Samus on Edge: Recovery, Edgeguarding, and Offstage Discussion

[n00b]

Rohins and I were talking.. we miss the good ole' days when everyone would chase Samus offstage and let us spike them. In today's metagame, everyone.. camps..

Discuss tips or tricksies on how to safely recover from different scenarios:

Offstage - Above and Below the stage
On edge - Getup options, stall tactics (boo)
Edgeguarding - Setups, punishments..

For example, iono:

Offstage:
Above - outmaneuver with bombs if up high, mess up their spacing, retaliate with spike/safely recover to ledge
On edge - ledgedrop zair through stage if they don't jump, sh air dodge onto stage, ledgedrop retether to stall until they whiff..
Edgeguarding - utilt if you expect a jump, uncharge shot spacie recovery, etc..

iono. Throw out some ideas!

 

[Pi]

My friends marth was wrecking my recovery, I was scurred and I hate the new bombs T.T

I'm going to go right into their stage spike, tech jump and spike them. That's my plan.

As far as edge guarding goes I like to predict with a Utilt (which kills at really nice %'s from the edge like that)
When they get use to that I'll drop a bomb and wait for them with a Ftilt or a UB.

try save your DJ as much as you can I spose, get under them and catch them in an UB perhaps

 

[n00b]

My friends marth was wrecking my recovery, I was scurred

Marth on Yoshi's vs. Samus offstage in last match of tournament set made me start this thread.

I think the obvious answer is to rohins combo in that scenario.

 

[Pi]

Marth on Yoshi's vs. Samus offstage in last match of tournament set made me start this thread.

I think the obvious answer is to rohins combo in that scenario.

Let's just SWD

 

[0RLY]

- Offstage -
Above - If far away, get closer with bombs. Stop bombing when you're within your foe's edge guarding range. When level with the stage, if you're about a grapple beam's length away grapple, wait a split second, tap down to cancel, double jump fair/uair to the stage. If you don't have your double jump, fall below the stage with a uair then screw attack to recover.
Below - Get closer to the stage with bombs. Double jump+airdodge if your Screw Attack can still reach the ledge after the airdodge ends. Otherwise, double jump+uair or just double jump+Screw Attack.
- On edge -
If your opponent is within understage zair range, use that. If they are less than a DK's width from the stage, ledgehop fair/uair then retreat back to ledge incase they shield. If they are out of range of ledgehop fair/uair and are too close for understage zair (we need to name this thing, NOW) ledgejump bomb followed by immediate ledge getup. Otherwise, ledgejump.
- Edgeguarding -
Do some of Tudor's fancy missiling/zairing, some of Xyro's fancy zairing, some of whatever random stuff I remember from videos to make my Samus look cool. Uair→dj Dair, Zair→dj Nair, Zair→dj Fair, Fair→dj Zair, full hop uncharged shot→homing missile cancel→run offstage uncharged shot→dj homing missile→recover→ledgehop reverse uncharged shot/homing missile. I just... do stuff.

 

[n00b]

- Edgeguarding -
I just... do stuff.

But the key in your stuff is that they're all pressured to keep the opponent offstage, as opposed to camping and punishing while they try to recover like a patient Marth would do versus us.

The problem with rising zair is people like Marth will just sh nair/fair wall you.. :[

 

[Crystanium]

I'm hoping to get another replay up and calling it Back to the Basics: Edge-Hogging 2. Otherwise, that is all.

I have two replays of me brawling with me two-stocking IsmaR. The second one is awesome, due to the fact that we both spike each other at the same time, but IsmaR loses his last stock while you can hear the faint sound of me using my Screw Attack. I also have two replays of me and my brother duking it out offline last night. One of the replays I two-stock him. But, the one video I have with IsmaR, you see a singles match where I edge-hog twice to beat him. Oh, and IsmaR isn't terrible, either. He and I two-stock each other sometimes. Good stuff.

 

[n00b]

irrelevant wall of text

You contributed nothing to this thread other than your own ego-stroking about how you beat people nobody cares about.

EDIT: oh I see now, you posted a free for all video reminding us that we can retether to gimp bad recoveries. Thanks.

 

[Crystanium]

You contributed nothing to this thread other than your own ego-stroking about how you beat people nobody cares about.

EDIT: oh I see now, you posted a free for all video reminding us that we can retether to gimp bad recoveries. Thanks.

I have bragging rights for two-stocking people. Ask TAC.

In the next replay I have, I edge-hog Sheik and Zero Suit Samus.

 

[n00b]

letters arranged in such a way that instill urges in the reader to cause harm to the original author

you're doing it again.

 

[xXTACXx]

I have bragging rights for two-stocking people. Ask TAC.

In the next replay I have, I edge-hog Sheik and Zero Suit Samus.

<_< on WiFi. i really dont have anything to say on this topic just dont be a *****.

