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Ryker Mafia Is Over: Ryker Always Wins

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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Ran I am happy to play this game, but the secrecy of hydras makes my read method much harder. Add that to the fact people get 10X cockier and instantly think they're good because they have a hydra partner and the game becomes a ****storm.

Tier, you...

I'm defeated, utterly defeated. I feel like I'm against a brick wall where no logic or reasoning will ever penetrate. Have you been reading this thread?
Swiss, let's be friends.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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I never said it was wrong to ask, it's just that I'm lazy and don't want to spell it out every time. Do you ever look and wonder "where did that town read come from?" and then think for yourself.

Claiming VT off the bat, he's STUCK to that claim. If he were scum and the fires of a lynch were licking his heels, he'd rather have a claim ready to save his ***, wouldn't you think? "But can't scum do that too?" Yes scum can do everything a townie does. Doesn't mean that it's not very risky.
I mean, maybe it's not a town-tell, it just goes to show he's not scum. Indy is still possible but that's for D2.

The rest of his play hasn't shown anything for me to think otherwise.
This logic is rubbish. No name, please do better than this.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
Joined
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I also don't like how he backpeddaled with Swiss. He just said "Yeah you're obvtown" most likely because of how Swiss reacted towards him. I didn't think that was grounds for him to change his read. Seemed forced.
First time i've agreed with Ranmaru. Even if i can see the sarcasm, the intention is more than enough to feel like it was forced, but the biggest thing I don't understand is the need to play overly zealous.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
Joined
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Messages
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Right, I am looking at it though and I see the way he claimed as a town-tell

Yes, but I don't need to know what everyone thinks of me all the time. It's fine if he wants to move me without providing reasoning. The moment he tries to lynch me without a good reason though, I will care.


I've noticed these, but pinning a bull**** scum read on Swiss is hardly something that shows he's not town.
Not answering you was kinda eh, because I can understand why you don't want to answer (if you're lazy), but still eh.

And on his 180 on Swiss; Reads change a lot, especially D1. But there seems to be no harm in asking.

S-Tier, why the change from Swiss making scumslips etc. to obvtown?
Because they were being pretentious and trying to goad Swiss when they should both know that doesn't work. They literally did the same damn thing Spidermang did, context in all.

hurr durr pressure swiss with fake appliance so we can read him
 

Gova

I'm goin' for it!
Joined
Jul 16, 2008
Messages
1,274
Location
Austin, TX
NNID
Takicodos
1. Spidermang (2) AM, Zapp
2. dtjglyphmoney ()
3. AM ()
4. The Account With No Name (1) Allegory
5. JTB (1) S-Tier
6. Soup~ ()
7. Allegory ()
8. giraffelasergun ()
9. Dabunz (1) JTB
10. J ()
11. Zapp Brannigan (2) Swiss, Spidermang
12. S-Tier (2) GLG, Soup
13. Swiss ()

Not voting - Glyph, TAWNN, J, Dabunz
With 13 playing, it takes 7 to lynch!

Deadline is April 6th at 11:59 PM EST (GMT-5).
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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I might make a case on s-tier, i might just let it sit and see people react and go from there. Who knows.

Lynch S-tier.
 
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Apr 17, 2011
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1,013
Swiss we haven't played before, I believe this is the first game. Why do you like me? If it is based on my play, then I'd be surprised. I think that I could have used the first day of D1 better.
What's not to like? You're a zetta sexy digit, I wouldn't mind multiplying with your binomials.

:smirk:

In a bit of a rut with some things and unsure of how to proceed. If someone wants to drop some hints, it would be appreciated. S-Tier's #257 was pure comic gold with his lynch choices of JTB, Spider, gira, and Glyph. I admit that I was a bit ecstatic when you read me as town, but then I saw No Name above me and chuckled.

No Name I'm still disturbed by the fact that it took so long to delay giving me such a nonchalant answer. I don't take your explanation at face value at all that it was just a joke. For one, if it was a joke why did you really need to check with John to give you the green light to share it? For me, this screams safe play and being way too conscious about what information you're giving to the town. I would like to state that I didn't read carefully the first time with your interaction with Spidermang which you respond with the following when he treats your position as one being legitimate and with stances:



I honestly do not understand why you wouldn't just reference your #52 in response to my pressure on asking you to elaborate on a read.

For me this interaction poses two problems. The first problem is that your interaction with Spidermang strikes me as being out of place. It seems like after Spidermang criticized your approach to the game, you decided to drastically shift how you decided to play the hydra. I don't understand why you allowed to cave in to Spidermang or allowed his words to have such a clout that you would slow roll me an explanation for your previous play.

