Roster Prediction Discussion Thread

[shinhed-echi]

Bowser being re-worked makes sense because he's a slow fighter and he still has all of his specials. Tons of characters have had their basic smash attacks re worked in Melee & Brawl. And regardless semi-clones have always happened. And are you seriously trying to imply Luigi & Falco won't be semi-clones? I understand if you don't like semi-clones, but they are nowhere near deconfirmed. I wouldn't be surprised if we only have 1 new one, but you seem really sure of this.

Except I did say that characters who were upgraded to Semiclones (like Falco and Luigi) I can easily see coming back, perhaps even tweaked a bit more to be their own character. Although Luigi at this point is not even a semi clone. Nothing of what he does worked like Mario in Brawl.


And it's not just Bowser, man...
Pit has TWO Special moves reworked.
His UP+B which is now a diagonally upwards glide move (seen in the trailer), and his DOWN+B which apparently now covers both sides (seen in one of the Website picture updates).


So Bowser is NOT a "special case".
On the Website Update forum, people have come up with the conclusion that Link just got a new move too.

They are reworking EV-ERY-ONE.


...phew... I need a break right now. Gonna see if I can download Ducktales HD now, been waiting like 2 weeks for this. xD

 

[Silverjay323]

Except I did say that characters who were upgraded to Semiclones (like Falco and Luigi) I can easily see coming back, perhaps even tweaked a bit more to be their own character. Although Luigi at this point is not even a semi clone. Nothing of what he does worked like Mario in Brawl.


And it's not just Bowser, man...
Pit has TWO Special moves reworked.
His UP+B which is now a diagonally upwards glide move (seen in the trailer), and his DOWN+B which apparently now covers both sides (seen in one of the Website picture updates).


So Bowser is NOT a "special case".
On the Website Update forum, people have come up with the conclusion that Link just got a new move too.

They are reworking EV-ERY-ONE.


...phew... I need a break right now. Gonna see if I can download Ducktales HD now, been waiting like 2 weeks for this. xD

Don't forget the Guardian Orbitars!

 

[Depressed Gengar]

to add them put them in roster makers "images" folder, and use the "add new character icons" option.

Say, can you make a roster Icon for the main villain from M+L: DT?

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

So I'd like to ask a few questions to see what everyone thinks about these two subjects.

1) Let's say Sonic and Snake stay, and Megaman is the only 3rd party rep. What will this mean for future installments? Will the 3rd party roster become over saturated? Or will they just not add 3rd parties in the next installment?

2) Sonic has obviously not been revealed yet, but let's think about that third game that Sonic is going to have, exclusive to Wii U (hasn't been announced yet). Do you think that the third game is going to be Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS?

 

[shinhed-echi]

Don't forget the Guardian Orbitars!

Is that the red club thing he hits with that appears to be his new Side Special?

Because yeah, I just recalled that one. XD

 

[Glaciacott]

Is that the red club thing he hits with that appears to be his new Side Special?

Because yeah, I just recalled that one. XD

Nope, that's called the Upperdash Arm. You actually did describe the Guardian Orbitars (which seems to be the new Down B)

 

[Depressed Gengar]

So I'd like to ask a few questions to see what everyone thinks about these two subjects.

1) Let's say Sonic and Snake stay, and Megaman is the only 3rd party rep. What will this mean for future installments? Will the 3rd party roster become over saturated? Or will they just not add 3rd parties in the next installment?

2) Sonic has obviously not been revealed yet, but let's think about that third game that Sonic is going to have, exclusive to Wii U. Do you think that the third game is going to be Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS?

As for the 3rd Party thing, they might add more in future installments, just maybe one every few games.
For the Sonic one, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about.

 

[Scoliosis Jones]

As for the 3rd Party thing, they might add more in future installments, just maybe one every few games.
For the Sonic one, I'm not quite sure what you're talking about.

There is a third game that hasn't been announced yet that will feature Sonic and will be exclusive to Wii U.

 

[Silverjay323]

Is that the red club thing he hits with that appears to be his new Side Special?

Because yeah, I just recalled that one. XD

Its the Down B. You did mention it sry, I didn't notice before

 

[Thirdkoopa]

Star Fox?

