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Official Roster Discussion

Best101

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 27, 2005
Messages
983
Location
Atlanta, GA
What's so great and important about Ridley? The character roster is great with or without that thing. Don't worry, you will soon get over it when you buy the game March 9 :)

In my opinion there is nothing wrong with the Roster except the fact that all the Star Fox characters' Final Smashes are Landmasters (I don't even think Wolf know what a Landmaster is)
 

nobletoast

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Sep 29, 2007
Messages
321
I thnk if some of the newcomers such as Captain Olimar and King Dedede where kept secret untill the leak then people would be a lot less angry. I didnt get the two I wanted most (K Rool and Ridley) but I still think the roster is fantstic. Think back to how crap the Mellee roster was and you still loved that game.

And the R.O.B. is just a scapegoat. Dont go blaming the ROB man because your favourite never go in.

He saved Nintendo. End of.
 

Ebony Princess

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
35
1) I really hope you can choose ZSS from the select screen somehow
You can by holding R when starting the match or something like that.

4) Why are Ness AND Lucas in?
The same reason Link and Toon Link are in.

Ridley- Too big? Is that seriously the only reason yall have against him? What about Olimar... or Bowser for that matter
There's the issue of proportion between his body and his wings.

Paper Mario- I just think he would be more interesting than other "clones" because he could easily have his own moveset
The same could be said of Toon Link, but look at him now.
 

DRaGZ

Smash Champion
Joined
Jan 5, 2008
Messages
2,049
Location
San Diego, CA
I was always hoping for characters but never emotionally investing in any of them (I mean, why would I?), so I think the roster is really cool.

I mean, it's obviously not the best it could be, but, then again, the best roster ever, imo, would be Marvel vs. Capcom vs. SNK vs. Namco vs. Mortal Kombat vs. Super Smash Bros.
 

Storm Eagle

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 4, 2007
Messages
1,800
Location
Germany
NNID
Storm88
In my opinion there is nothing wrong with the Roster except the fact that all the Star Fox characters' Final Smashes are Landmasters (I don't even think Wolf know what a Landmaster is)
And that in every Star Fox game Falco literally claims that he hates being on the ground and that he would leave the landmaster to Fox...
 

SirPainsalot

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 21, 2007
Messages
176
Location
NYC, New York Mains: Mr G/W, Kirby, Toon
I am OK with the roster. I'm overjoyed of R.O.B.'s inclusion because it shows how much Sakurai respects the old games and such. Without R.O.B., no Geno, Krystal, Isaac, nothing. It might be even possible that Mario would've never reappeared again. Sure, he might not be everyone's favorite character. He might have 'wasted' a roster spot. But at least he's unique.

The clones are back... But it that really bad at all? All of them are Luigi-fied. The only thing that's disappointing is the fact that Ganondorf is still a clone and three Landmasters. Besides that, I think it's fine.

I think people are disappointed for the fact that everyone was unique and awesome at the starting, then ending with clones and mostly characters with low or no fanbase. People, this is SAKURAI we're talking about. He goes with the characters he thinks should have made it in. All of those characters are generally have no fanbase, because for uniqueness. I'm pretty sure if Sakurai had more time and if he wanted too, all of the characters would be unique and had much more characters. I was personally saddened that Bowser Jr. didn't make it in, but I soon got over it. Especially because of the fact that Jiggz made it in (somehow).
 

Magmar's Wrath

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 23, 2007
Messages
208
Location
In a house.
WW Link is a direct clone of Link. Ganondorf is still a Capt. Falcon clone. Lucas and Ness share the majority of their abilities, including Final Smash. Wolf and Falco are semi-clones of Fox with the exact same Final Smash...

Setting aside my personal wants (Geno, Krystal, Daisy, Bowser Jr., Midna, and Tom Nook)...

They had HOW much time and HOW much resources, and they still gave us a slapdash finish?! God! It really burns me.

But it doesn't make me as mad as the condescending people on all the available message boards who keep flaming me and calling me an immature whiner as most of their words are **'ed out.
 