The second problem I have is that you had no reason to slow roll me an explanation, since you already had provided one. More or less the one that you already gave Spidermang which you could have nonchalantly references when I requested it. I would have expected you to go, "Hey stupid, look, I already stated this, learn to read." Or something along those lines. Subsequent play before my second press on you had been you releasing another town read.
And this is why. Your play has a lot of sincere analysis that's trying to flesh out a read without jumping to conclusions hastily or forcing any assumptions that shouldn't be there. Your logical progression is good and the questions you're asking are on the mark and beneficial to town.

As for Nobody, I dunno how to read him. I've kinda been ignoring him as his input's rarely been valuable or useful. After this, I'll go back and focus on him more. He hasn't made much of an impact on my reads.

I'd have to go back and check, but I remember looking at it and seriously wondering, this guy is releasing another town read on another dude, yet he can't even give me an explanation to an old read he outed way in the beginning of the game. I'm seriously in a rut with figuring out your shenanigans man.[/QUOTE]
 
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AM is the same as S-tier, ironically. I've been having some trouble reading Soupa as Washed listed him as "good start" and I was reading Soupa as having a bad start when the game started.
Other than a few oddball moments where Soup just went ahead and started following the crowd for little discernible reason, he's had some solid play. I haven't looked at anything regarding S-Tier that he's done but like his play has been usually solid work. I haven't seen anything bad from him outside of what I said. This certainly isn't ****bag Soup who likes to **** around for the first five pages of the game posting stupid images and making dumb comments, to say the least. Maybe Soup's become more methodical and business-like, but I certainly don't have the experience to back that up.

AM gave me a better context to look at Spidermang's play, which is a simpler interpretation that held Spider to a higher standard of play. Not sure if I'm caving in to popularism, but the idea that Spidermang deserves to be pressured for his poor push on Swiss, makes the Soup slot more understandable.
Ding ding ding.
 
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I also liked the concept of him asking Swiss for reads on three players he hasn't played with. I said this before. I'm the type to try and get reads on people I haven't played with (such as rvs votes)
To make a point, I didn't, and the reason for this is that the question was a throw-away question. There wasn't anything meaningful Spidey wanted to gain out of it, so Spidey literally could've asked him anything and the objective would've been the same.
 
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When I say someone is going town for me after 3 posts, you shouldn't assume I already cleared that person. I understand the the part about him not caring about my pressure now, didn't look at it that way.
As for Dabuz; That was John's gut feeling and I had no more from him than a gut feeling either. John and I don't get to communicate a lot due to time zones and schedules. I can't push Dabuz now.

There's no more, just that.

Basically, in MB, I got the balls a lot for *****footing and never laying down my reads, so I decided to post them as I got them this time. Guess that's not the way to go either...
We'll keep town reads to ourselves now unless they're needed or something.


Where did I call him scummy?
Do the math! If your reads are inconsistent, you're going to appear scummy for it. This kind of wishy-washy, flip-flopping bull**** just makes me cringe.

Where's your beauty, radian?
 
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I want read the Jim side of the No Name hydra as town, but I really don't see it happening considering I feel while they're being openly honest with things, they also mitigate excuses for every action. I'm not sure how to read it exactly, I like the blunt attitude but I don't like feeling that someone who should be confident in what they post has to explain everything or make an excuse about it.

Yes, i'm implying a part of the read on me, I don't understand why No Name backed down from it after being pressured about it to an extent.
I think a lot of it is because the hydra is confused and sucks at being consistent within itself. If it's going to do that, it's going to be outwardly confusing and obnoxious to read regardless (and no, I don't think either head tagging their posts will help read them, as John/Guus already seem to be swapping reads based on what the other thinks). While I'm not sure if they're scum for it, they're definitely a liability.
 
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Because they were being pretentious and trying to goad Swiss when they should both know that doesn't work. They literally did the same damn thing Spidermang did, context in all.

hurr durr pressure swiss with fake appliance so we can read him
And with this, my read on S-Tier is suddenly cast into doubt.

I really hope it's not that easy/mechanical but gogdamn would that be hard to ignore.
 
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Done.

I agree in the sentiment that S-Tier was trying to do what Spidey was doing, but I think the difference in reaction is what sets the two apart. Spidey immediately turned it into a power struggle when Swiss failed to comply, whereas S-Tier followed through on what he was doing and kept up his goal. Spidey seemed more concerned with overpowering Swiss whereas S-Tier seemed more interested in actually reading Swiss.

But I do find both of their 180s in regards to their respective goals to be all sorts of shady. S-Tier read is totally in doubt right now.
 
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How can I tell? Simple: Spidey turned it into a massive pissing contest (evidenced breaking out exact definitions of what Swiss was calling him) whereas S-Tier seemed more concerned with actually goading a reaction from him in order to use it to his advantage (evidenced by him asking others their opinion and citing posts). One seemed like an argument for the sake of an argument, the other seemed like something more useful.

