Puzzle League/Panel De Pon General (Former SSB4 Lip Support Thread)

[N. Onymous]

And you know how they can fix that, right?

Like I've said, to still be afraid to market Panel de Pon in the west, seemingly Nintendo's target demographic in recent times, because they're afraid the character designs will lose them money is downright unfathomable in the era of Friendship is Magic (which is big in Japan too, so there's no way they can't be at least aware of its popularity) and its ilk. Someone on board has got to be biased against the series.

 

[continuityOfficer]

And you know how they can fix that, right?

Like I've said, to still be afraid to market Panel de Pon in the west, seemingly Nintendo's target demographic in recent times, because they're afraid the character designs will lose them money is downright unfathomable in the era of Friendship is Magic (which is big in Japan too, so there's no way they can't be at least aware of its popularity) and its ilk. Someone on board has got to be biased against the series.

If we had more characters in smash, or if we had less important characters in smash I would agree with you. But at this point, there is nothing that makes Lip necessarily or defaultly a good option, compared to other characters that have defaultly good reasons. And i'm not saying it wouldn't have been a good idea, i'm just trying to give fair reasoning to their side.

 

[N. Onymous]

At the same time though, there's nothing that makes her necessarily or by default a bad option either, except for Nintendo's general ignorance of the series lately.

 

[JaidynReiman]

While the removal of Isaac's assist trophy is weird, people always mention Golden Sun, but forget how abysmal the lack of representation Advance Wars is, a franchise that is much bigger and older than Golden Sun. Sure, there is an Assist Trophy, which happens to be one of the worst and very poorly representative of what the games are about. My point is, Golden Sun isn't the special snowflake, quite a few franchises are represented poorly (Advance Wars, Golden Sun, Baten Kaitos, Sin & Punishment, Panel de Pon) or not represented at all in Smash (Eternal Darkness? I don't remember any content of the game ever appearing in Smash).

By the way, Smash clearly works as a marketing device... Didn't Sakurai say that if a franchise doesn't have a future, it is not going to get representation in Smash or something like that?

Its arguable that Advance Wars is bigger. Longer-running? Yes, most definitely. Sales-wise, though, Advance Wars is abysmal. Golden Sun has almost the same number of lifetime sales in only three games, and is in a better current standing to possibly actually continue.


Though yeah, Panel de Pon is still in a questionable position as is...

 

[N. Onymous]

Happy New Year, panel poppers! Let's make 2015 the Year of Lip!

 

[True Blue Warrior]

Its arguable that Advance Wars is bigger. Longer-running? Yes, most definitely. Sales-wise, though, Advance Wars is abysmal. Golden Sun has almost the same number of lifetime sales in only three games, and is in a better current standing to possibly actually continue.


Though yeah, Panel de Pon is still in a questionable position as is...

Based off their statement, I actually honestly believe AW is more likely to get a new game than GS in the immediate future (not to argue that the latter doesn't have a future, because that is not true)

 

[N. Onymous]

Saying that any franchise doesn't have a future is ridiculous, really. Anything can be dusted off, given a next-gen level of polish, and revived. The company just has to be willing to take the potential risks.

Something I've noticed is that while Panel de Pon is as stagnant as ever, Japan has been seeing a sudden upswing in Puyo Puyo recently. 3DS skins, 3DS menu designs, Puyo Puyo Tetris... One has to wonder if Nintendo will follow Sega's lead with their own cute puzzle franchise at any point.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Based off their statement, I actually honestly believe AW is more likely to get a new game than GS in the immediate future (not to argue that the latter doesn't have a future, because that is not true)

You can argue that, but then when you look at what Camelot has done since Dark Dawn, and what Intelligent Systems is working on, Camelot is far more in a position to be developing a new Golden Sun right now; Intelligent Systems has two games its working on right at this moment already. Camelot cannot make a Wii U game, and they've already made the 3DS sports games, so the only thing they really can make is Golden Sun at this point in time.


The AW comment was more of an "Oh, we still want to continue the franchise, but we're not working on anything right now." Camelot has not made a statement at all, and are celebrating an anniversary next this year. A new GS is also a lot more in demand than a new AW (although I definitely think both should and will happen).


Actually, I think a new Panel de Pon is more likely to happen prior to a new AW, mainly because its easier to develop and IS has a lot on their plate right at this moment in time.

