Puzzle League/Panel De Pon General (Former SSB4 Lip Support Thread)

[Juliusaurus]

It seems to me that most people who support Duck Hunt Dog are only doing that so they won't be disappointed if Ninka Kiwi's leak is true. I'm not saying people aren't supporting it for other reasons, that's just how it seems to me.

If Duck Hunt is getting any rep at all though, it's as an Assist Trophy. Remember, when they were developing Melee and were still planning to use assist trophies, Duck Hunt was one of the first ideas thrown around, and Team Sakurai is known for reusing ideas that didn't get implemented the first time around in later games.

Wait... Duck Hunt was an idea for a Melee assist trophy? I had no idea about this!! Did it involve the dog in any way, or just... the ducks? weeeeeeird.

As for other potential non-Japanese-only retro characters Bubbles is a good candidate, I agree, but I think the Balloon Fighter would've been even better if the Villager didn't already steal his moves. Balloon Fight is probably Nintendo's most tossed around retro game (it's seriously cameo'd everywhere). But in terms of iconic retro characters that still aren't present, nothing beats the Duck Hunt dog. Everybody knows him and his devious laughter.

Lip to me falls in the same category as Takamaru and Prince Sable. A first party retro character, sure, Japanese-only even, but they don't have that an importance to them that Duck Hunt has, or that Game & Watch or R.O.B. have... Then again, Ice Climber was never really held in high regards either.

 

[SchAlternate]

Lip to me falls in the same category as Takamaru and Prince Sable. A first party retro character, sure, Japanese-only even, but they don't have that an importance to them that Duck Hunt has, or that Game & Watch or R.O.B. have... Then again, Ice Climber was never really held in high regards either.

And yet you forget that Panel de Pon (named Tetris Attack on the west, later known as Puzzle League) is still holding up today. So while she herself fell into obscurity, her series still remain popular.

 

[Juliusaurus]

And yet you forget that Panel de Pon (named Tetris Attack on the west, later known as Puzzle League) is still holding up today. So while she herself fell into obscurity, her series still remain popular.

But then wouldn't that be considered an even worse thing? That she as a character isn't important enough to even be used for her own franchise?

 

[Bingoshi]

But then wouldn't that be considered an even worse thing? That she as a character isn't important enough to even be used for her own franchise?

I believe Lip was removed to make the games easier to localize. Apparently, Nintendo was scared that her game wouldn't sell well, or would be too "girly" for people or something. She was taken out of her own game for both Yoshi and later Pokémon, and now the series is just...rather soulless, with no main protagonist or anything. I don't believe she "wasn't important enough", it's just that they weren't sure if the western market would like her. I believe things like MLP prove that things that are considered "girly" can still get rather popular. I think they made a mistake removing her in the first place.

And anyway, isn't that the point of retro revivals? To bring back old and forgotten characters from Nintendo's past? Lip would be an amazing revival, and I'm sure she would get pretty popular if she were to be revived in this game. Who knows, maybe she'd even come back to her franchise again. While DHD may be more well known, I feel Lip has far more potential.

 

[Grimnir]

@ Juliusaurus We get it. Duck Hunt Dog is likely to be that retro/surprise rep. I don't know what you hope to accomplish by coming in here to talk about how much more likely he is than Lip. We're aware of that. Why don't you keep the gloating to the Duck Hunt Dog thread, because you aren't going to be making friends here.

I'm sure just as you can think of a thousand reasons why DHD is better, we can think of a thousand reasons for Lip as well. Everyone can do as such for their favourite character of choice. You're just asking for a flame war.

 

[N. Onymous]

Wait... Duck Hunt was an idea for a Melee assist trophy? I had no idea about this!! Did it involve the dog in any way, or just... the ducks? weeeeeeird.

The idea for the Duck Hunt assist trophy, IIRC, was just the ducks, which would fly around and hurt any fighters they bumped into.

And yeah, you coming in here talking about how Duck Hunt Dog is more likely than Lip seems more boastful than anything - especially considering Duck Hunt was only ever considered for Assist Trophy status before. I'm not saying ATs can never become playable characters, just look at Little Mac, but it just doesn't seem very likely.

