[Official SSB4 Discussion] --- Nintendo announces 2 new Smash games!

[Sosuke]

um... more everything lol.
Definatly Raichu and Knuckles in SSB4 though =P (im starting to call the 4th one "super smash bros tussle" lol)

 

[PKboy89]

LOL tussle

 

[Night Avenger]

My wished Roster is as follows:

Veterans:
Mario
Luigi
Peach
Bowser
Donkey Kong
Diddy Kong
Yoshi
Wario
Link
Zelda/Sheik
Ganondorf
Toon Link
Samus/Zamus
Pit
Ice Climbers
ROB
Kirby
Meta Knight
King Dedede
Captain Olimar
Pikachu
Pokémon Trainer
Lucario
Fox
Falco
Wolf
Captain Falcon
Marth
Ike
Ness
Lucas
Game & Watch
Snake
Sonic

Newcomers:
Dixie Kong
King K. Rool
Mach Rider/Little Mac (You know we need a NES nostalgia character.)
Ridley
Dark Samus
Mewtwo
Krystal
Black Shadow
Black Knight
Claus
Megaman

Now based on all the new bad guys this game should be called Super Smash Bros. Clash. 8D Awesome... Well, IMO at least... XD

 

[Sosuke]

Maybe there should be a thread on what this game should be called. =P
Im sure like everyone would be interested in that. xD

 

[Ilex]

Super Smash Bros. Armageddon ftw.

I want Toad in most. I know that he's already in Peach's Special, but such a popular Mario deserves to be a character and not just a move :/ They can change Peach's move so her parasol absorbs the attack or something.

 

[lonewolf537]

i'll be happy as long as they keep olimar wolf and ike in. but i would just love to see shadow the hedgehog in it.

 

[Spire]

Maybe there should be a thread on what this game should be called. =P
Im sure like everyone would be interested in that. xD

It would be closed immediately. This thread is for discussion about matters like so.

To touch on the over-suggested characters:

• Ridley
• Krystal
• King K. Rool
• Geno
• Bowser Jr.
• Black Knight
• Micaiah
• Masked Man/Claus
• Black Shadow
• Samurai Goroh
• Isaac
• Bomberman
• Mega Man
• Animal Crosser; etc, etc....

What significance (please explain in-depth) do you feel resides in any of the above characters, and, why do you feel that they are deserving of being a PC? In no way am I shooting any of these characters down, for I too hold desires for the majority of them, but, the question remains.

I'd also like to note that despite my past beliefs, I no longer support third party characters in Smash Bros. I would love the inclusion of several, but it no longer feels acceptable. Call me short, but for a time, I was unimpressed with the Nintendo characters available, sadly. I have since built a strong respect for many Nintendo characters and have strong hopes that Sonic and Snake will be cut for the sake of making room for more first party characters. I love Bomberman. I hate Mega Man. I love Black Mage. I hate Shadow. See how this works? The love-hate relationship between players and third party characters, and their inclusion in an up-until-now Nintendo-only game is persistent in all of us. None of us love every third party character, nor do we love all of the Nintendo characters, but I never find myself playing with Sonic or Snake, not because of how they play, but because I've grown a disgust for their addition. Nintendo characters feel so more homely, even if I never play with them. I don't play with the Fire Emblem characters, Pit, and several other characters, but I appreciate their inclusion because they are all part of the family. Snake and Sonic are not. Bomberman is not. Mega Man is not. Geno...is not.

 

[Chris Lionheart]

I'm pretty sure everyone wants Mewtwo to be back in, but I want to take the idea a bit further.

MEW AND MEWTWO!!!

Mew:
B- Psybeam- Fires a chargeable psychic laser horizontally. A fully charged Psybeam also sets the foe on fire for 3 seconds (doing 3% damage a second.)
Side B- Mirror Coat- Mew is temporarily protected by a force field that reflects projectiles, doubling their speed. This has multiple super armor frames and low lag.
Up B- Future Sight- Mew disappears and after 2 seconds appears a good distance in a controllable direction. A huge area at the end location is covered in psychic energy with high knockback and damage.
Down B- Mewtwo- Teleports out. Mewtwo teleports in.

Mewtwo:
B- Shadow Ball- Charges a shadow ball that grows bigger and more powerful as it charges. Each shadow ball causes the foe to burst into dark flames for 1 second (adding 3% damage.)
Side B- Whatever his current Side B is...- Manipulates the area in front of him with psychic force to flip opposing players and reflect (rather than just deflect) projectiles. This has much less lag than its Melee iteration.
Up B- Teleport- Same as in melee except with a slightly extended range.
Down B- Mew- Teleports out. Mew teleports in.

Now Mewtwo becomes a better character by having his near useless Down B replaced with the option to switch to Mew, who is faster and better at combos. Mewtwo will have his power increased to make him a good finisher.

Changes to Mewtwo:
Heavier (Mew gets his old weight)
less floaty (Mew inherits his old floatiness)
More powerful overall character.
Backwards air changed to a 180 spin that goes into a psycic attack with high knockback.
Down smash now has a slight backwards Area of Effect.
Extended range on teleport.
B-Sticking makes Mewtwo more effective.
And the greatest change of all is that his Down B was replaced with the option to switch to Mew who improves his combo'ing and overall versatility.

 

[SkylerOcon]

It would be closed immediately. This thread is for discussion about matters like so.

To touch on the over-suggested characters:

• Ridley
• Krystal
• King K. Rool
• Geno
• Bowser Jr.
• Black Knight
• Micaiah
• Masked Man/Claus
• Black Shadow
• Samurai Goroh
• Isaac
• Bomberman
• Mega Man
• Animal Crosser; etc, etc....

