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Radical's Radical Kingmaker { ASSASSINS WIN SOME RADICAL TIMES }
- Thread starter RadicalRat
- Start date
Zalak
Smash Lord
Zalak
Smash Lord
not gonna lie, this is very impressive so far. shroomed is the man.
who do you wanna investigate first, spak?
Usually I determine that from RVS, but it seems I'm the main suspect right now lol. I'd be fine with you guys continuing to question me if you have anything to go off of, but I'd like to see what Sang and Orbo think about events thus far; I haven't heard anything from them since the game started.
Yeah, but there are no votes in this game.I don't think you'll actually be modkilled fwiw. My game's punish editing posts with permanent modvotes and these rules are already kind of strict.
Zalak
Smash Lord
I just thought of something tricky about using votetrails in this setup... I think the pros of having everyone state who they wanna vote for outweigh the cons though.
You could be warned or something.
RadicalRat
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2015
- Messages
- 423
SPAK
YOUR EDITING HAS VIOLATED THE LAW
But you're king and it was a mostly harmless edit, so don't sweat it.... THIS TIME...
YOUR EDITING HAS VIOLATED THE LAW
But you're king and it was a mostly harmless edit, so don't sweat it.... THIS TIME...
SangfroidWarrior
Smash Journeyman
Sup everyone! I'm just gonna immediately give you all a heads up that I'm super busy right now in the semester but that I will post as often as I can.
Moving on, it seems like there's actually already something to comment on! Honestly, Spak, you should just stick with your gut for however you want to do this. Although I've never played a kingmaker game before, you're the king, which means you have final say in who you want to lynch and how. Voting just gives your lowly subjects some obvious say and, as people have stated before, a paper trail. Or it could give the King an out. The only... interesting aspect I see with a paper trail is that people will not be hard pressed to follow the majority vote. This could be good or bad, or even nothing at all, but it's something to think about.
That all being said, I generally like the idea of voting.
Yo, Zalak, could you elaborate on the votetrails thing? What do you think could be tricky?
Moving on, it seems like there's actually already something to comment on! Honestly, Spak, you should just stick with your gut for however you want to do this. Although I've never played a kingmaker game before, you're the king, which means you have final say in who you want to lynch and how. Voting just gives your lowly subjects some obvious say and, as people have stated before, a paper trail. Or it could give the King an out. The only... interesting aspect I see with a paper trail is that people will not be hard pressed to follow the majority vote. This could be good or bad, or even nothing at all, but it's something to think about.
That all being said, I generally like the idea of voting.
Yo, Zalak, could you elaborate on the votetrails thing? What do you think could be tricky?
Zalak
Smash Lord
YEAH, sure
I worry that when someone states who they think the baddies are, and they get it right, the assassins will want to kill them before they can become king. trying to figure out if they killed them because they were right, or if they killed them to frame the people the victim voted for would be WIFOMy. basically, it becomes easier for the assassins to kill off threats to them, unless the assassins are agreed to be bad by more than a couple of players.
Maven89
Smash Master
So you don't want people to say who they think the assassins are?
Zalak
Smash Lord
Like I said, I think the pros of everyone posting solid stances outweigh the cons. It's just a potential danger that occurred to me.
Zalak
Smash Lord
Zalak
Smash Lord
What I think we should absolutely avoid doing is throwing out fake stances to throw the kingmaker/assassins off. If the town isn't honest with itself, we'll have no one to trust.
Zalak
Smash Lord
Maven89
Smash Master
Honestly Zalak I find even talking about possibly...not talking about the assassins to be one of the scummier suggestions I've seen put into the beginning of a game. Like there's no way to play mafia without discussion
Zalak
Smash Lord
I didn't say no discussion. I only meant be vaguer, and don't make it 100% obvious who you would execute as king. Right now, I don't even think it's what we should do, but I think it's something that we might as well consider. Not discussing anything is NOT something I think we should consider.
So my question would then be, what is the problem of turning up the pressure and letting someone know they are going to be lynched by the King?
Hypothetical Situation:
If I were to be named King, I would announce 2 slots I am considering to lynch and go from there. I would have those be my nominations of discussion and things would go from there. However, nothing in mafia is ever concrete and someone could change minds.
This type of mafia is starting to make me think it is more about Charisma and Charm over other things will save you more so than naught. It only matters at the end of the day what the King thinks of your slot and then you are dandy, but that changes on a day to day bases.
I have some things I am looking out for in terms of things that will trip some red flags in my mind.
Hypothetical Situation:
If I were to be named King, I would announce 2 slots I am considering to lynch and go from there. I would have those be my nominations of discussion and things would go from there. However, nothing in mafia is ever concrete and someone could change minds.
This type of mafia is starting to make me think it is more about Charisma and Charm over other things will save you more so than naught. It only matters at the end of the day what the King thinks of your slot and then you are dandy, but that changes on a day to day bases.
I have some things I am looking out for in terms of things that will trip some red flags in my mind.
Zalak
Smash Lord
If I were king, I would have everyone go through rigorous trials until I find someone I'm confident is scum... then I'd turn up the pressure on them to see if they have any grand final defense.
HMM, I think you might be right about charisma and charm being especially effective when you only have to worry about convincing one player. I think it's really important that the villagers are give SOME kind of say in the execution. I think instead of all of us voting on who the king should execute, the king should say who they would like to execute, and we should vote on whether or not they should go through with it...
or something like that.
I don't see anything wrong with turning up the pressure on someone, but I don't think it's a good idea for a king to pick 2 people they're considering to lynch and only focus on them, unless it's late into the day. If you were to do that early on, it would make it very easy for the other players to hide in the shadows.
