Translucent
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- May 20, 2012
- Messages
- 354
That toonlink was amazing. It looked like to me DK gimped you in the beginning, I was surprised that you came back. Good Job!
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Project M Social Thread
- Thread starter Project M
- Start date
- Status
`dazrin
Smash Champion
Yeah that was really cool! So creative and innovative with everything you do. Really fancy stuff lmao.
I'm really curious how you would play against like a high-level melee player playing space animals, or anyone relatively fast and not big like DK though, cuz I feel like alot of that stuff might not work, but I'd really love to see how you would play it out.
You don't really do shffl combos or anything that looks like a melee young link, so it looks REALLY unique and really cool to me. It kinda reminds me of like brawl toon link or something lol with the fullhop double aarow, T-bombs, more usage of zair, and all the additional momentum in the air you get from AGTing.
Really, REALLY cool stuff. I learned alot! I'll try to incorporate some of this stuff into my game play.
Did you ever play melee young link at all? Or were you a Toon Link main in vbrawl or something? Really would like to know where this playstyle came from lol
I'm really curious how you would play against like a high-level melee player playing space animals, or anyone relatively fast and not big like DK though, cuz I feel like alot of that stuff might not work, but I'd really love to see how you would play it out.
You don't really do shffl combos or anything that looks like a melee young link, so it looks REALLY unique and really cool to me. It kinda reminds me of like brawl toon link or something lol with the fullhop double aarow, T-bombs, more usage of zair, and all the additional momentum in the air you get from AGTing.
Really, REALLY cool stuff. I learned alot! I'll try to incorporate some of this stuff into my game play.
Did you ever play melee young link at all? Or were you a Toon Link main in vbrawl or something? Really would like to know where this playstyle came from lol
I never used young link or toon link in either games. Everything you see I came up with. And I have plenty of matches vs fast fallers/ spacies. Like I said, more to come
thank you for the feedback!
And when I say everything you see I came up with, I mean that I had started doing it without seeing anyone else do it prior. Not that I invented it
Sanity's_Theif
Smash Ace
Haha YES! Best movie of the franchise
And that's because, it's his best character, and his favorite lol(mine too), he hates most of the characters, not in their feel so much as the characters themselves, besides the Mario, Zelda and DK characters that is, both of my brothers are still learning
LOL not even close, he can be very easily picked apart if you know how to deal with him, and some buffs he got still weren't enough to make moves useful, like his side-tilt, almost completely useless
Now Zelda on the other hand >_> though I think she should stay as is, she's a good broken
GunBlaze
Smash Lord
Proud of being a Tink main :')http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUfT4ZRsuY&list=UU0W-BMZdUvPXrZ-aG9y-chA&index=1&feature=plcp
Minor lag and dropped frames at some parts of the video, but hopefully entertaining all the same
standardtoaster
Tubacabra
Jonny Westside
S4mus Fiend
Keep the P:M vids coming! But yo I gotta ask, what is up with those weird *** finger shows? O_o Never really seen anything like it. I take it you are a fan of raves?http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUfT4ZRsuY&list=UU0W-BMZdUvPXrZ-aG9y-chA&index=1&feature=plcp
Minor lag and dropped frames at some parts of the video, but hopefully entertaining all the same
Edit: I assume Baby3Years is your Youtube channel o.o
GP&B
Ike 'n' Ike
Link's FTilt... useless? I'm sorry but an overhead swing with fairly low startup and endlag and a strong semi-spike trajectory is anything but that.
ZodiakLucien
Smash Ace
I actually don't play toon link anymore. My training partners were complaining how unfun he is to fight against and how boring he is to look at so I switched. I play almost all wolf now, he is better than I initially thought after putting a lot of effort into him. I also have a lot of character loyalty to him. I still think that Toon Link is one of the best characters in the if not the best. Only one giving him competition is Fox.Nope. We're calling it T-Bombing now cuz your name is Samus-T. Cool stuff.
Do you have actual matches recorded? I'd like to see your playstyle, as pretty much the only toon link's I'm aware of are myself, monk, kizzu, lucien, tyler and armada. All of us have unique playstyles so I'm interested to see what yours looks like
There's a big project M tournament in San Francisco that project M is the only event. It will be recorded so you guys will be able to see my wolf and other norcal players play
EDIT: yea I shamelessly name searched.