Saying that any franchise doesn't have a future is ridiculous, really. Anything can be dusted off, given a next-gen level of polish, and revived. The company just has to be willing to take the potential risks.

Something I've noticed is that while Panel de Pon is as stagnant as ever, Japan has been seeing a sudden upswing in Puyo Puyo recently. 3DS skins, 3DS menu designs, Puyo Puyo Tetris... One has to wonder if Nintendo will follow Sega's lead with their own cute puzzle franchise at any point.

That would be nice...

 

[smashkirby]

Hey guys, recently Sakurai had another interview talking about the full process of SSB4, and according to him, MANY, MANY more characters were planned for SSB4 than initially thought. I know this is me grasping at straws, but I honestly feel Lip may have been in consideration for Smash 4.

 

[vZakat]

We were talking about how slow planet puzzle league was before and when I found this video I figured I'd post it here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCToUhu7c4I

Also can we get this thread moved back to the nintendo zone?

 

[N. Onymous]

Odd you'd say that when the post just before you is talking about Lip in Smash Bros.

As for the video, yikes, that IS slow. Planet really did have more problems than casually discarding any attempt at personality or marketability, didn't it.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

What probably bugs me the most about the Wii U Smash Bros. is that while Panel de Pon doesn't really have any new representation or mentions, Tetris Attack does (there's a bit of trivia about the puzzle games Yoshi has been in). It feels like neglect almost, purposeful or otherwise.

Erm, about that....

Spoiler

I'm not surprised after what this all has come to. Panel De Pon won't really change from it's current status of "dolled-up dead puzzle game series" on anytime soon because of it's past.

They still mention PDP in Lip's Theme's details in Sound Test, mind you.

 

[N. Onymous]

Nintendo, you sons of *******.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Nintendo, you sons of *****es.

I wanna agree but TBH, PDP is not Fire Emblem. And that's saying a lot. (FE was about to die once, remember)
This won't hurt them in any margin as majority won't care and only ones who do will only be upset. I personally think this was to just stay true to the games released in the country Sm4sh's regional copy is on.

I kinda think PDP's done with and must have been ages ago. I personally moved on and it seems that it was a good move, seeing how Nintendo decides to go into this direction. I don't think there's any hope for PDP and only thing we can do is to tribute to the series in our own means to give it the attention it deserves, yet we ask for the company itself not caring about it anymore due having much better resources or successful properties to invest on.

Might seem foolish, after coming to a point where there's clearly some vocal minority and they're met with this.

 

[N. Onymous]

I want to disagree with you, but speaking honestly, the more and more I see just how little Nintendo cares about the fairies, the more reasonable you seem.

I'm never going to give up hope that at some point we'll see Popples again, but this? This is our darkest hour.

 

[continuityOfficer]

In many ways its much too late to simply add them in smash bros. Hell, we should be lucky its still called Lip's Stick and not 'Flower' at this point. The franchise hasn't had a new game in ages, it didn't do particularly well and they decided for it to not even have the same characters between countries.

If Lip has any chance for Smash its going to be after some revival of the franchise. and even then, only if its popular (and if Lip is actually in the US, EU, AUS, etc releases)

 

[Etc_Guy]

Erm, about that....

Spoiler

I'm not surprised after what this all has come to. Panel De Pon won't really change from it's current status of "dolled-up dead puzzle game series" on anytime soon because of it's past.

They still mention PDP in Lip's Theme's details in Sound Test, mind you.

Didn't Tetris Attack star ? I don't see why call it Lip's Stick if she doesn't appear in her own game.

Nintendo, you sons of *****es.

Nintendo has lots of branches working on different games, so it isn't the whole company working on this.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

I want to disagree with you, but speaking honestly, the more and more I see just how little Nintendo cares about the fairies, the more reasonable you seem.

I'm never going to give up hope that at some point we'll see Popples again, but this? This is our darkest hour.

In anycase, I think I.S and Nintendo won't put up any effort on that unless some wacky miracle happens.

So it's best that the fans are the only ones to show tribute to this franchise while it can still have any activity. It's really downing, I know, but TBH, it's better than this series being abandoned for real by everyone.

Cult following is better than nothing.

 

[N. Onymous]

Didn't Tetris Attack star ? I don't see why call it Lip's Stick if she doesn't appear in her own game.

