Possible Oversights of 2nd Brawl Trailer!!!

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

These were all taken from ME PERSONALLY while reviewing the second trailer.

These are all "possible oversights", that doesn't mean nobody knows about them. In fact I may be the only one who hasn't. Worse comes to worse, this thread is closed... who cares?

*Story* It was just an average day on Smashboards when I decided to check what was said in a new post in a thread based on character discussion. It was said (by Creo*) that the platform to the left had eyes. This had not caught my attention during the countless times I had watched the trailer, so I decided to check it out for myself. While he was right about the eyes on the platform, they actually belonged to the hill underneath. That's when I noticed it had a more animatable color platform compared to the main stage, it blinked, and (this is what started my quest) in the last fraction of a second, it decended slightly! I was extatic to notice this, I bragged in the thread to everyone and thought to myself "Hey, I wonder if there's anything else I, myself, or anyone else had missed in this trailer?" That's when I took an hour and a half out of my night to study and review the trailer to find oversights. This should open some eyes on how Brawl will turn out ultimately. I hope you enjoy and learn from this, because I now am stoked. So stoked I decided not to sleep and write this thread. Hahaha... I'm pathetic...

Now for the good stuff:
(Notes highlighted with a star (*) were given to me by another person.)

1> Mario's fAir now appears to be A COMBINATION of Doc's and his own from Melee. Shoots Pikachu upward and forward with opening swing, much like Doc's, and on the follow through, knocks Kirby downward, much like Mario's.

2> Link's B (Bow and Arrow) seems to shoot possibly at full strength almost immediately. During Snake's portion of the video, while Snake jumps up on the platform where Link is, Link *begins* to charge his bow and releases the arrow which flies quickly and at a very minimal arc before being kicked from behind by Snake. It appears to have gone much farther and faster than would have been launched, if charged for the same amount of time, in Melee. *Also, Link's Smash Up A is significantly faster than it was in SSBM as well. (Thanks go to Ecstatic)

3> Pikachu's Smash fA appears to extend much longer than in Melee and SSB64. *Pikachu's Smash Down A has more range due to the increase in lightning it produces. (Thank you for reminding me Ecstatic)

4> During the Yoshi's Island stage portion, the raised platform is angled in a East by Northeast direction from left to right during (theorized to be) "Spring" season, and is angled West by Northwest in the (also theorized) "Summer to Fall" seasons. Also, during the "Summer" season, there is a hill with eyes noticeable to the left of the main stage, it appears to blink and move slightly downward during the last few fractions of the last second of the scene. Also note that it is totally absent during the "Spring" season in the scene prior.

5> During the scene showing Snake, Wario, Zamus, and Meta, Wario is seen being shot off the stage set on fire, while Snake appears have just recovered form having throwing something upward at him from underneath. A grenade move perhaps? *In one of the closing skirmish scenes involving Pit, Snake, Pikachu, and Kirby, Pit either jumps up to attack Snake and is disruppted by a grenade being spiked into him from above, OR he has made contact with Snake and Snake has countered him. At this angle recorded it is difficult to tell what is happening, but this gives us clue on what Snake's moves may be. (Thanks go again to Ecstatic)

*6> Ok, this one comes from the first trailer. In the fight scene in Meta Knight's level, right before we see Meta and the original 4 are duking it out in darkness, Mario throws a fireball off to the right of the stage mid-flight. It doesn't make contact with any character, but the "afterburn" or "tail" of the fireball hits Pikachu. If you play it slowly, you'll notice Pikachu blinks red right before he uses his recovery move. This is not a color used in his recovery in the past two games, and possibly is from damage recieved from the "tail" of the fireball. This doesn't happen in any of the past games. No knockback is recieved, but possibly slight damage from contact. (Thanks go to VanityAngel)

That's all for now. Thank you for reading, enjoy playing Melee for the time being. I can't wait for the next Brawl trailer! Thank (place desired supernatural deity here) for Smash!

