Olimar general discussion

[steelguttey]

how is that a risk

i would kill to be in a dating sim

 

[CrazyCupofJoe]

So this is what the Olimar discussion has devolved into... Sad really

 

[steelguttey]

so

when 3.6 comes out im restarting the matchup thread, writing a guide on side b and olimar as a whole, and if there is a demand for it starting the video thread back up

 

[Dotcom]

the Falco match up absolutely sucks for us.

 

[Ningildo]

Wasn't Falco the one spacie we did decent against or was that only in 3.0?

I have yet to play a Falco in 3.5, but I'd imagine there being a reason for you to say that the MU sucks for us?

 

[steelguttey]

i think flaco vs oli is 55-45 in falco's favor

we get pooped on by pillar combos but boy does fsmash let us tech chase him to death nearly every time we grab him

just grab, dthrow and read roll with fsmash and get a free follow up off that. simple

 

[robosteven]

reminder: if Olimar can land the grab in the first place

 

[Dotcom]

For those that haven't seen it
@ steelguttey 's Oli Match-up spread. http://pastebin.com/iAa864Lf

I still got quite a few qualm with it, but considering Oli's so unexplored we'll leave the beast at bay.

Personal changes:
Falcon: 7:3 - 6:4
Pit 5:5 - 6:4
Jiggs 5:5 - 6:4
Lucario: 4:6 - 5:5
Ivysaur 2:8 - 6:4 (If you think Ivy is harder than Shiek you're crazy)
Samus:35:65 - 45:55
Luigi:5:5 - 45:55
Link 5:5 - 4:6

Just want to point out that Ike is harder than Marth.
I was gonna comment on the Yoshi matchup, but you vs Pig was convincing enough lol.

 

[steelguttey]

ok first of all, ow. that hurt ;_;

second, i play like **** in tournament (moreso than usually) but no johns, hes a really good player.

second, why do you think we lose to pit? and even with lucario?

and ivy is by far his hardest matchup. her bair is everything about marth that we hate and everything about disjoints we hate but on a character we cannot use side b on. its infuriating. i can see us beating link and luigi, though.

edit: after playing a link yesterday i found something that kinda skews that mu in our favor? if we land a pikmin on the front of him he cannot throw aboomerang because the pikmin will just eat it. kinda funny really

 

[Dotcom]

Lol all jokes G.
I want to travel more and you aren't like BAT**** hours away so if you guys are hosting stuff feel free to let me know in advance.

I think we actually beat pit, that's why the 6 is in our side. We out, almost everything him bar recover and priority. But our disjoints are longer we hit harder, and neutral always comes back to favoring us.

Link is 55:45 his favor I feel. He does a REALLY good job of stuffing approaches and working us down to defend in a corner. He doesn't die (especially if he's good with bombs), and his build a bears eat us. We win neutral mostly(with a good power shield of course.) But we can't edge guard him but so well, and that's the main area where Link's weak at.

Lucario's SO much fun of a match up. Both characters strengths shine really well, and the matchup is totally decided on who is punishing who harder. He has a hell of a time getting in, and we have a hell of time getting out once he's in. We escape the most brain dead of Lucario shenanigans, but at the cost of dying to Nair and Side B a little earlier. We can both screw with each others recovery to some pretty satisfying results (unless you get side-b'd off stage. in which case. HAHAHAHAHA. GG.)

I just feel at home vs Ivy man. even though she get's things off of side killing our side b, we get free punishes for her acting out of line. As long as you aren't doing stupid stuff (LIKE GOING OFF STAGE EVER VS HER) 80:20 her favor is STRETCHING it. 65:35 at worst.

 

[steelguttey]

every saturday on long island homie. come through, if you bring 2 other people from your region i'll waive venue.

i cant read but i think i can agree wit hthat. it seems that arrows dont really do much to now especially after their nrfs.

we shouldnt really ever be approaching, especially against link. the trick against link is to throw pikmin at the times where his waves of projectiles are pausing to avoid dead pikmin.

i play against a lucario alot so i can feel that. he def can't approach us well enough and his options of getting a pikmin off are meh because nair has lag.

i seriously think ivy is impossible tho. if she has half a brain she can just bair all day and then usmash when she has a pikmin on her or synthesis if were too close. either way shes like, made to kill oli. it sucks.

 

[blandsabbath]

Hey guys, I'm very new here on smashboards, but i've been maining olimar really since brawl came out. I heard olimar was trash when i started playing PM about a year ago, so i started playing wolf instead. Now pretty recently (Probably about a month or two) I've been playing strictly olimar only. Honestly, loads of people keep telling me they think he's hidden boss material and that the way i play him makes him seem like he doesn't suck at this game.