HMM, I think you might be right about charisma and charm being especially effective when you only have to worry about convincing one player. I think it's really important that the villagers are give SOME kind of say in the execution. I think instead of all of us voting on who the king should execute, the king should say who they would like to execute, and we should vote on whether or not they should go through with it...
or something like that.
Zalak
Smash Lord
I think we need to establish some kind of structure early on, or this is gonna be #chaotic
I feel a little PTSD from your first line of making everyone go through trials. *shiver*
Regardless, you cannot set a structure to this sort of game. That's the point of this game actually. Focus on trying to find scum rather then trying to find out a "clear-way" this game can be worked out because it will only convolute the thread. Every King will be different and every day will be different. Exciting, no?
Zalak, talk to me about your brief discussion with Maven and then Sang's post which, in turn, caused these conversations of (maven:you | J:you). What do you make of their inquiries to your position you had taken?
Regardless, you cannot set a structure to this sort of game. That's the point of this game actually. Focus on trying to find scum rather then trying to find out a "clear-way" this game can be worked out because it will only convolute the thread. Every King will be different and every day will be different. Exciting, no?
Zalak, talk to me about your brief discussion with Maven and then Sang's post which, in turn, caused these conversations of (maven:you | J:you). What do you make of their inquiries to your position you had taken?
Zalak
Smash Lord
I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, but just because the kings have free will, that doesn't mean we can't establish some kind of structure, and punish kings who break that structure.
I think Sang's inquiry is perfectly normal. I said something really vague, so of course they'd want me to elaborate.
Maven's first inquiry was fine, especially because I wasn't 100% clear about what I was suggesting. His statement about me being scummy bothered me a little bit though, mostly because in that post, he didn't actually answer my question. I also got the sense that he MIGHT be intentionally twisting my words, because I explicitly said I was talking about
I was the vague though, so I think this was most likely just a miscommunication. Also my idea is admittedly pretty out there, so criticism of it isn't scummy at all. Maven felt a little too aggressive, but that's all.
Zalak
Smash Lord
I WAS VAGUE THOUGH*********
Zalak
Smash Lord
UNLESS THE NEXT KING IS ALSO ANTI-STRUCTURE
Okay, I see what you're saying. this setup is hectic
However, he didn't say you were explicitly scummy though. You are taking that out of context. He said your suggestion was one of the scummier ones and to be frank, I agree with him that your suggestion leans more of the scummier side of thought.
Explain the aggressiveness though. Go into why you felt almost attacked by Maven? I do not see this at all nor do I see Maven being aggro towards you in any fashion.
Explain the aggressiveness though. Go into why you felt almost attacked by Maven? I do not see this at all nor do I see Maven being aggro towards you in any fashion.
Zalak
Smash Lord
I have no problem with him calling my idea scummy, but by not answering my question, he ignored my own wishes, and instead turned the discussion into one about my scummyness.
I still worry about the risks I mentioned, and I wonder if there is a way to deal with them while still having everyone post solid stances.
I was trying to get everyone's opinion about my idea, so I'm glad Maven spoke his mind. What bothered me though, is that fact that I specifically asked Maven what he thought about the risks involved with leaving vote trails, but he instead only stated what he doesn't like about the idea. To me, that feels slightly aggressive, because he is ignoring one aspect of the situation in order to make me defend myself. I don't think this is necessarily scummy though, it's just something that bothered me a little bit.I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR EVERYONE ELSE'S OPINION ON THAT THOUGH.
Maven89
What do you think of the risk I mentioned? Do you think it's that big a deal?
I still worry about the risks I mentioned, and I wonder if there is a way to deal with them while still having everyone post solid stances.
RadicalRat
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2015
- Messages
- 423
Yeah, let's make it Friday. I'll update the title.
RadicalRat
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Aug 17, 2015
- Messages
- 423
Not literal sunset. Flavor sunset.
Thursday at 11:59 PM EST will be the official deadline if you need to be super specific though.
The only problem for that is I have no basis for announcing two slots of suspicion, and the two slots I would announce would know that. Other than that, good D2-end strat.
I think J was trying to say that he would have 2 people to start the conversation and then, in his own words, "go from there".
But wouldn't that just be the same as normal Mafia with one lynch suggester?
Let me get this straight: You asked for one person's opinion (tagging and asking them directly) on someone and they responded with why they thought the idea was a bad one. You then felt offended that they stated their opinion and said it was "aggressive". He gave his honest response and you would have accused him of question dodging if he didn't answer the question.
FoS: Zalak
*Something
Zalak
Smash Lord
I'm just trying to think of a way to give the villagers more of a voice. I worry about what might happen when the scum players only need to convince the king of their innocence to survive. I guess I just have to have faith in our kings.
J asked me what I thought about Maven's inquiry, so I stated the problems I had with it. I never said it was scummy that he didn't like my idea. That's perfectly normal. What I didn't like was the possibility that he was intentionally twisting my words (not very worried about that, cuz I wasn't very clear about what I was suggesting), and the fact that he ignored one of my questions. I'm not saying Maven is scum because he ignored a question, but that's a small problem I had with his inquiry. I WAS ASKED, so I told.
Orboknown
Smash Hero
So...
You're worried about madia being able ro nk someone who is doing well, which is a standard threar jn a regular game where you can have one person finding everyone out. Onlyndofference is in a usual game that guy has to convince multiple people vs one oerson or himself
Zalak
Smash Lord
Yes. That's a pretty big difference, and it's the main thing that separates King Maker from a normal game. One player can hold all the power to take out scum. Like I said though, I don't think we should really act on this. It's just something that I considered.