Ridley- The only constant boss of the Metroid series. He would have a unique moveset, we would have a flier, and a pretty cool evil character if there's another SSE-type thing.

Krystal- Another girl, another unique moveset, and more representation for Star Fox. What's not to like?

King K. Rool- Though I'm not a fan, I could see how he would fit in. A boxer type character that's a freakin' crocodile. That'd be pretty cool actually.

Geno- I love Super Mario RPG, but I don't really see Geno as somebody who needs inclusion. I love the guy, but I don't see him as a smasher.

Bowser Jr. - No. One million times no. Light and weaker version of Bowser. Clones = fail.

Black Knight - We want Roy, not him! He'd be an Ike clone, anyway.

Micaiah- Pretty cool, we need a full mage character instead of the Zelda/Shiek split.

Claus- I don't know enough about him to make a good decision

Black Shadow- No. I don't even see how this guy makes sense. He wasn't even in the original F-Zero. He'd be a Falcon clone anyway.

Samurai Gorough- He'd introduce a unique style of sword-play, and I love F-Zero so I want him in anyway

Isaac- Isn't he a mage guy like Micaiah?! If not, then I don't know enough to give a good answer.

Bomberman- Awesome third party, and an awesome character. Unique moveset too. I want this guy in.

Megaman- Yes. I'm a Megaman fanboy (I have the entire manga series) so I'm probably byass, but as long as they don't turn him into a Samus clone I'll be happy . Maybe a moveset where his B-Down does type transformations (regular to fire to wind and stuff)

Animal Crosser- No. God dammit. Stupid idea. Since when have animal crossing characters fought? Never. They deserve a stage and that's it.

 

[Steck]

Looking over the games as a series
64: all combos, little spacing game, slower, average gravity
Melee: balance of combos and spacing, faster, gravity feels a bit strong
Brawl: few/small combos, mostly about spacing, slower, gravity is weak

What I want for SSB4 is: the combos of 64, the speed of melee and the gravity of brawl
It would be rather refreshing by the time it came out. After years of playing brawl I would want something different

 

[Spire]

I'm pretty sure everyone wants Mewtwo to be back in, but I want to take the idea a bit further.

MEW AND MEWTWO!!!

Mew:
B- Psybeam- Fires a chargeable psychic laser horizontally. A fully charged Psybeam also sets the foe on fire for 3 seconds (doing 3% damage a second.)
Side B- Mirror Coat- Mew is temporarily protected by a force field that reflects projectiles, doubling their speed. This has multiple super armor frames and low lag.
Up B- Future Sight- Mew disappears and after 2 seconds appears a good distance in a controllable direction. A huge area at the end location is covered in psychic energy with high knockback and damage.
Down B- Mewtwo- Teleports out. Mewtwo teleports in.

Mewtwo:
B- Shadow Ball- Charges a shadow ball that grows bigger and more powerful as it charges. Each shadow ball causes the foe to burst into dark flames for 1 second (adding 3% damage.)
Side B- Whatever his current Side B is...- Manipulates the area in front of him with psychic force to flip opposing players and reflect (rather than just deflect) projectiles. This has much less lag than its Melee iteration.
Up B- Teleport- Same as in melee except with a slightly extended range.
Down B- Mew- Teleports out. Mew teleports in.

Now Mewtwo becomes a better character by having his near useless Down B replaced with the option to switch to Mew, who is faster and better at combos. Mewtwo will have his power increased to make him a good finisher.

Changes to Mewtwo:
Heavier (Mew gets his old weight)
less floaty (Mew inherits his old floatiness)
More powerful overall character.
Backwards air changed to a 180 spin that goes into a psycic attack with high knockback.
Down smash now has a slight backwards Area of Effect.
Extended range on teleport.
B-Sticking makes Mewtwo more effective.
And the greatest change of all is that his Down B was replaced with the option to switch to Mew who improves his combo'ing and overall versatility.

This is just about one of the greatest ideas to date. I'm diggin' this big time; good job Chris.

Also, the only characters that I'm really wanting right now are: King Boo, Dimentio (in 3D), Funky Kong, Skull Kid with Majora's Mask, Leon, and now Mew & Mewtwo. Again - wow. Perfect idea.

 

[PKboy89]

It would be closed immediately. This thread is for discussion about matters like so.

To touch on the over-suggested characters:

• Ridley
• Krystal
• King K. Rool
• Geno
• Bowser Jr.
• Black Knight
• Micaiah
• Masked Man/Claus
• Black Shadow
• Samurai Goroh
• Isaac
• Bomberman
• Mega Man
• Animal Crosser; etc, etc....

What significance (please explain in-depth) do you feel resides in any of the above characters, and, why do you feel that they are deserving of being a PC? In no way am I shooting any of these characters down, for I too hold desires for the majority of them, but, the question remains.

I'd also like to note that despite my past beliefs, I no longer support third party characters in Smash Bros. I would love the inclusion of several, but it no longer feels acceptable. Call me short, but for a time, I was unimpressed with the Nintendo characters available, sadly. I have since built a strong respect for many Nintendo characters and have strong hopes that Sonic and Snake will be cut for the sake of making room for more first party characters. I love Bomberman. I hate Mega Man. I love Black Mage. I hate Shadow. See how this works? The love-hate relationship between players and third party characters, and their inclusion in an up-until-now Nintendo-only game is persistent in all of us. None of us love every third party character, nor do we love all of the Nintendo characters, but I never find myself playing with Sonic or Snake, not because of how they play, but because I've grown a disgust for their addition. Nintendo characters feel so more homely, even if I never play with them. I don't play with the Fire Emblem characters, Pit, and several other characters, but I appreciate their inclusion because they are all part of the family. Snake and Sonic are not. Bomberman is not. Mega Man is not. Geno...is not.