 

[FaceFaceMcFace]

All of that stuff is some really spiffy observations. The most intriguing part to me is Mario's FAir, since that might make it less useful for shuffle combo setups, but more useful for kills. Now that I think about it though, from what you've said I'd guess that the move would send them in one of several different trajectories depending on how far into the move it is, and where in the hitbox you hit the enemy... much like Mario's current UAir (which I hope doesn't change.)

Hopefully I made sense.

 

[h1roshi]

mario's fair in brawl could be like pikas uair in melee. depending on what part of the cycle of the uair you hit them with, they get sent in a different direction...peace

-hiroshi

 

[DarkLordKefka]

does anybody else notice that fix seems to be carrying a motion sensor on his hip? or am I just pointing something worthless out?

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

No, I'm sure that's just part of his costume. He has a whole new upgraded look to him. He has a utility belt, an eye monitor, some gloves... not to mention his head is round now...

 

[tsetse]

Actually at the point in which the trailer was made the game was and still is in development. All the moves and animations are prolly going to be changed or tweaked somewhat. I think that for the most part the trailers were not made to let us see gameplay mechanics but moreso to show us that the game was in development.

 

[tstumo]

there's a part in the trailer where Wario does his fart move. not like the big over exagerated one in the first trailer.

 

[Sculelos]

there's a part in the trailer where Wario does his fart move. not like the big over exagerated one in the first trailer.

I must of missed that part...anyways here's to hoping that we get another trailer by mid July, only 3 months to go... then maby 4 months more for brawl, so if it hits in November I'll be extremely happy.

I'm hoping they show us at least 5 more chars in the next trailer, I'm just seriously hyped up, I probably watched the trailers at least a few dozen times now.

 

[rsc_390]

The "Hill with eyes" (lol makes me think of "The Hills have Eyes") that you speak of is from the Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island for Super Nintendo.

Actually i've always thought of him as more of a ghost or a blob of goo, since his transparency makes him look like one of the game's bosses who definitely isn't a hill. Also there's a standard platform on his head, which wouldn't be needed if he were a "hill"

Anyway, in the single level in which he makes an appearance (which might be the castle of said boss), you are forced depend on him for an entire chunk of the level (a HUGE pit). He stops and starts, and moves up and down, making the level pretty difficult. Every now and then he'll go to a spot and stop so that you can jump off him and collect some goodies. However, he will leave in short time so you have to be quick about collecting things. At the end of the portion, he slowly moves downward off of the screen.

I loved that guy when I first played that level. I think i named him Bob.

 

[tsetse]

i think it is cute you guys think brawl is coming out this year.

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

there's a part in the trailer where Wario does his fart move. not like the big over exagerated one in the first trailer.

No he doesn't. But there's one scene where Snake is crawling across a level and Wario is following him on all fours backwards. I have a theory that maybe this has something to do with it. Maybe he can only do that move in his "crawl" position?

 

[Sensai]

Something I noticed today while looking in my Nintendo Power magazine was that Fox has what appears to be a power level reader thing from Dragon Ball Z.

'IT'S OVER NINE THOUSAND!1111111111111111'

 

[Chepe]

Most of the observations have been noted by others. Mario's fair change, Link's faster arrows, the helper platform from Yoshi's Island, and Snake's grenade move have been speculated upon in other threads. The Pikachu thing Ive never heard of though, but I dont think it will be too significant...

About Snake's grenade, it most definitely is. There is another scene where you can see its physical form. In the scene where Snake, Pit, Kirby, and Pikachu fight on the Sky Sanctuary stage, Snake drops a grenade on the platform which detonates, destroying the platform and sending Pit off the stage. Some have been able to capture a screen which shows a small black object falling near Snake and onto the platform for a split second right when the scene starts. Snake also does a jerky movement that seems like the one seen in the Halberd scene later...

 

[ecstatic]

I was extatic to notice this

How could you misspell my name?

Anyways, great observations. I'm gonna go watch the trailer again because you're so awesome at observations... you've inspired me to try to find my own!