Exactly why we're pissed about this. To not have Lip in Smash Bros. is one thing. To lie about what game her wand is from and misdirect people looking to learn more about her home series reads more like intentional sabotage.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Exactly why we're pissed about this. To not have Lip in Smash Bros. is one thing. To lie about what game her wand is from and misdirect people looking to learn more about her home series reads more like intentional sabotage.

It's most likely well-known what the source for Lip's Stick is, and it's kinda unavoidable if going to internet to research it. Wikipedias and whatnot.

Once again, I think this was done to stay "correct" to what PDP became in the region that the copies of Sm4sh outside of Japan are in language and other cultural differences. Even if this was needlessly stretching it.

 

[N. Onymous]

It's most likely well-known what the source for Lip's Stick is, and it's kinda unavoidable if going to internet to research it. Wikipedias and whatnot.

The English Wikipedia's article on Panel de Pon has been a redirect to Tetris Attack for a while now (about a year? maybe two?).

Do you have any idea of the repercussions this could have to people outside our circle? This pile of horse manure combined with the Wikipedia redirect will make some people going into the series for the first time think "Oh, I guess Tetris Attack is the English version after all" and just play that instead of Panel de Pon and they'll think it's a Yoshi game instead of an original IP and argh. Arrrrrgh.

 

[BluePikmin11]

ギャルボス

 

[N. Onymous]

I really really wish there were more people like him. I honestly do.

If there were more people in the fanbase with artistic talent who would draw and make fan art and edits like that and show their love for the Panel de Pon series, if we were even on the level of the EarthBound series, then maybe things would be different. Maybe Nintendo would realize there are too many fans to completely ignore (only mostly ignore). Maybe they'd care enough to not let a slip-up like "Lip's Stick was totally in Tetris Attack you guys" through. Maybe other people would have a clue what we're talking about and stop telling us to shut up because no one cares. Maybe Nintendo would actually stop trying to bury the series. Maybe they wouldn't be letting it rot in the bin of Things We'd Rather Forget.

But there aren't.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Wait just a minute.

This must be some weird EU thing, I'm looking at the trophy right now and it says Panel de Pon (Japan).

I distinctly recalled being happy to see it mentioned on the actual trophy, so I had to make sure when I saw this picture.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Wait just a minute.

This must be some weird EU thing, I'm looking at the trophy right now and it says Panel de Pon (Japan).

I distinctly recalled being happy to see it mentioned on the actual trophy, so I had to make sure when I saw this picture.

Wait, US-copies don't have this?

NOE must be still licking NOA's arse nowadays, huh.

 

[JamesDNaux]

Wait, US-copies don't have this?

The trophy clearly states that it is from Panel de Pon, and it says Japan where the date would go. It even has the Super Famicom logo instead of the SNES one:

I would take a picture if I could.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

The trophy clearly states that it is from Panel de Pon, and it says Japan where the date would go. It even has the Super Famicom logo instead of the SNES one:

I would take a picture if I could.

You could post the screenshot on Miiverse and copy it from there to here.

 

[N. Onymous]

Geez, and I thought the whole Whittleton -> Mayscore thing was bad...

So it's not AS bad as it first appeared. I'm still really mad about it, though. You'd think NOE would be more willing to showcase cute characters than NOA! : P

 

[Curious Villager]

It's probably just another one of those slip ups I guess....

 

[JamesDNaux]

You could post the screenshot on Miiverse and copy it from there to here.

My Wii U can't connect to the internet.

Could someone else from the US confirm it?

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

My Wii U can't connect to the internet.

Could someone else from the US confirm it?

That... sucks. But thanks for informing anyway!

Geez, and I thought the whole Whittleton -> Mayscore thing was bad...

So it's not AS bad as it first appeared. I'm still really mad about it, though. You'd think NOE would be more willing to showcase cute characters than NOA! : P

Ah well. After they already removed Tetris from VC in 3DS Eshop some days ago... Same for Hudson Soft's 3DS installment.

NOE IMO is big frigging dumb in general. For getting Xenoblade before US, we gotta deal with delay after delay, and not even gain access to some games (LolKirbysDreamCollection)

 

[N. Onymous]

Odd that they'd remove the VC Tetris from the European eShop when you left in "TETRIS Attack". As far as I know, it's still up in America.