Why not just say no more new characters..with the list you have, we only have room for third parties...lol

 

[Blade Knight]

i'll be happy as long as they keep olimar wolf and ike in. but i would just love to see shadow the hedgehog in it.

Emo Clones FTL, and Thanks buddy you ssaid Olimar.

 

[M@v]

My list for SSB4 feautres. Many have been said already.

1. New characters. Definately some more 3rd party comers.
My List for some newcomers, 1st and 3rd party, and reasons.


1.Saki-VERY suprised most didn't mention him. I would main Saki in a heartbeat. He is of course an assist trophy now, but has the potential to be a very playable character. And his game has been very popular and positively rated. Some may say"But he only has one game!" Ok. Pit, Ice climbers, ness, and lucas all have only one game as well.

2.Ridley- As everyone mentioned, hes been in every metroid game. This poor space pirate dragon deserves his shot.

3.Krystal- Face it many want her in, and another starfox rep =D

4. Sora- Could be a great fit, and would fit well with all crowds. Younger ones who would love to play him due to the Disney affiliation. I think Kingdom Hearts is a good game, so I would definately look at him. He could be a very well balanced character, and I could easily think of a moveset.

5. Shadow(Maybe)- He would be a nice addition, but he would just wind up being a sonic clone.

6. Waddle Dee- The poor dude is abused. Hes a projectile for DDD. He should get a chance to whip his tormentor.


Better online play. Mario Kart wii is a great step for nintendo in the online department. hopefully they will have online down pat when the next ssb installment rolls around. And please, ONLINE RANKINGS!!!!!

Better Storymode. Done get me wrong. SSE was great, but there is much room for improvement. And dont make half the story mode a giant maze repeating everything you already did .

 

[Spire]

Why not just say no more new characters..with the list you have, we only have room for third parties...lol

Well that's just it. There are plenty of more Nintendo characters that could be added. These are only the most popular because people copy others. A lot of people hop on the bandwagon when they see that the same characters are being requested by many people, so they join in and post that they would like to see them included too, regardless if they have played the game that the character derives from, or even have the slightest idea as to who they are. That is how a character's popularity gets bumped more and more, and along the way, stumpy reasons are drawn for why they should be included, and it actually convinces people.

"We need more females, so Krystal has to be in." Okay, more females would be nice, but does that mean that she is necessary? Although Krystal was a key character in one "semi-spinoff" Star Fox title, she was not necessary enough to match up to Wolf's inclusion. I am no Wolf player, but he deserved the spot much more than she.

"Metroid only has had one rep since SSB64, and since Ridley is basically Samus' nemesis, he should be resized dramatically so we can play as him." Well, how about reasoning. There is reason as to why Ridley did not make it into Brawl, despite the number of votes on Sakurai's poll. The man himself said that he was too large, and resizing him would [be ludicrous].

"Geno was one of the most badass characters ever, and even though he was made entirely by Square, Nintendo could buy him because he would be a great addition." Seriously, the characters in Brawl are important to the series that they derive from, at least at some point in time. Geno was important to... one game, and that game was not even made by Nintendo.

Now, I am not ranting about whether or not these characters should be added or not, but rather stating the reasons as to why they were not, and furthermore, the types of quotes as to why their superstardom has skyrocketed far beyond reasoning. There are other characters that could fit in just as well, if not better than the aforementioned. Yes, I agree that we need more female characters; yes I agree that Metroid needs another representative; and yes I agree that Geno could make an interesting character, but despite with what I agree, there are reasons as to why they were not included in Brawl, and perhaps why they may not see the light of day in SSB4. If however, it's a matter of money, and what characters would attract more green, then perhaps we will see Ridley and Geno, with Krystal almost being a given.

 

[PKSkyler]

If there is any more third parties...Megaman(X or Classic, probably Classic) and either Protoman or Zer(Depending if they put X or Classic)

Id like more earthbound releated stuff, seeing as I am a big fan. Starman, Paula, Poo, or Jeff in the next smash bros, please.

As for Pokemon, well my favorite Pokemon is Hitmonlee, so maybe if they had Hitmonlee, Hitmonchan, and Hitmontop as one character, similar to pokemon trainer. I had a moveset written down somewhere...

Another intersting character for yoshis island would be baby mario and baby luigi, an ice-climbers type character.
Theres a lot more, of course, but yeah.

 

[Banjodorf]

K. Rool for the win.
... That's two people who've told me to... Yikes, I guess I should...
I've played halfway through Super Metroid, beaten Metroid Primes 1 and 2, played about a quarter way through Corruption (who took my disc!?!), and beaten Hunters (irrelevant, I know). Which game is Ridley stated to have done something important, other than stealing the last Metroid? This is a question, by the way, not a shot at Ridley.


... *dies*
I HAD ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA. Donkey Kong is Nintendo's fourth best-selling franchise!?!
... The DK fanboy (me) is happy.

Hehe I'm glad I have opened up your eyes about DK, young padawan.

 

[Banjodorf]

1. Ike, although has been the lord of 2 FE's, is not more important than Micaiah. Micaiah is actually a crucial part of the plot while Ike is there purely by coincidence. Micaiah also has the potential to be a MUCH more unique character than Ike. FE although could use 3 reps and not 4 however I will admit.

2. Okay, I agree with you, The Starfox crew should not be replaced or cut for SSB4.

3. The Pokemon series does not need SEVEN characters. But if Charizard does not have what it takes, they could always put Meowth in the game.

4. May I ask if you have played Stafy's game. He is most certainlly not a waist of a character space.

Also, I realize ROB is very important now. He needs to be put in the roster.

