Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[Xhampi]

That would be so lame for Smash to have a character from a traditional fighting game imo, especially Ryu since Mario and Luigi can already Shoryuken and Lucario can Hadoken.

I completly agree, I was just stating the facts here, if I could choose anyone from Capcom regardless of importance tough, I would go with Arthur from Ghouls and Ghosts.

 

[BluePikmin11]

why is morbid liking everything again?

He likes good statements I'm guessing.

 

[Xhampi]

Zelda already has five, you seem to be forgetting that our community considers Zelda and Sheik two separate characters, and if you count DK, Wario, and Yoshi (all originated on a Mario game) then Mario has seven.

Then Pokemon have 6 since Sakurai count every transformations as separate characters including the pokemons of the Pokemon Trainer.

 

[Bajef8]

Not to be a buzzkill Noah, but Sakurai also said that these factors, including what's the hot ticket, are how he determines the Pokemon
-How are they unique?
-How do they fit in with the rest of the game?
-What do they have? (Not sure what is meant by that, probably just a bad translation, however, I assume it means what can they bring to the Smash table as a whole)

 

[Reznor]

why is morbid liking everything again?

its what he does

 

[Morbi]

OK heres a poll: If only one of them had to make it, who would you choose?
Lucario or Mewtwo?

Lucario. I have more fun playing him. Not to mention Lucario's Mega Evolution > Mewtwo Y/X.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

My guess is that we will get a roster in the early fifties (transformation included). At worst case scenario, we will see at least forty-five characters (again, transformation included).

So anywhere between 45 to 58 is possible, but I'm betting more from 48 to 53.I'd love to see Paper Mario show up in Smash, but I particularly want to see more Paper Mario representation. Loved the first three games and would be all for giving the game more contents even if Paper Mario fails to become playable.I think people will once and for all realize just how little recentness matter. Should that day come, it will be glorious. Recentness is the pre-Brawl equivalent of the female supporters except without the supporters drenching us in fetish.Because Pac-Man is going to get in. Remember that leak back a few months ago? Well it's true and will prove to be true eventually. So yeah, unless we get four third-parties, Snake isn't coming back.

Leaks don't mean ****. Pac-Man is not confirmed because some random person on the internet said so. I honestly doubt Pac-Man would get in over Snake anyway.

 

[deadjames]

OK heres a poll: If only one of them had to make it, who would you choose?
Lucario or Mewtwo?

Lucario because I think he's cooler than Mewtwo and I like 4th gen more than 1st.

 

[jaytalks]

OK heres a poll: If only one of them had to make it, who would you choose?
Lucario or Mewtwo?

Mega Mewtwo. When pokemon Z comes out, I can't wait to see his true form!

 

[BluePikmin11]

The random person also guessed WFT, which none of us saw coming.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Thank you for explaining that clear and concise. The main thing I want to point out is that you are correct. Jigglypuff has lost relevancy in recent years, but he is VERY important to Smash. We aren't debating whether or not Jigglypuff will be on the front cover of X and Y because she is a Fairy type. She is important after 13 and a half years of being in the franchise (Smash). So I think it would be fair to say that Lucario is the lowest priority. Not only is he COMMONLY associated as someone who replaced Mewtwo, but his new Mega Evolution gives him just as much relevancy as Jiggs getting Fairy type. They are the same thing. When we examine it from the Smash lens, Jigglypuff is way more important. Mewtwo and Pikachu are given, Pokemon Trainer has Charizard and he represents Pokemon as a whole.

Lucario was just a cool 4th gen Pokemon. He hasn't really been popular in recent years either. At least compared to Charizard/Mewtwo/Pikachu.

But, more than Jiggs

 

[Starcutter]

The random person also guessed WFT, which none of us saw coming.

maybe he was just really into fitness games?

 

[N3ON]

thought it was because there isn't much to talk about so we just arguing about every thing to pass the time (things will get way better when/if we get some new game mechanics to talk about)

If you think there isn't much to talk about now, you should've been around for the two years prior to the trailer.
At least we're getting constant updates now, for Brawl there was nearly a half year gap between the initial trailer and Fox, and then another half-year gap between that and the DOJO's daily updates.

