PPMD's Falco Discussion Thread

[CallMeMars]

Hey PP. I have some random questions on some matchups ive been struggling with.

Sheik Neutral:
At what distance should I laser in this matchup.
How can I deal with sheiks dash back if they are one of their mixups is to dash back after laser and whiff punish my aerial with grab? Should I do more fade back on my drift / aerial->spot dodge? The sheik I play regularly power shields very consistently so shooting more lasers typically leads to my demise.

Puff:
Whats the best ways to shield pressure a puff while effectively covering rolls and wave dashes? A lot of the times when I pressure puff I can land low aerials into -> shine and repeat, but if they wavedash away or roll I tend to get caught trying to chase. It seems like the risk reward is really not in my favor.
And how shield pressuring change at very high percent (+80%?). Are there options instead of shine I can use to try and lead to a kill? In the corner I feel like bairing on shield outside of their grab range is strong. If they aren't in the corner im pretty lost and usually just land a shine or some stray aerial that leads to nothing.

General:
Do you have any systems or methodologies to keep yourself doing mixups in every situation? A lot of times when I play, I'll realize in some specific scenarios I keep doing the same option over and over. For example sometimes ill spam double laser from the ledge even though I am very comfortable with other options. Or Ill keep approaching in the same rhythm.

Do you have any good resources to understand mixups in general, and how to cycle through your options efficiently?

My last question might be a bit of a stupid and vague one, but how can I tell if my controller is having issues or its my technical skill thats causing bad inputs? I feel like I drop a lot more combos and inputs then I used to, but I just might be playing better opponents. I'm just constantly making small tech flubs in my games and im not sure how to tackle the issue.

 

[Dr Peepee]

It's good to laser just around or out of Sheik dash attack, but it's better to discourage DA then laser a bit out of walk Ftilt range so you can actually pressure her. Getting slightly closer than that is money.
If Sheik dashes back on your laser, then just keep running forward before aerial'ing if you wanna beat grab, or waveland back/down, or DJ, or don't FF. Lots of ways to beat grab. Yeah fadeback can work sometimes too.

If you space aerials, it means you can react to Puff moving away for more pressure but not a guaranteed hit. It'll let you catch rolls. If you act like you're gonna be close then fade back an aerial you can dodge grab and also chase rolls. If they roll after shine then it might be better to WD after shine, or just hold it for a second then WD after wherever they go. You could also do some shine FH if you think shine might hit and it also lets you avoid grab and still get a bit of pressure. I used to do it a lot and it probably can work occasionally.

Go into games only thinking about doing some different stuff like stuff on the edge. You could even practice the edge stuff between stocks to help you think about doing it while in a game. For approaches, it may help to consciously overthink it at first so you can begin doing it as long as you've been practicing different approaches. It may also help to think why you like doing this at that position...maybe you think you will always hit?

I don't think I have any resources for that, but ssbm tutorials probably can cover it a bit.

If you make the flubs in practice and also vs opponents that don't challenge you as much, then it's the controller. If it only happens vs stronger players, it's you. If it's kinda both, then practice will help you know it better. If you're also just dropping a lot of stuff you may be trying to change things though so this is a natural result. Practice again will help you see what's going on.

 

[SalaMenace]

Hey PP, hope you're doing well.

This might be a broad topic, but I'm having trouble understanding how to use Falco's lasers properly to put myself in an advantageous position.

I feel like I don't know the ideal ranges I want to be hitting my opponent with a laser. I'm guessing the closer I hit a laser the better, because I have more frame advantage, and can get on top of them before they can throw out a hitbox. However, I feel like lasering close to an opponent is in itself a disadvantageous situation, because I can be beat by my opponent jumping at the right time, throwing out a hitbox, or even just shielding and countering properly out of shield. So with regards to lasers, what exactly is Falco's objective? Do I want to be shooting approaching lasers into my opponent's threat range? Should I be waiting for my opponent to come to me, and then trying to hit their inwards movement with a laser? Should I be linking lasers together, slowly inching forward? At what point can I enter my opponent's threat range with a laser?