I read earlier someone saying never go aggro with Oli? I usually rush down people with olimar and it works fine. Depending on the first pikmin i get, I usually wait for the opponent to approach me first, then dodge whatever they come at me with, combo something like

dash attack>dash attack>down tilt>Fair if i want to end the combo, or instead Up tilt> up tilt > forward air (this usually works out great, but i keep DI, CC all that in mind, i try to read the players)

If i get a white pikmin, i usually start of throwing those cause **** yeah. I feel like white pikmin, if resolved in his little explosion thing, can really gimp people or just set you up for comboing.


Idk, it seems like people really prefer to play him from afar, but i think Oli is great in close combat and can really **** **** up.

Anyone on here ever see Shokio's olimar? i feel like i play him in a similar fashion.

sorry if this post is hard to read or doesnt make sense, like i'm very new on here, and this is literally my first post

 

[Ningildo]

Vids generally gets things like these across better, so if you have any, do share them.

 

[steelguttey]

Hey guys, I'm very new here on smashboards, but i've been maining olimar really since brawl came out. I heard olimar was trash when i started playing PM about a year ago, so i started playing wolf instead. Now pretty recently (Probably about a month or two) I've been playing strictly olimar only. Honestly, loads of people keep telling me they think he's hidden boss material and that the way i play him makes him seem like he doesn't suck at this game.


I read earlier someone saying never go aggro with Oli? I usually rush down people with olimar and it works fine. Depending on the first pikmin i get, I usually wait for the opponent to approach me first, then dodge whatever they come at me with, combo something like

dash attack>dash attack>down tilt>Fair if i want to end the combo, or instead Up tilt> up tilt > forward air (this usually works out great, but i keep DI, CC all that in mind, i try to read the players)

If i get a white pikmin, i usually start of throwing those cause **** yeah. I feel like white pikmin, if resolved in his little explosion thing, can really gimp people or just set you up for comboing.


Idk, it seems like people really prefer to play him from afar, but i think Oli is great in close combat and can really **** **** up.

Anyone on here ever see Shokio's olimar? i feel like i play him in a similar fashion.

sorry if this post is hard to read or doesnt make sense, like i'm very new on here, and this is literally my first post

olimar has very bad tools when he gets in. he isnt fast and his only really good close stuff is his fair and other than that hes kinda boned. the most optimal way of playing him is to throw pikmin and wait for them to do something and pivot grab

 

[blandsabbath]

i dont have any videos of me, my weeklies are tomorrow and ill try to get on stream to share with you guys, but like in this video, you can see shokio with a pretty aggressive approach. i feel like olimars dash attack is pretty insane good. idk i do win a lot with my olimar generally https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGSSy1cjaJY

 

[steelguttey]

i dont have any videos of me, my weeklies are tomorrow and ill try to get on stream to share with you guys, but like in this video, you can see shokio with a pretty aggressive approach. i feel like olimars dash attack is pretty insane good. idk i do win a lot with my olimar generally https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGSSy1cjaJY

dash attack is extremely unsafe and laggy. its good, but not as good as you think. @ Shokio is a good oli, but look up old ss olimar vids or zygo if you want good olimar vids

 

[blandsabbath]

dash attack is extremely unsafe and laggy. its good, but not as good as you think. @ Shokio is a good oli, but look up old ss olimar vids or zygo if you want good olimar vids

I've seen them but i just prefer to play similar to shokio

 

[steelguttey]

i mean go for it. its just optimal olimar isnt aggro sadly

 

[Shokio]

Aggro Oli only works well if you are the better player or your opponent has no idea how to fight Olimar. I mean, aggro Oli isn't *bad* even against an equal player, but like Guttey said, it's not optimal or ideal.

Of course you can play the way you want to (I do), just know that against higher level opponents - the more notable guys in your region - you should definitely slow things down and focus on wearing them down with Side-B and bait-punish.

 

[Dotcom]

"Aggro Oli only works well if you are the better player " @ Shokio with probably the truest statement uttered on these here boards.

Olimar's aggro options don't lead well into followups by nature of his move set. Nair probably gives you the most mileage if you're going on the offensive.

 

[Dotcom]

Mid percents on fast fallers Olimar can Utilt/Usmash footstool. Play with it, Oli gets some really mean follow-ups.

 

[TricksterNo1]

Are there any bread and butter combos Olimar can get? I'm trying to pick him up after being inspired by dotcom's olimar.