 

[Morbi]

Not to be a buzzkill Noah, but Sakurai also said that these factors, including what's the hot ticket, are how he determines the Pokemon
-How are they unique?
-How do they fit in with the rest of the game?
-What do they have? (Not sure what is meant by that, probably just a bad translation, however, I assume it means what can they bring to the Smash table as a whole)

If I had to guess, being part of the game for 13 and a half years might just meet that criteria.

Lets also be realistic. One of the easiest to develop characters that is ALSO part of the original 12? Common sense.

 

[TwentyTwo]

While Sakurai hasn't specifically said he prioritizes original members. It's hard to argue against the fact that they have made it through three games, and cutting them in the fourth seems a bit farfetch'd(pun intended). Seeing as other characters that have gotten cut had an appearance in one game and were gone the next. (In reference to the jigglypuff argument).

 

[Xhampi]

lolno... Sakurai already said he isn't adding characters from fighting games to Smash.

He did ? I didn't know that, thanks for the info =)

 

[Reznor]

At least we're getting constant updates now, after Brawl there was nearly a half year gap between the initial trailer and Fox, and then another half-year gap between that and the DOJO's daily updates.

true I guess there is more to talk about than I thought

 

[BluePikmin11]

maybe he was just really into fitness games?

The list he got was from an unknown source who supposedly got the leak list.

 

[Bajef8]

Zelda already has five, you seem to be forgetting that our community considers Zelda and Sheik two separate characters, and if you count DK, Wario, and Yoshi (all originated on a Mario game) then Mario has seven.

Mario originated from DK thus meaning any Mario related series' characters are, by extension, part of the DK series, so I like to think the DK series had 8 reps in Brawl

 

[Morbi]

While Sakurai hasn't specifically said he prioritizes original members. It's hard to argue against the fact that they have made it through three games, and cutting them in the fourth seems a bit farfetch'd(pun intended). Seeing as other characters that have gotten cut had an appearance in one game and were gone the next. (In reference to the jigglypuff argument).

This.

Cutting Jiggs during Melee? No one would have noticed (aside from about 1/12 of the player base that is).

Cutting Jiggs during Brawl? A little weird, maybe unnecessary... but called for.

Cutting Jiggs during Smash 4? A detriment to the game. Extremely awkward. Not to mention she would probably be the ONLY member of the original 12 to go.

 

[Pacack]

Just to criticize your first point. There is no evidence to suggest that Sakurai will give the same priority to the same characters this time around. Two notions come to mind. One, he stated that cuts are inevitable. So Pokemon Trainer is obviously a very easy candidate based on the fact that he is difficult to develop. From a developers perspective, would you cut a character that is SUPER easy to develop and that you have developed 3 times before (once last minute) or would you cut the Pokemon that takes up 3 characters? I know that Sakurai wants Pokemon Trainer in the game. However, I doubt Sakurai wants to cut 3 or 4 individual characters before he cuts a gimmicky one that is difficult to develop.

Sakurai sent two different messages. One was that Jigglypuff WAS low priority in Brawl. The other was that Jigglypuff was important enough to put in the game regardless. His act of putting Jigglypuff in, when he probably should have cut her, is enough to interpret that Jigglypuff is indeed safe. She DID make it. The circumstances are irrelevant.

I agree with this 110% It's just not worth it to develop a single character over three others (and we could easily have another Pokemon rep if we really want 5). I've tried to make a diverse roster and just can't justify cutting three others when I can cut Pokemon Trainer (Wolf/Falco, Lucas, Ike instead of just Pokemon Trainer).

 

[deadjames]

What do you all think about Magnus from Kid Icarus and Ado from Kirby making it into Smash 4?

 

[Espio264]

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

 

[N3ON]

What do you all think about Magnus from Kid Icarus and Ado from Kirby making it into Smash 4?

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

No.

 

[MargnetMan23]

OK heres a poll: If only one of them had to make it, who would you choose?
Lucario or Mewtwo?

Mewtwo, easily. EASILY.

 

[Reznor]

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

I think its because Capcom is trying to kill Megaman

 

[Morbi]

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

It is possible. I kind of bought the excuse that they were tired of him and that Zero had more to offer, but you could be right.

What do you all think about Magnus from Kid Icarus and Ado from Kirby making it into Smash 4?