Here's something to think on: Was Pit relevant at all back when Brawl was in development? Did he have the same importance to Nintendo history as Mr. Game & Watch, R.O.B., or yes, Duck Hunt Dog? He was that game's Ice Climbers. We'd only seen him twice before, and we were the lucky ones - Japan got the Famicom game and that was it, for over twenty years.

 

[Blucas]

Isn't duck hunting a sensible theme in the west? Make a character about it might make trouble, not to mention they removed a trophy seal from the ice climbers back in melee and that dog hunt didn't got a re-release unlike other retros in smash, even lip got her game in the japanese VC

 

[N. Onymous]

I understand you probably aren't that fluent in English, but Lip is a girl. ^^

I'm not sure whether or not the decision not to rerelease Duck Hunt has to do with controversy or not, but it would certainly rile PETA's nerves, and it might bug the SPCA too. Panel de Pon would, believe it or not (considering Nintendo's reluctance to giving it widespread exposure), have far less issues. A fantasy adventure starring a young princess on a journey to save her friends is certainly more marketable in these days than a game where you shoot and presumably kill ducks for sport.

 

[Luminario]

It seems to me that most people who support Duck Hunt Dog are only doing that so they won't be disappointed if Ninka Kiwi's leak is true. I'm not saying people aren't supporting it for other reasons, that's just how it seems to me.

If Duck Hunt is getting any rep at all though, it's as an Assist Trophy. Remember, when they were developing Melee and were still planning to use assist trophies, Duck Hunt was one of the first ideas thrown around, and Team Sakurai is known for reusing ideas that didn't get implemented the first time around in later games.

The reason DHD is on everyone's leaks is the same reason Chorus Kids were on everyone's leaks a while ago, one simple leak that got too much credibility and everyone wants to pretend they have all the info.

Wait... Duck Hunt was an idea for a Melee assist trophy? I had no idea about this!! Did it involve the dog in any way, or just... the ducks? weeeeeeird.

As for other potential non-Japanese-only retro characters Bubbles is a good candidate, I agree, but I think the Balloon Fighter would've been even better if the Villager didn't already steal his moves. Balloon Fight is probably Nintendo's most tossed around retro game (it's seriously cameo'd everywhere). But in terms of iconic retro characters that still aren't present, nothing beats the Duck Hunt dog. Everybody knows him and his devious laughter.

Lip to me falls in the same category as Takamaru and Prince Sable. A first party retro character, sure, Japanese-only even, but they don't have that an importance to them that Duck Hunt has, or that Game & Watch or R.O.B. have... Then again, Ice Climber was never really held in high regards either.

Duck Hunt does not hold importance, it is a barbaric game that references killing animals for sport and it deserves to die off. You saw how much they changed Snake's moveset so he would fit into the world of smash. You think Nintendo will really add a character that holds up a dead duck by the neck and snickers? Adding DHD would probably piss off a lot of animal protection groups as well.

Lip rises up over Takamaru and Sable because Sakurai specifically stated her game was a masterpiece and considered adding Lip but decided not to add her because of obscurity, but now things have changed because one little Google search will tell you all you need to know about that character (plus all the other reasons such as uniqueness, female character, references the puzzle genre, fills the cuteness niche, retro character etc).

 

[Blucas]

The reason DHD is on everyone's leaks is the same reason Chorus Kids were on everyone's leaks a while ago, one simple leak that got too much credibility and everyone wants to pretend they have all the info.



Duck Hunt does not hold importance, it is a barbaric game that references killing animals for sport and it deserves to die off. You saw how much they changed Snake's moveset so he would fit into the world of smash. You think Nintendo will really add a character that holds up a dead duck by the neck and snickers? Adding DHD would probably piss off a lot of animal protection groups as well.

Lip rises up over Takamaru and Sable because Sakurai specifically stated her game was a masterpiece and considered adding Lip but decided not to add her because of obscurity, but now things have changed because one little Google search will tell you all you need to know about that character (plus all the other reasons such as uniqueness, female character, references the puzzle genre, fills the cuteness niche, retro character etc).

Not to mention that his dog hunt "leak" is also holding off gematsu's fame.