Ebony Princess

Smash Cadet
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
35
I am OK with the roster. I'm overjoyed of R.O.B.'s inclusion because it shows how much Sakurai respects the old games and such. Without R.O.B., no Geno, Krystal, Isaac, nothing. It might be even possible that Mario would've never reappeared again. Sure, he might not be everyone's favorite character. He might have 'wasted' a roster spot. But at least he's unique.

The clones are back... But it that really bad at all? All of them are Luigi-fied. The only thing that's disappointing is the fact that Ganondorf is still a clone and three Landmasters. Besides that, I think it's fine.

I think people are disappointed for the fact that everyone was unique and awesome at the starting, then ending with clones and mostly characters with low or no fanbase. People, this is SAKURAI we're talking about. He goes with the characters he thinks should have made it in. All of those characters are generally have no fanbase, because for uniqueness. I'm pretty sure if Sakurai had more time and if he wanted too, all of the characters would be unique and had much more characters. I was personally saddened that Bowser Jr. didn't make it in, but I soon got over it. Especially because of the fact that Jiggz made it in (somehow).
ROB's inclusion didn't seem like he was respecting the old games, it seemed more like he was following Mario Kart DS.
 

zurf23

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Feb 28, 2007
Messages
106
Location
Ventura, CA
I love the roster to death! Hey Panda, Lucario has a black and white outfit.

Guess what I thought of?

It looks badass too, check it out on youtube! :laugh:
 

BDawgPHD

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 1, 2007
Messages
751
The roster is fine.
I disagree. Captain Falcon's knee should be a transformation for Captain Falcon XD

I actually somewhat like the roster, I don't care for DeDeDe, ROB, or Wolf, really, and Krystal not being in it doesn't phase me one bit. The only things I was really worried about was Link being made better and Captain Falcon being in it in his entirety. So far Link looks pretty good and Captain Falcon is in with the knee (stupid Japanese noobs should make more gameplay vids with Captain Falcon and stop sucking *** with Link). I'm also satisfied that Sakurai didn't strip "clones" from the roster...Luigi definitely should have and does have a place in Brawl, it's good to see Ganondorf in it for sure and with a differentiating moveset as well, and it's nice that most of the characters from melee made it in. I didn't give two ****s about Roy or Mewtwo, and Doc is nice, but I'm not going to miss him. Pichu was pretty cool though, but I'll live. And Lucario is definitely an epic Mewtwo replacement, and it's nice to see all the other characters from Melee and the new ones in Brawl.

This is a little OT, but I like a lot of the finer tune-ups they made to smash. The new handicap system is going to be epic as opposed to the last one, which was lame. I also sort of like the random character function, but I sort of wanted to see an Olcadan type of thing, where there's a generic cool-looking base character that basically changed to fit to a randomized character, and would become a random character for each stock. That would have given a new type of random function, so you can't random a gay character and suck for the whole match or random a beast character and **** for the whole match. Other than that, I don't have a lot of opinions (other than people from Japan fail), as I haven't played the game yet :-P
 

JoseOle92

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Nov 4, 2007
Messages
86
Location
Alhambra, CA
i watched a couple of "spoiler" vids and i've noticed that everytime you meet a new character the screen pauses and says the characters name. now i was watching one and another character came up, it was a mysterious blue guy whos name is taboo i think. idk if it does that for major characters or only playable ones. but if this is the final roster then i guess hes not playable and is a major charcter? idk...

other then that i like this roster. sure i wanted maybe krystal or megaman, but as long as falco, marth, and sonic are in then its all good. too bad for knuckles though. the three landmasters is questionable too..
 

Viroxor

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 25, 2007
Messages
803
Location
On the precipice of victory
From another thread:

I'm perfectly fine with the way the game came out. In fact, I think it's brilliant. The only flaws I see are the exclusion of Krystal, Ridley, and Megaman. Other than that, this kicks the crap out of all other games in the past 7-8 years.

I'm thrilled that the Star Fox series got the representation it deserved, although I could have hoped for a little more than clones. Anyway, I now only mourn the rival Metroid and F-Zero series, which were promptly robbed of equal representation. But, Ridley appeared as an SSE boss, and Samurai Goroh as an assist trophy. Not really enough, but it's a step in the right direction.

Still don't know why Andross's AT is the SNES one instead of the N64 one. Even the one from Adventures (Ganondross as I call him) would have sufficed.
 

