Roster Discussion Thread (Closed)

[Deleted member]

Having Paper Mario move like a G&W character is an insult to anyone who's played Paper Mario, pure and simple.

It's possible? Yes. It's good? Hell no.

By that logic, we can have Pikachu as an alt for Ganondorf!

Is it possible? Yes. Is it good? Just look at the damn image to see how "good" it is.

I'm pretty sure that Pikadorf/Manchu, having the memetic status he does within the Brawl community, would be seen as an unexpected yet hilarious gag as a Ganondorf alt.

 

[FlareHabanero]

@ChronoBound: I think Habanero was referring to Xenoblade outselling Dark Dawn in North America. However, it still doesn't change the fact that Golden Sun and Golden Sun: The Lost Age outsold Xenoblade in North America.

No, I was referring to how it's selling patterns were like Golden Sun. As in, it sold okay in Japan but sold better in other regions. Basically a case of Germans Love David Hasselhoff in terms of numbers.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Takamaru vs Sheriff would be the REAL East vs West (you know, that rumor from the Namco employee (which is pretty much false anyways))

Why would it be Little Mac? Even though he would be in the game.

Takamaru and Sheriff could fit that bill and both are retros.

Eastern Samurai from Feudal Japan and a Western Cowboy from the Old West

One is just a popularity character, the other practically represents Nintendo's jump into arcades

 

[SmashShadow]

For one thing, Sakurai is not gonna put in guns.

 

[FlareHabanero]

For one thing, Sakurai is not gonna put in guns.

Oh sure, laser guns are fine but traditional guns are a sin against humanity.

Double standards man...

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

For one thing, Sakurai is not gonna put in guns.

Could make it a pop gun

 

[Big-Cat]

I'm pretty sure that Pikadorf/Manchu, having the memetic status he does within the Brawl community, would be seen as an unexpected yet hilarious gag as a Ganondorf alt.

Seeing memes referenced WOULD be nice so long as it's not overdone. While we're at it, we need a Capt. Falco alt.

For one thing, Sakurai is not gonna put in guns.

That might change in the next game. It depends on a few things: sound effect and hit animation. I think we only got Snake's DThrow as they opted for a Sleeper Hold as oppossed to breaking necks. Then again, Ibuki has been doing that in Street Fighter for over ten years, but it's so quick that you really can't tell and that's rated T. A proper combination of sound effects and hit animations should be able to make an acceptable version of gun shooting.

Of course, guns are now the hot topic next to hating Congress and Obama as usual so it'll be really divisive. I couldn't tell you how many Facebook posts I see about guns.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

The Fire Emblem roster will always cause controversy, from now until the end of time.

Same thing with Zelda, Pokemon, Mario, Retros, and 3rd Parties.

 

[Deleted member]

Yes, Kuma.
Falco Punch is where it's at.
EDIT: On the neck breaking issue, Snake already does that in his pummel.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

FE has to yet be represented properly in Smash as well. Smash never told me that FE was about strategy, lots of quirky characters and archetypes and very medieval setting (and thus I never really felt getting into it until last year). If anything Castle Siege seems to be only thing that really showcases the recurring settings in the series.

Hoping they do it properly this time.

Yuui: Please don't remind me of that, it still weakens me inside... disturbing.

 

[FlareHabanero]

As for people saying guns won't be used because Sakurai didn't want Snake to use it, well let's put it this way. Snake is a character with a lot of powerful attacks and has abnormally high weight with a lot of momentum cancelling capabilities, with the ability with pressuring the opponent with mines and grenades and has a very good DACUS to compensate for his low dash speed. Now imagine if Snake had guns with properties to say Falco's Blaster or something. Yeah... you can see why it would be a problem. It's probably the same reason why Ike doesn't throw axes. It's a game balance problem more then a controversial problem.

 

[Deleted member]

For one thing, Sakurai is not gonna put in guns.

Ho-boy, here we go again.

Bayonetta anyone?

At this point, I'd like to see her just for the sake of shutting up all the nay-sayers.

 

[Moon Monkey]

Oh sure, laser guns are fine but traditional guns are a sin against humanity.

Double standards man...

Hand Guns = Bad
Rocket Launcher = Good

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Sharla's Sniper Rifle as an item

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I think Habanero put that up in a good way. Doesn't still explain why he doesn't use knifes though as PM did put on him.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Doesn't still explain why he doesn't use knifes though as PM did put on him.

Again probably a double standard thing.

"Ike with this big ass sword is fine, but Snake slicing people with a pocket knife would scare the children!"