 

[Iko MattOrr]

I don't think that the fact that the game is about hunting ducks is the problem itself... in WiiPlay you shoot at ducks and PETA didn't say anything (maybe they haven't played the game, but it sold so much).
I think that the problem would be hyping the hunt. We know that each character in Smash generates hype. If Sakurai puts the dog in, automatically hunting ducks is the coolest thing in the world in the reveal trailer... it would be like a big spot to hunting ducks, and the thing would be communicated as if it's a positive thing, because nobody would create a trailer for a feature of their own product (in this case, a character in a game) saying that it's bad, and it should not be done.
Even if he's a secret character with no reveal trailer, even the moveset of the character itself, since it would consist in dead bodies of ducks falling from the sky... it would not be nice to see.

There are simulative games about hunt, and lots of violent games in the market. But we know that Nintendo would never do something like those games.

 

[N. Onymous]

Duck hunting was also not as prominent in Wii Play. Duck Hunt, as the name implies, is 2/3 duck hunting and 1/3 skeet shooting. It's much more visible and much more likely to irritate PETA (who would actually have a legitimate reason to dislike a game this time...).

...Boy, this thread got derailed quick.

 

[Luminario]

Duck hunting was also not as prominent in Wii Play. Duck Hunt, as the name implies, is 2/3 duck hunting and 1/3 skeet shooting. It's much more visible and much more likely to irritate PETA (who would actually have a legitimate reason to dislike a game this time...).

...Boy, this thread got derailed quick.

We've covered all the basics of Lip's character so there isn't much left to talk about. Plus bringing up a character and a game a few people here don't like is gonna take us off topic for a bit.
we could always go back to talking about how we want our girl to be revealed in her trailer. I see it as her quietly playing in a field of flowers until some fighters stomp on a few of them and annoy her, then we see her completely destroy them all with her wonderful flower based magic. Then some gameplay.

 

[Blucas]

I doubt a retro will get its own trailer but if she does it will be with yoshi or Dr. Mario.

 

[Juliusaurus]

Duck Hunt Dog is on a leak? I had no idea... I always thought he was a good candidate.

And let me break it down for Panel De Pon's Lip. She's an obscure Japanese-Only character, that's really all that needs to be said. Sakurai stated during Brawl that he wanted fewer of those characters playable, and so far, we're seeing those guys as assist trophies. Not ruling her out completely, but it's a more likely path for her to take.

Duck Hunt on the other hand was a monumental success internationally. The reason why it hasn't been re-released on virtual console is because of the zapper technology, and how different/difficult it would be when emulated. Not unlike R.O.B., who also never had his games brought to the virtual console, yet he still got in as a playable character, and I believe his historical significance had something to do with that. And despite not having a VC release, Duck Hunt is still referenced and cameo'd in plenty games, particularly Wii Play and the Wario Ware series.

Panel De Pon is sorta big, it's an ongoing franchise and it had a mascot character for a while in Japan, that's more than you can say for most other obscure Japanese-Only characters, but it still doesn't touch the historical importance of Duck Hunt, a game that predates Nintendo's foray into the video game market, as well as being bundled with every NES turning it into a household name... Of course, only in North America, and I could see that being its downfall, really. But I do believe it was popular in Japan as well. As for "animal violence" give me a break, the dog and ducks are all very cartoony, like Looney Tunes cartoony, comical violence is sort of their shtick, and in a fighting game where everybody beats up on cute animal characters to begin with I don't see a problem at all. I could bring up how beating on Lip is just as awful, since she's a young child, a little girl no less. The point is moot (that, and the ducks don't even die in Duck Hunt, if you notice when the dog is holding them, they have an annoyed look in their eyes, they're expressive). And I don't think "hyping the hunt" has much weight to it when "clubbing baby seals" is still present with the Ice Climbers.

And yes, Pit did have importance during the NES/Famicom years. He stood alongside Samus, Link, Mario, and DK in those days, as if he was destined to have an ongoing franchise, Nintendo put him on a pedestal. Kid Icarus was one of their big games.

 

[Oracle_Summon]

I doubt a retro will get its own trailer but if she does it will be with yoshi or Dr. Mario.

If Lip is a newcomer then she will get her own trailer. I can understand Yoshi, but Dr. Mario? Only if to show Dr. Mario is an alternate costume for Mario.

 

[Luminario]

Duck Hunt Dog is on a leak? I had no idea... I always thought he was a good candidate.