Translucent
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- May 20, 2012
- Messages
- 354
Lucien I'm going to that tournament :D. Hope to see you there
Kink-Link5
Smash Hero
Loving the arrow bombing. It's the only angle I'd want to toss bombs at most of the time to be honest.
"t-bombing" is one f the best options for edgeguarding IMO. It lobs the bomb at an upward trajectory and lingers in the air for over 3 seconds. It also limits the options a player has for recovery IE fox having to choose to up-b straight towards the ledge or upbing diagonally upwards. And as toon link you have so many options for coverage. T-bomb at the edge, double arrow, AGT down a bomb, into a down air. And don't get me started on the hookshot XD haha t-bomb as an edgeguard, it works!
JediKnightTemplar
Smash Lord
Last I checked Link really doesn't have anything useless...
JCaesar
Smash Hero
Ftilt useless? Honestly, that deserves a "stopped reading here" comment, but I'll respond anyway.
Out of all the characters I play well enough that I would use them in tournament (ROB, Mario, Link, Wario, Snake, Marth, Peach, DK), I feel that Link has the best overall matchups (except maybe Peach, but as my sole Melee character, I try to avoid using her in P:M unless it's a free win, like when a fastfaller CPs me to FoD).
Maybe it's just the characters I play against frequently though. For example, I have a tough time fighting Bowser with most of those characters, but Link ***** the matchup. Same goes for some other characters, though that's probably the most extreme example.
`dazrin
Smash Champion
The only one giving him competition is fox? What about falco? Wouldn't you agree that Falco is a harder MU for Toon Link cuz of the lasers, pressure, and how easy it is to gimp TL with falco dair? Even wolf can do something similar, although I personally find it easier to manage a fight with wolf since his nair doesn't have much priority, although nair-shine on shield pressures it hard. Sheik/ Zelda can also be really difficult as well if the sheik plays really edgeguard-heavy and the zelda plays campy by spamming side-b and punishing approaches.
What if the fox recovers low then?
But yeah, I guess, Samus-T. T-Bombing to edgeguard is probably the only time you'll have time to do it anyways. But you could do the same thing by upthrowing a bomb on the edge of the stage and have another bomb ready in hand as the first one is in the air so you can z-drop/ throw the second one while your opponent is recovering while the first one falls into them. If either bomb hits, it's a free up-b/ nair/ fair/ dair depending on where they were when either bomb hit them. It's twice the bombs and puts you in better position. I'm not opposed to the idea though, I just initially felt like it might be impractical most of the time and that there are other options available. I need a lot more time to experiment with it and it's uses though.
edit: Link ftilt is one of his best moves. loooooooooool. range, speed, decent power/damage all in one move and send at a great angle for a follow-up boomerang.
Might just be me, but I find fighting Link is hard with Toon Link cuz he out ranges me and has his own projectiles.. I never play any Link mains though, so.. eh Annnoying MU imo, but not as annoying as space animals
abcool
Smash Ace
I am starting to upload some Project M friendlies. The static is kinda annoying btw. I'll upload other matches later.
http://youtu.be/6U4WwJZvxos
http://youtu.be/6U4WwJZvxos
Haha that's my friends account. I don't have a YouTube account and don't really care to make one. He plays smash too though. And I don't really go to raves and have never done lightshows. I have been but I'm not a raver
standardtoaster
Tubacabra
Abcool, I wouldn't use that falcon model you have. It has renamed bones from what I can see. It will mess with hitbox/hurtbox placements.
