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"PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale": Sony's version of Super Smash Bros.

sfkingalpha

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Will be maining Crash or Parapa.

Crash will be announced... you know he will.

So it looks like most of the community aren't pissed about this game/calling it a rip off etc. I mean of coarse it is but it looks like it'll be fun just as smash is.
 

soviet prince

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I rather then copy a successful fun formula like sb then make there own terrible engine :p
 

lordvaati

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here is a vid showing Overtime mode.

in a nutshell, when the time runs out and there is a draw, they add an additional minute to the clock, and the amount of meter players gain is doubled. this is way better then Smash's "put everyone at 300% and drop Bomb-ombs" method.
 

~automatic

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Sudden Death's not bad (it really isn't) but having bombs appear after 10 or so seconds ruins it imo. Overtime is definitely a welcome innovation to the genre.
 

SmashChu

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It's a pretty popular franchise, and it gets quite a bit of press. So I think Sony did make the right move including him. The problem was that he got leaked prior to E3.
If I didn't know it until E3, I still wouldn't have been impressed.

There are a lot of characters who are popular and get more press. You might as well went with the guy from mass Effect as it's the same relation to Sony. Plus, again, there are better options that still have more to do with Sony. A big problem is this is the first game so a roster needs to be established. Adding someone like Big Daddy doesn't help it.

here is a vid showing Overtime mode.

in a nutshell, when the time runs out and there is a draw, they add an additional minute to the clock, and the amount of meter players gain is doubled. this is way better then Smash's "put everyone at 300% and drop Bomb-ombs" method.
My problem with Overtime is it's just continuing the game with an extra minute. I'd rather have it be once you get killed you are out of the match. It also prevents you going into overtime again.

Smash's is an actual Sudden Death. It's suppose to be quick and adds more tension to a match. The overtime doesn't seem as fun, at least not how it's set up now.
 

theeboredone

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I think it's fun and can be used in tournaments as well. If you're doing one on one, and the match goes overtime...well your supers build up that much faster and now you are either fighting to protect the lead or making a last ditch effort to grab it.
 

~automatic

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The only way to score a kill in PSASBR is via super anyways so having both characters begin with a Lv. 3 would be stupid since the player with a safer/more effective super would easily win. OT works well for this game's format.
 

Morin0

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I kind of wish Sweet Tooth looks like he did in the old days.




I don't know when he got so fat and his face became a mask, lol.
 

Claire Diviner

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I kind of wish Sweet Tooth looks like he did in the old days.




I don't know when he got so fat and his face became a mask, lol.
I never thought Sweet Tooth was fat now. I always thought he either hit the gym hardcore, or took roids. Who knows?

I also never knew his clown face was actually a mask, unless they decided to retcon his face.
 

Morin0

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I never thought Sweet Tooth was fat now. I always thought he either hit the gym hardcore, or took roids. Who knows?

I also never knew his clown face was actually a mask, unless they decided to retcon his face.
You can see straps on his face in this close-up:



I'd say he got fat and a bit bulky lol

 

lordvaati

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Maj reveals new info about the gameplay features:

Thank you sir, that’s good to hear. Was there anything specific that you wanted to know about?

Guess i’ll start with truendymion’s questions and provide as much information as i can. Keep in mind that everything i’m about to say could change over the next few months, but this is where we’re at right now with Battle Royale.

1) There’s no hitstun increase like Smash, because it wouldn’t really add anything to our game engine or resolve any problems that we might face. There’s no hitstun deterioration like Marvel, because although it’s a convenient system, none of us really like the idea of basic reactions changing halfway through a combo. We feel it’s better to keep attack behavior consistent as much as possible, so that players can move combo pieces around freely.

2) Currently throws are untechable, but this is a perfect example of something that could easily change over the next few weeks as we buckle down on playtesting for balance. Judging by the current state of the game, i personally happen to think that we can get away with oldschool untechable throws. But it’s not a terribly difficult feature to add, so we’ll see how it goes.

3) There’s no air control during hitstun, but i’m sure you’ve seen characters automatically flipping out of air reactions to regain mobility. Ed Ma has been experimenting with adding SFA3-style directional control to our automatic tech flips. You still wouldn’t be able to escape early out of true hitstun, but you’d have some control over how you recover in the air. We’re actually trying to be very careful about how our characters recoup from scary situations like air reactions, knockdowns, and things like that. You should always have a few defensive options under pressure.

