Pokemon Black and White (Spoiler Warning)

[Wave⁂]

Tangrowth is pretty slow even after +2, Shiftry is a better Growther.

 

[Claire Diviner]

so i read somewhere that growth gives +2/+2 in sun.

Tangrowth???!?!?!?!!!?

I've heard that too, but I don't believe it's been confirmed. I may actually be wrong. X__x

 

[kirbyraeg]

Tangrowth is pretty slow even after +2, Shiftry is a better Growther.

It isn't actually a speed boost, it's a +2 Atk/+2 SpAtk boost. And it apparently only does this in sun, so the speed boost is already there...in which case Tangrowth's excellent mixed movepool is like really good.

i bet it winds up being a disproved rumor, since that really does sound too good to be true.

 

[Claire Diviner]

i bet it winds up being a disproved rumor, since that really does sound too good to be true.

It often is. But given the many buffs to older moves in B/W, such a change would hardly be surprising. Still, without concrete confirmation, all we can do is wait until the games either come out worldwide, or someone tests this to get said confirmation of such a boost.

 

[Kofu]

so i read somewhere that growth gives +2/+2 in sun.

Tangrowth???!?!?!?!!!?

From what I understand, it's confirmed, but I can test it if you like.

 

[Wave⁂]

It isn't actually a speed boost, it's a +2 Atk/+2 SpAtk boost. And it apparently only does this in sun, so the speed boost is already there...in which case Tangrowth's excellent mixed movepool is like really good.

i bet it winds up being a disproved rumor, since that really does sound too good to be true.

Tangrowth is still pretty slow after the +2 from the Chlorophyll boost.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Tangrowth is still pretty slow after the +2 from the Chlorophyll boost.

Yeah, but doubling its 50 base Speed means it will be able to speed tie with Salamence and other base 100s. It may not be stellar for Speed, but given its great physical bulk and attacking stats on both sides of the spectrum, it becomes pretty scary. You gotta think about some of the possibilities here.

 

[Kofu]

Actually, when stats are doubled, the ACTUAL stat is doubled, not the Base Stat. Maxing out Tangrowth's Speed, then doubling it, gives it 436 Speed, on par with a hypothetical Base 149 Speed.

Not shabby at all.

 

[kirbyraeg]

We could settle with 80/176/252 with a rash nature. +2 of a +nature base 100 spatk is good. Solarbeam, Earthquake with decent mixed power, HP Fire/Return for coverage in sun, and hitting 418 speed. It won't outspeed base 80 scarfers without running Naive, but that's a decision for players to make vs. arguing about the effectiveness of the set.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Actually, when stats are doubled, the ACTUAL stat is doubled, not the Base Stat. Maxing out Tangrowth's Speed, then doubling it, gives it 436 Speed, on par with a hypothetical Base 149 Speed.

Not shabby at all.

Wow! I'll be d***ed! You're right. So with that, Tangrowth becomes even scarier. Like I said to my friends, Fire, Water and Grass-types are getting the largest buffs the moment Nintendo distributes DroughtTales and DrizzleToed! X3

 

[kirbyraeg]

Straight from the smogon research thread in case we weren't sure about it before:

"Confirmed Growth now raises the user's Attack and SpAttk. If the weather is Sun, Growth raises Attack and SpAttk two stages each"

List of things that could abuse this in sun quite nicely:
Tangrowth (Great mixed attacking stats, workable speed with chlorophyll)
Venusaur (good movepool, nice mixed defenses)
Victreebel (Good mixed attacking stats, good speed)
Shiftry (Good attacking stats, stab on Dark)
Shaymin/Shaymin-S (should be clear why these are good even without a chlorophyll boost)

 

[Charmander]

Its seems Groudon/shaymin is gonna be very common in ubers with growths new update

 

[Z'zgashi]

Soooo imma try and get active here as black/white will be my life when the games come out.

Hi charmander :D

 

[Claire Diviner]

@Kirbyraeg: I can see Tangrowth and Venusaur using Growth very effectively. Victreebel and Shiftry can use it well too, but may need to watch out due to their lack of bulk. Still, Grass has really become scary, and just as well: it's one of my favorite types.

 

[Wrath`]

I am glad I carry three pokemon that know Flamethrower for all these Grass boosts. That does suck tho, as long as a switch in can survive the +2 boost any fire move should just decimate the Growther in sun. (Obvious statement is obvious)

 

[Claire Diviner]

I am glad I carry three pokemon that know Flamethrower for all these Grass boosts. That does suck tho, as long as a switch in can survive the +2 boost any fire move should just decimate the Growther in sun. (Obvious statement is obvious)

True, but I always imagined Sunny Day teams to have a mix of both Grass and Fire-types... Heatran, especially for the latter to switch in predicted Fire attacks aimed at one's Grass-type for a Flash Fire boost.

 

[Wrath`]

Or shandeera, but wich would benefit a Sunny grass team best? Also if you get out predicted and come in on an earthquake it could be bad, but thats therymon for ya.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Or shandeera, but wich would benefit a Sunny grass team best? Also if you get out predicted and come in on an earthquake it could be bad, but thats therymon for ya.

That too is also true for any Heatran not equipped with the nifty new godsend, the Balloon, which - as you know - gives the holder Ground immunity until it takes damage from an attack. Thankfully, Stealth Rock and other indirect damage are confirmed to not affect the Balloon.

