Project M Social Thread

[Juushichi]

There generally isn't one, I guess?

It's mostly a merging of Melee's stuff (like stalling... DSR, etc etc) along with a stage list that encompasses most of the first page, I think.

 

[Oracle]

every tournament match from day 2 got recorded. Vids will be up on sethlon's and mrbutterfuzz's youtube channels.

I'll weigh in on the pmbr tournament issue after I eat breakfast.

 

[CORY]

breakfast at 2pm? damn, man, you're a beast.

 

[WIDL]

There generally isn't one, I guess?

It's mostly a merging of Melee's stuff (like stalling... DSR, etc etc) along with a stage list that encompasses most of the first page, I think.

Yeah, I was thinking mainly stages. Should've been more specific. =P

and stage bans!

 

[Wrestlemania]

Yeah, I was thinking mainly stages. Should've been more specific. =P

Often people will use the bottom row as neutrals, the rest of page one as counter picks, but it also depends on the TO they might decide for example that Castle Siege is always banned but Lylat is a counter pick.

 

[Kati]

Lylat is definitely counterpick material at the very least now. Starter worthy if one isn't afraid of melee battlefield ledges.

 

[Strong Badam]

I was skeptical about Lylat, but after playing on it and counterpicking there a good bit at LTC I don't mind it at all.

 

[DMG]

Lylat is legit without the tilting. Bout the only reason people hated it in the first place.

 

[SpiderMad]

The obnoxious moving background is horrendous. Would this desync Wifi/Bring back the tilting? How do I get this into P:M without bringing back the tilting? http://forums.kc-mm.com/Gallery/BrawlView.php?Number=31856

 

[Oracle]

In response to pmbr members' results at low tier city or w/e:

The issue of allowing developers to enter tournaments is really complicated and scary. Anyone who develops a game is going to have some sort of advantage in tournament, because of the extended time to play and learn about their character (which is a big part of why I chose not to reapply to the pmbr after sakurai can't save you now). As ripple said, there is also a risk of characters getting buffed/nerfed unnecessarily to benefit the players (which isn't currently an issue; as much as I think DK is stupid i would never accuse strong bad or anyone else of maliciously buffing him to win more). And believe me, if i thought someone was doing that i would call them out). There's also the issue of top players understanding the metagame enough to give more relevant changes to their character; for example, reflex might understand what his characters need to do well more than a designer of another character who isn't at his caliber, so then the changes reflex suggests end up being more relevant and the character ends up better, regardless of either developer's intent. This is fairly unavoidable, however: i think if we didn't let top players into the pmbr to change their characters then the game would be pretty bad.

Talking to Burnsy before the tournament about how it was unfair to him and heyseuss that they couldn't get a chance to play 2.6 but we could brought up the issue of pmbr members having that massive advantage to start. And really, aren't they always going to have an advantage this close to after any release? If they develop the characters, for at least one tournament they could just abuse changes that the opponents wouldn't have understood or known how to deal with. This advantage is always going to be there just because of the nature of the pmbr; all we can do is mitigate it. Which brings me to my final point regarding LTC:

The whole reason that this issue is even being discussed is because of how close 2.6 was released to Low Tier City. We did the best we could, but no amount of random smashfests or advice from sethlon is going to compare to having months to try the game out, study up on changes, and get in individual testing. In my opinion, the release should have been delayed to prevent this issue. My tournament was announced long before 2.6, so there is no reason that the announcement could have waited until after the tournament. I, nor anyone else to my knowledge, did not anticipate that this issue would even be a problem, so I blame myself for not thinking about what would happen.

I advise for future releases of project m, there should be at least two months of time between the release an any major tournament, to make sure that everyone is on equal footing. If the release for whatever reason is released in such close proximity to a national, then the previous version of the game should be used. Having a national with such high stakes only 10 days after a game's release is stupid as hell, and I really hope this doesn't happen again. If any version is released later than 2 or 3 months before low tier city 2, I will run the older codeset to make it more fair for everyone. Hopefully, however, the pmbr will take note of this suggestion and not create a similarly poor situation.

Side note: i'm not johnning for dfw's performance at low tier city. I don't want to discredit OOS performance; we got exposed. next time!

 

[Kati]

@ spidermad

Try exporting the model data, collisions (misc data), and camera (labelled stpm in the latest version of brawlbox) from each of the p:m versions and import them into that sse version.

---
edit*

Regarding 2.6, if a developer entered a tourny such as ltc with metaknight wouldn't they have a huge advantage due to other participant's lack of mu experience?

And now that I'm curious, why didn't recent tournaments just use 2.5b?

editedit*
to be more specific regarding modeldata, try modeldata 0 and modeldata 100 from stgstarfox_gdiff.

 

[hotdogturtle]

Often people will use the bottom row as neutrals, the rest of page one as counter picks,

I've seen people do this, and that's why I think that the PMBR should put some extra thought into which page they put some "borderline" stages on. Sure they can say that there's no recommended ruleset and that TOs should make up their own stage lists, but a lot of people use page 1 for convenience, so that does have an impact on the tournament scene.

 

[Comeback Kid]

I've seen people do this, and that's why I think that the PMBR should put some extra thought into which page they put some "borderline" stages on. Sure they can say that there's no recommended ruleset and that TOs should make up their own stage lists, but a lot of people use page 1 for convenience, so that does have an impact on the tournament scene.

Other than Lylat Cruise after the update, which can take up the extra spot not currently being used, what page 2 stage is really borderline? I can't think of any more that qualify.

I advise for future releases of project m, there should be at least two months of time between the release an any major tournament, to make sure that everyone is on equal footing.

Oracle: that's just silly. The game demos should be released when they are ready, not be delayed for months to appease a few whiners with mod envy. Tourney players shouldn't get all the consideration.

