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Pokemon’s gigantic popularity drop after gen 1

MasterWarlord

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I’m mainly curious as to what generation 2 did to kill Pokemon, as I just really don’t see enough reasons. Yes, there are new Pokemon, but generation 2 still has many, many old Pokemon throughout the game – it revolves around the old Pokemon more than the newly introduced ones. Rattata is the Rattata of Johto – Sentret is only on a single route or two. Johto would be quite a barren place if the original 151 Pokemon were nowhere to be found. There’s enough familiar territory in Gold and Silver for veterans to not get scared off.

Now, generation 3 was practically unrecognizable when it first came out and was trying to distance itself from the past Pokemon games. There were only a handful of old Pokemon in the game while the new ones were without a doubt the main ones in the spotlight. That’s not all, though – all of the hard work we’d done over the past 2 generations were thrown out the window with the new games not being trade compatible to these games. While those are the main things, the other thing I really regret about generation 3 and onwards is how there was never a real “Stadium” game on par with gens 1 and 2 – Colosseum’s mode that tries to emulate Stadium is impressively bare bones and has no Rental Pokemon.

Speaking of Colosseum, yes, the old Pokemon were brought back through it, but only the Johto Pokemon – not the Kanto Pokemon that holds Pokemon’s formerly gigantic fanbase. Even for those who were happy to see the Johto Pokemon come back, it was hardly worth playing through such a mediocre title. Eventually the original 151 were brought back – in the exact same game that we played at the start of all this. Ignoring the fact that we’re not stupid enough to pay money for the same game god knows how much later, this game is compatible with only Colosseum rather than the Stadium games.

Yeah, I’m a pretty big Pokemon fan and I actually do like gen 3, but I refused to buy Sapphire until Colosseum got me somewhat used to the 3rd gen Pokemon. While I love gen 3 now, I can see plenty of reasons why everybody felt so alienated by it. Pokemon didn’t entirely die in the mainstream during the days of gen 2, but gen 3 made the Pokemon name much less recognizable.
 

UberMario

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It was a fad when it came out, fads die hard for unexpected reasons. Plus a lot of companies tried to make Pokemon look controversial which hurt it somewhat.
 

MasterWarlord

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It was a fad when it came out, fads die hard for unexpected reasons. Plus a lot of companies tried to make Pokemon look controversial which hurt it somewhat.
Almost all of those attacks on Pokemon claiming that it rotted the brains of children and turned them evil and what not happened during Pokemon's prime in gen 1. It was only attacked because it was so insanely popular - once it stopped being in the spotlight, people stopped insisting that because kids liked it so much it must be the work of demons (Their only "reason" for attacking it). If those "attacks" had any effect, it should've caused Pokemon to die out during gen 1.
 

finalark

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While Pokemon's popularity dropped after gen 1, it's still one of the single most recognizable franchises in the world. Kids still play it (if my many younger relatives are telling the truth), the card game is still kicking and the cartoon has been running for what, thirteen years now? I think that it wasn't the games themselves that caused Pokemon's popularity to drop. It's as UberMario said, it was a fad, and those tend to die relatively quickly.

The thing was Pokemon when it first came out was that it was brand new and nobody had seen anything like it in mainstream gaming. I think what caused it's popularity to drop was all of the imitations and some of the mild bad publicity it received from some organizations.
 

flyinfilipino

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Pretty much what UberMario and finalark said; Pokemon was new and different when it started out, like all fads. Once Game Freak started to settle down for the long haul, the general public had grown accustomed used to it and Pokemon just became one of the biggest video game franchises.
 

UberMario

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Almost all of those attacks on Pokemon claiming that it rotted the brains of children and turned them evil and what not happened during Pokemon's prime in gen 1. It was only attacked because it was so insanely popular - once it stopped being in the spotlight, people stopped insisting that because kids liked it so much it must be the work of demons (Their only "reason" for attacking it). If those "attacks" had any effect, it should've caused Pokemon to die out during gen 1.
No, but it would cause succeeding titles to not be as popular, though the fact the "gotta have it!" fad died out due to the dynamic game industry probably was more significant.
 

finalark

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I think that one of the issues that caused Pokemon to take a dip in popularity is how little it's evolved in terms of game play. Sure, there have been plenty of tweaks and additions along the way but for the most part it does feel like the same game. Don't get me wrong, I love Pokemon but that's a fact that cannot be ignored.
 