But that's not exactly the strongest opinion. I still question it, as S-Tier's motivations do seem a bit shady. He certainly jumped the gun and his opinions came off as very fluid during that entire situation when he should've been more firm. It came off as very excitable and that's shady to me.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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I can agree with that sentiment, I just feel that they backed down for no reason, and that the zealous gig they were pulling was fake. The way they played that situation didn't feel like it had a goal in mind, it felt like they were jerking Swiss' chain and seeing which way he tugged.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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How can I tell? Simple: Spidey turned it into a massive pissing contest (evidenced breaking out exact definitions of what Swiss was calling him) whereas S-Tier seemed more concerned with actually goading a reaction from him in order to use it to his advantage (evidenced by him asking others their opinion and citing posts). One seemed like an argument for the sake of an argument, the other seemed like something more useful.

But that's not exactly the strongest opinion. I still question it, as S-Tier's motivations do seem a bit shady. He certainly jumped the gun and his opinions came off as very fluid during that entire situation when he should've been more firm. It came off as very excitable and that's shady to me.
You ninja'd me.
 

giraffelasergun

Smash Lord
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1,173
Well, he must be what he says.

I'm doing this ryker-style, mostly because i've missed a lot and it's easier on me.

I don't understand the scum-read on S-tier for this at all, especially when nothing is set and stone, that couldn't be his actual role and he could be joking. I don't think Zen or Seph would be inane enough to blatantly claim their role regardless of alilgnment and hope someone thinks it's nothing more than b]null.[/b] Did you think about that in first hand? What do you think about the slot in general?
I'm trying to figure out how to explain this right. Whenever I see someone claim unprovoked, especially when it's vanilla town, it screams scum to me. First of all it's irrational to do, and secondly people are thought to be town until they're guilty. I don't understand why this would be taken as "null", obviously when they did that they intended to get reactions of some kind and didn't just do it fortehlulz. The slot has been so-so for me otherwise, I'd need to reread and pull out some quotes.

Vote: S-tier

Well, ****. S-tier has really blew my expectations out of the water. I take what I said back Swiss, they're both scum.
Whyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy


Any idiot can drop a read, I'll drop the freaking SCUM TEAM.

hi *****es
I smiled.

Anyway, I'm going back to reread some stuff on spidermang becuase everyone seems to have him on this scum list that I don't have him on and I'm going to find out why. Wheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee
 

JTB

Live for the applause
Premium
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6,512
Apologies for my absence, I have other priorities than this game atm.

Tomorrow is my day off, so ill definitely invest time into this then.

:phone:
 

zapp brannigan

Ranmaru|Vanderzant
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I'm trying to figure out how to explain this right. Whenever I see someone claim unprovoked, especially when it's vanilla town, it screams scum to me. First of all it's irrational to do, and secondly people are thought to be town until they're guilty. I don't understand why this would be taken as "null", obviously when they did that they intended to get reactions of some kind and didn't just do it fortehlulz. The slot has been so-so for me otherwise, I'd need to reread and pull out some quotes.
I got ya. Hey, what do you think of No Name getting a town read just from S-tier claiming?
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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GLG said:
I'm trying to figure out how to explain this right. Whenever I see someone claim unprovoked, especially when it's vanilla town, it screams scum to me. First of all it's irrational to do, and secondly people are thought to be town until they're guilty. I don't understand why this would be taken as "null", obviously when they did that they intended to get reactions of some kind and didn't just do it fortehlulz. The slot has been so-so for me otherwise, I'd need to reread and pull out some quotes.
This is fair reasoning and I would say considering my own read on S-tier right now I would take it in heavy consideration.
 