I used to think that Magnus had a good fighting chance, but then I remembered... Palutena.

 

[deadjames]

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

I had heard that it was because they felt like he didn't fit well in a traditional fighting game since he uses primarily projectile weapons, and that Zero was essentially his replacement.

Mario originated from DK thus meaning any Mario related series' characters are, by extension, part of the DK series, so I like to think the DK series had 8 reps in Brawl

Mario was the protagonist in the original Donkey Kong, thus making it a Mario game

 

[Starcutter]

The list he got was from an unknown source who supposedly got the leak list.

maybe the unknown source really liked fitness games?

 

[Xhampi]

Magnus should just hand over his sword to Ganondorf.

 

[Bajef8]

If I had to guess, being part of the game for 13 and a half years might just meet that criteria.

Lets also be realistic. One of the easiest to develop characters that is ALSO part of the original 12? Common sense.

Exactamundo. People seem to gloss over "the facts" if you will, and pick out the ones they want. Sakurai has said he doesn't favor cuts. I highly doubt he will cut a perfect attendee to all of the games, seeing as "the facts" dictate that she kinda does fit in with the Smash universe. Ya know, since she's kinda been there since its inception.

Smash relevancy probably has a bit more weight than Pokemon relevancy since this is kinda the new Smash game, not the next Pokemon game. Kinda makes sense that a character's own relevancy to a game we are arguing about (Smash) might factor in a bit more than said character's relevancy in a game we aren't arguing about (Pokmon). But that's just me I guess.

But whatever, it's all up in the air til he posts her on the site (or not).

 

[jaytalks]

Here's a Capcom related question:

Do any of you think that Megaman wasn't included in the latest Marvel Vs. Capcom game because he had already been planned for Smash 4?

Completely different company and process. Zero was picked over Mega Man though.

I had heard that it was because they felt like he didn't fit well in a traditional fighting game since he uses primarily projectile weapons, and that Zero was essentially his replacement.


Mario was the protagonist in the original Donkey Kong, thus making it a Mario game

That doesn't make sense about fitting in the fighting game think. He already was in 1 and 2. Zero replacing has been confirmed; more specifically Zero was chosen over him.

 

[Deleted member]

I think its because Capcom is trying to kill Megaman

That doesn't make sense considering that Capcom allowed Mega Man to be in Smash in the first place. Putting Mega Man as a playable character in the biggest fighting game cross-over in history is massive exposure for him and will draw a lot of attention towards him. If Capcom wanted to kill Mega Man, he would not be in Smash.

 

[deadjames]

Completely different company and process. Zero was picked over Mega Man though.

That doesn't make sense about fitting in the fighting game think. He already was in 1 and 2. Zero replacing has been confirmed; more specifically Zero was chosen over him.

I know he was in the first two, but I guess they just felt like he didn't work very well in either of them, which is why they chose Zero over him, and let's be honest Zero is definitely one of the best characters in the game.

 

[ChronoBound]

I absolutely did not read any of the walls of text on this page. But I assume its a slapfight over which Pokemon veterans will out-prioritize whom.

What's the point of arguing it, when Sakurai is probably going to try his best to get all the Brawl Pokemon veterans (plus Mewtwo) back for Smash 4?

The fact that we had a relatively expendable character confirmed today so early on, and the fact that all of these Pokemon veterans have something to claim to them in tying in with X/Y shows that people need to get over that Sakurai is NOT going to cut Lucario or Jigglypuff simply on a whim.

Sakurai will try his best to bring in Pokemon's Brawl veterans with Mewtwo.

 

[SuperBrawler]

I'm bored, hey guys, what's up.

 

[Morbi]

Exactamundo. People seem to gloss over "the facts" if you will, and pick out the ones they want. Sakurai has said he doesn't favor cuts. I highly doubt he will cut a perfect attendee to all of the games, seeing as "the facts" dictate that she kinda does fit in with the Smash universe. Ya know, since she's kinda been there since its inception.

Smash relevancy probably has a bit more weight than Pokemon relevancy since this is kinda the new Smash game, not the next Pokemon game. Kinda makes sense that a character's own relevancy to a game we are arguing about (Smash) might factor in a bit more than said character's relevancy in a game we aren't arguing about (Pokmon). But that's just me I guess.