I'm guessing there's different nuances to each matchup, but as a general rule, how should I go about thinking of my lasers as a tool to gain advantage? And how can I avoid lasering in positions that will just get me hit?

 

[Dr Peepee]

So yeah, lasering on top of people gives you the most reward. Also yeah, doing so means you can just get hit. There's a middle ground where you laser kinda close where they maybe could hit you if they super call it out, but it's close enough to give you a chance to threaten them with your aerials(or at least allows you to get closer to then do that). So based on your own threat range and theirs, that's what you wanna aim for. I'd say it's a bit inside of Dair/Nair distance.

Lasers are a projectile that control horizontal space and have low end lag but high startup so people will combat by hitting early, playing vertically around it, or just repositioning during the startup so you can't followup with the lower end lag well.

Where you go from there is its own strategy that can change by matchup and player and your own preferences, but perhaps that is a good place for you to start.

 

[DickNixon]

Hi pp!

What should I do when I'm below the side platform and fox is falling down on top of the platform?

I usually try to escape to center stage but I'm not sure how to react if Fox chases me with short hop off aerial or run off aerial, since you have to be so far away to stuff that with a backair. I want to try to put more pressure on Fox by doing something like a FH shine but it feels like the risk reward is skewed in Fox's favor, since so many of his options seem to soft cover that. (Shine, aerial again, shield, dj or land -> jump again).

 

[Dr Peepee]

You could Uair it. You can shine the landing or otherwise set up to Bair/Uair if the Fox DJs away. If you WD'd to center you could Utilt if he comes in afterward as well.

 

[TrueLeeka]

Hello PP (Bonjour !)

First of all many many thanks for the educationnal vids on YT, the RM podcast and everything you do for Melee. You helped and help a lot growing my Falco !

Here's my few questions : Few months ago as a beginner, I found that double shines are easier for me to execute by softly tapping the left stick for the jump-cancel imput. I know I'm making it more difficult for me that way, but do you think it's "silly" to continue to do this tech like this given that I'm training to multishine in that way as well ? I'm okay with any amount of training necessary for that, but still ?
Are you thinking of more occurences of tight stick control for Falco techs ? (Given what I'm already doing I might as well look out for those)
Edit : Except pivoting into anything.

Sorry if this is odd or if my english is incorrect.
Thanks !

 

[Dr Peepee]

I think it's okay as long as you can do other things comfortably out of it. If not, then you'll need to change or learn to do that.

I'm unsure what the second question was...you'll have to rephrase that.

 

[TrueLeeka]

I'm unsure what the second question was...you'll have to rephrase that.

Thanks for your answer, apologies for being unclear.

I meant, what else can I do with Falco to improve my left stick smooth movements ?
I guess I could do things like repeating pivot into tilts or any other move. are you thinking of anything else ?

I hope that is more explicit.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Oh if you want to improve control stick movements, then just do basic practice.

This guide goes over a lot of basic practice that I find can help with lots of stuff!

- YouTube

Enjoy the videos and music that you love, upload original content and share it all with friends, family and the world on YouTube.

www.youtube.com

 

[AnonymousID]

hey pp, just wondering how come I almost never see mango go to side platform vs fox. I feel like he mostly stays grounded and spaces with aerials/lasers.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Falco often controls space better on the ground. Being on the platform makes it harder to approach with aerials because you have to drop down more first, meaning you have less threatening potential. Also Fox can attack you with FH faster if you're there.

 

[TheOther07]

Hey PP, hope you've been doing good. My question is: when trying to understand neutral, is it best to shadow box , just try to use resources already available to me, or do a mixture of both. If it's both, which one is more important?

 

[Dr Peepee]

I wouldn't recommend shadowboxing as a starting point, or at least not the full practice. It's fine to practice basic attacks and defenses you'd like to use, and also how to mix those things up. For example, after a laser, practice doing an approaching aerial vs wait vs dash in dash back and imagine what each loses to and what each beats in a given matchup. This is a simpler form of shadowboxing that's still relevant.