 

[ChronoBound]

Here's a trip back in time, from the site at May 2006:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060616050048/http://www.smashbros.com/en/characters/chara5/index.html

After much consideration, we decided to have Snake refrain from using real-world guns—instead, he'll use lots of explosives.

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

FE has to yet be represented properly in Smash as well. Smash never told me that FE was about strategy, lots of quirky characters and archetypes and very medieval setting (and thus I never really felt getting into it until last year). If anything Castle Siege seems to be only thing that really showcases the recurring settings in the series.

Hoping they do it properly this time.

Yuui: Please don't remind me of that, it still weakens me inside... disturbing.

Yes, especially in the class types.

Swords are not the only weapons used.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Chrono: Okay. Case closed. (-l^l-);

Speaking of FE, I really wish they'd give some spotlight to the Jugdral-games because they were completely overlooked in Smash Bros. I have to yet see why is this... /Sigurd kicks loads of ass Diddy, he really does./

 

[Swamp Sensei]

It's funny because in North America, Xenoblade actually sold a better like Golden Sun. However, Xenoblade was also sold exclusively in GameStop in limited quantities, which is even more impressive..

No it didn't.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Blame whoever was involved with handling the bonus content. Between the lazy recycling of models and artwork and the severe imbalance between franchises, whoever handled it that needs to be shot in the foot.

 

[Deleted member]

Here's a trip back in time, from the site at May 2006:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060616050048/http://www.smashbros.com/en/characters/chara5/index.html

After much consideration, we decided to have Snake refrain from using real-world guns—instead, he'll use lots of explosives.

It doesn't outright say it is because guns are bad, but it does seem to imply it. Also, I think this statement needs to be kept context sensitive with Nintendo's marketing strategy of the time.

However, it doesn't outright forbid the use of gunplay in Smash Bros, nor does Sakurai ever say he's against them afaik. Thus the argument that Snake didn't use guns because it would make an OP or Awkward character is fair. Look at PSABR, look at the gun users and how they play. I think it's more likely that Snake doesn't use guns due to balance issues rather than anything else. Especially since if you look at the Metal Gear canon, the series promotes the use of Stealth over Violence, and his current moveset reflects that a lot more than if he were equipped with machine guns and rifles. Instead, most of Snake's moves are underhanded and "sneaky." Sakurai as an MGS fan, I think realized this and built him around that concept instead.

Just my two cents, before someone jumps the gun and states this confirms we'll never see real guns in Smash.

 

[FlareHabanero]

No it didn't.

It's selling patterns were like Golden Sun. It sold better outside of Japan. I never said it sold better then Golden Sun, I said it sold like Golden Sun. Why can't people understand this?

 

[ChronoBound]

More of Sakurai not giving Snake realistic weapons:
#231-240: The smash Snake will not use his knife or his pistol [read: guns]. Instead, weapons like his grenade and rocket launcher are being worked on, and it is planned that he will use them. Sakurai reasons that while in Japan, using a survival knife and using a sword are very similar, it is not the same in other parts of the world. In order to allow more people to play this game [read: to not get a T for Teen rating] they will balance it for all countries. Apparently, they also had this reasoning when they created Fox's blaster.

I know at the very least Germany is very strict when it comes to weapons (and violence in general) in video games. Japan recently has tightened also about firearms in games too.

 

[---]

Here's a trip back in time, from the site at May 2006:
http://web.archive.org/web/20060616050048/http://www.smashbros.com/en/characters/chara5/index.html

After much consideration, we decided to have Snake refrain from using real-world guns—instead, he'll use lots of explosives.

Was looking for this site for a while now. Kinda nostalgic, but going through it there's not much that could be saved for later. :/

 

[DragonSniperNintendo]

Chrono: Okay. Case closed. (-l^l-);

Speaking of FE, I really wish they'd give some spotlight to the Jugdral-games because they were completely overlooked in Smash Bros. I have to yet see why is this... /Sigurd kicks loads of *** Diddy, he really does./

I think the games need to get remade and localized first.

The games are older and not many people know of them.

 

[Deleted member]

Sakurai reasons that while in Japan, using a survival knife and using a sword are very similar,

That's just ****ing dumb... Seriously, there is no other way to describe this. So what is Marth holding? A dildo?

It funny too because that whole idea of pinning videogame violence as a source of real violence has been disproven countless times with scientific studies and research in recent times. I honestly don't know what to say anymore on the whole topic...

But it is true Japan has tightened up it's laws in many areas with the recent election of PM Abe.

 

[FlareHabanero]

These double standards are only proving that people are complete morons. When I say people are morons all the time, I'm not kidding.

Is this really the planet we live on?