But whatever, it's all up in the air til he posts her on the site (or not).

That is all I am arguing. Haha.

Anyways... I have a prediction. Jigglypuff will be on the Smash site in October, probably late October. It will correlate with Halloween. Why you ask? Jigglypuff is the only character in Smash (aside from Pichu and maybe kind of sort of Wario) that doesn't do pallet swaps. Nope. She always dresses up for her different costumes. Meaning... that the October reveal will be Jigglypuff. You cannot deny the facts.

 

[Bajef8]

Mario was the protagonist in the original Donkey Kong, thus making it a Mario game

Well if you wanna be nit-picky, It's a Jumpman game, seeing as he didn't have the name Mario then. Then again the game is called Donkey Kong. 8 DK reps or 8 Jumpman reps, whichever you prefer

 

[Morbi]

Well if you wanna be nit-picky, It's a Jumpman game, seeing as he didn't have the name Mario then. Then again the game is called Donkey Kong. 8 DK reps or 8 Jumpman reps, whichever you prefer

I think he was just joking about how Mario consumes anything and everything Nintendo.

 

[Hotfeet444]

Bull ****. You have nothing to prove that these WILL be the 4 most important ones. Like I said Lucario is Gen 4 and more popular than Jigglypuff so I can just as well say that Jigglypuff will not get in over Lucario. There is no statement from him that Smash 64 Veterans have any special treatment so her being Smash 64 in no way guarantees her a spot.

Considering they're the most important to both Pokemon and Smash Bros on an even level, yes I can. The only reason you're denying that because, to you, all Gen 1 = Sin against humanity.

Because half-***** IGN charts totally affect Sakurai and Pokemon's opinion of who is more popular and important to them. Maybe we should take into consideration what Sakurai and Pokemon think is more important and what they want to represent. We only know one thing and it's that he wants the hottest Pokemon. Lucario & Mewtwo are hot Pokemon, not Jigglypuff, so this statement contradicts your theory of "Veterans are immune regardless of bull**** expenses". I also don't see any charts where Squirtle, Ivysaur, and Jigglypuff are more popular than Lucario or Mewtwo. So than technically the Starter trio is behind Lucario. Where are these charts you speak of anyway? How many people knew about and took part in it? Do their opinions not count because they didn't vote? Are these charts about who we like more or who is more well known? How many charts were made? Where are the links to said charts?

Who said IGN? I said polls in general, both American and Japanese Mewtwo is always near the top. And you ask me for proof? Let me pull a you and give it never.

Also you shouldn't say "No, didn't think so." A: It adds to your attitude. B: You're assumption that I can type a full response to your comment AS you are typing it is unrealistic. You should wait until your response is posted and give me more than 0 seconds to respond to it accordingly.

Well, it's okay, I could never measure up to your arrogance, but at least I tried. :3

Where do you get off acting like you KNOW how Sakurai establishes priority? The way he does that is inconceivable and the Brawl roster shows that. Mewtwo already had more than Lucario last time and he has more than Lucario this time. So what? You acting like you know Mewtwo would be prioritized over Lucario is ridiculous and you're doing this based off the assumption that Sakurai cares only things you mention. Being more iconic doesn't always get you in over somebody. The line between Mewtwo's popularity and Lucario's is not as big as you make it out to be. You're saying he would just throw Lucario in the trash can because Mewtwo is more iconic/popular by an insignificantly small percentage.

I never even said anything about how Sakurai establishes priority, where are you pulling this out of?! And yes, I know Mewtwo will be prioritized over Lucario. And no, I'm not judging it because of Sakurai's views, I'm judging it based on the Pokemon series as it is right now, where Mewtwo is the big thing. And also, insignificantly small percentage?!

Yeah, it would be, Hotfeet. That's one of the biggest reasons why cutting Lucario is unreasonable and illogical. I can't honestly believe you think the backlash would be any less.

I KNOW it would be less since more people care about Mewtwo than Lucario, and that's for both sides of the world.

It's called earth. Come on over there's plenty of room! (seriously though, you're seriously trying to tell me Jiggs being a veteran makes her more important than Lucario? What happened to your iconic/relevant ideas earlier? Did they just vanish into thin air or are you changing the rules for whatever characters you choose again?