 

[Chill]

Straight from the smogon research thread in case we weren't sure about it before:

"Confirmed Growth now raises the user's Attack and SpAttk. If the weather is Sun, Growth raises Attack and SpAttk two stages each"

List of things that could abuse this in sun quite nicely:
Tangrowth (Great mixed attacking stats, workable speed with chlorophyll)
Venusaur (good movepool, nice mixed defenses)
Victreebel (Good mixed attacking stats, good speed)
Shiftry (Good attacking stats, stab on Dark)
Shaymin/Shaymin-S (should be clear why these are good even without a chlorophyll boost)

Oh god, that's awesome. I need to breed a good mixed tangrowth now.

 

[Z'zgashi]

Woah i didnt know about the balloon, thats a nifty little item.

 

[Kofu]

I downloaded PO today so I could try my hand at battling and found out that Return isn't implemented correctly. :/

My team is awful, but it's apparent that I've got a bit more talent than some of these other players. I've seen a Skarmory with Air Slash and a Doryuuzu that, apparently, only had Earthquake and Shadow Claw as its attacking moves, lol. I'll have to figure out a better team, though.

Looks like fun, I will say that.

 

[kirbyraeg]

Only thing wrong with return is that your pokemon's default happiness is zero.

I did that too first time i used it xD

there's lots of small annoying things that i don't like about PO but yeah...until PkmnLab gets gen v we're stuck using it. =/

 

[Charmander]

Balloon should be very usefull, Balloon Magnezone anyone?
Oh, and Hi Gashi

 

[Chis]

Yeah, balloon is a really good item on the mole. Hippo can't stop you now.

 

[Moozle]

Do entry hazards break the balloon?

 

[Kofu]

Nope.

You'll need to hit it with an actual attack.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Heatran with a Balloon will also be a staple on almost all teams that want/need a Heatran.

 

[Daddy Ash]

can't you edit the base happiness in the team builder using the advanced settings on PO, or is that Shoddy only? And if you can't then wouldn't frustration be a better move, seeing as it grows more powerful the less your liked?

 

[Claire Diviner]

Aww, Daddy Ash beat me to it! But yeah, he has a point. XD

Also, what is this PO anyway? Is it similar to Shoddy or anything of the sort? It sounds rather interesting. Pity I've no PC to download it. T-T

 

[Daddy Ash]

It's Pokemon Online, another online battle simulator, notably it is the only sim. I know of to be running a Gen V teambuilder and servers.
And cool I actually beat someone on here to a post about some relevant lol

 

[Z'zgashi]

PO is down, nooooo

 

[Claire Diviner]

PO is down, nooooo

There's always the option of turning on your DS and battling on wi-fi. That's what I prefer, anyway. XD

 

[Wave⁂]

>Implying I have a DS

 

[Claire Diviner]

>Implying I have a DS

Does that mean you don't have a DS? Sorry, I'm bad with taking hints. X_x

If so, that sucks... unless you never cared to get one, in which case, everything is fine. XD

 

[Terywj [태리]]

There's always the option of turning on your DS and battling on wi-fi. That's what I prefer, anyway. XD

Typically if he's using Pokemon Online if he's trying to play Black / White.

Although the changes to Growth under Sunny Day is awesome. if Swords Dance Venusaur was fierce in UU, then I can see Venusaur going places, albeit lacking Chlorophyll.

 

[kirbyraeg]

Am I the only one who thinks Alakazam+Gengar is the best offensive pair ever?

Like seriously...the only thing that beats both of them is scizor, which is just the reason to run Magnezone, and gengar x4 resists U-turn, so even a CB u-turn will only do like 30%. Zam outspeeds ScarfTar and both can run Substitute to get around Sucker Punch.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Am I the only one who thinks Alakazam+Gengar is the best offensive pair ever?

Like seriously...the only thing that beats both of them is scizor, which is just the reason to run Magnezone, and gengar x4 resists U-turn, so even a CB u-turn will only do like 30%. Zam outspeeds ScarfTar and both can run Substitute to get around Sucker Punch.

True, but say you switch out your Gengar or Zam for Magnezone, the opponent may predict the switch and go with Pursuit instead. Of course, it'll be as good as dead with Magnezone in, but you may also be down 1 Gengar or Zam. Of course, if either are running HP Fire, and you predict the Scizor will use anything not named "Bullet Punch", then you're pretty much golden. Ahh, Pokémon is such a wonderful mindgame in its own, is it not? X3

 

[Wave⁂]

Well, there's always Blissey, but Blissey loses to half of the metagame.

 

[Terywj [태리]]

(I think there should be some sort of differentiation so this thread and the competitive theorymon thread don't overlap but maybe that's just me.)

Weavile is faster than both Alakazam and Gengar and obviously has Night Slash / Pursuit to damage them, but as always has issues with frailty, but would probably be more suited for a revenger anyways. Swellow is also faster than both and wrecks with a Guts-boosted Facade / Brave Bird. Starmie is faster than Gengar (minus Choice Scarf) but takes hits like a girl anyways.

Alakazam+Gengar do seem like a potent pair.

 

[Claire Diviner]

Weavile is certainly a great counter for the two. Starmie and Swellow aren't counters by the strictest definition of the word, but can scare them off. In Starmie's case, however, it may not OHKO them due to Gengar and Zam having decent Sp. Defense.