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Well to his credit, he did change it to 6:4.
How do customs make this MU even for Robin?
He's probably referring to Robin's speed thunder. Raziek actually has some videos of him using custom Robin against custom Rosalina in tournaments. I'm sure he will have some insights to share from both sides of the matchup.
The charge time is also fast enough to still be reliable even when being zoned with custom star bit shot. Robin will have access to more thoron and arcthunder usage and by extension, thunder tomes, which as mentioned earlier will ko early. Admittedly though, I don't know how things change if we also take into account of Luma warp, if it does change anything.
Wouldn't luma warp make it hard to charge speex thunder? Also Rosalina's floaty star bit eats a lot of projectiles how does speed thunder do vs that?
Presumably luma warp would make things more difficult although it's also possible that by using that, you leave Luma open and as it has been established around, Robin kos Luma easier compared to most character. Also, don't underestimate the charge time of speed thunder especially since you can still do it in increments and those increments are really short compared to the other variations. Unfortunately, I'm not well versed with luma warp so I can't say much more. I assume it would also depend on the stage as well.
Is that the goal with custom Robin? Charge as many thorons as possible?
Not necessarily, especially since all stages of speed thunder are useful although it might depend on both the player and the matchup. The goal of Speed Thunder is to achieve better zoning and a more consistent neutral. This isn't even just the sentiment of us Robins. Emblem Lord of the Marth boards (just placed 15th in a stacked 100+man tournament yesterday so props to him) said something similar.
Not necessarily. The other Thoron special, Thunder+ increases charge time, durability consumption and damage. It's brutally powerful, and capable of KOing under 100%. Though that's better for heavy weight slowpokes and team fights. Also, what Cardinal said.
Thunder in general (Thunder, El and Arc) will clunk most projectiles, while Thoron will eat them and keep going.
I'm not sure what EL placing has to do with the discussion I'm just curious since I haven't played the MU and don't really know how the projectiles interact with each otger.
Was talking about speed thunder not thunder+. I'm just theorycrafting though. I'm just curious as to why this MU changes so drastically because of customs. I personally don't see it.
I only mentioned EL's placing to prove that he's a player who knows what he's talking about and to bring a non-Robin main perspective to this. As far as why Chapter Serf brought up Thunder+, it's probably because you technically said custom Robin, which includes Thunder+, although perhaps the context should of made it clearer.
Thanks for the response I thought Robin's customs were a bit more useful than how you're describing them. That's good to know though thanks for the information.
Yeah, sometimes just can't keep it up.
Lololol Robin dashing ^_^.
Nice analysis.
The best that I can probably do is make links to each post that begins a new discussion period.
And why did you take customizations consider in the MU already? Like that what's the point making second MU when some character's customiztion has taken considered?
We do have to do the discussion periods a second time, because months have passed since we've started analyzing the first batch of characters. As a result, there might be some drastic changes to how those match-ups will turn out. And of course, there will be some rule changes for round 2 as well.
Alright, I be looking forward to round 2 of the analysis ; )
Robin's up B only meteors if Robin is literally right on top of the target when the projectile is launched, like, Robin's hand has to be patting the target's head for it to work. I've had my Elwinds GP'd by AI Rosas, and I've never been hit by them. It's possible that you could meteor Robin if you popped GP perfectly to defend against that tiny window in which Elwind can meteor. It would be really hard to test, though. And even then, it's not that strong of a meteor. There are stronger meteor smashes out there.
I didn't see anyone else post it, so here you go if you didn't find it yourself yet:
I imagine it does. I'm not a Robin main but if I remember correctly the first Elwind spikes and the second doesn't. So I would imagine if you GP the first Elwind and not the second and it connects with Robin while spinning around you it would spike. Even if it does it's almost an inconsequential detail though. Since Elwind has such huge vertical range I doubt Robins with stage contorl trying to spike you with Elwind get close enough that you can actually hit them with the Gravity Pulled Elwind. And if Rosalina has stage control she has way better things to do.
They can both meteor smash. It just requires the exact same window on both projectiles. And it goes without saying that you can't meteor the same person twice with the same Elwind throw.
Sadly all the Robin research thread OP has to say on the matter is, and i quote, "(can spikes?)" But if it's true it would be cool to see some proof. Pretty much every resource that gives data on Smash 4 currently goes out of it's way to say that only the first Elwind has Spike potential. If the second one can spike too someone needs to correct them.
If the Second Elwind has Spike Potential, it would require them to be the same range as the first: Right below Robin's bottom. This is impossible to test on computers, so if anything I'd be willing to attempt it with someone if they're willing to take the time out.
[55:45 - 57:43] 
Is this including customs?Robin's discussion period is now over, and as such, I've added up all the ratio inputs for the Rosalina vs. Robin match-up, to get an overall average.