And let me break it down for Panel De Pon's Lip. She's an obscure Japanese-Only character, that's really all that needs to be said. Sakurai stated during Brawl that he wanted fewer of those characters playable, and so far, we're seeing those guys as assist trophies. Not ruling her out completely, but it's a more likely path for her to take.

Duck Hunt on the other hand was a monumental success internationally. The reason why it hasn't been re-released on virtual console is because of the zapper technology, and how different/difficult it would be when emulated. Not unlike R.O.B., who also never had his games brought to the virtual console, yet he still got in as a playable character, and I believe his historical significance had something to do with that. And despite not having a VC release, Duck Hunt is still referenced and cameo'd in plenty games, particularly Wii Play and the Wario Ware series.

Panel De Pon is sorta big, it's an ongoing franchise and it had a mascot character for a while in Japan, that's more than you can say for most other obscure Japanese-Only characters, but it still doesn't touch the historical importance of Duck Hunt, a game that predates Nintendo's foray into the video game market, as well as being bundled with every NES turning it into a household name... Of course, only in North America, and I could see that being its downfall, really. But I do believe it was popular in Japan as well. As for "animal violence" give me a break, the dog and ducks are all very cartoony, like Looney Tunes cartoony, comical violence is sort of their shtick, and in a fighting game where everybody beats up on cute animal characters to begin with I don't see a problem at all. I could bring up how beating on Lip is just as awful, since she's a young child, a little girl no less. The point is moot (that, and the ducks don't even die in Duck Hunt, if you notice when the dog is holding them, they have an annoyed look in their eyes, they're expressive). And I don't think "hyping the hunt" has much weight to it when "clubbing baby seals" is still present with the Ice Climbers.

And yes, Pit did have importance during the NES/Famicom years. He stood alongside Samus, Link, Mario, and DK in those days, as if he was destined to have an ongoing franchise, Nintendo put him on a pedestal. Kid Icarus was one of their big games.

Yes yes we get the point you have a great counter-argument you want duck hunt dog instead of Lip please go back to the DHD thread if you want to talk about him with people who actually like the idea.
I still think he's a terrible idea for a playable character and that Lip encapsulates so much more and deserves much more of a chance.

 

[JaidynReiman]

All this Duck Hunt Dog vs. Lip crap reminds me of the arguments against the Robin thread.

"You guys are delusional."
"The only Awakening rep will be Chrom!"
"Only Main Lords will ever be playable in Smash Bros!"

And so on, so forth. I love it when I support an underdog character and win out in the end.


Now here's hoping I can have the same thing happen for Saria in Hyrule Warriors. :D (And Lip, too, of course.)

 

[Blucas]

All this Duck Hunt Dog vs. Lip crap reminds me of the arguments against the Robin thread.

"You guys are delusional."
"The only Awakening rep will be Chrom!"
"Only Main Lords will ever be playable in Smash Bros!"

And so on, so forth. I love it when I support an underdog character and win out in the end.


Now here's hoping I can have the same thing happen for Saria in Hyrule Warriors. :D (And Lip, too, of course.)

Sorry for going off-topic a bit but Lana has an item that makes her some deku trees and plant stuff and that sorta killed saria's chance.

 

[Luminario]

All this Duck Hunt Dog vs. Lip crap reminds me of the arguments against the Robin thread.

"You guys are delusional."
"The only Awakening rep will be Chrom!"
"Only Main Lords will ever be playable in Smash Bros!"

And so on, so forth. I love it when I support an underdog character and win out in the end.


Now here's hoping I can have the same thing happen for Saria in Hyrule Warriors. :D (And Lip, too, of course.)

AGH THAT'S WHY THIS ARGUMENT WAS SO FAMILIAR!

Sorry for going off-topic a bit but Lana has an item that makes her some deku trees and plant stuff and that sorta killed saria's chance.

I don't know I find it hard to believe they put in OOT characters (sages, no less) and didn't throw in someone like Saria, the most famous Kokiri the most famous of sages (barring Zelda of course) but then again I can't think of anything else she would do besides what Lana now has.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Sorry for going off-topic a bit but Lana has an item that makes her some deku trees and plant stuff and that sorta killed saria's chance.

I know. That's why I'm supporting the underdog. Besides, Saria's most notable trait is the Ocarina anyway, and the Ocarina is nowhere to be seen. ^^ She could play several different songs, including both her own and the Minuet of Forest (which was also absent from Sheik's list).