 

[Dotcom]

Wow, that's an honor man than you.
Olimar is really BnB based, mostly people just don't understand what's happenin' :

Utilt/Usmash -> Usmash works on pretty much everyone.
Dthrow -> Fair
Dthrow - > Dair
Utilt -> Footstool - > Dair (only bnb on Fast Fallers (Spacies, Falcon, Diddy etc...))
Dtilt -> Uair
UAir -> Uair
Dtilt -> Fair.
Dash Attack -> Fair
Uthrow -> Bair.
If you hit someone with a purple at lower percent,s you can do anything my friend.

 

[Sodo]

@ Dotcom forgive my ignorance because I just recently got into P:M but do you have any vids of you playing? I saw the gfycat of you mauling a Fox on Pokemon Stadium and it made me want to see a full set. Google brought up nothing for me for some reason.

 

[Dotcom]

@ S Sodo first thing's first.
Fly Eagles Fly, on the road to victory. Fly Eagles Fly, score a touchdown 1-2-3.
Hit em low, Hit em high. Watch our Eagles Fly.
Fly Eagles Fly, on the road to victory.
E-A-G-L-E-S, EAGLES.

Our video thread is down, but i think these are all my recorded matches on the tube.

Friendlies:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oKoTVjubg4U vs Lucario
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MTf0P84H_lg vs M2/Falcon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4kk6a7cDsp4 vs Ganon*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=coJqL4ZA--Q vs M2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=no8xzTge6XM vs Ike
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5m4slJjv4_o vs Marth**
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VSC966flCgE vs Bowser*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpbWzuDpbOI vs Samus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQbo-cGsu5M vs Ness

Tournament:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9g-U0sKSzkM vs UFB| Kingtoon[Charizard/Kirby]
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3NOpLaXH138 vs CT| Chibo[Samus]*
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=32YYo_90qDE vs UltimaScout[Marth/Fox]

* Good Olimar play.
** watch the ending.

 

[Sodo]

@ S Sodo first thing's first.
Fly Eagles Fly, on the road to victory. Fly Eagles Fly, score a touchdown 1-2-3.
Hit em low, Hit em high. Watch our Eagles Fly.
Fly Eagles Fly, on the road to victory.
E-A-G-L-E-S, EAGLES.

I'm going to ignore this...

And thanks for posting the videos, they are extremely helpful. That Marth game was crazy.

 

[TricksterNo1]

Wow, that's an honor man than you.
Olimar is really BnB based, mostly people just don't understand what's happenin' :

Utilt/Usmash -> Usmash works on pretty much everyone.
Dthrow -> Fair
Dthrow - > Dair
Utilt -> Footstool - > Dair (only bnb on Fast Fallers (Spacies, Falcon, Diddy etc...))
Dtilt -> Uair
UAir -> Uair
Dtilt -> Fair.
Dash Attack -> Fair
Uthrow -> Bair.
If you hit someone with a purple at lower percent,s you can do anything my friend.

Thanks man. I'm gonna start messing around with Olimar, he may become a secondary and a possible future main depending on what happens in 3.6!

 

[blandsabbath]

Hey guys, I've been trying out a few things from watching other players here on this board, and i went to a local today and took 4th which isn't that big of a deal, but I was just happy with my games today and i had a lot of fun. I got two matches on stream if any of you guys care to watch it, http://www.twitch.tv/fsink/b/670988695 My matches start at 03:50:20. Im aware i'm not a very technical player by any means, but i have loads of fun playing my favorite character all the time. Hope you guys enjoy

 

[IcyLight]

I have recently picked up Olimar again for PM after trying him out in Smash 4 a few months ago and watching some old brawl videos. The nostalgia was strong

To add some combo information I have been using depending on the situation:

dtilt > jab x2 > grab
dtilt > grab > uthrow > dair > tech chase

As far as aggro oli goes, it doesn't really work unless you out play and out skill your opponent. It's a very unsafe play style no matter what you are fighting. However, against very very technical foxes (or sheiks) who like to spam shine game, camping isn't a good thing to do either. You want to stay close and space fairs and pivot grabs. You want to be just outside of the range where they could tilt or approach you, but not too far so either could camp with needles or lasers. The moment you start to side b (unless purples/whites) or play too defensive you're going to start falling behind. Staying immobile for more than a second or two is generally a bad idea nowadays anyways.

I don't know much about the BnB for PM olimar, but I am able to go dead even or beat some of the top players in the New England region with him. I have a very strong spacing and punishing style, similar to how old brawl olimar used to be. Baiting into grabs and keeping people off the stage is relatively easy, and I find that olimar's recovery is actually pretty decent if you know how to mix it up with neutral B, whistle bouncing, etc.

