People need to understand the real reason for our disappointment:

[Weed]

They should spend the one month extra they took, revamping the stupid *** clones, and getting their heads out of crap-no-one-cares-about (I.E = rethinking R.O.B)

 

[A New Challenger]

Before saying "It wasn't for you, get over yourself!" let's ask who it was for?

- Who was clamoring for more clones?
- Who was really amped about the possibility of Captain Ganon being back?
- Who was really chomping at the bit for the chance to play as R.O.B.?

I had a revelation watching one of the videos of past stage Corneria - we are in fact moaning a little too much because we will, yes, all buy the game anyway. It won't be so bad if we look at it as Melee + balance and a few new characters. That's my plan.

But it's less the fact that certain characters aren't in and that certain decisions weren't made, and more the fact that certain OBVIOUSLY half-cocked decisions were. Yes, especially so after all of the hype and delays.

Oh, and an advance note to the sheep - don't say we created our own hype, because that's a crock. We were lead on - all of us - and we were stupid to be. If you don't want to admit that by denying that you got caught up in the same hypestorm, well then have fun in denial. Protip: if you weren't as hyped as the rest of us, you wouldn't be on a messageboard about the **** game.

 

[limitbreak]

THANK YOU FOR THIS!

Honestly since they threw in these "semi"-clones they might as well have added in a few more Melee clones as well. Throwing back Roy with an unchanged neutral B, and and edited side B would have worked. Giving Mewtwo a slight buff would have made him different enough from Lucario since all his attacks have that added "psychic" blast thing. Hell even add Dr. Mario back in! At least he could have a totally different FS.


Instead we were given 4 possibly 5 clones, a slightly changed Mewtwo with a new skin, and a whole crapload of extras. It's really disappointing that all these compliments were added to the Brawl sandwich, and the meat that was added was less than prime cut.

Well I only have one complain with this post. I think you meant to say condiments instead of compliments. lol .. but seriously this pretty much sums it up. I cant add anything else.

 

[Kapusta.KO]

I've seen a lot of people on this board (and others) shouting about how the people who are disappointed with the final Brawl roster are just whining because their one favorite character wasn't in, or because nothing short of a 50-character of roster would have been enough for them, or other condescending crap like that. That's NOT why we're unhappy...at least not most of us.

Anyone who comes to Smashboards can see that there are literally hundreds of character support threads filled with people who would love to see one cool character or another. We all knew that it was going to be impossible for the roster to include everything. I wasn't expecting a roster that was perfect. All I wanted was a roster that I could look at and say, "Well, it might not have everything, but I can tell from these choices that they did the best they could with the time and resources they had." Nothing more.

That is NOT what I am seeing here. Young Link with his same cloned Link moves, with no cool new Wind Waker items like the Deku Leaf or Skull Hammer. Fox in the game three times over to the exclusion of many cool and unique alternatives. This does NOT say "best effort" to me. I'm not sure if it even says "laziness". It says they just didn't care about making the best of what they had. They didn't care about uniqueness or diversity in the playable characters. They spent all this time and effort on all these random modes and features, but couldn't be bothered with properly planning out the single most important aspect of the game?

If they only have enough time and resources to make 35 characters, then fine. I can accept that easily. But use that time to make the best 35-character roster you can! "Let's spend our precious time adding a clone of a clone of Fox" is not the thing a competent developer has any right to say when you have those sorts of limitations. If they had taken out Falco, Wolf, and Lucas, and instead put in, for example, Krystal, Ridley, and Simon Belmont or something, they would have used only slightly more development effort and the roster would have been twice as good as what we got. They made stupid, boring choices over and over for no reason at all.

We're not saying that we won't buy the game now, or that it will no longer be fun. Of course it will still be fun! It is because it will be fun that this is upsetting. This is a game that will probably played well into the next decade...maybe longer. Seeing its potential reduced so much because of a pointless, inexplicable error is a tragedy, and I don't see what's wrong with acknowledging that.

I agree with everything you say, except one thing. Ridley is a giant monster pterodactyl and should never have even been considered, and also, who is Simon Belmont? lol. oh and you forgot to mention why the put R.O.B. in the game

 

[TerminalMontage]

I wish it had Geno :/

 

[Reyairia]

Being a huge Metroid fan myself, I am satisfied with having Samus go it alone again. Ridley being turned into a playable character would have made him a joke, Ridley wasn't smart enough to pick up items and fight tournament style. He's a giant monstrosity who just wants to destroy everything, so his place in the game makes sense.