Uncle Punch can help give you an idea of what beats what, so that may be a better starting point if you don't like guesswork.

 

[TheOther07]

I wouldn't recommend shadowboxing as a starting point, or at least not the full practice. It's fine to practice basic attacks and defenses you'd like to use, and also how to mix those things up. For example, after a laser, practice doing an approaching aerial vs wait vs dash in dash back and imagine what each loses to and what each beats in a given matchup. This is a simpler form of shadowboxing that's still relevant.

Uncle Punch can help give you an idea of what beats what, so that may be a better starting point if you don't like guesswork.

Ahh, thx PP

 

[TheOther07]

Another question: I feel like I'm just SOOOO bad at analysing my own games and I don't really know where to begin. Can you point me in the right direction?

 

[Dr Peepee]

Sure. I think looking for a hit and asking why it happened is important. Just make a guess. Then keep gaining information. Eventually patterns will emerge and you get a lot from there!

 

[TheOther07]

I gotcha, thanks ^-^

 

[TheOther07]

Yo Mr. PP, I just have no idea how to get shine to connect consistently. It feels like when I nair I'm always too far away (either in front or behind them) and when I dair they're always in the air and therefore are actionable before me. It's just so unbelievably frustrating when I win neutral, but get absolutely nothing off of it even if it feels like I should have been able to.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Yeah this started being a Falco problem a while ago. The main thing that fixes this is attacking from spots where you can convert harder and trying to avoid attacking in less helpful positions. Alternatively, you can try winning neutral with shine, utilt, or dair (when they're grounded) more often.

 

[TheOther07]

Aight, thanks

 

[SalaMenace]

Thanks for answering my previous question PP .

Recently I've felt like implementing changes to my gameplay has been difficult. I do a lot of analysis, and I have a list of 500+ things I want to implement into my play. What do you think is the best way to incorporate these new things and replace my old habits?

Currently, I choose 1-2 things per matchup and try to focus solely on that during friendlies. This is something I've heard other top players talk about doing. However, I don't exactly know what kind of mindset I should have while doing this. Should I still be carefully paying attention to every interaction and trying to read my opponent? Should I go auto-pilot and only focus on my new idea?

Also, I find it hard to make changes when the situation I want to fix comes up very seldom. For example, I'll go into a Falco vs Fox game and say to myself "Okay, this game I want to slide-off his upair on platforms at low percent and counter shine." But then that situation will just never come up.

One more problem is that I don't know when I've truly mastered something. Maybe for a day, I'll practice positioning myself to avoid getting hit by Marth run-off the platform fair. Then the next day, I'll focus on not lasering when I'm too close to Marth. Then the third day, I'll focus on dashing back after getting powershielded. But suddenly while focusing on the third thing, I'll find myself getting hit by the run-off fair again. Feels like I'm on a ship with hundreds of leaks and I'm running around trying to patch everything up, but the old patches keep bursting open again.

I'd really appreciate any thoughts or guidance

 

[Dr Peepee]

This is a good question. I think for some of the ones involving being hit, it can be good to do something such as shield under a platform a lot vs Fox, or just spam shield so he has to grab and then you can go to the platform. Or you can find a person to practice it with. Or use savestates. The point would be to practice this a lot so it's at least somewhat automatic by the time it comes up when you're just playing.

For the first part, I do agree with just trying out some fixes, but maybe not over-focusing on them. If you're way stronger than your opponent then trying to fix whatever you want is easier, but if the matches would be more even if you went all out then it may be better to just see what the opponent is doing and try to implement whatever fixes are relevant to the way they play. Or you can play someone a lot and then just work on the fixes for that strategy, tell them, let them adapt, and go from there. This is part of why locals are good: you play expected people a lot and can help prepare for a more known number and type of things.