EDIT: I found WAY more than I thought. What I did was d/l it from IGN, and then play it in slow-mo. Here's what I found:

0:52- Meta Knight's roll in slow-mo is at least as fast as the fastest normal roll in Brawl. His lag is incredibly small, too. I wonder if rolls are getting faster in general...

1:37- Pika's dsmash now sends out sparks a that go slightly farther than his old dsmash, it looks like an effect untill you play it in slow-mo. This with Dyce's observation on his extended fsmash might a (IMO needed) range increase for Pika!

1:49- Link's usmash is MUCH faster.

1:51- Meta Knight has an ingame glide attack, not a big deal, but one could speculate that this is part of the "improved air games"

2:21- Is that Marth doing a spin attack/dolphin slash combo on Mario? It can't be Pit, because he's falling to the stage. And I'm pretty sure this guy had a cape.

Overall/unsure observations:

I know people have noticed this, but that's actual gameplay, isn't it? Where's the %'s? Are they taking the displays out to try to make it more "newbie-friendly" as Sakurai stated they'd try to do?

Meta Knight has 2 dashes it looks like. I didn't record the times, but one time he does a run->kick, and earlier in the trailer he does a run->slash.

Also, I can't tell one way or the other, but on Pit's stage, about 1:52, is Snake just throwing a bomb, or is Pit hitting him with his spinning blades move and Snake counters it with a bomb? I hope it's a counter!

I think I had another one, but I'm not sure. Oh, and Dyce, I saw all your observations, good eye!

 

[Keige]

i think it is cute you guys think brawl is coming out this year.

...
There's no reason to doubt that it will.

 

[DrGrimReaper]

RSC 390-- I know exactly which you speak of. At first it took me a second to remember but as you described the level it all came flooding back :-)

It makes one wonder.. if spoken of specfically enough, if a given gamer can recall every single memory from the games they've played. In otherwords.. how much can we recall on our own compared to how much we actually have stored in our memory.... :-o (mind boggle x_X)

 

[X-x-Dyce-x-X]

How could you misspell my name?

Anyways, great observations. I'm gonna go watch the trailer again because you're so awesome at observations... you've inspired me to try to find my own!

EDIT: I found WAY more than I thought. What I did was d/l it from IGN, and then play it in slow-mo. Here's what I found:

0:52- Meta Knight's roll in slow-mo is at least as fast as the fastest normal roll in Brawl. His lag is incredibly small, too. I wonder if rolls are getting faster in general...

1:37- Pika's dsmash now sends out sparks a that go slightly farther than his old dsmash, it looks like an effect untill you play it in slow-mo. This with Dyce's observation on his extended fsmash might a (IMO needed) range increase for Pika!

1:49- Link's usmash is MUCH faster.

1:51- Meta Knight has an ingame glide attack, not a big deal, but one could speculate that this is part of the "improved air games"

2:21- Is that Marth doing a spin attack/dolphin slash combo on Mario? It can't be Pit, because he's falling to the stage. And I'm pretty sure this guy had a cape.

Overall/unsure observations:

I know people have noticed this, but that's actual gameplay, isn't it? Where's the %'s? Are they taking the displays out to try to make it more "newbie-friendly" as Sakurai stated they'd try to do?

Meta Knight has 2 dashes it looks like. I didn't record the times, but one time he does a run->kick, and earlier in the trailer he does a run->slash.

Also, I can't tell one way or the other, but on Pit's stage, about 1:52, is Snake just throwing a bomb, or is Pit hitting him with his spinning blades move and Snake counters it with a bomb? I hope it's a counter!

I think I had another one, but I'm not sure. Oh, and Dyce, I saw all your observations, good eye!

Ok, I did what you said you did and I downloaded the video off IGN. Good idea btw.
Let me just comment on some of your findings:

1) Meta Knights roll: It is very quick, but I don't think that's what I was going for in this thread. I was kind of looking for abnormalities in comparison to old Melee gameplay or something about a level or character that someone had missed. That was also made pretty obvious since it's the basis of the clip taken.