I disagree. Ridley isn't just another monstrosity although portrayed that way too often in the games. Nintendo often repeats that Ridley is extremely smart, having at least human intelligence (wasn't he shown using a computer?). And I think his anthropomorphic build in most of the games is supposed to show that (he looked even more so in brawl, ironically) and he's not just another monster boss Samus fights. I think he's too important to be left as a simple boss.
And I also disagree about the mindless destruction thing, I think it's been implied that Ridley's species was genocided on by the GF which basically makes him like samus although on the other side.
Plus, I think a villain rep is needed, and it's not as if Samus and Ridley would team up or anything. The loner feeling is maintained so long as no real "helper" character is added.

Every single previous Smash Bros. character having their moves and attacks tweaked is another thing that impresses me. I was relieved to see my old favorites make their returns, as I was worried they were going to get shafted.

Too bad for my old favorite, Mewtwo. :/

But whether it's the stages being so dynamic, the character roster being too small, the concentration on items, the Subspace Emissary (a huge single player adventure that people are blaming for lack of content elsewhere), the Wi-Fi... it just feels like people are concentrating on the negative and it's been like this since we seen the first screenshots.

None of the people I know have really complained about the wi-fi and so on, they're ony upset that so many of these features were so detailed (like you said) and so on but the roster - the most important aspect of the game - wasn't done to the best it should have been. This is the Smash series, how could we expect anything less than the best?

I hope it's just a phase. I'm not saying people are not allowed to express disappointment, but I'm just disappointed at all the disappointment and quite frankly don't understand it. And if Brawl even passes with modest sales, that won't be enough to encourage Nintendo that they did something right. They did do something right, they are giving us a great game that doesn't just cash out on the Touch Generation. If we want to see more of this, we have to show support, otherwise no more Zelda, no more Metroid, just: Mario Party and Brain Games for the rest of Nintendo's history.

1. As I said before, very few people that are complaining are not going to buy the game. We're only upset that we didn't get the best this game got hyped up to be.
2. No other game gets as much feedback as this one.
3. How the heck would complaining lead to bad spin off games? :/ If anything, people complain about those more than anything else.
4. People that complain about Brawl are not going to go around and buy a bad spin-off game and not complain at all. *rolls eyes* I have no idea what movie drama you're making in your head like that

 

[Finn Macool]

points well made wyv and i very much agree about ridley
i never realized what a fav mewtwo was until he was taken out then their was this big outrage

 

[kainsword]

points well made wyv and i very much agree about ridley
i never realized what a fav mewtwo was until he was taken out then their was this big outrage

Mewtwo isn't so much as a consistent favorite as he is an important piece of Pokemon's history. Mewtwo in my opinion is the second most deserving Pokemon to be in Brawl, behind only Pikachu.

Mewtwo in the series is consistently has the highest Sp. Attack rating, except to the Deoxys variants which have far too little defense to live beyond one well-placed attack, and was featured in 3 Pokemon movies. Lucario? Well, he's a 4th generation favorite and appeared in only 1 movie.

Mewtwo deserved that huge buff to make him a worthy character in Brawl, instead he was skinned out and replaced with Lucario. I was heavily looking forward to seeing the most powerful of all Pokemon get that comboing ability to make him a great character, along with having several of his less useful specials replaced by more prominent movie attacks, such as Barrier and the ever useful Psychic. A legendary Psychic Pokemon that still used Confusion and Disable was disheartening to see in Melee, in my opinion.

 

[Wyvern]

AND one more thing, what exactly do you mean (I'm baffled) by "pointless, inexplicable error"?

I could have sworn I edited "error" to "lapse in judgement". I guess it never went through. Anyway, it refers mainly to the whole "Fox-Falco-Wolf" fiasco. I find it completely absurd that they would make two alternate versions of a pre-existing character rather than try to add in a new one. Yes, I know Wolf has some new animations. That doesn't mean a thing if that's all that's new about him, and it only furthers the point that any of countless more interesting characters could have been added in his stead without using an inordinate amounts of extra resources. I'll quote my own challenge to Wolf's alleged originality from a bunch of pages ago, since it has yet to be responded to by his supporters.