Sanity's_Theif
Smash Ace
Still takes too long to come out and isn't that strong, better option if above you is to up-tilt if at low % then forward air or down air, upsmash for more damage, mutliple up-airs, etc
Better option if opponent in front of you is downsmash, it's stronger and comes out quicker and covers both sides, or just jab since it has comparable range, is much quicker, and leads into a down-smash, grab, or spin attack
I really can't find a good use for it
Forward-tilt has yet to proves it's use to me
down-tilt is awful, slow-startup, low damage, it's only use is spiking enemy's off the stage, but no idiot would hang on the edge too long, and the slow startup makes it hard to time, especially against characters with quick recovery moves like Fox's side-B, it's just a better and safer option to N-Air off the edge
Forward-Smash has too much startup and endlag to just throw out, only real use is if you wavedash backwards from an oncoming dash attack
Arrows and Bombs have their uses but the boomerang is definitely Link's best projectile
Please explain it's best situations to me then as I have yet to find one where it's the best option, I'm serious btw I'd like to know
And I think Link has some good matchups but not many, most seem even to me, and maybe it's because Link is my main but when I play a quick character like: Fox, Falco, Wolf, Sheik, Sonic, or someone who can shut down Link's projectile game like: Zelda, Mario, or Pit, I can easily pick apart anyone playing Link, quick characters destroy him in close range if you don't let him get his projectiles out, and even then it's not too hard to manuever around, and if you shut down Link's projectile game, well, his approach is almost completely screwed
metroid1117
Smash Master
Nerf TL's recovery, it's not bad enough. /sarcasmhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUfT4ZRsuY&list=UU0W-BMZdUvPXrZ-aG9y-chA&index=1&feature=plcp
Minor lag and dropped frames at some parts of the video, but hopefully entertaining all the same
In all seriousness, I was VERY entertained by those matches. Your use of projectiles was very creative and your opponent was doing very cool things with dash attack. I can't wait for more
.
9Kplus1
Smash Master
Right, so Marth's Fsmash is useless because the player using Marth could just Utilt instead and start a juggle? You should keep in mind that percent numbers can drastically change the mindset of either player. If an opposing character is at a kill percent for one of Link's more potent KO moves, then it's very likely that they player using said character will make a mental note of where it's safest to approach Link. Dsmash, Utilt, Usmash, Zair, etc all have their respective faults, and cannot cover all of Link's blindspots simultaneously. Link's Ftilt adds another option to his already amazing zoning; it's another 'bubble' which the player using Link could use to cover certain areas.
Batting people away, maybe? You're 'rating' Ftilt through the utilization of that nonsensically aggressive "everything must combo / kill / do something silly in order to have a use" mindset, which obviously isn't the best template to base feedback of a character on. In many cases, it's much better to play Link conservatively, and space Ftilts, in order to prevent to opposition from breaching Link's defenses -- effectively amplifying Link's defensive game and thus making him a more formidable (and for that matter, irritating) force. DI, spacing, and in a lighter sense, frame data, all have an effect on Link's blatantly fearsome options. Ftilt may not kill as early as Dair, combo as well as Utilt and Dthrow, or linger as long as Nair, but it certainly has use against players who understand Link and know how to stop a lot of his bull****.
My pocket Link has a better W/L record than my secondaries js
.On a side note, JCaesar is uploading vids from Saturday's Legion P:M tourney; doubles are up and singles are currently being uploaded as well. Be sure to swing by JCz's channel to check out low-mid-high level Smash, and don't forget to subscribe!
KingBlaze777
Smash Apprentice
Combos and Brawl in the same sentence that DOES NOT state that they do not exist in that game?!?!?!?
Jokes aside. Welcome to Project M
9Kplus1
Smash Master
Combos exist in vBrawl
Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dair is legit.
Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dthrow -> Dair is legit.
abcool
Smash Ace
Thanks Standardtoaster i had a feeling. It wouldn't load in boss battles either.
Edit: lol my bad.
`dazrin
Smash Champion
Standardtoadster is a cool guy.
standardtoaster
Tubacabra
How do people mess up my username? lol
abcool
Smash Ace
Archangel
Smash Hero
^ good stuff. Also for those of you that miss the epic/Lulz of the smash fest this past weekend JCaesar is uploading them right now.
PGH Carroll
Smash Master
toadster is a DK from MI iirc
ZodiakLucien
Smash Ace
The reference to only giving him competition wasn't talking about fox is the only person who gives him a hard match up, I meant for who is the best character.
I don't want to turn this into a toon link match up discussion but I have a good amount of experience of falco vs toon link so I will talk a bit about this. It's rough for falco, everything you said doesnt apply. Lasers are super easy to take care of by power shielding into SH boomerang/fire arrows, not to mention full hop nairs are very hard for falco to deal with. Pressure isnt an issue, bair and nair out of shield will beat out anything he tries to do out of a high aerial or after a shine. Not just falco, it's really good in general. Fox's pressure is more tight though still has more holes than in melee.