 

[Crystanium]

All right, my apologies. I don't think I can express things about Samus any more than someone writing a fanfic about Metroid. Simply put, images describe Samus much better, and so I am hoping that replay that I linked will suffice. If I could post up my other ones, I would.

 

[VirisKnite]

If you need matches of gimping people with retethering n00b ***** me with it in our last set of matches. Matches 10 and higher.

 

[0RLY]

Okay in all seriousness, nobody ever deserves the right to brag. People are more impressed by modesty than being omnipotent. It's also why Tudor is slightly more popular respected than Xyro.

After reading this post, Xyro77 will now post in this thread without contributing.

 

[Xyro77]

Tudor is TRASH! clearly the better player is.....XYRO!

results son.........plain and simple!

Face the facts!!


but also, from what i read, Wes(melee samus) wants to jump in the brawl samus scene.....this could bring us to a new level.

 

[Tudor]

Okay in all seriousness, nobody ever deserves the right to brag. People are more impressed by modesty than being omnipotent. It's also why Tudor is slightly more popular respected than Xyro.

After reading this post, Xyro77 will now post in this thread without contributing.

but i though i was better than xyro because all he does is spam zair to win =(

 

[Solo Assass1n]

Tudor is TRASH! clearly the better player is.....XYRO!

results son.........plain and simple!

Face the facts!!


but also, from what i read, Wes(melee samus) wants to jump in the brawl samus scene.....this could bring us to a new level.

Doubt it. I remember Phanna saying he'd make something out of Samus in the early days of Brawl, we all know that didn't happen.

 

[Aran]

For most people, I typically bomb jump inwards till I'm close, then do a missile (sometimes two if I still have another jump) then immediate up-B or tether to ledge. It provides pretty good protection against edgeguarding, because if he tries to airdodge the missile, he can't attack you before you grab the ledge, and if he goes for the attack, he'll usually eat the missile and the hitstun normally keeps him from retaliating before you get invincibility and sets you up in a position to edgeguard them sometimes.

 

[Orichalcum]

If you got someone campiong, rtether, fair and grabd edge, play with their minds until you see an opening to get back. jump immediately bomb -> zair/fair. jump -> dair.

Above stage. bomb bomb bomb bomb bomb and bomb, dont get hit land safe and continue

Edgeguarding. UTILT. predict jump Zair. or the famous dsmash edgeguard by xyro

 

[Sago]

mixups .....

 

[Jasona]

how does tudor pull off the really low ledge hop to zair? every time i try it, i just get the super high tethered ledge grab. is it just precise timing that i need to work at or is it some position relative to the ledge that makes it possible? maybe i'm just DI'ing too close to the ledge when i ledge hop.
learning to ledge hop to zair as low as possible would help me out tremendously vs undr

 

[0RLY]

1) Ledge drop. (down)
2) Move closer towards the stage without falling too far. (left/right)
3) Double jump and zair at the same time. You must zair before your double jump puts you above the ledge. (X/Y+Z)
4) ???
5) Profit

 

[n00b]

1) Ledge drop. (down)
2) Move closer towards the stage without falling too far. (left/right)
3) Double jump and zair at the same time. You must zair before your double jump puts you above the ledge. (X/Y+Z)
4) ???
5) Opponent short hops over zair, punishes you
6) Recover to ledge
7) Go to step 1

this is how it plays out for me

 

[Jasona]

i'm stuck somewhere between steps 2 and 3. can't find the right position before i zair. i'm either well above the ledge when i zair, zair cancels on the ledge as i get over it or i get the super ledge tether jump thingy

 

[SarahHarp]

You can also air dodge to make it easier. Just push the opposite direction of the ledge to let go, and immediately DI towards the stage. Then jump and air dodge at the same time. After a brief moment, zair out of the air dodge and it should be possible to get the zair to full extend before you land on the stage.

If you want to use the non-air dodging way, then you need to have quick fingers. Push back away from the ledge (only push the controller about 10% of the way though so you don't spend too much time going away from the edge), DI towards the stage again, jump, and at the peak of your jump (or somewhere near it) simply zair. If you re tether the ledge again, your arm cannon wasn't past the ledge enough when you zaired.

 

[Undrdog]

Happy 100th Sarah.

Anyway, just to clarify Sauna's looking to get his Zair to practically lay on the ground as seen in Tudor's compilation/combo video, "It's Not Fair, It's Dair!". Not sure if that's what you're describing, but I haven't been able to get it down yet either. Granted I've only been fiddling with it for about half an hour. >_<

 

[SarahHarp]

The variant that comes up through the ground? I've only been able to get it to work on stages that have a slanted edge (Battlefield and AnimalCrossing). You let go of the ledge, DI towards the stage a little longer than you would for a normal ledgehop ziar (so that you're under the slanted part), then jump and zair at about the same time. The slope above you will cause your jump momentum to go back out towards the edge again, while the zair comes up from the ground.