M.K

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises

Considering the fact that Pokemon is the #2 greatest selling franchise after Mario with over 200 million ever sold, I don't think there was a major drop in popularity at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pokemon_Red/Blue#Reception_and_legacy

The very fact that of the 200 million sold, only 18 million were from Generation 1 (in both Japan and North America) sort of disproves this whole theory of unpopularity.

Just because you're in a grade level (assuming, of course) that's higher than maybe 8th grade in which playing Pokemon is, inherently, "unaccepted" or "uncool", doesn't mean the entire franchise is suddenly taboo. In psychology, this is called the False Consensus Effect, or the tendency for people to overestimate the degree to which others agree with them.
 

Fuelbi

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Wait a second, let me correct you. I think you mean that the popularity dropped after gen 2.

Every single person that I've talked to about this has mostly said that the series started going worse after gen two. People stopped liking the anime after gen 2, much less people like gen 3 rather than gen 2 and gen 4 ain't helping bring up the opinion, people I know stopped liking the card game after.... ok they started hating it after gen 1, but for the most part, I think popularity started going down. That's not to say that everybody hates it, because like MK said, it's the 2nd greatest selling franchise behind Mario, meaning it still has a huge fan base, including us.
 

UberMario

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No it was definitely after Gen 1 that the popularity hype dropped, I definitely remember that. In fact I'm pretty sure it dropped about a year before G/S came out anyway.


And also sales mean pretty much nothing in terms of popularity hype. Wii Sports and Wii Play both exceeded the record (previously held by Super Mario Bros) for most units purchased recently, yet they'll never recieve the same hype as Mario or Pokemon.
 

Wave⁂

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New things are always cool. Old things with a new name aren't as cool.
The very fact that of the 200 million sold, only 18 million were from Generation 1 (in both Japan and North America) sort of disproves this whole theory of unpopularity.
[/thread]
 

Fuelbi

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No it was definitely after Gen 1 that the popularity hype dropped, I definitely remember that. In fact I'm pretty sure it dropped about a year before G/S came out anyway.


And also sales mean pretty much nothing in terms of popularity hype. Wii Sports and Wii Play both exceeded the record (previously held by Super Mario Bros) for most units purchased recently, yet they'll never recieve the same hype as Mario or Pokemon.
Oh come on, that's pretty much because they came in bundled with the Wii, not because people actually went out and sought them.

EDIT:

You know, this thread sorta proves that gen 2 stayed popular within us, then started going down in gen 3.
 

Janne

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I thought quite the opposite. During Gen II I believe was the peak of Pokemon then declined somewhere in the middle of Gen III to Gen IV
 

Ryu Shimazu

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Something is a fad = Gen 1 and 2

Gen 3 and 4 were for hardcore fans, the fad was dead. Fads don't last forever guys.


Gen5 is looking like Gen1/2 material though, a lot of friends I have that never liked 3/4 are liking 5 so far.
 

finalark

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Gen5 is looking like Gen1/2 material though, a lot of friends I have that never liked 3/4 are liking 5 so far.
I have to agree. A friend of mine who found that the franchise had gone stale for him around the time Gen 3 rolled around suddenly became interested again once I told him how different they're trying to make Gen 5.
 

Janne

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Something is a fad = Gen 1 and 2

Gen 3 and 4 were for hardcore fans, the fad was dead. Fads don't last forever guys.


Gen5 is looking like Gen1/2 material though, a lot of friends I have that never liked 3/4 are liking 5 so far.
Yay, thank goodness for more Pokemon fans for this generation.
 

Ryu Shimazu

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I have to agree. A friend of mine who found that the franchise had gone stale for him around the time Gen 3 rolled around suddenly became interested again once I told him how different they're trying to make Gen 5.
Heres my person experience with Pokemon

1st Gen = I was a little fat **** and thought it was fun (Seriously, I was like over 100lbs overweight lol)

2nd Gen = Ditto(pun)

3rd Gen = Was fun, but it declined. Perhaps due to lack of different material. IV/EV did make it vastly different, but what young child is going to get that

4th Gen = Halfway in it I picked it up and realized, holy **** I'm the best in my school. (Not saying much out of 20 people) Began to breed and stuff to realize I can hold my own in Pokemon, and overall do better in it than Brawl (and I'm not terrible there)

All that to say.

Gen1/2 gameplay/designs/music OWNED ++++++

Gen3/4 Focused so hard on metagame and mechanics, the rest declined. Because it declined, sales declined. (Though Gen3/4 mechanics are MUCH LOVED)

So pretty much Gen4 hooked me (I breed nigh-perfect pokemon), but the I love the old designs more.