 

[PMS | LEVEL 100 MAGIKARP]

If halberd/castle siege/pokemon stadium are tourney legit then...

why not pictochat?

 

[Comeback Kid]

Pictochat transformations are on a whole other level of dumb and random.

 

[Yung Mei]

definitely picto/orpheon

orpheon's only problem is the dumb rising ledge
inb4flip
the flip isnt a problem, only bad players die to the flip

 

[Oracle]

iirc pictochat still has a transformation where the left ledge goes away, which is a little too game breaking to include.

@comeback kid: i think that if the issue gets more widespread then people's attendance of a national for pm might get influenced by how recent the new build came out. Why bother trying to win if i know some pmbr member is going to know both their and my character way better than i do?

 

[Yung Mei]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4XpliT8Xyc

i did something cool on stream yesterday

 

[GimR]

Smash @ Xanadu is live! There will be tournaments for Project M, Melee, and Brawl tonight.

http://www.twitch.tv/vgbootcamp

 

[Kati]

iirc pictochat still has a transformation where the left ledge goes away, which is a little too game breaking to include.

@comeback kid: i think that if the issue gets more widespread then people's attendance of a national for pm might get influenced by how recent the new build came out. Why bother trying to win if i know some pmbr member is going to know both their and my character way better than i do?

Are you talking about the diagonal line drawn from the bottom left to the top right corners? that's all I can remember from Pictochat ( and I got rid of the stage recently after never playing on it so I have little memories to work from).

***edit**

personally I'm okay with demos being released asap (as in not delaying a demo to appease a TO), but I would never join a tournament without extensive experience in its version of P:M.

 

[Mr.Jackpot]

I only like 3 or 4 of those CSP icons, and I definitely prefer all the default in-game icons to the ones shown.

The preview pics don't do it justice. The CSS squares are meh, but the CSPs are really good. Plus, he has a CSP/BP for pretty much every single texture hack in existence in his KC-MM thread.

 

[Minor Pandemic]

Was doubles at LTC recorded?

 

[DMG]

Lot of strong team doubles were done on stream on Sat. Sunday top 4 was probably all recorded. You can go back in the stream archive and definitely find Reflex SB vs Awestin Oracle, Me AJ vs Seth Dakpo, Fly and Oro playing, etc

twitch.tv/OracleTx

 

[traffic.]

http://www.twitch.tv/play_for_keeps/new

Play For Keeps crew streaming all night all day! Bo10, Meta, Breez, Traffic, playin dubs and money matching til dawn, blakka blakka!

 

[Wrestlemania]

At tourneys I host Hyrule 64, Kongo 64, and now Lylat are all be legal stages on page 2. Although I plan on learning how to edit Stage Screen Select to put at least Lylat on page 1.

 

[leelue]

Hopefully they'll put lylat on page 1 for the patch.

hashtag lylat for starter 2013

 

[SpiderMad]

Hope they don't, I'm gonna have to use my bans on it solely because of the background

 

[Wrestlemania]

Hope they don't, I'm gonna have to use my bans on it solely because of the background

Because there are so many stages that are eligible for counter pick I use InternetExplorer's 321 method.
On page 1 winner bans 3 stages, Loser Picks 2 they want to go 2, Winner picks which one to go to.
I find it works fantastically due to the number of stages to pick from.

 

[JCaesar]

For now I just use the first page with 3 bans for simplicity, but I would love to rearrange the SSS to work better for the CP system. I'm just not sure it's worth the effort while things are still evolving.

 

[ItalianStallion]

I put my vote in for demos being released when they are ready. No point to delay them. Of course, considering I've only gone Mewtwo at every Melee tourney I've been to, I can't really say I take tournaments too seriously. They are just hella fun.

 

[Vashimus]

Current public version: v2.6

Current developer version: v11993​

​

The PMBR's holding back on us! Where are the other 11,000 versions you guys are hiding from us! Conspiracy! D:<​

 

[JCaesar]

http://www.twitch.tv/jcaesar

Starting in a couple minutes with CTL and Godslafco.

 

[KayB]

I haven't checked the most recent Hyrule 64 stage, but if its the same as 2.5b, then it should still be banned. The blast zones are WAY too close to the stage.

 

[Taerk]

Streaming now: http://twitch.tv/taerknet

Sorry, no Wizzy or Plup.

 

[Wrestlemania]

I haven't checked the most recent Hyrule 64 stage, but if its the same as 2.5b, then it should still be banned. The blast zones are WAY too close to the stage.

Oh I agree, the blast zones are way too short, but I have been playing 64 for the last 13 years, and just this past winter started playing melee and PM. That stage is like home to me. Too bad Kat is not there. (The Tornado I have taken to calling Hurricane Katrina.)

 

[Kati]

If the smaller version isn't legal, why not make the big version standard? The smaller version is still ridiculously big, but makes the two sides cramped spaces to fight in.... what's the point?

 

[leelue]

Was snake given a single nerf?

 

[Comeback Kid]

A slight inconsistency I noticed: Kongo 64 is correctly listed as part of the Donkey Kong Country series in the stage select screen, but still listed as just Donkey Kong in the My Music select screen. Quick background fix (I think) when you get around to it.

 

[Problem2]

Delaying releases just for the sake of tournaments will become a huge headache. It will be better if the TO just hosts for the old version if it is too soon after release. I kind of wanted to make a bigger deal about using 2.5b for Low Tier City, but considering I mained Sonic, it would sound too much out of self interest. However, the tournament was hype anyways. We'll know not to make the same mistake again.

 

[Jolteon]

http://www.twitch.tv/jolte0n/

Streaming Melee atm with Prof, Jolteon, Alpha Dash, RWWK, TLA and BlizzyWolf, will be streaming PM later.