Nintendo of Europe is the same company who decided the Koopalings were suddenly to be referred to as "Bowser's minions" exclusively. (Didn't work, people still called them that.) Honestly, I don't see why having two translations of everything is necessary - it apparently started over the use of the word "spastic" in Mario Party 8, which is an ableist slur in British English - especially when it results in particularly inexcusable screw-ups like this.

 

[AEMehr]

So in turn Nintendo of Europe hides the existence of the Panel de Pon franchise but gave generally better Boxing Ring aliases.
I mean R.O.B. being, The Last of His Kind, gives feels but he's kinda cooler as the, Robotic Obliterating Buddy. Also Mega Man being the, Blue Metal Hero, in the states rather than the, Blue Bomber, in Europe is beyond me.

 

[N. Onymous]

Like I said, it's a relief to see it's not a universal thing and probably the fault of some overzealous European localizer. Still upsets me.

 

[Curious Villager]

Sometimes I feel like some of you overreact too much, but sometimes I feel the same in terms of certain other companies.....
I'm so conflicted.... :T

 

[N. Onymous]

Around here we're rooting for the underdogs by definition, so is it that unbelievable that we get a little bent out of shape when it seems Panel de Pon isn't being treated well? (Some of us react more poorly than others.)

 

[N. Onymous]

Out of curiosity: Considering the trophy mishap, is Lip's theme still marked as coming from Panel de Pon in the EU version, or did that become "Tutorial Theme (Tetris Attack)" or some other nonsense?

 

[LipFlare]

Hello there

,that "Tetris Attack" thing made me angry to ,but then again ,who knows ,here in germany Nintendo moved it's headquarters last year maybe something got lost(?). While I just can gues how much influence it had on the game development in the entire PAL territory ,I blame it

[Lip's Theme (Panel de Pon)] has it source listed with [Panel de Pon] arranged by Masafumi Takada ,over here in Pal-De.

The Panel de Pon anniversary: hmm I guess it's for me like "this year a game MUST be released or it will never happen" but I am not very hopeful... but I am lurking and if it happen then... well maybe someday. Until then...

Have a good time everyone!

LipFlare

 

[N. Onymous]

After watching the latest Nintendo Direct, it's really starting to piss me off how there are so many new Nintendo puzzle titles and none of them are Panel de Pon. It'd certainly do a lot better than that pay-to-play Pokémon-themed Candy Crush knockoff.

What do you guys want to do? Because at this point I'm thinking we have to do something, just to let everyone - most of all Nintendo - know we as a fandom exist.

 

[~ Valkyrie ~]

Out of curiosity: Considering the trophy mishap, is Lip's theme still marked as coming from Panel de Pon in the EU version, or did that become "Tutorial Theme (Tetris Attack)" or some other nonsense?

Nah. I think I mentioned it already but it's still "Lip's Theme" (Panel De Pon). So IDK, they just went whack apparently being "correct".

After watching the latest Nintendo Direct, it's really starting to piss me off how there are so many new Nintendo puzzle titles and none of them are Panel de Pon. It'd certainly do a lot better than that pay-to-play Pokémon-themed Candy Crush knockoff.

What do you guys want to do? Because at this point I'm thinking we have to do something, just to let everyone - most of all Nintendo - know we as a fandom exist.

You might not like what I'm gonna say, but I'll be honest here:

We just gotta let it go, simply.

The fandom does exist. The thing is, we're pretty damn niche today. Just not enough important to warrant a new game compared to what Nintendo has found better ways to churn it and audiences to appeal. Panel De Pon has gone through so many forms and alterations that marketing it today would just be pushing it riskily as a priority over what would make more business movement for Nintendo and I.S. It's sad, but this is just how business work. The best I can think is to rework the entire game's presentation from the ground-up, say, include Yoshi and PKMN on the mix with the Popple Fairies, and just rename the entire series "Panel Pop", much like what it's mean to be in Japan. But if we're instead getting new FEs and perhaps another sequel someday to Pushmo rather than that... yeah.

I mean, have ya seen what Konami had done for most of it's popular franchises that were prominent in 90s? Most, if not all, turned into Pachinko-games today. All because they've found more relevant and prominent franchises to market, and the market for these old franchises have gone less active and niche to warrant anymore interest today compared to much bigger IPs.

It sucks major brass balls, but sometimes we just better support these new games before they also turn into franchises to contemplate their glory never getting received on.