4) Most characters can cancel moves into other moves, but it’s not as fomulaic as SF4′s normal -> special -> super. Canceling between attacks is much more of a character-specific feature in Battle Royale, but it’s still pretty intuitive once you actually get your hands on a character. I think you guys will have a lot of fun exploring our roster.

5) At the moment, quite a few characters can combo into their super moves in various unique ways. Everyone seems to have a different way of approaching it. Generally speaking, lvl2 supers are the easiest to combo into, but that ends up being kind of an expensive way to guarantee a single KO. There’s definitely a cost vs benefit decision to consider here, and those choices shift frequently over the course of a match.

6) All super attacks are unblockable, but as you’ve seen by now, there are many other ways to avoid them. We wanted to give people that exciting moment of figuring out a way to dodge Drake’s crumbling wall or Fat Princess’ giant chicken. I’m sure you’ll agree that having everyone stand around blocking supers would’ve led to incredibly boring gameplay. (We tried it a long time ago, and sure enough, it made us all sleepy.)

7?) Beating Sly on paper and beating Sly in a real match are two different things. He’s quite difficult to pin down! Mobility is never an issue for him and he can definitely hold his own in a fight. But really, what makes me happy is that we’ve got creative designers like Ray Ray Shen who come up with interesting gameplay proposals for unorthodox characters like Sly – and that Omar and Paul are willing to roll the dice on stuff like this.

At the very least, the Battle Royale community will have some extremely interesting discussions about Sly Cooper a year from now. And i think the fighting game community as a whole will benefit from those discussions.
 

SmashChu

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I think it's fun and can be used in tournaments as well. If you're doing one on one, and the match goes overtime...well your supers build up that much faster and now you are either fighting to protect the lead or making a last ditch effort to grab it.
There is no keeping the lead since everyone is tied. My big beef with overtime is it doesn't really make for a big finish. It just tries to resolve a tie. Sudden Death in Smash was a big finish.

They don't have to do it like Smash does though. I would be fine with over time if it was a 1 life thing. Having it the way it is isn't very exciting (as in I don't get tense when I find out I have overtime) and can just lead to more overtime 9I know a lot of sports will have the game end when someone gets a point).
 

theeboredone

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There is no keeping the lead since everyone is tied. My big beef with overtime is it doesn't really make for a big finish. It just tries to resolve a tie. Sudden Death in Smash was a big finish.
You missed my point. I meant that once OT starts, whoever ends up getting the lead now has a job to protect it for that short amount of time, while the opponent is desperate to tie it up once again. It essentially becomes cat and mouse.

SD in Smash was stupid, because one hit from anything could kill you. Instead of 300% with bombs eventually flying, it would be better to have it at 120 or something.

They don't have to do it like Smash does though. I would be fine with over time if it was a 1 life thing. Having it the way it is isn't very exciting (as in I don't get tense when I find out I have overtime) and can just lead to more overtime 9I know a lot of sports will have the game end when someone gets a point).
And there are sports that keep the game going if a person scores (Basketball and Soccer/Futbol), the other team has a responsibility to score back. It's to each their own, but I don't see much wrong with this method. The worst feeling is that in sudden death, you don't get a chance to score back for whatever reason. Having an opportunity grants that.
 

~automatic

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SD in Smash was stupid, because one hit from anything could kill you. Instead of 300% with bombs eventually flying, it would be better to have it at 120 or something.
I think SD's only flaw is the eventual release of bombs. The 1HKO format forces you to be safe and careful. It also grants characters with less than stellar KO power or bad MUs a fair and even setting to compete with characters which are more efficient (to put it in a way) in some game play aspects; EG, Link can take on MK at 300% but not at 120%.

EDIT: Or any other percentage lower than the knockback cap, lulz.
 

lordvaati

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^yeah. infact in most SD's dudes just play unaway until the bombs drop, wich makes it too campy.

this Overtime mode however embraces offensive play, as it turns into a race to get the most kills in a minute.
 

theeboredone

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Let's assume for a second that Brawl didn't have bombs falling in SD, and it was tourney legal...

It enforces too much of a defensive/camping game. Both characters are at 300, meaning both don't want to make a mistake. So when we already suffer through high levels of matches where the timer runs out, we now have to watch two MKs camp, Falco, Pit, Fox, Yoshi, and any char with projectiles throw them all day. At some point, someone has to make a move, one move and it's over.