Django_EXE

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 22, 2007
Messages
92
Location
Take route 666 west, then drive 13 miles past meph
The roster is great, figuring in my excitement at previous characters (ones revealed on the dojo), but imo It could have used more villians, and I would have replaced Falco (I know he's only a semiclone, but Starfox has no need for 3 semiclones) with Ridely, as Metroid has no villian. I would have had Mewtwo stay, or at least given PT a Rocket costume, and have Megaman, just because he has so much potential. FE could have had Black Knight, and I would have replaced Toon link with Vatii, because of him being a villian, and the orrigianal moveset. I wanted Isaac to, and It would have introduced a better EU market (Golden sun is worshiped in europe. I saw a used GS in a store for 40 euros [aprox. 60 USD] compaired to the other games at 10-15 euro [15-25 USD.]) I also wanted Claus instead of ness, but the Costume works for me.
 

The Director

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 22, 2007
Messages
1,500
Location
North Carolina
The roster is fine. Anybody who complains about it is spoiled, period. Who cares if your "main" didn't get in. There are plenty of other characters to choose from.

Considering how much content is being put into this game, characters included, nobody has any right to complain.

The only gripe about this roster that I have is Toon Link. Not because I think a "better" character was taken out because of him, but simply because I think it's a terrible character choice. I've been saying this since Melee, but do we really need two Links?

Okay, I lied. I have two gripes about the roster. The other is the FS that is shared by Fox, Falco and Wolf. Really? Three Landmasters? Okay, that's just a lack of creativity. They had enough space, they had enough time, no two characters should have the same FS.
 

Uchiha.Sanosuke

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Nov 12, 2007
Messages
429
Location
USA
Ehh...work for me.

Doesn't have Ridley, doesn't have Krystal, doesn't have Mewtwo...but it's Smash Bros. I'll play it regardless.

Still a tiny bit disappointed that there were virtually no changes to Ganondorf or Luigi, and that Toon Link is basically Young Like with a costume change.

That's about it, really. Not much else to it.
 

BDawgPHD

Smash Ace
Joined
Mar 1, 2007
Messages
751
The roster is fine. Anybody who complains about it is spoiled, period. Who cares if your "main" didn't get in. There are plenty of other characters to choose from.

Considering how much content is being put into this game, characters included, nobody has any right to complain.

The only gripe about this roster that I have is Toon Link. Not because I think a "better" character was taken out because of him, but simply because I think it's a terrible character choice. I've been saying this since Melee, but do we really need two Links?

Okay, I lied. I have two gripes about the roster. The other is the FS that is shared by Fox, Falco and Wolf. Really? Three Landmasters? Okay, that's just a lack of creativity. They had enough space, they had enough time, no two characters should have the same FS.
This dude and his signature win.

Personally I think toon link should have a leet *** hammer if he doesn't already ;)
 

antimatter

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
1,957
The roster is fine. Anybody who complains about it is spoiled, period. Who cares if your "main" didn't get in. There are plenty of other characters to choose from.

Considering how much content is being put into this game, characters included, nobody has any right to complain.

The only gripe about this roster that I have is Toon Link. Not because I think a "better" character was taken out because of him, but simply because I think it's a terrible character choice. I've been saying this since Melee, but do we really need two Links?

Okay, I lied. I have two gripes about the roster. The other is the FS that is shared by Fox, Falco and Wolf. Really? Three Landmasters? Okay, that's just a lack of creativity. They had enough space, they had enough time, no two characters should have the same FS.

hypocrite much?
 

antimatter

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
1,957
hey, same here. i'm fine with the roster, just pointing that out. and, i at least come out and say i dont think it's perfect, unlike some other people who change their minds halfway through their posts. i am not referring to you, but there are others.
and by i'm fine, i mean i dont make threads complaining about sakurai's choices. i was interrupted while trying to post and posted before completing my points.
 

Machete

Smash Ace
Joined
Dec 8, 2007
Messages
628
Meh, if you exclude the lack of Mewtwo, Ridley and Ganondorf's sword and having 3 Landmasters, I'm fine with the roster.
 

Sogeking

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 11, 2008
Messages
48
I'm fine with it but i'me confused by adding Falco as a character. Wolf eclipses him in almost everything and he just looks cooler so i really don't need to see him as a character.