What aspects of Wolf's character distinguishes him from the rest of the roster? What things can Wolf do that nobody else in the roster could hope to replicate? In what way does Wolf represent an ENTIRELY new character archtype added to the game?

THIS, to me, is what makes a character "new".

It's not even about the game just having one less character than I wanted or anything like that. Seeing so little originality in all of these secret characters (remember: "clone" does not automatically mean "lack of originality": see Ganondorf) suggests something about the overall design philosophy of the developers. It says to me that when planning for the game began, "let's add as many unique and distinctive characters as we can" was NOT one of their top priorities. There are a number of unique characters, and I'm glad to have them, but it definitely feels as though effort was diverted away from that aspect of the game to fuel other things. Those of us who feel that the roster is the heart and soul of any Smash game are very disheartened by this. If they had focused more heavily on the roster from day one, who knows how things might have turned out?



Also: did Apollo Justice come out already? Where the hell have I been? I just got Trials and Tribulations, like, a month ago.

P.S. "Apollo Justice" is a stupid name and will be forever.

 

[Lord Knight]

You clearly don't know how hard it is to make a game these days.

 

[flyinfilipino]

It's not even about the game just having one less character than I wanted or anything like that. Seeing so little originality in all of these secret characters (remember: "clone" does not automatically mean "lack of originality": see Ganondorf) suggests something about the overall design philosophy of the developers. It says to me that when planning for the game began, "let's add as many unique and distinctive characters as we can" was NOT one of their top priorities. There are a number of unique characters, and I'm glad to have them, but it definitely feels as though effort was diverted away from that aspect of the game to fuel other things. Those of us who feel that the roster is the heart and soul of any Smash game are very disheartened by this. If they had focused more heavily on the roster from day one, who knows how things might have turned out?

What if they did focus on the roster from the beginning, and what we have now was their ideal roster i.e. what is best for the game?

 

[Magmar's Wrath]

You clearly don't know how hard it is to make a game these days.

So because it's hard, we shouldn't complain?

Video games were meant to entertain, to be their best. If you're given almost 3 years and a 100+ man team on it, and you end up with a slapdash finish, then you're not entertaining.

They even delayed the game for two months because the developers needed more time. So what is their excuse?

 

[flyinfilipino]

So because it's hard, we shouldn't complain?

Video games were meant to entertain, to be their best. If you're given almost 3 years and a 100+ man team on it, and you end up with a slapdash finish, then you're not entertaining.

They even delayed the game for two months because the developers needed more time. So what is their excuse?

Go ahead and complain! Gah! No one knows why it happened, it just happened.

 

[Pink Reaper]

So because it's hard, we shouldn't complain?

Video games were meant to entertain, to be their best. If you're given almost 3 years and a 100+ man team on it, and you end up with a slapdash finish, then you're not entertaining.

They even delayed the game for two months because the developers needed more time. So what is their excuse?

Do you just copy and paste this response? Im pretty sure we already discussed that Sakurai did NOT have 3 years on the game and Im also certain that you understand that not all of those 100+ people were actually working on characters.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

I've seen a lot of people on this board (and others) shouting about how the people who are disappointed with the final Brawl roster are just whining because their one favorite character wasn't in, or because nothing short of a 50-character of roster would have been enough for them, or other condescending crap like that. That's NOT why we're unhappy...at least not most of us.

Anyone who comes to Smashboards can see that there are literally hundreds of character support threads filled with people who would love to see one cool character or another. We all knew that it was going to be impossible for the roster to include everything. I wasn't expecting a roster that was perfect. All I wanted was a roster that I could look at and say, "Well, it might not have everything, but I can tell from these choices that they did the best they could with the time and resources they had." Nothing more.

That is NOT what I am seeing here. Young Link with his same cloned Link moves, with no cool new Wind Waker items like the Deku Leaf or Skull Hammer. Fox in the game three times over to the exclusion of many cool and unique alternatives. This does NOT say "best effort" to me. I'm not sure if it even says "laziness". It says they just didn't care about making the best of what they had. They didn't care about uniqueness or diversity in the playable characters. They spent all this time and effort on all these random modes and features, but couldn't be bothered with properly planning out the single most important aspect of the game?

