Reasons for no final smash in tournaments?

[King Of Be@st]

Soooo does anyone on these boards have a good explanation as to why there are no smash balls in tournament play? I think that banning these ruined play. Think about it, do you ban supers in MvC2? Thats basically what has happen with brawl.

 

[KillerJawz]

With Smash Balls, where they spawn and where they will fly about is completely random unless theres some kind of wind/smash on the ball. It's far to random based and luck dependent

 

[TP]

EVERYONE would pick Fox, Falco, Wolf, or Sonic. Does that sound like a better game to you?

 

[KillerJawz]

EVERYONE would pick Fox, Falco, Wolf, or Sonic. Does that sound like a better game to you?

Actually it does. Four characters are better for the metagame then one.

 

[Big-Cat]

Comparing Final Smashes to Supers/Distortion/Ultras is like comparing apples to oranges. The former come out of nowhere and are ridiculously broken. They also require you to break them open in order to be used.

The latter is accessible to everyone because the meter increases through out the fight. In other words, you're aware when you can use them and are typically much better balanced.

 

[King Of Be@st]

Comparing Final Smashes to Supers/Distortion/Ultras is like comparing apples to oranges. The former come out of nowhere and are ridiculously broken. They also require you to break them open in order to be used.

The latter is accessible to everyone because the meter increases through out the fight. In other words, you're aware when you can use them and are typically much better balanced.

Yes the smash ball randomly spawns but both player have a equal chance of breaking it and obtaining their special. And I do believe smashballs and supers are similar just with smash ball you got to hit it a few times before you get your super.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Both players most definitely do not have an equal chance of breaking a smash ball. What if it spawns right next to me? Also, who do you think is going to have a better chance of breaking a smash ball, Meta Knight or Ganondorf? Brawl is imbalanced enough, Smash Balls only make it worse.

 

[JOE!]

well, it only takes like 1 murder stomp to break the smashball...

 

[King Of Be@st]

Good point JOE meta takes mutil swipes to break and Ganon would def have enough time to get over there and do a few attacks himself to try and get it......sounds pretty fair to me....

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

MK has 5 jumps. Good luck matching that, Ganon.

Maybe Ganon was a bad example. But either way, saying that every character has an equal chance of breaking a Smash Ball is bull****.

 

[Jack Kieser]

On account of the fact that the thread has fallen off of the Brawl Tactical front page, I'll direct you to do a search for "Item Standard Play" and read that thread; it will explain all to you.

In fact, let me Google that for you.

 

[King Of Be@st]

On account of the fact that the thread has fallen off of the Brawl Tactical front page, I'll direct you to do a search for "Item Standard Play" and read that thread; it will explain all to you.

In fact, let me Google that for you.

Spam Much? Lol how long have you been waiting to use that old joke huh?

 

[UltiMario]

Falco with Smashballs on is 20 times more broken than MK would ever hope to be.

Thats why.

 

[TP]

Falco with Smashballs on is 20 times more broken than MK would ever hope to be.

Thats why.

This. Not only does he have the single best final smash in the game, but his lasers also make him one of the best characters at opening the smash ball, AND he is already a top tier character going into this.

 

[JOE!]

however, it would be rather interesting to see where characters may fall with smashballs as a factor

for example, it is EXTREMLEY easy for Charizard, Ivysaur and Yoshi to snag that thng...

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

MK can zone Ganon(or anyone else for that matter) out of the location of the Smash ball until it has been out long enough for MK's nair to break it.

The Smashball has a formula based on the time it's out and how much damage it has to determine whether it breaks.

For example, a thunderstomp won't break it instantly until it has been out for a specific amount of time.

Note that all the hits of Yoshi's dair can break it if the Smashball has been out for 2.5 seconds.

THere are certain moves that have special flags for instantly breaking it though like Snake's box. Huh.

What's unfair is that the chance of stealing the SB from someone is apparently influenced on score. TIMED MATCHES' SCORING SYSTEM, NOT STOCK. Depending on how big the difference is, it may not be possible to take the SB from the loser at all with out KOing.

On the other hand there are times where a single laser from Fox can break the SB from you when you are winning.

The pity FS system sucks hardcore.
I have a old replay somewhere proving how bad it is on deciding on who gets the pity FS.
Once again, it's based on TIME MATCHES' scoring system and NOT STOCKS, but it can't do this right.

 

[King Of Be@st]

MK can zone Ganon(or anyone else for that matter) out of the location of the Smash ball until it has been out long enough for MK's nair to break it.

The Smashball has a formula based on the time it's out and how much damage it has to determine whether it breaks.

For example, a thunderstomp won't break it instantly until it has been out for a specific amount of time.

Note that all the hits of Yoshi's dair can break it if the Smashball has been out for 2.5 seconds.

THere are certain moves that have special flags for instantly breaking it though like Snake's box. Huh.