Is there ANY character in the Zelda series not in the big 3 that is at least somewhat significant in more than 1 game?

Edit: Double post, I'm so sorry.

You got rid of Olimar? WTF is wrong with you?

 

[Ramgigon]

Ridley- The only constant boss of the Metroid series. He would have a unique moveset, we would have a flier, and a pretty cool evil character if there's another SSE-type thing.

Good point on the consistent boss thing...
A unique moveset - actually, I daresay he'd take a few moves from Charizard.
What makes a flier so great? Wouldn't that just make his inclusion awkward?
Yeah, villain, that's good...

Krystal- Another girl, another unique moveset, and more representation for Star Fox. What's not to like?

Another girl, good.
Unique moveset - very true.
Do we need more Star Fox representation?

King K. Rool- Though I'm not a fan, I could see how he would fit in. A boxer type character that's a freakin' crocodile. That'd be pretty cool actually.

That's completely true. I mean... How could be possibly not be in? Not even an Assist Trophy? I'm disgusted.

Geno- I love Super Mario RPG, but I don't really see Geno as somebody who needs inclusion. I love the guy, but I don't see him as a smasher.

Yeah, a star that possesses a doll in one game. What a great character idea... [/sarcasm]

Bowser Jr. - No. One million times no. Light and weaker version of Bowser. Clones = fail.

Sunshine. Play it.

Black Knight - We want Roy, not him! He'd be an Ike clone, anyway.

Yeah, let's avoid this villain (who also happens to be a heavyweight), and put in another hero instead (who is another mid-weight character). Plus, who's to say Roy wouldn't be a Marth clone again?

Micaiah- Pretty cool, we need a full mage character instead of the Zelda/Shiek split.

Yes.

Claus- I don't know enough about him to make a good decision

I'm with you there. Curse you, Nintendo... I want some Mother 3.

Black Shadow- No. I don't even see how this guy makes sense. He wasn't even in the original F-Zero. He'd be a Falcon clone anyway.

Eh, he'd be another villain, but I have no idea about whether or not he should be included.
... So what if he wasn't in the original? Diddy Kong wasn't in the original Donkey Kong game. Were Meta Knight and/or King DeDeDe in the original Kirby game?
Actually, I'd say he'd take Ganondorf's moveset. You know, big evil guy? From the same game as C. Falcon, thus he would have a similar moveset?

Samurai Gorough- He'd introduce a unique style of sword-play, and I love F-Zero so I want him in anyway

Eh, another sword... I dunno.

Isaac- Isn't he a mage guy like Micaiah?! If not, then I don't know enough to give a good answer.

What you said.

Bomberman- Awesome third party, and an awesome character. Unique moveset too. I want this guy in.

Ugh... Third-parties... No comments here.

Megaman- Yes. I'm a Megaman fanboy (I have the entire manga series) so I'm probably byass, but as long as they don't turn him into a Samus clone I'll be happy . Maybe a moveset where his B-Down does type transformations (regular to fire to wind and stuff)

See Bomberman.

Animal Crosser- No. God dammit. Stupid idea. Since when have animal crossing characters fought? Never. They deserve a stage and that's it.

I bring up the golden example of R.O.B.. Or Fox. Or even Captain Falcon.
You can make your character violent... Animals get mad if you hit them with an axe.

 

[Deathcarter]

Well that's just it. There are plenty of more Nintendo characters that could be added. These are only the most popular because people copy others. A lot of people hop on the bandwagon when they see that the same characters are being requested by many people, so they join in and post that they would like to see them included too, regardless if they have played the game that the character derives from, or even have the slightest idea as to who they are. That is how a character's popularity gets bumped more and more, and along the way, stumpy reasons are drawn for why they should be included, and it actually convinces people.

"We need more females, so Krystal has to be in." Okay, more females would be nice, but does that mean that she is necessary? Although Krystal was a key character in one "semi-spinoff" Star Fox title, she was not necessary enough to match up to Wolf's inclusion. I am no Wolf player, but he deserved the spot much more than she.

"Metroid only has had one rep since SSB64, and since Ridley is basically Samus' nemesis, he should be resized dramatically so we can play as him." Well, how about reasoning. There is reason as to why Ridley did not make it into Brawl, despite the number of votes on Sakurai's poll. The man himself said that he was too large, and resizing him would [be ludicrous].

"Geno was one of the most badass characters ever, and even though he was made entirely by Square, Nintendo could buy him because he would be a great addition." Seriously, the characters in Brawl are important to the series that they derive from, at least at some point in time. Geno was important to... one game, and that game was not even made by Nintendo.

Now, I am not ranting about whether or not these characters should be added or not, but rather stating the reasons as to why they were not, and furthermore, the types of quotes as to why their superstardom has skyrocketed far beyond reasoning. There are other characters that could fit in just as well, if not better than the aforementioned. Yes, I agree that we need more female characters; yes I agree that Metroid needs another representative; and yes I agree that Geno could make an interesting character, but despite with what I agree, there are reasons as to why they were not included in Brawl, and perhaps why they may not see the light of day in SSB4. If however, it's a matter of money, and what characters would attract more green, then perhaps we will see Ridley and Geno, with Krystal almost being a given.

I agree with you a lot. A lot of what you said could apply to me (looks at my support for Issac). But characters that appear in more popular (and recent) games will be more known about and will the characters most desired to appear in smash before the bandwaggoners come into play. Remember, Ike managed to get into Brawl when both of his games (although good) are bested imo by FE's 1,3,4,7, and 8. Ike being popular with a wider audience is what got him into the game over Sigurd, Roy, Lyn, HECTOR, Eliwood, Ephiram, and Eirika. Him being more recent is what gave him the edge, the bandwaggoners were coincidental .