If they only have enough time and resources to make 35 characters, then fine. I can accept that easily. But use that time to make the best 35-character roster you can! "Let's spend our precious time adding a clone of a clone of Fox" is not the thing a competent developer has any right to say when you have those sorts of limitations. If they had taken out Falco, Wolf, and Lucas, and instead put in, for example, Krystal, Ridley, and Simon Belmont or something, they would have used only slightly more development effort and the roster would have been twice as good as what we got. They made stupid, boring choices over and over for no reason at all.

We're not saying that we won't buy the game now, or that it will no longer be fun. Of course it will still be fun! It is because it will be fun that this is upsetting. This is a game that will probably played well into the next decade...maybe longer. Seeing its potential reduced so much because of a pointless, inexplicable error is a tragedy, and I don't see what's wrong with acknowledging that.

QFT, this sums up a lot of things.

 

[MysticJon]

I've seen a lot of people on this board (and others) shouting about how the people who are disappointed with the final Brawl roster are just whining because their one favorite character wasn't in, or because nothing short of a 50-character of roster would have been enough for them, or other condescending crap like that. That's NOT why we're unhappy...at least not most of us.

Anyone who comes to Smashboards can see that there are literally hundreds of character support threads filled with people who would love to see one cool character or another. We all knew that it was going to be impossible for the roster to include everything. I wasn't expecting a roster that was perfect. All I wanted was a roster that I could look at and say, "Well, it might not have everything, but I can tell from these choices that they did the best they could with the time and resources they had." Nothing more.

That is NOT what I am seeing here. Young Link with his same cloned Link moves, with no cool new Wind Waker items like the Deku Leaf or Skull Hammer. Fox in the game three times over to the exclusion of many cool and unique alternatives. This does NOT say "best effort" to me. I'm not sure if it even says "laziness". It says they just didn't care about making the best of what they had. They didn't care about uniqueness or diversity in the playable characters. They spent all this time and effort on all these random modes and features, but couldn't be bothered with properly planning out the single most important aspect of the game?

If they only have enough time and resources to make 35 characters, then fine. I can accept that easily. But use that time to make the best 35-character roster you can! "Let's spend our precious time adding a clone of a clone of Fox" is not the thing a competent developer has any right to say when you have those sorts of limitations. If they had taken out Falco, Wolf, and Lucas, and instead put in, for example, Krystal, Ridley, and Simon Belmont or something, they would have used only slightly more development effort and the roster would have been twice as good as what we got. They made stupid, boring choices over and over for no reason at all.

We're not saying that we won't buy the game now, or that it will no longer be fun. Of course it will still be fun! It is because it will be fun that this is upsetting. This is a game that will probably played well into the next decade...maybe longer. Seeing its potential reduced so much because of a pointless, inexplicable error is a tragedy, and I don't see what's wrong with acknowledging that.

one of the smartest things ive read here. well said.

 

[LuisMa316]

So because it's hard, we shouldn't complain?

Video games were meant to entertain, to be their best. If you're given almost 3 years and a 100+ man team on it, and you end up with a slapdash finish, then you're not entertaining.

They even delayed the game for two months because the developers needed more time. So what is their excuse?

So you're an expert on game making now?

None of the people I know have really complained about the wi-fi and so on, they're ony upset that so many of these features were so detailed (like you said) and so on but the roster - the most important aspect of the game - wasn't done to the best it should have been. This is the Smash series, how could we expect anything less than the best?

It gives them too much added pressure?

And we got alot of guys we've never though would get in like Sonic and snake.

I really can't complain and hey atleast Ridley's boss fight is kickass and in true ridley fashion he comes back for anouther round.

 

[Magmar's Wrath]

Do you just copy and paste this response? Im pretty sure we already discussed that Sakurai did NOT have 3 years on the game and Im also certain that you understand that not all of those 100+ people were actually working on characters.

I did say almost three years, because it wasn't exactly three years but it was close to it. And usually, video games have less than 10 people on them, if I remember the podcast correctly.

Let me try to point it out this way:

If WW Link had weapons and abilities that were from Wind Waker...
If Ganondorf had his own moveset, with Twilight Princess and OoT abilities...
If Falcon and Wolf had, at their least, their own Final Smash...
If Lucas had been different than Ness, if they had different Final Smashes...