Krystal as starter, tweak Wolf and Falco's specials and final smashes, make them both unlockable and Wolf have a bigger role in the story. There. You're done. You've pleased everyone except the ADD People who go "Oh no Krystal suckz" or "falco and wolves aren't that important, slippy for Smash!" or "mah overrepresenting" because I don't care. Xbox, go home.

And no, Andross does not need to have himself as a full character. It ruins the point of the character considering that when he became unable to walk, that was far before Star Fox canonically.

 

[Curious Villager]

The only third party newcomer character I currently care about is Professor Layton, if he isn't added. I'd be just content with Megaman, Snake and Sonic I guess. :/ Well I guess there are the likes of Bomberman and Rayman as well but yeah... Just Professor Layton for now is enough...

 

[FlareHabanero]

Fire Emblem may get 3 reps time around, but the Marth/Ike/Roy combination everyone suggests isn't exactly diverse, and brings no newcomers to the franchise, another reason I'm a Chrom supporter.

Oh yes, because Chrom is so incredibly diverse that it's going to fix everything.

 

[Silverjay323]

So I'd like to ask a few questions to see what everyone thinks about these two subjects.

1) Let's say Sonic and Snake stay, and Megaman is the only 3rd party rep. What will this mean for future installments? Will the 3rd party roster become over saturated? Or will they just not add 3rd parties in the next installment?

2) Sonic has obviously not been revealed yet, but let's think about that third game that Sonic is going to have, exclusive to Wii U (hasn't been announced yet). Do you think that the third game is going to be Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS?

I think only important 3rd parties should be in, and we already have 2 good ones (Sonic and Megaman) and I wouldn't mind snake being replaced in favor of Simon Belmont, and we might only get 1-2 new 3rd parties with perhaps 2 more installments.

The third exclusive is not Smash brothers. A developer from Sumo(responsible for SASAR and SASART) mentioned it being another Mario crossover, mentioning that he wondered who would win in a kart race.

Oh yes, because Chrom is so incredibly diverse that it's going to fix everything.

I know you don't like Chrom, but he could bring alot to Smash along with Lyn. Did anyone think Ike was bringing anything new beforehand?

 

[Depressed Gengar]

No changes to Fox, change Falco to a starter, maybe de-clone him a bit (definitely a new FS), and leave Wolf as an unlockable and give him a new FS.
THAT'S what the SF roster should be.

 

[Thirdkoopa]

No changes to Fox, change Falco to a starter, maybe de-clone him a bit (definitely a new FS), and leave Wolf as an unlockable and give him a new FS.
THAT'S what the SF roster should be.

^ Exhibit A

Though, not having Krystal is probably the easiest chop you could do to mine if any. What's funny though is the part that annoys me the most is not changing the specials.

Oh yes, because Chrom is so incredibly diverse that it's going to fix everything.

Honestly, unless there's changes, if we get Ike/Marth/Chrom or Ike/Marth/Roy, I see it being pretty bland either way. Chrom will replicate Ike, Roy will replicate Marth. Pick your poison.

I know you don't like Chrom, but he could bring alot to Smash along with Lyn. Did anyone think Ike was bringing anything new beforehand?

...

IKE IS THE LORD IN FE THAT HAS THE MOST MOVES (I won't say more original because that's debatable, also what I said might be arguable because I haven't played/seen most of the games asides from Awakening in a while, but they had stuff to work with at least. Nobody thought he was gonna be a clone.)

XBOX, GO HOME

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Special moves don't make the character.

Yes, we all know that. I mentioned he has different smash attacks and the same specials, nowhere did I mention one was more important than the other. You could take that advice too since you always claim "Oh, Aura Sphere is the ONLY similarity between the two." My point is nobody is getting there ENTIRE move set reworked. I don't even know how this discussion got started.

Except I did say that characters who were upgraded to Semiclones (like Falco and Luigi) I can easily see coming back, perhaps even tweaked a bit more to be their own character. Although Luigi at this point is not even a semi clone. Nothing of what he does worked like Mario in Brawl.


And it's not just Bowser, man...
Pit has TWO Special moves reworked.
His UP+B which is now a diagonally upwards glide move (seen in the trailer), and his DOWN+B which apparently now covers both sides (seen in one of the Website picture updates).