 

[Deleted member]

These double standards are only proving that people are complete morons. When I say people are morons all the time, I'm not kidding.

Is this really the planet we live on?

Well, not to get off topic too much but this is something I talk about with my Conversational Students all the time. 90% of the people on this planet are ignorant idiots, point and fact. Sometimes I wonder if the world would be a better place without said people...

 

[SmashShadow]

Guns and Knives are synonymous with everyday murders and gangs.
Most country's aren't constantly dealing with grenades and hostile rockets on a daily basis so they don't hit close to home like the former do.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Chrono: Sounds reasonable. I guess it means the whole Bayonetta-debate is open then.

 

[FlareHabanero]

Guns and Knives are synonymous with everyday murders and gangs.

Like slicing off the heads of people with swords is any better. Seriously, swords are not simple play things ether you know.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

Guns and Knives are synonymous with everyday murders and gangs.
Most country's aren't constantly dealing with grenades and hostile rockets on a daily basis so they don't hit close to home like the former do.

Pretty much this. As stupid as it is, this is the reason.

Heck, I know a few kids who would only use Snake, if he had knives and guns because 'he would be gansta, yo."

 

[---]

I always thought we never used guns/knives to make the game a bit more over-the-top, which in Snake's case he desperately needed to have to fit in besides just cardboard boxes. Either way it seems that it could be a bit of a hypocritical moment coming from Sakurai on this so called issue. Honestly all it takes is a little common sense during the moveset making process to know what is and what isn't appropriate for a game.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Smash Bros uses slapstick violence as the theme behind all the things you can do in the series anyway... I guess Snake wouldn't have fitted in that world as he is now until he was given bit of tweaks.

 

[SmashShadow]

Like slicing off the heads of people with swords is any better. Seriously, swords are not simple play things ether you know.

The thing is, who's going around slicing people up with swords these days? Nobody.

 

[Big-Cat]

That's just ****ing dumb... Seriously, there is no other way to describe this. So what is Marth holding? A dildo?

Just a shining example of the double standards out there. And you're right 90% of the people out there are idiots plain and simple. And to make things worse, it's the dumb ones that have the most kids typically.

But it is true Japan has tightened up it's laws in many areas with the recent election of PM Abe.

Is Abe part of the Japanese Liberal Party?

@SmashShadow
Why use a sword, when they can use a baseball bat?

 

[Smooth Criminal]

Like slicing off the heads of people with swords is any better. Seriously, swords are not simple play things ether you know.

To be fair, swords are a lot less relevant in this day and age than guns and knives. The latter is a bit more of a visceral reminder of modern conventions for violence.

Not that I'm disagreeing with you, Habanero. Or anybody that feels like it's a double standard. I agree that it's ridiculous, but there is a lot of red tape to contend with in the end. Not to mention precedents and mores and other memetic crap.

Smooth Criminal

 

[Deleted member]

Guns and Knives are synonymous with everyday murders and gangs.
Most country's aren't constantly dealing with grenades and hostile rockets on a daily basis so they don't hit close to home like the former do.

Actually, if you wanna get into Geopolitics it's more fair to argue that a large portion of the world today is indeed deadlocked in war and endless strife, in which many people do indeed see 'rocket launchers and grenades on a daily basis.' However, those people don't buy video games, and the people that do pay no attention to the suffering happening in other countries, nor do they realize that it is that precise suffering that allows the to live in wealth and peace.

I would even go as far as saying that having rocket launchers and grenades is much more insensitive to the real problems in our world today than having handguns and knives. However, the world is littered with hypocrisy and double standards, and most of the world is numb to the reality of the situation because it is far too dark for most to handle, so instead they shut their eyes and look away. But turn on the news every once in a while, read about what's happening in the world these days, and what's predicted to happen in the coming years, it's not a pretty picture.

I didn't mean to get all preachy there, and I certainly got off-topic. But the fact remains that videogames are escapism. Censoring the content you can an cannot have in a virtual space because it is insensitive to the real world is the most bull**** thing I've heard get thrown around these days. It is about as ridiculous as telling people what and what not to fantasize about. Censorship is never the answer, quite the contrary it is the antithesis of progress, shutting your eyes and refusing to accept the reality of things is not the way to solve the problem. Of course, this is something that goes beyond what developers can do, and reaches more into the territory of not only modern politics, but our stupid and fickle modern society.

 

[Swamp Sensei]

This poll man. Lot's of changes.

Ridley has really gone past K.Rool and Little Mac caught up to the crocodile monarch. Waluigi has risen past Isaac. (WHY WAAAA?!?! WHY!?!?!?!) Roy seems to be falling behind but other than that, it's pretty similar to the last update.