This debate and the topics would be far, far less. I'm talking about tweaking five characters, not making new ones altogether. It just is not satisying to have clones when the potential should have been greater.

Just look at us like people who were expecting more from the art, that's all. I don't think anyone in this topic agreeing with it is being unreasonable. I know I haven't threatened anyone.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

What if they did focus on the roster from the beginning, and what we have now was their ideal roster i.e. what is best for the game?

Well their ideal roster, wasn't the best. Not to mention they even asked us, the fans, what we wanted in the game. Then they wasted spots with some characters when instead, they could've used what we asked for. A clear example being Geno

 

[Magmar's Wrath]

So you're an expert on game making now?

There's no need to be rude, for crying out loud. Do you even READ my posts? I'm saying we're let down because we were expecting more from so much!

We saw a great deal of potential in this game, and it was less than expected. There, that's what is wrong. Why are those against that point so fervent on it? You didn't design the game.

 

[flyinfilipino]

I did say almost three years, because it wasn't exactly three years but it was close to it. And usually, video games have less than 10 people on them, if I remember the podcast correctly.

Let me try to point it out this way:

If WW Link had weapons and abilities that were from Wind Waker...
If Ganondorf had his own moveset, with Twilight Princess and OoT abilities...
If Falcon and Wolf had, at their least, their own Final Smash...
If Lucas had been different than Ness, if they had different Final Smashes...

This debate and the topics would be far, far less. I'm talking about tweaking five characters, not making new ones altogether. It just is not satisying to have clones when the potential should have been greater.

Just look at us like people who were expecting more from the art, that's all. I don't think anyone in this topic agreeing with it is being unreasonable. I know I haven't threatened anyone.

Of course that would be wonderful, but at the end of the day, is there anything this community can do about it? You'd have to take it up with the developers. But if you're unable to do that, then skip forward a few weeks when the initial disappointment has worn off, because there is truly nothing you can do about it. I'm not trying to be condescending in anyway, but there are just better things to talk about.

 

[PrettyGoodYear]

So you're an expert on game making now?

So if my mechanic breaks my car I'm supposed to not complain just because I can't do it myself?

Althought it probably was a mistake to post this, as someone will find a way to twist it into something I didn't mean, but meh.

 

[LuisMa316]

Well their ideal roster, wasn't the best. Not to mention they even asked us, the fans, what we wanted in the game. Then they wasted spots with some characters when instead, they could've used what we asked for. A clear example being Geno

From what i understand they did want Geno in......but square didn't let em.

There's no need to be rude, for crying out loud. Do you even READ my posts? I'm saying we're let down because we were expecting more from so much!

We saw a great deal of potential in this game, and it was less than expected. There, that's what is wrong. Why are those against that point so fervent on it? You didn't design the game.

Didn't mean for it too sound rude.

But anyway maybe you guys set your hopes up way too high, i mean as it is we do have an excellent roster and dare i say the best story mode in a fighting game i've ever seen and a stage builder,Online play, etc.

I can sorta see what you mean...but you had to understand that not all the people you wanted where gonna make it.

 

[LuisMa316]

So if my mechanic breaks my car I'm supposed to not complain just because I can't do it myself?

Althought it probably was a mistake to post this, as someone will find a way to twist it into something I didn't mean, but meh.

Sakurai broke your wii?

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

Sakurai broke your wii?

No, Sakurai broke hopes with parts of the roster.

 

[flyinfilipino]

No, Sakurai broke hopes with parts of the roster.

Then You Must Recover!

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

Then You Must Recover!

I'd rather do a barrel roll

 

[PrettyGoodYear]

Sakurai broke your wii?

*sigh* I said it myself. I knew someone would twist it into something I didn't mean

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

*sigh* myself said it I. I twist something knew didn't someone mean I would it into

Oops....I did it again

 

[fuuzball317]

everyone should stop their bithcing this game is gonna be soo phat even though we gotta shafted some characters, it's over, your all wasting your breath, the roster is not gonna affect you buying the game and playing online is gonna be unreal so just shut up, and be patient for one more month

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

everyone should stop their bithcing this game is gonna be soo phat even though we gotta shafted some characters, it's over, your all wasting your breath, the roster is not gonna affect you buying the game and playing online is gonna be unreal so just shut up, and be patient for one more month

Wasting our breathes by typing on a keyboard? I don't want to be patient for one more month, I want the game on the 10th

 

[Rick88]

everyone should stop their bithcing this game is gonna be soo phat even though we gotta shafted some characters, it's over, your all wasting your breath, the roster is not gonna affect you buying the game and playing online is gonna be unreal so just shut up, and be patient for one more month

Out of curiousity, did you even read the first post?