2) Pikachu's Smash Down A: Haha... funny story. I actually put that in, but I also had a bit about how it sucked characters in. I thought that was Pichu's move and I put that in my notes as well. I doubted myself for a second and checked it out, Pikachu's Smash Down A is a tornado, Pichu's isn't. I deleted that whole part out of embarassment, including the bit about its range. Thanks for reminding me!

3) Link's Smash Up A: Yes it is very quick. I'll put that in.

4) Meta Knight's Glide: Also another obvious one. I didn't put it in because I'm sure many people have noticed it.

5) Gameplay?: Yes, I'm sure it's gameplay. But I doubt they would have taken out the percentages onscreen. It's probably just because they wanted you to see all of the new material, without the hub getting in the way.

6) Meta Knight's 2 Dash Attacks: Well, I think I see the problem... the first attack, the running slash (if it's the one against Kirby) is done while in a short hop. The second dash attack found much later in the video (against Wario) looks to be his actual dash attack. I think you misjudged, but please correct me if I'm wrong.

7) Who Attacked Who?: While it's very hard to tell, it appears that during Pit's desire to strike Snake, Snake hit him with a grenade or something. However, it could very well be a counter. But once again, I must make note that it's very hard to judge through those blasted clouds.

8) MARTH!?!?: I didn't believe my eyes when I read this one. I thought to myself, "No, he's wrong, that has to be Link and he misjudged something else as a cape or it's Meta Knight and he has bad eyes." Then upon further investigation I came to the conclusion that... IT'S MARTH!!! IT HAS TO BE!!! THE CAPE, THE BODY, THE SWING, THE MOVES!!! LADIES AND GENTLEMAN MARTH IS IN SUPER SMASH BROS. BRAWL!!! Ecstatic, WE NEED TO INFORM THE MASSES!!! INCREDIBLE FIND!!!

THANK YOU ECSTATIC, I'm going to update the list now. Don't worry, you'll get the sitation and thanks you deserve for this info.

 

[stryderhyru]

so this is reel ?

 

[tstumo]

1:51 into the gameplay trailer wario does his fart move. for the people that said no. watch him carefully kinda hard to notice.

 

[Funnypinoy87]

This is just my observation, but I don't think that's Marth.

When it cuts to the battle, all it really looks like is Link doin' his aerial Up+B in the air. He also falls down with his sword in his left hand; Link's dominant hand. I believe Marth is right handed.

 

[McFox]

...
There's no reason to doubt that it will.

He's right. At least for now, there's no reason to think that it won't launch this year.

For now.

And about Marth, I'm not really that concerned. Cool if he's in, fine if he's not. It's almost impossible to say from the footage. Yes, it's POSSIBLE that it's him. But it could also be somebody completely different who's taken on some moves similar to Marth's old moves. See: Zamus vs. Sheik.

 

[Red Exodus]

It's not Link, the person has a cape and he's/she's right handed. Marth is right handed, Link uses his sword with his left and shield with his right. It appears that Link is also in the same scene so it might not Link since they don't show dittos. It could be another FE character.

But that's not the biggest thing, is that mystery character wavedashing? I keep watching it and it looks like a wavedash but it might be a fast roll, I can't be certain but it looks more like a wavedash.

 

[Kel]

I'm pretty sure that's Link guys. I'm not here to start a flame war of any kind. I'm just saying that It looks an awful lot like link's areial Up B. And when he lands, after he rolls right, I'm pretty sure he's left handed and has a sword.

What's more notable about that sequence is the fact that Link's Up B didn't have any lag when he landed before he rolled right. Of course a lot of the stuff we've seen involves little to no lag. There's a clip where Wario dash attacks Pit on the battlefield-like stage and I can't tell if Pit techs in place or just recovers super quickly. They most likely just haven't decided what lag to give each character with their moves in attempt to balance the game yet is my guess.

The other thing is, why would they just keep him from us if they've already got his character in that fox scene with a moveset?