PS All Stars though...you two start out fresh and if someone dies, that person still has a chance to catch up. So it enforces both defense and offense.
 

Morin0

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Let's assume for a second that Brawl didn't have bombs falling in SD, and it was tourney legal...

It enforces too much of a defensive/camping game. Both characters are at 300, meaning both don't want to make a mistake. So when we already suffer through high levels of matches where the timer runs out, we now have to watch two MKs camp, Falco, Pit, Fox, Yoshi, and any char with projectiles throw them all day. At some point, someone has to make a move, one move and it's over.

PS All Stars though...you two start out fresh and if someone dies, that person still has a chance to catch up. So it enforces both defense and offense.
Wait. I thought bombs falling during SD was to make the game go faster, lol. After a certain amount of time, the bombs start falling so that the game can end. It kind of confuses me why the players won't attack each other when the bombs aren't falling.
 

theeboredone

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Wait. I thought bombs falling during SD was to make the game go faster, lol. After a certain amount of time, the bombs start falling so that the game can end. It kind of confuses me why the players won't attack each other when the bombs aren't falling.
Bombs falling are too random, and they aren't predetermined as to where they will fall. Basically, like tripping, it can happen at any moment, and it can screw you over.

The players start at 300%, meaning both would be playing really safe. One hit and you're done. So you play a defensive game, not taking any risks, waiting to see where the opponent screws up, and then capitalize on it.
 

PDOT

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I read somewhere that this game is hella floaty..floatier than brawl. -_-
 

SmashChu

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This was something I was waiting to say but I wanted to wait. From the new info just posted, I can tell this game will not do very well. Why do you ask. Well.....

4) Most characters can cancel moves into other moves, but it’s not as fomulaic as SF4′s normal -> special -> super. Canceling between attacks is much more of a character-specific feature in Battle Royale, but it’s still pretty intuitive once you actually get your hands on a character. I think you guys will have a lot of fun exploring our roster.
This is a game ender right here and can ruin the game's chances of success. Canceling has not helped games. In fact, as it has become more prominent in fighting games, their sales have gone down. Sales have been bad for a while.

Sony Smash Brothers, if it wants to rival Smash, needs to learn from Smash. It needs to find out why Smash was a success. Instead, they are looking at other fighting games which have all done poorly. Instead of trying to find a man who will rival Sakurai, they find people with "fighting game experience." As such, it will have fighting games sales rather than Smash Brothers sales. The most offensive part is this.

At the very least, the Battle Royale community will have some extremely interesting discussions about Sly Cooper a year from now. And i think the fighting game community as a whole will benefit from those discussions.
News Flash, there is NO Battle Royale community. There hasn't been a game out. Communities are made from games coming out. I wouldn't had said there was a Kid Icarus community before the game even came out. For all you know, no one will want to play Battle Royale, let alone discuss it on message boards. This shows that they don't understand their game and don't know how to make it a success.

ON SD:If Sudden Death is so defensive and bombs will drops and there is no way to tell if you will win or not, why don't you just try and kill him. You only need to hit him once.
 

theeboredone

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You missed my entire point. I said, let's assume there were no bombs given it's a random factor for sudden death circumstances. If there are no bombs, the game becomes much more defensive.
 

Claire Diviner

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The fact of the matter is, there are Bob-oms in SD for Smash Bros., and as a result, is the reason why it's never counted when determining set wins, should a tie occur. While a nice assumption to use as an example, it doesn't really change the fact that SD involves random Bob-oms.
 

SmashChu

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Surprised no one wanted to talk about the canceling thing. Oh well.

You missed my entire point. I said, let's assume there were no bombs given it's a random factor for sudden death circumstances. If there are no bombs, the game becomes much more defensive.
You can't say that because there are bombs. Can't ignore them.

The fact of the matter is, there are Bob-oms in SD for Smash Bros., and as a result, is the reason why it's never counted when determining set wins, should a tie occur. While a nice assumption to use as an example, it doesn't really change the fact that SD involves random Bob-oms.
Truth be told, the set up you have now for deciding ties is far worse. Using damage in smash is stupid as damage is irrelevant. You can die at 1% and live at 999%. It's also different for each character. Heck, all it does is support running away (guess which characters that benefits).

ON Overtime though, does everyone go to overtime, or just the people that tied. Be kind of silly if everyone plays it. Is kind of silly now.
 

Jeyfar

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That's why tiebreakers are made in a 1 stock, 3 minutes match, at least in Melee.