I also agree that Ridley in smash is farefetch'd due to his nature. More people need to support Dark Samus as it is COMPLETELY different from Samus and is the only human-esque boss to be the final boss in 2 or more Metroid games. It is time for it to shine.

That, my friend, is 100% country-fried GENIUS.

I commend you. Imagine what kind of sick moveset Sakurai could hook Dimentio up with...

Thanks, you rock! Dimentio is a GREAT important character originating from the Paper Mario series (and those are quite difficult to come by) and I feel that entitles him (and Majora's Mask; man I loved that game) to consideration.

Edit: Double post, I'm so sorry.

You got rid of Olimar? WTF is wrong with you?

I apologize. I always neglect a character or 2. Olimar definately deserves to be in.

 

[Spire]

More people need to support Dark Samus as it is COMPLETELY different from Samus and is the only human-esque boss to be the final boss in 2 or more Metroid games. It is time for it to shine.

Thanks, you rock! Dimentio is a GREAT important character originating from the Paper Mario series (and those are quite difficult to come by) and I feel that entitles him (and Majora's Mask; man I loved that game) to consideration.

See, it's the strange characters that add so much flavor. At the time of SSB64, a lot of people did not know who Samus, Ness, or even Captain Falcon were (I knew all but Ness), but look how those characters have ended up - continuing repping in the smash games, with Samus and Falcon's series growing more and more. Adding characters that aren't as popular, but would definitely spice up the color of the roster, and the heat of the battles is a smart move indeed. It sparks wonder in those who are unfamiliar with the characters, and helps to popularize those in need so that their respective game series may accelerate even more, and wider. We can't go living on with the expected, the consistent; we need a surprise!

Why live on with just Mario, Luigi, Peach, and Bowser, when you could spruce up the Mushroom reps with less known, but very rich characters like Petey Piranha, King Boo, Toad, or even Rosalina. We have Link, Zelda, Ganondorf, and Toon Link, but those are the most expected characters. Drop Toonboy, and add a Goron, or Skull Kid.

Add some more flavor to the roster, and you'll have a successful game with less complaints. Add those "linear" characters; those that are to be expected, and you'll have a successful game, but many will complain because the other expected characters did not make the cut. When you are offered apples, take zucchini. Don't go with what's generic; draw a parabola, not a line. That's innovation; that's revolution. Games grow boring when they continue to grow on a line. Curve that line so they grow so much quicker, and different than before. Metroid was practically dead until it was flipped 180 degrees and transformed into an FPS. Smash Bros needs to flip 180 degrees.

I've quoted this before, and I'll do it again:

"A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds."

- Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

[S_B]

More beta testing to avoid huge bugs like Bowser going off the screen and staying there if someone else knocks a player out of his toward+B and how he wins or goes to SD with a Bowsercide depending upon controller port.

Seriously, this is some pretty easy stuff to pick up in testing...

 

[Testament27]

More beta testing to avoid huge bugs like Bowser going off the screen and staying there if someone else knocks a player out of his toward+B and how he wins or goes to SD with a Bowsercide depending upon controller port.

Seriously, this is some pretty easy stuff to pick up in testing...

That is seriously my biggest gripe about brawl. A lot of the **** that frustrates our community with the game could have easily been taken care of if sakurai was not a noob, and put forth the extra effort to perfect the game through a beta testing or by making sure patches/dlc were possible. what a nube

 

[SmashChu]

More beta testing to avoid huge bugs like Bowser going off the screen and staying there if someone else knocks a player out of his toward+B and how he wins or goes to SD with a Bowsercide depending upon controller port.

Seriously, this is some pretty easy stuff to pick up in testing...

The first one they probably didn't find, for obvious reasons.
The second one might have been left in. It is one of the strategies I guess.

 

[smashbot226]

Am I the ONLY one on this thread who wants moar Yoshi series reps?

Shy Guy and Kamek, to be more specific?

 

[Spire]

Am I the ONLY one on this thread who wants moar Yoshi series reps?

Shy Guy and Kamek, to be more specific?

I'm a supporter of both, but Shy Guy might be a bit too pressing due to spacial and rational constraints. Kamek is a necessity in my opinion if Yoshi were to get a fellow rep. The Yoshi series is very relative to the Super Mario series, so to put Kamek and Shy Guy in would probably be too much, but I nevertheless reinforce both for personal favor.

 

[Golem the Stern Father]

It's all characters in this thread, typical.

I'm interested to see what new apporach and what music there will be in the future installment.

 

[PKboy89]

Saying that no body knew who ness, samus and captain falcon were is just stupid. Yea, little kids didn't know who they were, but real Nintendo fans did...plus, Earthbound and the Mother series is EXTREMELY popular in Japan, if you didn't know, Sakuari doesn't care about America...he based the rooster on Japanese requests, and Japan was begging for Lucas since melee...it doesn't matter if its popular in America. And it really didn't matter if it sparked interest...Metroid and the F Zero series were already popular, and Earthbound...you'll find that game for about 100 bucks now and Nintendo refuses to remake it or bring Mother 3 to America.