But yeah, if you work on something for a whole day and don't have it mastered, this may be because you're either spreading yourself too thin, or not truly paying attention when learning. You may need a shorthand to tell yourself to remember what to do. If you're getting hit by Marth runoff Fair, then it would be helpful to know where that hits on every stage, FF and not, and just avoid that spot. If you ever get hit there again it would likely be because you either forgot the spacing or they tricked you, and then you add that into your understanding. I'm not sure how you could totally lose that. So part of it is probably about how well you learn it and try to keep it in memory. You may need to use emotion or pictures to hold it in your mind.

 

[Blue53]

What makes Falco backflip so useful? i hear it being talked about sometimes but its not something ingrained in my play yet.

 

[Dr Peepee]

It's mainly useful because it makes it harder to hit/grab Falco than his in place/forward jump. So you can delay aerials or whatever slightly longer due to slightly more safety.

 

[JaggedCole]

Hello Mr. PPMD. I need some advice. I get really bad physical performance anxiety and I don't really what to do about it. My hands tense up really bad when I play and my body shakes slightly. Obviously anxiety in game is normal but it happens to me (albeit less often) in friendlies too. No like intrusive thoughts, it's just like physical stuff and sometimes it'll cause me to zone out. Anyways if you know what might help this especially in the moment of it happening I'm very interested.

 

[Dr Peepee]

In the moment, I don't know how much there is you can do. I still believe that deep breaths in which the exhale is longer than the inhale will help. Making sure your posture doesn't reduce airflow and increase tension is also important. Practicing in a way where you aren't forcing inputs is also very valuable.

You may be able to re-label your anxiety as excitement. They work along the same physical pathway in the body and this has been shown to work for some people.

It may be deeper emotional issues related to success or failure. For deep issues like this, they are often subconscious and the absence of conscious thought doesn't indicate security there.

 

[JaggedCole]

In the moment, I don't know how much there is you can do. I still believe that deep breaths in which the exhale is longer than the inhale will help. Making sure your posture doesn't reduce airflow and increase tension is also important. Practicing in a way where you aren't forcing inputs is also very valuable.

You may be able to re-label your anxiety as excitement. They work along the same physical pathway in the body and this has been shown to work for some people.

It may be deeper emotional issues related to success or failure. For deep issues like this, they are often subconscious and the absence of conscious thought doesn't indicate security there.

So a few questions. First, to relabel it as anxiety do I just consciously tell myself something like "I'm excited" whenever I feel the anxious feelings? Second is there optimal timing for deep breaths during a game. And third how do I not force inputs? I don't if that last one sounds dumb, but sometimes I'll force something and not be aware of doing it. I appreciate any and all advice.

 

[Dr Peepee]

Yes, you would consciously tell yourself that.

You can take the deep breaths between stocks and games or if you get hit high up, and perhaps eventually learn to do it automatically.

Practice not forcing inputs. You start slowly and build speed. Many people train incorrectly and don't actually do this and so they end up forcing things.

 

[JaggedCole]

Do you have any insight into playing to your strengths. I feel like for the longest time now I've been just emulating other people because I like learning about how people play and I've lost my ability to identify at all what my natural playstyle is. I also know that weaknesses need to be targeted, but I'm also a believer in the saying "hide the negatives, exploit the positives." So I guess my question is how do I get back to finding who I am as a player and using my strengths to play like myself instead of playing like I feel like I should based purely on how I see top players have success?

 

[Dr Peepee]

It helps to think about what you learn easily, or what you have the most fun doing, or what you think is most important. These areas are likely what you care more about and therefore can learn more easily and with fun.

 

[JaggedCole]

So I've noticed, as have people that play me a lot, that I get stuck a lot. Part of that is my hands tensing up, but another part is that I'm very slow to make decisions. It's not that I don't have an idea of what to do, but it feels like I have too many ideas and then I end up doing none of them or just picking a bad one. This has made me afraid of using aggression when I'm more zoned in even though I know it's necessary a lot of the time. So I guess my question is how do I just make the decision and not let myself get bogged down by my brain trying to pick through several options and/or consciously process my opponent's play?