Anyway, I'm not seeing this game getting anywhere, the character cast better get an upgrade, because it sucks right now. The battle system looks clunky as hell still, and cancelling, ohhhhh boy, where's my MvC3 trainwreck.
 

GunmasterLombardi

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Their canceling mechanic reminds me of Dragonball Raging Blast 1 and 2. In DB, each character had their own set of cancels that required exploration in order to find. In DB, you could not cancel into the same move numerous times for obvious reasons. I'm not sure if they are doing the Battle Royale cancels the same way though...

I don't see what the big deal is with canceling. It's a turn off to casual players, I get that, but most fighting games don't build a casual experience along with the competitive one.

This game doesn't need to learn from Smash Bros. only. As you can see, they are looking at multiple fighting games to develop a competitive experience. Smash Bros. is a party game at heart and Melee being a solid competitive game was an accident. The only things they've taken from Smash is 4-player simultaneous play and items.
 

SmashChu

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Their canceling mechanic reminds me of Dragonball Raging Blast 1 and 2. In DB, each character had their own set of cancels that required exploration in order to find. In DB, you could not cancel into the same move numerous times for obvious reasons. I'm not sure if they are doing the Battle Royale cancels the same way though...

I don't see what the big deal is with canceling. It's a turn off to casual players, I get that, but most fighting games don't build a casual experience along with the competitive one.

This game doesn't need to learn from Smash Bros. only. As you can see, they are looking at multiple fighting games to develop a competitive experience. Smash Bros. is a party game at heart and Melee being a solid competitive game was an accident. The only things they've taken from Smash is 4-player simultaneous play and items.
First, your vector avatar sucks. Please don't use something so cliche. Be creative with it (everyone else in this thread has a good one).

The reason learning from Smash is important is Smash makes the money while the others don't. Usually the only games with a strong competitive focus and decent sales had prior games that usually didn't focus on that (Street Fighter, Starcraft). Smash makes the bacon. Since they aren't going in Smash's direction, no bacon.
 

GunmasterLombardi

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@SmashChu

Smash Bros. has established a big name for itself for being a great series of action/ party games. Battle Royale has not done any of that because it's a new IP. Most IPs will accumulate more sales down the road if they started off well like Uncharted: Drake's Fortune.

It won't sell like Smash, but not because it's trying to be different.
 

Claire Diviner

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First, your vector avatar sucks. Please don't use something so cliche. Be creative with it (everyone else in this thread has a good one).
Come now, don't bash someone's avatar for being cliché. I can understand if it was offensive and/or vulgar.
The reason learning from Smash is important is Smash makes the money while the others don't.
By "others" do you mean imitators, like TMNT Smash Up and Cartoon Network's Punch Time Xplosion?
Usually the only games with a strong competitive focus and decent sales had prior games that usually didn't focus on that (Street Fighter, Starcraft).
Usually didn't focus on what exactly?
Smash makes the bacon. Since they aren't going in Smash's direction, no bacon.
I can see the argument, but at the same time, some people might not get it if it does become too much of a Smash Bros clone, as then some people who don't buy PASBR will accuse it of being a rip-off. Mind you, as different as the game is trying to be, it's already seen as enough of a rip-off as it is, so whether it tries to differentiate itself even more, or if it does become more like Smash Bros., its potential for money-making is more akin to that of a coin flip in my theory.
Having her as a playable character would be rather interesting. I do wonder what kind of moveset she'd have if they ever do decide to make her playable.

That comes to my next question: We've seen the characters being confirmed, but what do they all have in common? They're the only ones representing the games they come from. Any chance we'll see more than one character per franchise? I mean, Smash Bros. has plenty of Mario game reps, Zelda game reps, Kirby game reps, etc.. Just something I thought was worth asking.
 

lordvaati

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well so far, they said they have plans of on character per franchise, though one can assume DLC characters could be from other series.

@Chu

I thinkthey are aiming for amiddle ground/3rd option with this game. because while it is true that competitive fighters have a hit-or-miss sales record,games that go down the road of Smash.....HAVE IT EVEN WORSE. TMNT Smash-Up for example sold 80,000 copies. total. across both systems. and that was made by dudes who workedon Brawl, so that's about as close to Smash as you can get. In fact, I don't think any of the Smash-like games sold around a million. because between being a Smash-inspired game that tries something new vs. being a Smash inspired game that copies everything, the former seems more successful.

and while this doesn't relate to you specifically, I find it stupid that almost everyone who complains it's a Smash cloneis complaining that it didn't copy more things from Smash(ringouts, %, etc.)- it's like they want more to b**** about.
 