Either way, this is for Lip discussion, and once again, Lip is the underdog. Personally I don't see Duck Hunt Dog being playable at all.

 

[Juliusaurus]

I wasn't here for the Robin discussions, but from what I'm aware of (I haven't played awakening) is that Robin is an avatar type character, and a character that can represent the player is generally a good candidate for a playable character as we've gotten others like that in the past, so I don't see the problem with him.

The dog is unconventional sure, and you'd have to make up a majority of how he plays. But like Wii Fit Trainer, Pac-Man, Mr. G&W, and ROB, it's not impossible, and those characters pull content from the games they are from... and I think that's what's most important here, the games/franchises they're from (or the entirety of retro Namco in Pac-Man's case). It's not so much about the dog as it is about Duck Hunt, and the dog is a big part of Duck Hunt so like Wii Fit Trainer, he'd be able to represent the game/franchise.

But back to Lip, she is not the underdog. I may be new to the smashboards but I used to roam Gamefaqs in the Brawl days and she was immensely popular as a retro rep, much moreso than the dog. And she even fits the part of a fighter better than the dog, she has a weapon even. If she ended up playable, I'd be fine with it, I just think there are better retro candidates that are more integral to the company and have a broader appeal.

 

[JaidynReiman]

I wasn't here for the Robin discussions, but from what I'm aware of (I haven't played awakening) is that Robin is an avatar type character, and a character that can represent the player is generally a good candidate for a playable character as we've gotten others like that in the past, so I don't see the problem with him.

The dog is unconventional sure, and you'd have to make up a majority of how he plays. But like Wii Fit Trainer, Pac-Man, Mr. G&W, and ROB, it's not impossible, and those characters pull content from the games they are from... and I think that's what's most important here, the games/franchises they're from (or the entirety of retro Namco in Pac-Man's case). It's not so much about the dog as it is about Duck Hunt, and the dog is a big part of Duck Hunt so like Wii Fit Trainer, he'd be able to represent the game/franchise.

But back to Lip, she is not the underdog. I may be new to the smashboards but I used to roam Gamefaqs in the Brawl days and she was immensely popular as a retro rep, much moreso than the dog. And she even fits the part of a fighter better than the dog, she has a weapon even. If she ended up playable, I'd be fine with it, I just think there are better retro candidates that are more integral to the company and have a broader appeal.

She's the underdog because most people believe she's disconfirmed due to Lip's Stick and Garbage Block.

Robin was the underdog because everyone thought that Chrom would, for sure, be the character picked. After Ike's reveal a lot of people started flocking to Robin, but Chrom was still the "sure pick" from FE by most everyone.

 

[Juliusaurus]

Ooooh, but Lip's stick and Garbage Block have been around since Melee, never stopped people from thinking Lip could be in. But sure, it's more against Lip than there is against the dog, there's literally nothing from Duck Hunt so far seen in the game, heck, the dog has never even appeared before in a Smash game, not even a sticker.

But even with the stick and the block, I think she'd still be capable of making it in. For example, Olimar's spaceship, it appears both as an item and as Olimar's final smash. Repeats can happen no problem.

 

[Blucas]

Ooooh, but Lip's stick and Garbage Block have been around since Melee, never stopped people from thinking Lip could be in. But sure, it's more against Lip than there is against the dog, there's literally nothing from Duck Hunt so far seen in the game, heck, the dog has never even appeared before in a Smash game, not even a sticker.

But even with the stick and the block, I think she'd still be capable of making it in. For example, Olimar's spaceship, it appears both as an item and as Olimar's final smash. Repeats can happen no problem.

the ducks were a trophy, and about your duck hunt argument before, the ducks die, it implies that in it's trophy in melee and having a character being a dog swingging dead ducks wont be very good

 

[Oracle_Summon]

Ooooh, but Lip's stick and Garbage Block have been around since Melee, never stopped people from thinking Lip could be in. But sure, it's more against Lip than there is against the dog, there's literally nothing from Duck Hunt so far seen in the game, heck, the dog has never even appeared before in a Smash game, not even a sticker.

But even with the stick and the block, I think she'd still be capable of making it in. For example, Olimar's spaceship, it appears both as an item and as Olimar's final smash. Repeats can happen no problem.