So Bowser is NOT a "special case".
On the Website Update forum, people have come up with the conclusion that Link just got a new move too.

They are reworking EV-ERY-ONE.


...phew... I need a break right now. Gonna see if I can download Ducktales HD now, been waiting like 2 weeks for this. xD

Lot's of characters are gonna get re-works, but A few/ A lot of characters does not equal "EV-ERY-ONE". And Luigi clearly still has some of Mario's moves. Can we tone down the exaggeration please?

 

[masterluigi1]

I don't see the big deal with adding a fourth star fox rep to the roster. Star Fox has always been "over represented" in smash bros and I don't think this is going to change anything.

As far as importance goes krystal definitely deserves it.

 

[TumblrFamous]

So I'd like to ask a few questions to see what everyone thinks about these two subjects.

1) Let's say Sonic and Snake stay, and Megaman is the only 3rd party rep. What will this mean for future installments? Will the 3rd party roster become over saturated? Or will they just not add 3rd parties in the next installment?

2) Sonic has obviously not been revealed yet, but let's think about that third game that Sonic is going to have, exclusive to Wii U (hasn't been announced yet). Do you think that the third game is going to be Smash Bros. Wii U/3DS?

1. I think for the future, if its just those three, we'll get a Namco and a square Rep. And that's it.

2. That's entirely possible. Maybe they'll announce it perhaps?

 

[Jaedrik]

The only third party newcomer character I currently care about is Professor Layton.

Though Level-5 has heavy ties with Sony, isn't the Layton series exclusive to Nintendo products?
I would think that they're more 2nd or 2.5th party, not 3 party.

Fire Emblem may get 3 reps time around, but the Marth/Ike/Roy combination everyone suggests isn't exactly diverse, and brings no newcomers to the franchise, another reason I'm a Chrom supporter. Marth/Lyn/Chrom is my hope. 3 Swordmen (woman?) of varying speeds, strength and tactics.

Oh yes, because Chrom is so incredibly diverse that it's going to fix everything.

Honestly, unless there's changes, if we get Ike/Marth/Chrom or Ike/Marth/Roy, I see it being pretty bland either way. Chrom will replicate Ike, Roy will replicate Marth. Pick your poison.
IKE IS THE LORD IN FE THAT HAS THE MOST MOVES (I won't say more original because that's debatable, also what I said might be arguable because I haven't played/seen most of the games asides from Awakening in a while, but they had stuff to work with at least. Nobody thought he was gonna be a clone.)

There is no question or worry of diversity if Anna would be put in, and if she turned out not to be diverse anyways, then Sakurai would have done the same with whatever 3rd FE rep came.
She has the most potential, why don't more people support her? She's even plausible, forchris'sake! There's no need for skeptic worry, our discussion has crushed all reasonable doubt time and again.

 

[zauberdragon]

Star Fox, along with Kirby, falls within the box titled 'do not feed'. Rather than add another character for the sake of it, focus attention elsewhere.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

I don't see the big deal with adding a fourth star fox rep to the roster. Star Fox has always been "over represented" in smash bros and I don't think this is going to change anything.

As far as importance goes krystal definitely deserves it.

If it's already over repped then why over rep it more? Besides all the characters share a similar move set so Krystal's staff doesn't really fit in. We have all the SF characters we need.

Star Fox, along with Kirby, falls within the box titled 'do not feed'. Rather than add another character for the sake of it, focus attention elsewhere.

Baically. They both got 2 while Metroid is over here with 1 still.

 

[masterluigi1]

If it's already over repped then why over rep it more? Besides all the characters share a similar move set so Krystal's staff doesn't really fit in. We have all the SF characters we need.

I'm saying that star fox has always been "over repped" so it's likely to fall into that same pattern again.

so you're really arguing that the fact that her move set would be more unique would make her less likely?

don't you want more diversity within the starfox series?

 

[Curious Villager]

Though Level-5 has heavy ties with Sony, isn't the Layton series exclusive to Nintendo products?
I would think that they're more 2nd or 2.5th party, not 3 party.