What's unfair is that the chance of stealing the SB from someone is apparently influenced on score. TIMED MATCHES' SCORING SYSTEM, NOT STOCK. Depending on how big the difference is, it may not be possible to take the SB from the loser at all with out KOing.

On the other hand there are times where a single laser from Fox can break the SB from you when you are winning.

The pity FS system sucks hardcore.
I have a old replay somewhere proving how bad it is on deciding on who gets the pity FS.
Once again, it's based on TIME MATCHES' scoring system and NOT STOCKS, but it can't do this right.

Interesting point. I just feel the smash ball will add more depth to the game overall and how its played.

 

[OfTheEarth]

"gutter trash!"

Dudley
SFIII
yeah, and it would me marth and sheik or zelda. there is like a ranking from 1-5 on Final Smashes. 1 being worst, 2 being not too good, 3 being decent, 4 being pretty good, 5 being Balls Crazy.
example,
Marth-1: For it's easy to use and always rewarding with a KO if it.
Ike-3: It is strong, but does not always kill, and is very hard to hit with
Sonic-4:Is very good, but a little trickier to use than Marths
Yoshi-2: Hard to hit with, and have to work harder for the kill
Kirby-1: Sh*t. Hard to hit and not very rewarding at all.

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

If the FS system was better designed, it would be considered. Anyway,



On a side note, I'm surprised that so many peope underestimate Yoshi's FS.
He doesn't need to shoot fireballs at all. He can rack up a lot of damage from the flame spurts that occur about every 5 seconds if he doesn't fire a fireball. Not to mention his body has a weak hitbox that breaks dodges. Each series of spurts does up to 70% damage. It's hard to DI out of not only because the flames were designed to be hard to DI out of(Most FS are designed to be impossible to DI like Samus') but also because Yoshi can move freely while the flames are coming out.

They are as expected, unblockable.

He can do about 4 of these before time's up.

They may not KO but who cares. Once the move is over, and if you use it correctly, Yoshi's opponent will have so much damage(over 200% if ALL the flames connect)
that Yoshi can KO easily afterwards.

 

[JOE!]

i think it was poorly designed for 1v1 is all

 

[Eternal Yoshi]

Also for doubles. I'll have video proof later.

 

[¯\_S.(ツ).L.I.D._/¯]

Interesting point. I just feel the smash ball will add more depth to the game overall and how its played.

And it will upset the balance so much that the game will become completely broken.

 

[King Of Be@st]

smashballs = SSBB equalizer

 

[Zook]

smashballs = SSBB equalizer

How so? How does adding Smash Balls to the competitive scene make a character like, for example, Kirby, equal to Falco?

 

[Atomic Yoshi]

Smash Balls are banned because they are more dominant than actual fighting. You could be at 130% and end your opponents stock at 0% depending of the Final Smash. Plus, who would even want to play with cheap OHKOs that are luck based?

 

[darksamus77]

They're ridiculously overpowered and can give some characters an unfair, cheap, or lame KO. Some prime examples of FS that make Smash Balls easier to ban are C. Falcon's, Ike's, Link's, Yoshi's. They are based purely on luck, no skill necessarily required to use/kill with them

 

[HeroMystic]

Smashballs do not add depth to the tournament scene. They're just gimmicks to have characters a crowning moment of awesome.

Some food for thought: Smashballs favor the losing player. They spawn and motion towards the losing player and also takes less hits for the losing player to open. On top of that, Final Smashes are blatantly overpowered and extremely imbalanced. Sonic's is the strongest FS because he can just hover in front of you and damage you that way. Some characters gain high damage and invincibility, and others, while hard to hit with (Ike, Metaknight, Falcon) can lead to instant KOs anyway.

They also appear 30-40 seconds if they're the only item on, and that alone would drastically change the metagame. Actually, it'd create an entirely new one. Final Smashes just weren't made with balance in mind.

 

[CaptainOlimar123]

Smash Balls are banned because they are more dominant than actual fighting. You could be at 130% and end your opponents stock at 0% depending of the Final Smash. Plus, who would even want to play with cheap OHKOs that are luck based?

I agree with you.

 

[tuestresfat]

Also for doubles. I'll have video proof later.

please do :D i'm curious if anybody has actually found some amazing doubles combo with final smashes in mind. basically i want to see the chaos

 

[Met]

smashballs = SSBB equalizer

no dude what is wrong with you?
DK already not to good. FS terrible how is that equal?

 

[Kunx990]

Soooo does anyone on these boards have a good explanation as to why there are no smash balls in tournament play? I think that banning these ruined play. Think about it, do you ban supers in MvC2? Thats basically what has happen with brawl.

8/10 Troll post seeing how it lasting this long.

 

[Vyse]

The Smash Ball appears and stays near the player that is currently losing. It also takes that player fewer hits to break the Smash Ball. It also appears every 30-40 seconds if it's the only item you have on, even when items are set to low. People have already experimented with Smash Ball tournaments. It doesn't work out.

Just read that for the explanation as to why there are none on in tournaments. HeroMystic and AtomicYoshi nailed it.