Lip uses Puzzles mainly for her series. The Garbage Block and her stick are things that come from her series, but that does not stop her from being who she, a Puzzle Solver.

Lip was not playable in the games in Melee and Brawl, but you have to take into account who she was going up against.

Now that many of Nintendo's major Titles have playable characters, Lip's chances have increased significantly. The only other Major Title that has yet to have a playable character is Xenoblade Chronicles.

 

[JaidynReiman]

Ooooh, but Lip's stick and Garbage Block have been around since Melee, never stopped people from thinking Lip could be in. But sure, it's more against Lip than there is against the dog, there's literally nothing from Duck Hunt so far seen in the game, heck, the dog has never even appeared before in a Smash game, not even a sticker.

But even with the stick and the block, I think she'd still be capable of making it in. For example, Olimar's spaceship, it appears both as an item and as Olimar's final smash. Repeats can happen no problem.

I know. I agree as well, that doesn't change the fact that it makes other people believe she can't make it in because of it. The arguments against Saria for Hyrule Warriors are almost the same thing, really. An item that fits Saria is being used by someone else (even though there's plenty of things she could still do), she's not going to be playable. For Lip, Lip's Stick is a random item and Kirby can transform into Garbage Block, she's not going to be playable.


Its not about the facts; that Lip's Stick and Garbage Block means nothing towards Lip's inclusion. Lip is the underdog because the majority of the Smash speculation scene thinks she's not going to be in because two things associated with her are being used by other characters.

 

[Juliusaurus]

the ducks were a trophy, and about your duck hunt argument before, the ducks die, it implies that in it's trophy in melee and having a character being a dog swingging dead ducks wont be very good

The ducks do not die, look at the sprites, they have very cartoonish expressions and hold an annoyed look in their eye when the dog holds them up. And yes, the ducks were the trophy in Melee, but the dog wasn't, the dog is who I was talking about, he hasn't appeared at all in any Smash game.

As for Lip's underdog status, I'll agree with you, just as the villager has moves based on Punch-Out and Wii Sports Bowling taking away from Little Mac and Mii... But then it not making a difference in the end. Lip could be a similar case, but then again, the Villager also has a Balloon Fight move, and it's so much of a Balloon Fight move that I can't help but think it destroys Balloon Fighter's chances... So it can happen. Not sure if Lip's Stick and Garbage Block are on that same level though.

 

[Blucas]

The ducks do not die, look at the sprites, they have very cartoonish expressions and hold an annoyed look in their eye when the dog holds them up. And yes, the ducks were the trophy in Melee, but the dog wasn't, the dog is who I was talking about, he hasn't appeared at all in any Smash game.

As for Lip's underdog status, I'll agree with you, just as the villager has moves based on Punch-Out and Wii Sports Bowling taking away from Little Mac and Mii... But then it not making a difference in the end. Lip could be a similar case, but then again, the Villager also has a Balloon Fight move, and it's so much of a Balloon Fight move that I can't help but think it destroys Balloon Fighter's chances... So it can happen. Not sure if Lip's Stick and Garbage Block are on that same level though.

They do die, they are clearly bullets in the screen when you, their "annoyed" look doesn't really matter.

 

[JaidynReiman]

The ducks do not die, look at the sprites, they have very cartoonish expressions and hold an annoyed look in their eye when the dog holds them up. And yes, the ducks were the trophy in Melee, but the dog wasn't, the dog is who I was talking about, he hasn't appeared at all in any Smash game.

As for Lip's underdog status, I'll agree with you, just as the villager has moves based on Punch-Out and Wii Sports Bowling taking away from Little Mac and Mii... But then it not making a difference in the end. Lip could be a similar case, but then again, the Villager also has a Balloon Fight move, and it's so much of a Balloon Fight move that I can't help but think it destroys Balloon Fighter's chances... So it can happen. Not sure if Lip's Stick and Garbage Block are on that same level though.

Lip's Stick and Garbage Block aren't nearly as damning as Villager's Balloon Fight move. Again, though, its not about what we think, its what about the general Smash speculation community thinks.

 

[Juliusaurus]

They do die, they are clearly bullets in the screen when you, their "annoyed" look doesn't really matter.