Its all about what Japan wants, and it doesn't matter, he knew it would sell like crazy in America regardless. And does it really matter whether the fighter is female or not...Peach is a female but seriously has no place in Brawl...all these years she has been kidnapped by Bowser, since when does she start kicking his *** all of a sudden? And what other females are left to add...Daisy? I'm sick of Mario characters...Krystal? Yea, she is a pretty cool character...but who else is out there, Paula...I love earthbound, best rpg ever...but I doubt we'll be seeing anymore Earthbound characters, if you're expecting a wave of new females, it won't happen, we don't have that many left...Brawl had one new female fighter...Zamus...the same person as Samus except without the power suit...you could include Pit though...lol

 

[Dream Chaser]

-Ridley
-Banjo-Kazooie
-Gannondorf moves (at least specials) for Gannondorf

 

[Kiki52]

Yes it is unfortunate that Sakurai might not care about America that much. Maybe a reason why the there won't be any cool female characters like Krystal and Paula etc because in Japanese culture they don't revere women that much like America does? I am not sure, that isn't a generalist statement but I am going by other threads by people which talked about the sexualization of women in Smash. That could be a somewhat sexist attitude in other cultures other than the west.

Remember though too Sakurai still somewhat listened to American requests for Krystal by putting in the communication dialog between Fox and her if you pressed a button sorta like Snake's codex.

But what about Sonic though? Wasn't he heavily requested in America for Brawl? Sakurai put him in, but I guess that was only a single instance. I don't know of the Japanese heavily demanding Sonic, and I know before Sonic was announced on the dojo tons and tons of people all the time were asking for Sonic to come in Brawl.

As far as music goes, they need to put the lost soundtracks of Earthbound back. I sent an email to Nintendo and got a response, so at least they heard me. Just because a music sounds too slow for battle doesn't mean it should be cut. They probably wasted money just to compose it just to cut it out.

 

[antimatter]

Yeah, a star that possesses a doll in one game. What a great character idea... [/sarcasm]

he has magic abilities, as well as an arsenal of bullets and other weapons concealed in his body. Mario lost a rep in brawl, and Geno was a highly requested character on the poll. not everyone likes him, others disliked the giant jump on the Geno bandwagon, but he's been requested and has a valid fanbase. Plus, he cameoed in M&L: Superstar Saga, so Square Enix seems willing to loan him out.

 

[Ramgigon]

he has magic abilities, as well as an arsenal of bullets and other weapons concealed in his body. Mario lost a rep in brawl, and Geno was a highly requested character on the poll. not everyone likes him, others disliked the giant jump on the Geno bandwagon, but he's been requested and has a valid fanbase. Plus, he cameoed in M&L: Superstar Saga, so Square Enix seems willing to loan him out.

Uh, and so what if he has a lot of bullets? That doesn't make him a good character.
Does Mario need more reps? It already has 4.
Right, he's popular. That doesn't mean he isn't a ridiculous character.
Okay... He cameoed in another game. So he had one role in one game that isn't even a series, and then had a cameo. That's quite the reputation there.

All I'm saying is that he doesn't seem like a good character. I wouldn't mind if he were in, just if he took up the developers' time obtaining licenses and such whereas they could be adding modes and characters, improving on old modes and characters, etc..

 

[Zombieoficer]

Uh, and so what if he has a lot of bullets? That doesn't make him a good character.
Does Mario need more reps? It already has 4.
Right, he's popular. That doesn't mean he isn't a ridiculous character.
Okay... He cameoed in another game. So he had one role in one game that isn't even a series, and then had a cameo. That's quite the reputation there.

All I'm saying is that he doesn't seem like a good character. I wouldn't mind if he were in, just if he took up the developers' time obtaining licenses and such whereas they could be adding modes and characters, improving on old modes and characters, etc..

Pokemon has 6 reps, and Zelda has 5. A less iconic series, Star Fox, has 3.

I think the Mario series would do well with one more.

There are many ridiculous characters in Brawl, (ROB, G&W...) and you admt yourself, that he is popular.

Also, I don't think the division that acquires rights is the same one that creates textures or models...

 

[PKboy89]

Yes it is unfortunate that Sakurai might not care about America that much. Maybe a reason why the there won't be any cool female characters like Krystal and Paula etc because in Japanese culture they don't revere women that much like America does? I am not sure, that isn't a generalist statement but I am going by other threads by people which talked about the sexualization of women in Smash. That could be a somewhat sexist attitude in other cultures other than the west.

Remember though too Sakurai still somewhat listened to American requests for Krystal by putting in the communication dialog between Fox and her if you pressed a button sorta like Snake's codex.

But what about Sonic though? Wasn't he heavily requested in America for Brawl? Sakurai put him in, but I guess that was only a single instance. I don't know of the Japanese heavily demanding Sonic, and I know before Sonic was announced on the dojo tons and tons of people all the time were asking for Sonic to come in Brawl.

As far as music goes, they need to put the lost soundtracks of Earthbound back. I sent an email to Nintendo and got a response, so at least they heard me. Just because a music sounds too slow for battle doesn't mean it should be cut. They probably wasted money just to compose it just to cut it out.

Sakurai planned Sonic long before there were any requests for him...well, there have always been requests, but Sakurai always planned to have in regardless...I love the Earthbound music in Brawl, Snowman is my favorite track, lol

 

[biohazard930]

I'm pretty sure everyone wants Mewtwo to be back in, but I want to take the idea a bit further.

MEW AND MEWTWO!!!

Mew:
B- Psybeam- Fires a chargeable psychic laser horizontally. A fully charged Psybeam also sets the foe on fire for 3 seconds (doing 3% damage a second.)
Side B- Mirror Coat- Mew is temporarily protected by a force field that reflects projectiles, doubling their speed. This has multiple super armor frames and low lag.
Up B- Future Sight- Mew disappears and after 2 seconds appears a good distance in a controllable direction. A huge area at the end location is covered in psychic energy with high knockback and damage.
Down B- Mewtwo- Teleports out. Mewtwo teleports in.