I'll try and get some videos next time there is a stream at the places I play

 

[Dotcom]

Icy you find most of Brawl Olimar stuff still works, just with combo's lol.
Good to have you around, i threw some BnB stuff above you for simplicity.
Movement's way more important now, so i'd suggest practicing wavelanding out of side b(I ca't do it, but it is pretty awesome)
I'm with you though that I think Olimar's recovery is really awesome with pluck, whistlebouncing, and never having to worry about if you sweet spotted the ledge or not. I'm telling you guys now, Olimar WILL be worse when 3.6 drops. We don't have options off stage as it is, but we had automatic ledge snap in addition to the mixups before. RIP.

I'm starting to agree Fox is kind of unwinnable. He out neutrals, punishes, and edge guards us(the most even of those three factors.)

 

[IcyLight]

Yeah, fox and sheik are the only characters that are giving me a hard time right now. And I'm pretty damn good at those matchups in general. I'm probably just going to stick with DK for those two (maybe Ivy) by themselves. Cargo throw combos are crazy on fast/medium fallers

 

[RelaxAlax]

I love jab lol.

I can't wait for the jetpack.

I miss tourneys.

 

[steelguttey]

Icy you find most of Brawl Olimar stuff still works, just with combo's lol.
Good to have you around, i threw some BnB stuff above you for simplicity.
Movement's way more important now, so i'd suggest practicing wavelanding out of side b(I ca't do it, but it is pretty awesome)
I'm with you though that I think Olimar's recovery is really awesome with pluck, whistlebouncing, and never having to worry about if you sweet spotted the ledge or not. I'm telling you guys now, Olimar WILL be worse when 3.6 drops. We don't have options off stage as it is, but we had automatic ledge snap in addition to the mixups before. RIP.

I'm starting to agree Fox is kind of unwinnable. He out neutrals, punishes, and edge guards us(the most even of those three factors.)

ok no olimar will not be worse. his buffs are wayyy to good to consider him worse. he gets mario up b, thats great. hes gonna be top 15

 

[Ningildo]

Icy you find most of Brawl Olimar stuff still works, just with combo's lol.
Good to have you around, i threw some BnB stuff above you for simplicity.
Movement's way more important now, so i'd suggest practicing wavelanding out of side b(I ca't do it, but it is pretty awesome)
I'm with you though that I think Olimar's recovery is really awesome with pluck, whistlebouncing, and never having to worry about if you sweet spotted the ledge or not. I'm telling you guys now, Olimar WILL be worse when 3.6 drops. We don't have options off stage as it is, but we had automatic ledge snap in addition to the mixups before. RIP.

I'm starting to agree Fox is kind of unwinnable. He out neutrals, punishes, and edge guards us(the most even of those three factors.)

Being able to hit people being jerks off stage while recovering is nice, as is being able to recover high from a lower height.
Yes, losing instant ledge snap kinda sucks, but uh, having a better recovery seems like a decent trade off, especially if we have Mario's Up-b levels of disjoint along with it. We also get better numbers on our pikmin attacks and that's always good (and frame 9 grab. SO MUCH is gonna be punishable by grab now. If nothing else, it gets harder to spotdodge).

Gameplan against Fox is gonna be DD along with him and hope you get a grab with a red. No way you can play neutral with Fox cause lasers, so DDing seems the way to go. As I've mentioned on Skype, Red pikmin uthrow > footstool > Dair > Dsmash CAN be a thing, but the timing is a bit finicky. It does get you to that precious mid-high percent where spacies are actually combofood (instead of being ungodly difficult to combo if you don't have Marth's Uthrow), so labbing it with slightly varying percents to get the hang of it seems worthwhile. At mid percents, Yellow pikmin Uthrow sets up for the footstool situation instead, so keep that in mind if you feel flashy. Also, at low percent, dair from the weaker colors (White, Yellow) can actually jab reset after the footstool on knocked down spacies, which leads into another grab that can lead into a tech chase. Fun.

Or you could play a secondary like a coward instead. Up to you, really.

 

[Dotcom]

I'm gonna go ahead with the coward option. I ca't stand outplaying my opponents and losing. Olimar vs Fox that happens consistently. Wario may not be better number wise, but at least the followups are free.

 

[blandsabbath]

Anyone download 3.6 beta yet? im about to try it out

 

[steelguttey]

me

godbless pmdt

 

[blandsabbath]

me

godbless pmdt

you mean like down throw? Im not sure how to feel about this olimar yet

 

[steelguttey]

hes just better im general. uthrow got unchanged so my throw combos got unchanged

 

[blandsabbath]

i feel like he will have to be played campier from just the couple games ive played