camping the edge means that lasers mean nothing, and you make him come to you. as soon as he goes below the edge to hit you its a stock. Falco only has the advantage if you stand their eating lasers to the face all day.

Gum, I saw Sethalon do that exact combo against Tudor twice in their third match. He chained two dthrows to a dair which pulled Samus back down for another dthrow and followed up the first time with a nair and the second time with another dair. Saying the chain throw doesn't work at most percents may be accurate, but saying it doesn't work at all is wrong, because it does work at low percents, like right after a stock like I mentioned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTmMP15zuBU
First time happens at the start of the match, second time happens at 2:14. Unless you need three throws or more back to back to be considered a chain-throw, those combos started with chain-throws.

As far as ledge camping goes, that sounds like the most effective way, but what happens if he doesn't follow you off?

 

[0RLY]

Of course. Camping is always the solution >.>

 

[Orichalcum]

no samus does not get chain grabbed to 50 !

 

[Gum]

Gum, I saw Sethalon do that exact combo against Tudor twice in their third match. He chained two dthrows to a dair which pulled Samus back down for another dthrow and followed up the first time with a nair and the second time with another dair. Saying the chain throw doesn't work at most percents may be accurate, but saying it doesn't work at all is wrong, because it does work at low percents, like right after a stock like I mentioned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTmMP15zuBU
First time happens at the start of the match, second time happens at 2:14. Unless you need three throws or more back to back to be considered a chain-throw, those combos started with chain-throws.

As far as ledge camping goes, that sounds like the most effective way, but what happens if he doesn't follow you off?

Yeah I see what you mean in the video, but at the point where Falco would SH dair, you can footstool him. I do it everytime. I also DI up and away so maybe there was a DI issue.

As far as the ledge camping goes, if he doesn't follow you then so be it. Either way, you aren't getting pegged by lasers OR getting grabbed.

 

[Coldfront]

Gum, you're the man. I wish you'd post more video's though.

 

[Gum]

haha yeah I need to post some more. I usually get all might vid stuff done through freind, but he's out of town. Definitely gonna get some vs Falco stuff up plus a combo vid.

 

[Uffe]

Falco > Samus obviously. But seriously, it doesn't mean Samus can't own Falco. Falco doesn't even feel all that great in Brawl like he did in Melee. So how do you beat Falco? Rely less on your projectile and more on your zair and regular attacks. If you can throw Falco off, then by all means blast him. Also, his Firefox or whatever you want to call his stupid return leaves him open and in one spot. You're better off just zairing him up off the cliff. But then what do you do when there are no cliffs?

He can't reflect bombs. You might want to create a barrage around him. Either way when I tried out Falco, a lot of his attacks seemed situational. His f-smash compared to Samus' is just horrible. If Falco is just going to use his lasers, then use your projectile or zair him from a distance. He may be a bad match-up, but he's not impossible to kill.

 

[FuLLBLeeD]

Bumping this thread because I need help vs Falco.

 

[Coldfront]

I was watching a video of Ike vs Falco, and I saw the Ike player do something pretty cool. When Falco was trying to get back on the stage, he attempted to use his sideB. The Ike player just jabbed him, which forced him to use his UpB.

Perhaps Samus can do the same, and follow up with a Dair when Falco goes for the UpB.

The issue is of course getting Falco off the stage. I can't be of much help in that regard, as I still get shut down by laser spam.

 

[Crystanium]

samus is so floaty falco got even more chance to grab lucario with his chain grab, you can easily jump out or nair when over 35%

Actually, I've been able to escape Falco's chaingrab with Samus at his first attempt. He'd throw me down, but he wasn't able to after that, and no, I wasn't at a high percent. My twin brother, Uffe, and my friend have tried using Falco's chaingrab on me while I was Samus. They were better off throwing me down once and using another attack, since the other grab failed.

 

[n00b]

My friend who I play often uses 1 downthrow -> dair -> downthrow -> nair
It's pretty effective, so watch out for that. Against Falco I've found that if you shield dash a lot on the ground to plow through lasers, they'll try to grab you out of your shield with jab/reflector pressure.. When I see a grab coming and they havent pushed me away far enough from shield, I like to do a dash OOS in the opposite direction, interrupted by an Fsmash in the opposite way. It's like a short pivot fsmash OOS.. it's pretty cool.

 

[Gum]

I mean seriously though, If Falco is allowed to be gay with lasers, why can't Samus just be gay and camp the ledge? Falco can't do **** to you and he is terrible off the stage.

 

[sandwhale]

isn't ledge stalling band in some tournaments?

 

[FuLLBLeeD]

Falco's fsmash is really freaking horrible too. Its the ****ing splits that always get me. Sure, Samus's dtilt is rigged too, but the freaking splits are instant.

 

[n00b]

His fsmash if timed/spaced correctly has very solid knockback, whoever you're fighting might not know how to use it.

The dsmash is actually less fatal than a well placed fsmash, because with good DI you can tech it on the ground depending where you are on the stage, or stop knockback with a quick grapple if you pass by the ledge low enough. I teched a dsmash at 190% with Samus on FD.. so.. it's possible.. fsmash sends you at too high of an angle to tech or grapple anything, whereas the KO potential from dsmash comes from its low trajectory which would gimp some characters with poor recoveries, but Samus clearly isn't one of them.