Mewtwo:
B- Shadow Ball- Charges a shadow ball that grows bigger and more powerful as it charges. Each shadow ball causes the foe to burst into dark flames for 1 second (adding 3% damage.)
Side B- Whatever his current Side B is...- Manipulates the area in front of him with psychic force to flip opposing players and reflect (rather than just deflect) projectiles. This has much less lag than its Melee iteration.
Up B- Teleport- Same as in melee except with a slightly extended range.
Down B- Mew- Teleports out. Mew teleports in.

Now Mewtwo becomes a better character by having his near useless Down B replaced with the option to switch to Mew, who is faster and better at combos. Mewtwo will have his power increased to make him a good finisher.

Changes to Mewtwo:
Heavier (Mew gets his old weight)
less floaty (Mew inherits his old floatiness)
More powerful overall character.
Backwards air changed to a 180 spin that goes into a psycic attack with high knockback.
Down smash now has a slight backwards Area of Effect.
Extended range on teleport.
B-Sticking makes Mewtwo more effective.
And the greatest change of all is that his Down B was replaced with the option to switch to Mew who improves his combo'ing and overall versatility.

Ugh...sorry, but this just seems like an almost random "team" character. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: characters need not be teamed unless they can't reliably exist on their own. I don't support the Diddy and Dixie team, and it even has a shred of precedence. This has none whatsoever (am I wrong?).

It was some nice thought on the character specifics, but it seems like a very forced character. Mew and Mewtwo stand alone very well, and should, because they can.

 

[Spire]

Saying that no body knew who ness, samus and captain falcon were is just stupid. Yea, little kids didn't know who they were, but real Nintendo fans did...plus, Earthbound and the Mother series is EXTREMELY popular in Japan, if you didn't know, Sakuari doesn't care about America...he based the rooster on Japanese requests, and Japan was begging for Lucas since melee...it doesn't matter if its popular in America. And it really didn't matter if it sparked interest...Metroid and the F Zero series were already popular, and Earthbound...you'll find that game for about 100 bucks now and Nintendo refuses to remake it or bring Mother 3 to America.

Its all about what Japan wants, and it doesn't matter, he knew it would sell like crazy in America regardless. And does it really matter whether the fighter is female or not...Peach is a female but seriously has no place in Brawl...all these years she has been kidnapped by Bowser, since when does she start kicking his *** all of a sudden? And what other females are left to add...Daisy? I'm sick of Mario characters...Krystal? Yea, she is a pretty cool character...but who else is out there, Paula...I love earthbound, best rpg ever...but I doubt we'll be seeing anymore Earthbound characters, if you're expecting a wave of new females, it won't happen, we don't have that many left...Brawl had one new female fighter...Zamus...the same person as Samus except without the power suit...you could include Pit though...lol

If you are responding to me, please quote. Otherwise, targeting only "little kids who didn't know Samus, Falcon, and Ness, and why Earthbound games have not reached our shores since the SNES days", and your whole female-fighter rant is a little lacking in the progressive department. I'm not here to argue, and I know you're a huge Earthbound fan, and that strongly influences many of the things that you say, but if responding to what I had to say, speak of the higher, more important things, rather than Earthbound and females characters.

Yes it is unfortunate that Sakurai might not care about America that much. Maybe a reason why the there won't be any cool female characters like Krystal and Paula etc because in Japanese culture they don't revere women that much like America does? I am not sure, that isn't a generalist statement but I am going by other threads by people which talked about the sexualization of women in Smash. That could be a somewhat sexist attitude in other cultures other than the west.

Ever play the Soul Calibur games? They're made in Japan, and about half of the cast is female. Also, Dead or Alive and Guilty Gear are great examples of the massive attention that females get. It's not a cultural thing, it's that most of the main characters in Nintendo's franchises are not female. If they were, the cast would have a lot more females. We can definitely expect to see more in the next Smash Bros though, due to series like Fire Emblem, Star Fox, Mario, and perhaps even Donkey Kong.

Sakurai planned Sonic long before there were any requests for him...well, there have always been requests, but Sakurai always planned to have in regardless...I love the Earthbound music in Brawl, Snowman is my favorite track, lol

Actually, Sonic was a last minute addition, and in fact, was the last planned character. People have been drooling over the idea of Sonic being playable since Melee came out, and since, requests have been building up. So, Sakurai planned him back in the early days of Melee? Wrong.

Ugh...sorry, but this just seems like an almost random "team" character. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: characters need not be teamed unless they can't reliably exist on their own. I don't support the Diddy and Dixie team, and it even has a shred of precedence. This has none whatsoever (am I wrong?).

It was some nice thought on the character specifics, but it seems like a very forced character. Mew and Mewtwo stand alone very well, and should, because they can.

This is true. Mew and Mewtwo could stand alone as individual fighters, but that would be a bit pressing, would it not? That's like having Pikachu and Pichu. Separate character representation from the same family is too much. I'm not an advocate of Link AND Toon Link, nor am I for Mario AND Paper Mario or Baby Mario. If either of the "Mews" get into the game, it's going to be Mewtwo of course. However, Chris Lionheart devised a great solution for how we could get both in the game, as a Zelda/Sheik character. Yes, Zelda and Sheik are the same being, but Mew and Mewtwo share a relationship so much closer than any other two Pokemon, despite that there is no evolution relationship between the two. Mewtwo is essentially Mew; a clone, but mutated. That is why they would work well together. Mewtwo would be heavy, while Mew would be light. You could interchange the two to put a twist on the fight.