Well Professor Layton and Inazuma Eleven are both games from Level-5 who have largely stuck around with Nintendo so far I know at least. Though there are a couple of spin off games on the IOS, the main games have always stayed on Nintendo consoles. But since Level-5 is a third party company, this means that the Professor Layton series is thus a third party franchise. And not a second or second and a half party franchise. (as much as I hate to admit it)

 

[Gingerbread Man]

Yeah I have to agree. I'm not sure there's much of a need to give star fox or kirby any more characters other than for the pure sake of boosting them to a series with 4 reps.
Krystal is debatable but how many times can you fit the same star fox formula into a character?

There is no question or worry of diversity if Anna would be put in, and if she turned out not to be diverse anyways, then Sakurai would have done the same with whatever 3rd FE rep came.
She has the most potential, why don't more people support her? She's even plausible, forchris'sake! There's no need for skeptic worry, our discussion has crushed all reasonable doubt time and again.

Except anna has never been a main character. Main characters typically get have priority.

 

[Jaedrik]

Well Professor Layton and Inazuma Eleven are both games from Level-5 who have largely stuck around with Nintendo so far I know at least. Though there are a couple of spin off games on the IOS, the main games have always stayed on Nintendo consoles. But since Level-5 is a third party company, this means that the Professor Layton series is thus a third party franchise. And not a second or second and a half party franchise. (as much as I hate to admit it)

Well ****, guess I better lower him on my priority list for the ideal roster.

Except Anna has never been a main character. Main characters typically get have priority.

In the Fire Emblem series this has been true for every example we've seen, but with only one preceding sample from the control, and with similar-ish series like Pokemon putting in merely 'iconic' characters like Pikachu (though I acknowledge the comparison is weak, Fire Emblem being wholly unique), it is a very weak 'typical'. *Shrugs* Who is to say 'story' is the single most important factor to Sakurai when considering Fire Emblem reps? No one besides Sakurai knows, and Anna certainly is important in a hell of a lot of other ways.

 

[masterluigi1]

The reason why Star Fox has ALWAYS BEEN "over repped" is because there are more characters within that series that FIT INTO smash bros than MANY other bigger series.

why does a bigger series like metroid only have 1 rep?

because there are not many characters within that series that fit into smash.

and sakurai doesn't simply want to limit the roster from potential unique fighters from other less important series (like star fox) simply because metroid doesn't have enough characters that fit ino the smash universe.

 

[Jak_spoon]

sorry i know this is random, if pacman isnt announced during the release of his game would you all say its safe to say hes out of the running?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

The reason why Star Fox has ALWAYS BEEN "over repped" is because there are more characters within that series that FIT INTO smash bros than MANY other bigger series.

why does a bigger series like metroid only have 1 rep?

because there are not many characters within that series that fit into smash.

and sakurai doesn't simply want to limit the roster from potential unique fighters from other less important series (like star fox) simply because metroid doesn't have enough characters that fit ino the smash universe.

I don't think Star Fox is over repped, if you gave it 4 then it would be. Also Krystal's Staff is rather outdated and something she never uses anymore, Sakurai doesn't seem to give Star Fox Adventures a lot of love. I think most people (including myself) want her because she's hot.

 

[AEMehr]

Yes, we all know that. I mentioned he has different smash attacks and the same specials, nowhere did I mention one was more important than the other.

You didn't say that though, you just said that it made sense that he was getting reworked because he was slow and that he has the same specials.

You could take that advice too since you always claim "Oh, Aura Sphere is the ONLY similarity between the two."

Wait what? That really is the main similarity between Mewtwo and Lucario. I don't see why that has any relation to Bowser's moveset being overhauled, but okay I guess?

My point is nobody is getting there ENTIRE move set reworked. I don't even know how this discussion got started.

What makes you so sure? Bowser appears to have a large amount of his normals changed. You can't claim that there won't be movesets that will be completely overhauled without us actually seeing if that will be the case or not.


(technically everyone gets reworked anyways because the characters are remade from the ground up)
(and no I don't think everybody is getting any real big changes but I would imagine that there will be some changes for the majority of the characters, but nothing drastic like Bowser except for maybe Ganondorf)

 

[zauberdragon]

The reason why Star Fox has ALWAYS BEEN "over repped" is because there are more characters within that series that FIT INTO smash bros than MANY other bigger series.

why does a bigger series like metroid only have 1 rep?

because there are not many characters within that series that fit into smash.

and sakurai doesn't simply want to limit the roster from potential unique fighters from other less important series (like star fox) simply because metroid doesn't have enough characters that fit ino the smash universe.