That said, gen 5 has the good mechanics + the good designs = it has potential to be a Salamence and Sweep Sales D: (lol)


Edit: As for Gen5 love, Zekrom ALMOST made my number 1 Pokemon. It still looses to Ttar though, I love my Tyranitar.
 

MasterWarlord

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I agree that if there was point when Pokemon -should've- lost it's popularity, it should've been gen 3. There was still some of the mainstream hype there during gen 2, but it was a far cry from that of gen 1.

Yes, I am aware of how Pokemon is still going strong and is still a huge name - but in the gaming world only. Before, you could go to actual random people IRL and find people who were aware of what Pokemon is. It's still huge now, but it was so impossibly gigantic before that it seems like it's only a shadow of its' former self.

I suppose that, yeah, it basically just boils down to the fact it was a fad, and the people who weren't shallow enough to die off during gen 2 were generally turned off by gen 3.
 

UberMario

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Oh come on, that's pretty much because they came in bundled with the Wii, not because people actually went out and sought them.
A. Wii Play was sold independently, but since it came with a Wiimote it was basically a controller with a $10 game.

B. Super Mario Bros came bundled with most Nintendo Entertainment Systems.
 

Fuelbi

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A. Wii Play was sold independently, but since it came with a Wiimote it was basically a controller with a $10 game.

B. Super Mario Bros came bundled with most Nintendo Entertainment Systems.
Ok, but I bet you parents were just looking for the better deal when they got Wii Play along with the Wiimote

The difference between Super Mario Bros and Wii Sports is the fact that people actually liked SMB
 

Chill

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_game_franchises

Considering the fact that Pokemon is the #2 greatest selling franchise after Mario with over 200 million ever sold, I don't think there was a major drop in popularity at all.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pokemon_Red/Blue#Reception_and_legacy

The very fact that of the 200 million sold, only 18 million were from Generation 1 (in both Japan and North America) sort of disproves this whole theory of unpopularity.

Just because you're in a grade level (assuming, of course) that's higher than maybe 8th grade in which playing Pokemon is, inherently, "unaccepted" or "uncool", doesn't mean the entire franchise is suddenly taboo. In psychology, this is called the False Consensus Effect, or the tendency for people to overestimate the degree to which others agree with them.
RBY sold 30 million worldwide, GCS 17 million RSE 15 million DPPt 17 million. Those numbers may not be perfectly accurate,I haven't looked them up in a long time, but I recall them being something like this. RBY definitely sold more than 18 million, those are the US and JPN numbers only.
 

Purtle

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I think it died after gen II.

From the vast majority of people I have talked to over my short lifetime(almost 18), most people played and enjoyed gen II. Many even said genII was there favorite or just as good as genI.
 

M.K

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RBY sold 30 million worldwide, GCS 17 million RSE 15 million DPPt 17 million. Those numbers may not be perfectly accurate,I haven't looked them up in a long time, but I recall them being something like this. RBY definitely sold more than 18 million, those are the US and JPN numbers only.
Ah, the numbers I found were only for Red/Blue. Forgot to factor in Yellow's sales.
Regardless, the number you have for DPPt is only for D/P, as DPPt sold over 21 million all together.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pokémon_Diamond_and_Pearl#Reception

Regardless, unless you provide a source, I can't readily accept your numbers as true.
 

UltiMario

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The popularity drop is mainly because the entire world started to insist if you were over 8 years old you were too old for Pokemon.

Also the fact people can't counter higher than 151 was a problem.
 

zelda rocks

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In my opinion, the series began dipping following Generation II; G/S/C improved upon the originals in nearly every aspect; actual GBC support, Day/Night system, 100 new creatures, etc. Nintendo couldn't follow suit when Generation III rolled around --never managed to pick any of them up because I had begun to lose interest; coincidentally, having later attempted to play Emerald through emulation, the charm was gone, and I quit shortly after the initial trek to the first Gym... After the lackluster performance of Generation III, Nintendo finally redeemed themselves with the release of D/P/P, which I thoroughly enjoyed --what aspects of the game I got to play and see in motion (through less than ideal means)--and finally, HH/SS; which I consider the greatest Pokemon games of all time :)
 

*JuriHan*

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lol what? ****s always been popular. as for the pokemon being demon **** the catholic pope said good things about pokemon iirc google it i forgot his exact words. i think it was because the game encouraged a posituve value or something

edit: here

http://www.theescapist.com/pokemon11.htm
 
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