 

[biohazard930]

This is true. Mew and Mewtwo could stand alone as individual fighters, but that would be a bit pressing, would it not? That's like having Pikachu and Pichu. Separate character representation from the same family is too much. I'm not an advocate of Link AND Toon Link, nor am I for Mario AND Paper Mario or Baby Mario. If either of the "Mews" get into the game, it's going to be Mewtwo of course. However, Chris Lionheart devised a great solution for how we could get both in the game, as a Zelda/Sheik character. Yes, Zelda and Sheik are the same being, but Mew and Mewtwo share a relationship so much closer than any other two Pokemon, despite that there is no evolution relationship between the two. Mewtwo is essentially Mew; a clone, but mutated. That is why they would work well together. Mewtwo would be heavy, while Mew would be light. You could interchange the two to put a twist on the fight.

By saying "Mew and Mewtwo could stand alone as individual fighters, but that would be a bit pressing, would it not?" I assume that you're assuming both should/would get in. What if neither or only one got in? I'll agree that having two reps from the same close family is too much. That's why there shouldn't be two. I didn't like Pichu, nor am I a fan of Toon Link. The solution should be a cut, not a pair. A pair lessens the appeal of both characters, in my eyes.

I know the relation between the two, but that's still not close enough to warrant them being paired. There aren't any other Pokemon that are paired (PT doesn't count; that operates on a different premise.) They exist separately, so even if they were to be included, they should be separate. And if separate is too much, someone gets cut. It's still too forced. I'd hate to "ruin" the image of such a cool character as Mewtwo.

 

[Spire]

By saying "Mew and Mewtwo could stand alone as individual fighters, but that would be a bit pressing, would it not?" I assume that you're assuming both should/would get in. What if neither or only one got in? I'll agree that having two reps from the same close family is too much. That's why there shouldn't be two. I didn't like Pichu, nor am I a fan of Toon Link. The solution should be a cut, not a pair. A pair lessens the appeal of both characters, in my eyes.

I know the relation between the two, but that's still not close enough to warrant them being paired. There aren't any other Pokemon that are paired (PT doesn't count; that operates on a different premise.) They exist separately, so even if they were to be included, they should be separate. And if separate is too much, someone gets cut. It's still too forced. I'd hate to "ruin" the image of such a cool character as Mewtwo.

I agree with you completely. I was merely stating how they could work together. It would dumb down Mewtwo, rendering him reliant on a Pokemon smaller, cuter, and weaker than he. I do appreciate the idea of pairing the two, but even though you technically would not have to play as Mew, just playing as Zelda, and knowing that if you press down+b that you're going to be playing as another character strips the individual of their uniqueness and overall integrity. Mewtwo should be Mewtwo, and that is that.

Also, if by the time that Smash Bros 4 comes out, if one, or two more generations of Pokemon have been released, Lucario should be replaced by a more deserving character. Mewtwo is completely deserving, but does not need to replace Lucario, but should rather be re-added as a "new" character.

 

[The Real Inferno]

I don't feel there are a great deal of well known females in the Nintendo Universe though and the "more female fighters" argument always creeps me out because all it makes me think of is the ninety billion porn picture of ZSS. The request being sex specific makes it sounds more like a request for more ****ing material or something.

Still, Lip would be cool.

If I were going to add new characters I wouldn't want there to be more than 3 new Third party chars personally. But here's my wish list just the same...

Sukapon
Bomberman
Elite Beat Agents - Rhythm based moveset? Yes please.
New Metroid Rep - preferably not Ridley but rather one of the Hunters
Megaman
Pokemon Rival- Chimchar, Grovyle, Feraligatr
Puu (or was it Poo? Kid from Earthbound who knew Starstorm)
Porky
AnimalCrosser
Mii
Lil Mac -I wish he was playable so bad....
Viewtiful Joe
The Wanna Be The Guy (From I Wanna Be The Guy.....what?.....**** you)

 

[Chris Lionheart]

By saying "Mew and Mewtwo could stand alone as individual fighters, but that would be a bit pressing, would it not?" I assume that you're assuming both should/would get in. What if neither or only one got in? I'll agree that having two reps from the same close family is too much. That's why there shouldn't be two. I didn't like Pichu, nor am I a fan of Toon Link. The solution should be a cut, not a pair. A pair lessens the appeal of both characters, in my eyes.

I know the relation between the two, but that's still not close enough to warrant them being paired. There aren't any other Pokemon that are paired (PT doesn't count; that operates on a different premise.) They exist separately, so even if they were to be included, they should be separate. And if separate is too much, someone gets cut. It's still too forced. I'd hate to "ruin" the image of such a cool character as Mewtwo.

I shouldn't explain why your argument is pointless but I will.

How would having Mew as a partner ruin the image of Mewtwo?

Mew kicks *** as much as Mewtwo. So he's cute and pink... so is Kirby!!!

By that logic you could say that Metaknight should get in because he is cool and Kirby shouldn't because he is small and pink.

And how is Mew not as deserving of a character? Mew was around first and is easily as powerful as Mewtwo. Mewtwo was a clone of Mew.

And being paired with Mew would most definitely not ruin the image of Mewtwo. Melee already did that by making Mewtwo the worst overall character in the entire game. Lets face it, Mewtwo needs any buff he can get, and if adding Mew would allow him to have his power raised and increase the pairs versatility why not do it?

I agree with Spire in that it would be much to pressing to add both as characters (that would give Poke'mon an immense number of reps if Lucario is not replaced by Mewtwo.) And having them paired is definitely not a weakness, nor does it require you to switch to the other character. A lot of Brawl Zelda players don't even use Sheik because of rediculous switching time.

What would having Mew added, nearly doubling the pair's moveset do to Mewtwo as a character?.... It would replace his next to useless Down B move.

Not seeing the problem...


But if they must be seperate. Then replace Lucario with Mewtwo and add Mew as a new character.

Heck, you could even give Celebi and Jirachi as alternate outfits to Mew, seeing as how they are all 3 the same size (roughly) and have few differences.