No of course not. If you did, you would realize our "b*tch*ngness" is about the roster, not the game itself. And why shouldn't we complain? We were promised a better roster, yet all we got was "Luigified" versions of characters.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

Out of curiousity, did you even read the first post?

No of course not. If you did, you would realize our "b*tch*ngness" is about the roster, not the game itself. And why shouldn't we complain? We were promised a better roster, yet all we got was "Luigified" versions of characters....

Rick's post continued:
that could've been a lot more unique than what we have. Most of the Luigified characters have the potential to receive a unique moveset. I mean, what's the point in WW Link, when he's almost exactly like Young Link and Link himself. Why have 3 Landmasters? Why not just gives us what we asked for, after all, it may be your game, but you are trying to appeal to us to the best of your ability.

 

[LuisMa316]

Out of curiousity, did you even read the first post?

No of course not. If you did, you would realize our "b*tch*ngness" is about the roster, not the game itself. And why shouldn't we complain? We were promised a better roster, yet all we got was "Luigified" versions of characters.

I think the real term is akumafied.

 

[LuisMa316]

Rick's post continued:
that could've been a lot more unique than what we have. Most of the Luigified characters have the potential to receive a unique moveset. I mean, what's the point in WW Link, when he's almost exactly like Young Link and Link himself. Why have 3 Landmasters? Why not just gives us what we asked for, after all, it may be your game, but you are trying to appeal to us to the best of your ability.

And they still did since people are going to buy it.

 

[Meta_Sonic64]

And they still did since people are going to buy it.

May I add, appeal to the best of your ability with all aspects of the game, characters included.

 

[Rick88]

Rick's post continued:
that could've been a lot more unique than what we have. Most of the Luigified characters have the potential to receive a unique moveset. I mean, what's the point in WW Link, when he's almost exactly like Young Link and Link himself. Why have 3 Landmasters? Why not just gives us what we asked for, after all, it may be your game, but you are trying to appeal to us to the best of your ability.

Indeed, Sakurai said he was treating this like the last Smash bros, responding to the fanbase the way they wanted. My hopes got up especially when he released his polls and journals, showing us that he WAS listening. Yet in the end, most of the characters requested ended up as bosses, cameos or not in at all (i.e. Ridley, Krystal and Geno). I can understand Geno, given his situation with Square Enix, but I'm really surprised he turned down Krystal.

@ Luisma: The real term, if you want to get technical, is "semi-cloned". Due to the fact they have the same moveset, just done differently (ex: Fox's and Wolf's ^B attack).

 

[Magmar's Wrath]

And they still did since people are going to buy it.

That's not the point. I doubt they just slapped the characters together, saying "Fans will buy it anyway." There was so much effort and heart put into this game. The cinematics, the characters like Dedede and Olimar, the game-like features of getting trophies and challenges, it's all incredible.

We feel upset because they could have, should have done better with characters like WW Link. We cannot understand why, after so much effort and time went into this game, they made him practically the exact same as Link.

 

[csquid]

im perectly fine woth there being clones. i really liked young link in melee and he was a clone. plus the clones arent exact clones they have diffrent stuff like they said with the ness update today. it is kind of sad that they made about 4 clones but they spent almost a year working on this game so dont critisize them so much for not putting in a little extra effort.

 

[LuisMa316]

That's not the point. I doubt they just slapped the characters together, saying "Fans will buy it anyway." There was so much effort and heart put into this game. The cinematics, the characters like Dedede and Olimar, the game-like features of getting trophies and challenges, it's all incredible.

We feel upset because they could have, should have done better with characters like WW Link. We cannot understand why, after so much effort and time went into this game, they made him practically the exact same as Link.

Except faster clones do have their different things going for them.

Besides, i've played enough fighting games to know that sometimes their are going be clones...no one really complains that ken pretty much has the same moves as Ryu.

Besdies its only 5 clones(and they're not even complete clones) out of a roster of 35.