 

[NG7]

Oh my god! You guys almost gave me a heart attack.

That is not Marth in the ending clip.

It is very. very. VERY. clearly Link.

 

[tstumo]

yeah it's Link. the "cape" looks more like a hat to me. and they arent that stupid to show him in the trailer if he hasnt already been confirmed. plus the ^ b move has link written all over it

 

[Funnypinoy87]

Kel has a point; if the mysterious character is in that scene, why not introduce them as well.? I mean, it has a move set, and everyone knows who Marth is.

Kind of pointless to point out one new character, when there's "another" one on the same screen. It should be Link.

That's just speculation, of course.

 

[Red Exodus]

I don't really care who it is there's some more important. Was that a wavedash they did when Fox dash attacked?

 

[Funnypinoy87]

I saw that too, but I doubt it is. There are no advanced techniques in the video. I don't think I saw a single tech..

 

[McFox]

The rolls are a hell of a lot quicker now. Watch earlier in the video at :57 when Metaknight rolls behind Kirby, or 1:13 when Pit does the same to Wario. I'm not sure if they're removing Wavedashing, but they're DEFINITELY marginalizing its usefulness. With a roll like that, Wavedashing would be kind of obsolete, I would think. So it's probably a newer, improved roll with Link at the end of the trailer.

 

[tstumo]

yeah it kinda looks like it but i doubt it. cant really determine what it is. i also noticed the little thing fox had on his side lit up or blinked really really fast. about 2:22 something blue blinks real fast. right before fox goes to the bottom to fight Link and do the thing that looks like a wave dash.

 

[Red Exodus]

I firgured so. Oh well only time can tell. The quality wasn't high enough for me to decipher, I looked for the little 'puff' that comes along with WDing but I couldn't tell since the camera was panning upwards.

I just noticed the blue flash, I have no idea what that is.

 

[The_Corax_King]

That is definitely link doing his up B...

you can see his sheild before he lands... and that is CLEARLY an upB

edit: he is also clearly holding his right hand foward with a shield after he lands...

watch the video on the official website... the quality is better...

 

[Devastlian]

That's very obviously Link and is obviously a roll. The landing smoke is there (the white flame looking thing) and the his animation is his SSBM forward roll albeit faster. That blue glimmer is probably just an uncharged/worn down Reflector.

 

[krlos F.]

omg i almost had heartattack reading about Marth! on 2:21! oh man! come on! clearly it's link! don't u see the shield after finisht his up+b attack! and just on the 2:22 u can see the shield! i was just about make a party in my home for the returning of marth! T_T but not... it's link!

 

[GimR]

That'sLink doing up-B, not Marth, go to gametrailers .com to watch in HD

 

[Wrath`]

so mario will get doc good traits

 

[ecstatic]

Yeah... I guess mine was lo-res, how about my other observations, though?

 

[keko_keko]

On HD it looks like the blue flash was fox's reflector move (would explain why pit is sent flying), does this mean his moveset hasn't changed or he just retained a few moves. Also they kick he does towards link when the fall down near the very end looks normal.

 

[Dylan_Tnga]

Marth isnt there, I watched the slowed down version. Link hits them with his up b, mario flies high in the air and shoots fireballs, link lands on the ground and rolls backwards, fox does his dash attack towards link and the character on the far left recovering has wings and does 2 double jumps, and obviously is Pit.

Who came up with this rumor? It's not even mildly believable and the ''evidence'' doesn't even exist in the slightest :S

 

[ecstatic]

Ok, I just watched the clip with Fox in HD like a dozen times in a row. It's defiently Link, sorry for all the "heart attacks" and such. What I can tell you is that he moves A LOT like Marth in the air, because that is not his normal UpB, nor roll.

With the roll "observation" I knew it was obvious, but I just wanted to point out just how little lag he has even in slow-mo. I just tested every Melee character, and no one rolls with that little lag (G&W is closest), and very few actually roll at that speed. My point is that Brawl is going to be faster, but probably without WD/Lcancels.