FlareHabanero

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DLC for characters would be kind of a bad idea within a game like this. Notably if some of the DLC characters are better then the initial roster. Hypothetically speaking, that could give someone an advantage over others, which can cause balance problems for both online and local multiplayer.
 

lordvaati

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yeah, but it may turn out OK in the end if it's only a few like in MK9. plus they do listen to feedback from folks, since they responded to the criticism of Parappa by nerfing his Boombox attack, so it's safe to assume that if a DLC character is OP they would make apatch.
 

SmashChu

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@SmashChu

Smash Bros. has established a big name for itself for being a great series of action/ party games. Battle Royale has not done any of that because it's a new IP. Most IPs will accumulate more sales down the road if they started off well like Uncharted: Drake's Fortune.

It won't sell like Smash, but not because it's trying to be different.
Smash Bros on the 64 sold 5 million. It started out as a success.

Come now, don't bash someone's avatar for being cliché. I can understand if it was offensive and/or vulgar.
I personally hate avatars that are memes (Ponies too). Having those sends the message that your "HURRR Ithe internet is SOOO lol." If it was shoop the whoop then it's rage comics now. At least put something you like up there.

By "others" do you mean imitators, like TMNT Smash Up and Cartoon Network's Punch Time Xplosion?
Others is other competitive fighting games, but the same principle holds true there. They didn't learn from what made Smash awesome. TMNT had some production quality and they used the same developers, but they didn't try making the same experience which Sony Smash wont do either.

Usually didn't focus on what exactly?
Usually the only games with a strong competitive focus and decent sales had prior games that usually didn't focus on being competitive (Street Fighter, Starcraft).
Better?

I can see the argument, but at the same time, some people might not get it if it does become too much of a Smash Bros clone, as then some people who don't buy PASBR will accuse it of being a rip-off. Mind you, as different as the game is trying to be, it's already seen as enough of a rip-off as it is, so whether it tries to differentiate itself even more, or if it does become more like Smash Bros., its potential for money-making is more akin to that of a coin flip in my theory.
For one, they are trying. The fighting system and other things help. heck, they could have just done the mix stages and it would have had something on Smash (also works for it because their properties are so fragmented). The other thing is that they'll never really break that "Doing their own Smash" since they are making a similar game. All of the Sony All-Stars fight in a 4 player free for all. Replace Sony for Nintendo and you got yourself Smash Brothers.

The problem is they are being different in the wrong dirrection. Making a game that beats Smash would make more money. At least then gamers will respect it for trying. Ambition helps. This game is going off the same assumptions other fighting games adopt and I don't think it will work for them.

@Chu

I thinkthey are aiming for amiddle ground/3rd option with this game. because while it is true that competitive fighters have a hit-or-miss sales record,games that go down the road of Smash.....HAVE IT EVEN WORSE. TMNT Smash-Up for example sold 80,000 copies. total. across both systems. and that was made by dudes who workedon Brawl, so that's about as close to Smash as you can get. In fact, I don't think any of the Smash-like games sold around a million. because between being a Smash-inspired game that tries something new vs. being a Smash inspired game that copies everything, the former seems more successful.
Like I said above, they don't try to be a comparable experience to Smash. They kind of half ask it. They never have the same oomph as Smash. Punchtime's problem is they do a bad job. The quality is just poor.

What I say doesn't apply to just fighting games. It applies to every genre. Usually going down the competitive road leads to failure. Fighting games are just the worst at doing it. Smash was the antithesis to all of this and it had massive success. What I'm saying is that if Gearbox wants to be successful too, they need to copy what Smash did right.

and while this doesn't relate to you specifically, I find it stupid that almost everyone who complains it's a Smash cloneis complaining that it didn't copy more things from Smash(ringouts, %, etc.)- it's like they want more to b**** about.
I know it's not at me, but just for clarity on the past argument: OT is a neat idea, I just don't like how they did it. It would be more fun if there was more pressure. Being killed off after a super would put more pressure on you and make it more exciting. Sudden Death (in a time match at least) is exciting because it is sudden (you don't know about it until it comes) and intense (because it can be over at any minute). OT is a different take, but lacks that thrill to make it great. Can work though.

I quoted a lot of people. I hope I didn't overdo it.
 
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