S-Tier

Sephiroths Masumune|Zen
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Ran you need to take a step back. You're being like your past self, asking questions that are no good. You seem to be really concerned about me saying that No Name could change because you think it contradicts my town read on him. The thing is I never cleared no lynch, which is how you are portraying it. I simply have a town read on him. You asked me the reasoning and I gave it to you. Now you're taking it as if I had this super strong town read on him because of it which is exactly why asking for people to unnecessarily elaborate on their town reads is counter productive. Acrostic is doing this same thing to No lynch. You asked No lynch his reasoning for his town read on me and now Acrostic is taking it as if he had cleared me. You see why I don't like your line of questioning? So again please stop asking questions like these. I've gotten to the point of skimming most of your posts.
S-Tier, why the change from Swiss making scumslips etc. to obvtown?
I was clearly making those posts on Swiss in teasing manner in attempt to gauge him. I probably know how to read Swiss better than anyone in this game. Swiss has been known to stick his neck out for his buddies before, pushing anyone that pushes him or his buddies. I wanted to gauge whether or not Swiss switched on me because I told him I wont tag my posts or because he was indirectly defending JTB. I can have a town read on someone and still look into their motives. Not to do so would just be bad play. This is a response to both Brann & Soup as well by the way since all three you asked.
S-Tier's #257 was pure comic gold with his lynch choices of JTB, Spider, gira, and Glyph. I admit that I was a bit ecstatic when you read me as town, but then I saw No Name above me and chuckled.
I'm genuinely confused about this post. What is comical about those choices?
Swiss, they're both scum.
Who is the other person you're referring to here?
I'm trying to figure out how to explain this right. (1)Whenever I see someone claim unprovoked, especially when it's vanilla town, it screams scum to me. (2)First of all it's irrational to do, and secondly people are thought to be town until they're guilty. (3)I don't understand why this would be taken as "null", obviously when they did that they intended to get reactions of some kind and didn't just do it fortehlulz. The slot has been so-so for me otherwise, I'd need to reread and pull out some quotes.
(1)Where else have you seen someone claim unprovoked?
(2)If it is irrational, how is that a scum tell? If it's irrational for town, it's irrational for scum.
(3)You're stating that I did it to get reactions. Which is a town motivation. You didn't name one scum intention in this post. The bold is actually very telling of you.

Vote: glg
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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S-Tier said:
Who is the other person you're referring to here?
Both of you, but I read the shenanigans earlier as Zen. This is Zen posting, right?
 

S-Tier

Sephiroths Masumune|Zen
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Yes, but why did you say both of us if you were only reading one of us? I'm very surprised you don't see JTB scum. His play is almost identical to TTGL and I thought you two were able to read each other well.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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but I read the shenanigans earlier as Zen.
S-tier said:
His play is almost identical to TTGL and I thought you two were able to read each other well.
So, you're metaing him a bit? That's gonna end you up in a ditch. I'm going to re-iterate something I said.

"You, among others talking about JTB (hi zen) confuse me with this read. JTB has done nothing worth investigation or a vote."
 

zapp brannigan

Ranmaru|Vanderzant
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Who cares if it's counterproductive. I know you would have a damn good reason for having a town read on him. I know you wouldn't just back off from some silly town tell, now would you? If you had your doubts, you would have pressed on, but you didn't. Also keep in mind I asked for substantiation on No Name AND AM. You left AM out, for some reason. :glare:

You had him as town, and you put that out there without anyone asking for a town read from you. Knowing your reason for why you would say he was town helps the town from mislynching town, nothing wrong with you substantiating a town read. It also shows if you are being legit or just ****. :smirk: Your reasoning to me wasn't very genuine. Even so, you flip flop with your read on him and Swiss, and I don't think you were trying to gauge Swiss at all, nope. I don't believe you. That was too easy for you to say that he was obv town. He hasn't done anything to even be considered obv town, I just have him as null. (In my opinion I like to see Swiss do some WORK you feel me? That's how I am with reads, but my other head has a gut town read on em)

Basically, that read is too solid and you are giving that away too easily. There is also no way No Name could have REALLY reached the conclusion that you were town from just your claim. It sounds like he was trying to excuse your claim even though it should be null and I don't like that coming from him.

Jtb is scummy but your push on him is just an easy path for you to go in. Obviously you as scum would choose to go that way.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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I was clearly making those posts on Swiss in teasing manner in attempt to gauge him. I probably know how to read Swiss better than anyone in this game. Swiss has been known to stick his neck out for his buddies before, pushing anyone that pushes him or his buddies. I wanted to gauge whether or not Swiss switched on me because I told him I wont tag my posts or because he was indirectly defending JTB. I can have a town read on someone and still look into their motives. Not to do so would just be bad play. This is a response to both Brann & Soup as well by the way since all three you asked.
Well, at least you can back up what you're saying.

The bolded implies something I didn't see, I felt and to repeat myself 'jerking swiss' chain and seeing which way he tugged' rather then a means to get a read on him and his connections with JTB.

I think that part makes more sense, however, when I think about it. You did directly tell Swiss 'are you seeing what i'm seeing.' The explanation aside is not my problem, the problem resides of the intentions of yourself and your play at hand. Why did you play so Zealously during that quick interaction? What intention would you have to goad a player like Swiss and then turn the other cheek when he repsones negatively? What do you think about him being scum-lean with you? Is JTB still your number one target?
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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I find your GLG vote a bit weird too, I found GLG's response genuine and the explanation insightful, I don't think there was a lot of reason to simply claim your role just because your hydra partner didn't get the PM. All that did was create a blanket of wifom.
 
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