 

[Dr Peepee]

I have found meditation useful to help me reduce mental clutter and think clearly at all times. Similarly for exercise.

It may be useful to think ahead of what kind of aggressive tactics you'd like to use or think are best and then pick from them when you're playing so it's a smaller list. Or maybe don't try to consider much at all and instead trust yourself to make good decisions.

 

[JaggedCole]

I have found meditation useful to help me reduce mental clutter and think clearly at all times. Similarly for exercise.

It may be useful to think ahead of what kind of aggressive tactics you'd like to use or think are best and then pick from them when you're playing so it's a smaller list. Or maybe don't try to consider much at all and instead trust yourself to make good decisions.

I've always struggled to trust myself which I think is definitely part of the problem. It's really hard for me choose the option without my brain reasoning that it's a good decision. Then again I do inevitably make decisions when I realize it's too late, but it's usually a bad one because of panic. I have however noticed that I play better when I'm just not thinking about the game at all and am instead doing something like having an unrelated conversation. This is not say that this how I should play, but more proof of how my brain works. I guess I just don't know how to trust myself while still being zoned in.

 

[Dr Peepee]

There may be ways to build trust in yourself that are and aren't Melee-related. For example, you may find it useful to notice that you successfully chose something you liked to eat, or made a life decision you're proud of, or knew what to say to a friend. In Melee, you may find it useful to notice when you successfully execute difficult tech and be proud of it, or when you do make good decisions. Sometimes we can over focus on when we make mistakes.

 

[JaggedCole]

There may be ways to build trust in yourself that are and aren't Melee-related. For example, you may find it useful to notice that you successfully chose something you liked to eat, or made a life decision you're proud of, or knew what to say to a friend. In Melee, you may find it useful to notice when you successfully execute difficult tech and be proud of it, or when you do make good decisions. Sometimes we can over focus on when we make mistakes.

I definitely only notice mistakes. I go in with ideas of what I want to do, so when I do them it's just like I'm driving down the road and nothing happens, but mistakes are like crashes.

 

[Dr Peepee]

It's important to celebrate your successes. You are capable of that.

 

[AnonymousID]

Merry Christmas PP! I got a couple questions if you don't mind answering

What do I do if I dair marth onto the side platforms, and he techs the direction I'm not covering. Lets say I uptilt the outside edge, but then he tech rolls in. I feel like now I'm stuck in the corner and marth has center stage. If I cover the inside edge and he rolls out it feels better but I'm still not sure how to push my advantage (If I even have any) without just getting hit with a shield drop aerial

What do you think of no FF lasers to mess with powershield timing?

What do I do when marth double jump airdodges back to stage? I'm thinking I can call it out with a back air but if he doesn't double jump i feel like that just puts me in a bad spot.

Thanks!

 

[Dr Peepee]

Merry Christmas!! =)

You can Fsmash to cover a tech roll even on the opposite side of the Dreamland platform. That's probably the easiest thing to do, but you could dash attack for something easier sometimes.

No FF is okay but the main problem is if they get it anyway or just hit you then it often messes you up. It'll mess some Marths up though.

You can sometimes Bair them before they airdodge, or if you grabbed the edge just before they airdodge you can react and DJ Bair or perhaps edgedash into something like Utilt if you go early.

 

[AnonymousID]

Merry Christmas!! =)

You can Fsmash to cover a tech roll even on the opposite side of the Dreamland platform. That's probably the easiest thing to do, but you could dash attack for something easier sometimes.

No FF is okay but the main problem is if they get it anyway or just hit you then it often messes you up. It'll mess some Marths up though.

You can sometimes Bair them before they airdodge, or if you grabbed the edge just before they airdodge you can react and DJ Bair or perhaps edgedash into something like Utilt if you go early.

Thank you!
For the first question though I was imagining me making a preemptive read but getting it wrong. So like I'm in lag and marth has time to put his shield up and threatens shield drop aerials.