Toon link can also grab a ton of stuff from falco thats safe in almost every other match up. Tipped bairs are always a free grab, tipped fsmash unless damn near perfect spacing is grabbable, and ftilt is grabbable. His pressure isnt an issue at all. He is easy to edgeguard. Also all of falcos CC options are really bad when compared to fox's. Also a huge approach option from falco is eliminated since he cant hop off platforms or come straight down on Toon link, free up B every time.
jalued
Smash Lord
wait the melee model???
JCaesar
Smash Hero
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL8CF76CBFCEDE9ABA
All the videos from the tourney last weekend.
All the videos from the tourney last weekend.
I like your Toon Link, you're really consistent with his ATs and use them appropriately, so it's entertaining to watch.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vGUfT4ZRsuY&list=UU0W-BMZdUvPXrZ-aG9y-chA&index=1&feature=plcp
Minor lag and dropped frames at some parts of the video, but hopefully entertaining all the same
King Funk
Int. Croc. Alligator
http://www.twitch.tv/kingfunk
Armada, Leffen, and more danish and swedish players!
P:M tournament will start in a few hours, until then its friendlies
Armada, Leffen, and more danish and swedish players!
P:M tournament will start in a few hours, until then its friendlies
Divinokage
Smash Legend
I actually played some P:M yesterday, it wasn't bad. Ganon is still as powerful as I thought, god... lol. When I can defeat my masters consistently, you know something is wrong.
Actually I realized matches take longer than usual, we played with the same team setup in P:M and matches lasted 3-4 mins.. but when we played Melee the matches lasted 1:30-2 mins, on avg. Not sure I get that, I guess the game is definitely slower.
Actually I realized matches take longer than usual, we played with the same team setup in P:M and matches lasted 3-4 mins.. but when we played Melee the matches lasted 1:30-2 mins, on avg. Not sure I get that, I guess the game is definitely slower.
jalued
Smash Lord
what matchups were you playing? Playing any new characters mean that combos are not as fluid and games take longer. Even playing melee characters will make the game last longer if the player isnt 100% used to the 1 frame difference from melee
Divinokage
Smash Legend
It's not that hard to get used to, all you need to do is play a little bit. =P We were playing tons of different matchups. I played mostly Ganon but I tried, Ike, Charizard, Marth, Snake, Zelda. Charizard's float is cute. lol.
`dazrin
Smash Champion
Hm, thanks for this! It's really helpful for me cuz I just find falco's stuff to be really hard to deal with. I get laser'd twice and the next thing you know I'm eating pillars and the whole deal, and it's really hard to get back my footing and start projectiles into shffl combos. I guess what it all comes down to is powershielding. I guess falco is a difficult MU for me no matter what character I'm using, so maybe it's just me. It could also be that young link vs falco in melee was a disgusting mu so it's probably still drilled into my head that it's bad lol.
There aren't any good videos of Toon Link vs space animals so I continue to have a difficult time dealing with the MU since I'm left to figure everything out myself. The only one I've had process with is mainly wolf vs toon link since I play against it all the time. It doesn't help that there aren't very many amazing Toon Link players to learn from, and even worse that most videos of toon link floating around have MUs that are relatively easy for TL and theres little to no footage against space animals. Too bad the only videos of your Toon Link is just the one against Shroomed's Sonic. It'd be cool to see more.
BTW I loved your little smash tutorials about spacing and reading comprehension in melee. Those were very helpful and informative videos and you should consider making more of those and maybe even make some with project:M stuff lol.
edit
wow. really? jeez I need to take that **** off, no wonder the *higher level* melee players were saying falcon is different than what he was in melee when they try falcon in P:M.Yeah that melee falcon floating around has renamed bones. Kinda hoping someone does a proper melee port of cf and ganon.
Does this mean melee ganon screws with the hitboxes as well?
MonkUnit
Project M Back Roomer
Melee Ganon doesn't have renamed bones. Unless it's a model import of Melee ganon. The vertex of Melee ganon doesn't have renamed bones though.
For a Melee falcon model, I think ST and I use scarfless Falcon because it doesn't rename bones, lol.
For a Melee falcon model, I think ST and I use scarfless Falcon because it doesn't rename bones, lol.
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