Metroid has two reps, granted both the same character but they are considered different.

Metroid also has fewer personalities than Star Fox. Outside Samus the only recurring characters are the bosses. Ridley has been considered in the past but left out due to technical limitations. Ridley will likely be in the new game taking the total reps to three, same as Star Fox.

Star Fox has the two main protagonists and the main rival repped. Krystal is the sometime love interest of the main character who has appeared in considerably less, and might I add less well received games (I'm actually one of the few who liked Adventures though so I'm being honest not bias).

And if I might consider the adding unique characters point, which is fair, surely it would be easier to add characters from new or under-repped series rather than bloat an existing one. Sakurai has said many times he wishes to keep the franchises relatively balanced and four Star Fox's is too much.

 

[TheLastJinjo]

You can't claim that there aren't movesets that will be completely overhauled without us actually seeing if that will be the case or not.

Of course I can't prove his specials WON'T be overhauled, but I can tell you his specials have not been re-worked so far and I see no reason for them to be. There's more to a character than their basics

 

[Curious Villager]

Well ****, guess I better lower him on my priority list for the ideal roster.

Well on the bright side, he was requested to both Sakurai and Akihiro Hino (creator of the Professor Layton series) at the same time during a talk show and Hino commented that it would be a wonderful opportunity to have him in smash. So at least there is interest as well as Sakurai's awareness. So I wouldn't say that he is that much out of the realm of possibility. But it's there. I think what Layton needs is more demand, that's why I have been thinking of starting a petition but I'm not sure how far those things can go... or if they are even effective if at all... :/

 

[Rebellious Treecko]

I am curious if there is anyone in this thread that personally wants to see Roy return. It seems nearly all of the new posters are Chrom guys.

However, perhaps its people posting what they see as "likely" as opposed to what they actually want.

Well, it is a prediction thread after all, not a wishlist thread.

I want to see Roy return (and the rest of the removed Melee fighters), but I'm not sure if any of those characters will return.

Mewtwo and Roy certainly have the best chances of returning, though. The were pretty popular on the polls in Japan and the West if I recall.

----

 

[Jaedrik]

To say Sakurai bases his choices on reps based on story influence is wrong, Sakurai HAS said, however, that he looks for 'story-driven' characters, which can be reasonably interpreted as being driven by their story, i.e., their personality (which Sakurai imagines and injects into the characterless characters, see, R.O.B. and G&W and how they act in SSE), and we've also seen him say if HE thinks they can work in Smash (as in he can devise a moveset for them or likes them) then he'll put 'em in. There's certainly no real barrier for Anna that we know of for certain, only those manufactured by her detractors. (<- bold claim)

 

[Bowserlick]

I agree four Star Fox reps are too much. Even three (with their specials similar) is too much.

Change Wolf's specials or don't bother with him. And don't add another FE if his specials are going to involve a counter and a chargeable B move stab.

 

[AEMehr]

There's more to a character than their basics

Other than the fact that it takes up a good majority of their moveset and the fact that those are the moves you will be using more than half the time.

Nothing really "special" about those moves, right?

 

[TheLastJinjo]

Other than the fact that it takes up a good majority of their moveset and the fact that those are the moves you will be using more than half the time.

Nothing really "special" about those moves, right?

Implying I said they weren't important??? The point is that your smash attacks aren't the only attacks you have or that matter.

 

[ChronoBound]

Donkey Kong > Fire Emblem > Kirby > Star Fox

Basically the order I would like to see in terms of which series I think should have four playable characters.

 

[IsmaR]

Roster Prediction Discussion, Go Home.

 

[TheBakonBitz]

My original idea was to give Falco his move set back from melee, and make him more aerial based, change wolf's specials, and give Fox Krystal's staff. In this way we have three different, diverse, and important reps, while keeping Star Fox limited to three. But Sakurai is slowly crushing my dreams with these daily updates.