 

[Echo_0]

I've mained samus since the first game, and i've always had some trouble with falco (or fox back then) Maily because he's faster. But Samus destroys him in the air and off the ledge

 

[0RLY]

Naw, Falco's dair goes through Samus' uair and his nair goes through everything else. Falco's speedier ftilt and jabs makes it easier for him to land a hit up close. His Phantasm lets him respace himself against Samus with very little threat. Lasers are very hard to deal with. So yes, I ledge camp against Falco.

 

[Gum]

isn't ledge stalling band in some tournaments?

But its not stalling if you are at least attacking. This is why ledge hop uncharged shots and stuff.

 

[Falcos_feather]

A good Falco ***** a good Samus (most of the times)

Super Missiles & Charge shots suffers from the reflector!

"Homers" (Which I use to call 'em) works pretty good though!
Combine with zair ffs!!

 

[Koji123]

A friend of mine switched to Falco from Marth and I gotta say gimping recovery has never been easier. Gonna use your forward B? Z-air is there to stop you. Gonna UpB? Nope, Dair has got that front covered. Plus now I don't have to worry about getting tipped near the ledge and die at 56%. laser spam on the other hand is pretty **** annoying... I could do without a mouthful of laser thanks. -.-

 

[Crystanium]

My brother plays a mean Falco, and he hasn't been playing as Falco since the game came out. Perhaps Falco has an easy learning curve. My brother played as Falco in Melee. Since we're twin brothers, I like to use characters that are the opposite of my brother. For example, consider the following:

Dryn/Uffe:

• Fox/Falco (Melee)
• Roy/Marth (Melee)
• Ganondorf/Captain Falcon (Melee/Brawl?)
• Fox/Falco (Melee/Brawl?)
• Lucas/Ness

I was going to use Lucas, but I didn't get much out of him after coming across another person who played as Lucas. I dropped him. I dropped Fox as well, but because my brother seems to be using Falco, I'm thinking about adding Fox to my line-up. Anyway, I apologize for digressing. The point I was going to make was that you can learn how Falco players play, especially those who like to play competitively. Often times I see Falco players use Falco Phantasm (Forward+B) to return instead of Fire Bird (Up+B). They'll even use their edge-game by jumping off the edge and using Falco Phantasm. Bombs, Charge Shots and Super Missiles are good against this. Be sure to stay back when Falco is on the edge.

 

[smashgamer211]

definatly falco, but im not sure if falco has a huge advantage though.

 

[Gum]

Im telling you guys, falco does not have a true advantage in this match-up. It really only seems that way.

 

[theshortgamer]

olimar has the true advantage!!!

but yeah falco > samus, cause my friend is a ***** with falco.

 

[0RLY]

Samus really isn't fast or small enough to avoid constant illusion/laser spam. If Samus could work her way around that, then she would stand a chance. You can't win a game by camping on the ledge the whole time.

 

[J4pu]

Samus is largely horizontal projectiles, Falco's reflector specializes in horizontal projectiles, Samus can't kill to save her life, lasers destroy samus on stage due to her height and generally slow speed, and spamming the reflector will beat a ledge camping samus.

I see this matchup largely in Falco's favor.

 

[Gum]

Samus is largely horizontal projectiles, Falco's reflector specializes in horizontal projectiles, Samus can't kill to save her life, lasers destroy samus on stage due to her height and generally slow speed, and spamming the reflector will beat a ledge camping samus.

I see this matchup largely in Falco's favor.

Spamming reflector beats a ledge camping Samus? Wtf? Lose. If someone were spamming reflector, why would you try to ledge hop anything? You wouldn't. You would simply hang there, which is fine because then nothing happens and you still aren't getting laser spammed. That plus you don't use projectiles against Falco, you use zair.

@Orly: You most certainly can win by camping the ledge the whole time. Hit him once then run and grab the ledge. If you are winning in damage, you can win the match. Most of the time the falco ALWAYS chases you off the edge so it doesn't matter anyway. If you take a stock on time, then you can just run away the entire time and/or keep hanging on the edge.

 

[J4pu]

So you're gunna just sit on the edge the whole game never rising to stage height? firstly the fact that you would force a 0-0 tie proves that Falco has the advantage since the best you seem to want to do is tie.

Falco can run to the oppositte side of the stage that you are hanging on and spam SHDL to hit you if you mistime a jump to fire something at Falco since I don't think you actually plan on sitting under the stage for 7 straight minutes due to the fact that's ********. Lasers are a decently fast projectile that can travel the distance of FD (and plenty farther) while most of Samus's projectiles are quite slow and won't make it that far other than the fully charge blast shot which she can't charge while she is hanging anyways (yes, yes I know FD isn't the only stage people play on but I'm using it as an example anyway). If you are playing on a shorter map that say a strong missile will make it to the other end, Falco still has ample time to throw out a reflector or just straight out dodge it since the SHDL leaves him with no lag.

If you can't see this matchup is clearly in Falco's favor you are the one that fails and you seriously need to stop just thinking so highly of a character because they are your main and instead try thinking of the advantages and disadvantages that are straight fact.

 

[n00b]

^ Yea boi, drop dat knowledge. Torrance/Irvine represent~~~