Are you messing with me? I can't tell if you're being serious... I mean, look at the sprites, look at the gameplay. There are no bullets, there is no death. There is comical violence though!! But if anything, that just helps fit in with Smash Bros..

As for Lip (heheh), the general Smash speculation community is bonkers, pay no mind, they make no difference in the end.

 

[Arcadenik]

They do die, they are clearly bullets in the screen when you, their "annoyed" look doesn't really matter.

If animals really died in Duck Hunt... then how come the dog survived a headshot?

 

[Luminario]

I wasn't here for the Robin discussions, but from what I'm aware of (I haven't played awakening) is that Robin is an avatar type character, and a character that can represent the player is generally a good candidate for a playable character as we've gotten others like that in the past, so I don't see the problem with him.

The dog is unconventional sure, and you'd have to make up a majority of how he plays. But like Wii Fit Trainer, Pac-Man, Mr. G&W, and ROB, it's not impossible, and those characters pull content from the games they are from... and I think that's what's most important here, the games/franchises they're from (or the entirety of retro Namco in Pac-Man's case). It's not so much about the dog as it is about Duck Hunt, and the dog is a big part of Duck Hunt so like Wii Fit Trainer, he'd be able to represent the game/franchise.

But back to Lip, she is not the underdog. I may be new to the smashboards but I used to roam Gamefaqs in the Brawl days and she was immensely popular as a retro rep, much moreso than the dog. And she even fits the part of a fighter better than the dog, she has a weapon even. If she ended up playable, I'd be fine with it, I just think there are better retro candidates that are more integral to the company and have a broader appeal.

You do put up one hell of an argument for the dog ill give you that but In no way would DHD give more of a broader appeal than Lip and puzzle based games are certainly more integral to Nintendo. Also has anyone mentioned that Sakurai was a game designer for Meteos? with gameplay quite similar to Panel de Pon? It's kinda grasping at straws here but it shows Sakurai's love for VS puzzle games hasn't really dimmed (even though it was released in 2005) So there's yet another small point for Lip.

 

[Juliusaurus]

The fact that Duck Hunt was bundled with every NES and that EVERYBODY remembers the dog laughing in their faces, yeah, I'd say the dog has a wider audience. And he's a dog, people love dogs, everybody loves dogs.

 

[Blucas]

The fact that Duck Hunt was bundled with every NES and that EVERYBODY remembers the dog laughing in their faces, yeah, I'd say the dog has a wider audience. And he's a dog, people love dogs, everybody loves dogs.

Not really, time have change and the dog isn't popular as he used to be, not to mention he hasn't been mentioned a lot until the new "leak".

 

[Grimnir]

The fact that Duck Hunt was bundled with every NES and that EVERYBODY remembers the dog laughing in their faces, yeah, I'd say the dog has a wider audience. And he's a dog, people love dogs, everybody loves dogs.

The dog is quite literally (in)famous for being one of the most hated characters in video game history.

 

[Juliusaurus]

The dog is quite literally (in)famous for being one of the most hated characters in video game history.

Yes, agreed, that helps my argument.

Not really, time have change and the dog isn't popular as he used to be, not to mention he hasn't been mentioned a lot until the new "leak".

I'm not sure you know what retro means...

 

[Blucas]

Yes, agreed, that helps my argument.


I'm not sure you know what retro means...

Pit got in brawl because popularity, despite being retro but that was what sakurai said in interviews

 

[Juliusaurus]

Pit got in brawl because popularity, despite being retro but that was what sakurai said in interviews

Ice Climber, Mr. G&W, ROB... Not popular, but they were important to Nintendo's history, and at one time, they were popular. But being historically significant is a big deal, I'd imagine. Duck Hunt is both significant to Nintendo's history and was popular back in the day (as was Pit, who was more popular in his day than he was when he was chosen for Brawl).

 

[Blucas]

Ice Climber, Mr. G&W, ROB... Not popular, but they were important to Nintendo's history, and at one time, they were popular. But being historically significant is a big deal, I'd imagine. Duck Hunt is both significant to Nintendo's history and was popular back in the day (as was Pit, who was more popular in his day than he was when he was chosen for Brawl).

If I remember well Ice climbers were choosed too by popularity in one japanese poll, baloon fighter almost made to the top too.