Again with the smartass comments, then again, it's you. Jiggs is important to Smash Bros, whether or not you want to accept that that means anything is up to you, but it does.

The fact that their are 6 generations of over 600 Pokemon and you pick only 6 from one. Also bad representation if you cut Lucario. Just like cutting Mewtwo was bad representation.

It's not bad representation if the four pokemon represent the franchise as a whole, you're just butthurt that there's a possibility that there may be only Gen 1 Pokemon this time around, that or you can't just stand the sight of Lucario going since you talked about it so much.

You mean like Lucario?

You mean like Lucario represents nothing that can't be represented by other Pokemon with more importance to Smash Bros?

I'M contradicting MY statements? Maybe you are reading this wrong. I think Jiggs is low priority because she serves little importance to Pokemon as of now. Dopes thought that Toon Link was low priority because he was a clone and another link when in actuality he serves great importance to the series. You could argue Jiggs is fairy, but it'd be no better than dissing Toon Link for being clone.

Of course, it's always the other person's fault, never yours. The fact is that Toon Link was thought of as low priority and the main character for the chopping block, and yet here he is, the fourth veteran revealed. Who's to say Jigglypuff isn't the same? Who's to say that Jigglypuff isn't higher priority? You're basically saying that Lucario is higher than Jigglypuff because she was low priority in Brawl, and you have nothing else to go off of other than that, which was broken by Toon Link's reveal.

I'm loling right now!

How mature of you.

Lol, because being a new type overshadows ALL popularity doesn't it! He has a Mega Form and Jigglyuff doesn't. Guess he overshadows Jigglypuff.

The smartass is strong with this one.

• His own movie based off of him
• Several appearances in the anime (over 7 appearances, that's more than Mewtwo, don't forget the mangas as well)
• Super Smash Brothers Brawl
• Got his own Mega Form
• Almost every trailer for X & Y
• The cover of Pokemon Rumble along with Mewtwo, Zoroark, and Genesect.
• There is official Artwork of Mewtwo & Lucario in Mega Forms duking out! Yeah, Mewtwo and Lucario's popularity are definitely not even close . I'm sure this has nothing to do with how Pokemon feels about them being present in SSB4 together too.
• Riolu's role in Pokemon Mystery Dungeon (Yes, I'm counting that)

I said THIS GENERATION AND LAST GENERATION. And no, his popularity isn't close to Mewtwo's, go check polls for yourself and just watch how wrong you are. PS: STOP WITH THE IMAGES, we don't care for them and they take up space. Oh, and the mangas, where Mewtwo has a much more prominent role?

Explain how his importance is less than Pokemon Trainer, because he's the main character, because Jiggs is Smash 64? What about the fact that Lucario is gen 4? That should count just as much. And aren't we going on iconicness (and apparently charts?)

He's lower than the Pokemon Trainer because A.) He's the MOST ICONIC TRAINER IN THE WHOLE SERIES. B.) He's appeared in every gen to date C.) His pokemon are the three most iconic starters D.) His pokemon are still relevant thanks to being obtainable in Gen 6 and their mega forms and E.) Pokemon Origins

Oh, cool! Sakurai sat down with you and told you that!? That's awesome! Tell me about the interview where he said he doesn't give a **** about representing another generation and that replacing a character with a previously cut character makes sense when they are only ever so slightly more popular to the point of near insignificance?

No, common sense told me that, clearly he hasn't been visiting you enough or you wouldn't have wasted time writing this paragraph. And again, near insignificance? Do you even research?

Excuse me, where is your proof that Pokemon Trainer didn't replace Pichu? Also, are you comparing the backlash of Pichu's loss to LUCARIO'S LOSS!?

Because both Pichu and Lucario were representatives of their current generation. Not to mention the Pokemon Trainer was a new idea, not directly replacing anyone, and he didn't replace Mewtwo.

Hope I'm not coming off as rude, but these are pretty biased statements.

I'd say more conceited than Rude.

In short, tone down the sarcasm, I'd prefer to actually reply to a comment, not wade through a sea of arrogant ****. All this is is you acting like you know more about what Sakurai's thinking than me, and to be honest, since you know as much as anyone else (Jack ****) it's a waste of my time.