Oh yeah ZSS is the second Samus representative, she's playable from the start and she has a totally different move set and her FS is completely different than Samus.
 

The Director

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 22, 2007
Messages
1,500
Location
North Carolina
hypocrite much?
lolzorz

I'm talking about the people who think the roster downright sucks just because Krystal, Geno, Ridley etc. didn't get in. Because a certain character or characters didn't make it, they ***** and moan and ***** and moan and curse Sakurai, a man who devoted the last 2 1/2 years of his life trying to make us happy. I think he succeeded with flying colors.

I simply have one problem with a single character that I just don't agree with, and 3 shared FS's. Honestly, having a gripe with 3 characters sharing the same FS is understandable, no?
 

vonfinell

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
165
Location
Poised for a Zerg Rush on your Base
Good Points:
Toon Link
No Krystal (*does happy dance*)
Picking Sheik from the getgo (I know about the holding A thing, but it just seems nicer to make it not a secret)
Playing as ZSS from the getgo (I might start using her since I don't need to worry about clunking around with Samus for a Smash Ball)

Bad Points:
Two Fox Clones (including Final Smashes)
Lucas being a Ness clone (I wanted to Ness to have a moveset based on...you know...his actual moves from Earthbound?!)
Toon Link being an exact clone (I was hoping for some WW and PH specific moves.)
Gannon still being a clone
Lack of lesser known but awesome character (Isaac, Alex Roivas, Elite Beat Agents)
R.O.B. (idk, it just seems like a waste of a slot.)
Only two 3rd Party characters (weren't we promised more?)
Only 35 characters (I guess everyone was just expecting at least 40)
 

m0dredus

Hail Hydra
Joined
Nov 20, 2007
Messages
132
Location
Maine
Meh, the final smash copying is a bit dumb, but I don't mind Falco and Wolf. Falco has a lot of similar moves, but still has enough original ones. And from what I've seen, Wolfs are pretty much all different. Plus his laser is flippin' sweet!
 

SirPainsalot

Smash Apprentice
Joined
Sep 21, 2007
Messages
176
Location
NYC, New York Mains: Mr G/W, Kirby, Toon
ROB's inclusion didn't seem like he was respecting the old games, it seemed more like he was following Mario Kart DS.
Um, explain Mr. Game and Watch, Pit, Ice Climbers, and the confirmed fact that one of Pokemon Trainer's alternate includes the old Gameboy colors. If you take all of those examples into consideration, you'd might as well say Sakurai is paying a homage to R.O.B. like all those other characters instead of following Mario Kart DS. Besides, since when has Mr. Game and Watch ever got a cameo besides in the Warioware games?
 

antimatter

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Messages
1,957
lolzorz

I'm talking about the people who think the roster downright sucks just because Krystal, Geno, Ridley etc. didn't get in. Because a certain character or characters didn't make it, they ***** and moan and ***** and moan and curse Sakurai, a man who devoted the last 2 1/2 years of his life trying to make us happy. I think he succeeded with flying colors.

I simply have one problem with a single character that I just don't agree with, and 3 shared FS's. Honestly, having a gripe with 3 characters sharing the same FS is understandable, no?
understandable, yes. just felt like being a smart aleck.
 

Viroxor

Smash Ace
Joined
Jun 25, 2007
Messages
803
Location
On the precipice of victory
I'm fine with it but i'me confused by adding Falco as a character. Wolf eclipses him in almost everything and he just looks cooler so i really don't need to see him as a character.

Oh yeah ZSS is the second Samus representative, she's playable from the start and she has a totally different move set and her FS is completely different than Samus.
Sorry, but in the spirit of fandom, I must call BS on this.

Falco>Wolf. It may be close, but he's still just that little bit better. It's even stated at some points that Falco is better than Fox, who has clearly beaten Wolf multiple times.
 

MysticJon

Smash Cadet
Joined
Jan 27, 2008
Messages
71
Sorry, but in the spirit of fandom, I must call BS on this.

Falco>Wolf. It may be close, but he's still just that little bit better. It's even stated at some points that Falco is better than Fox, who has clearly beaten Wolf multiple times.
guess we will have to wait and see. personally, i plan on trying out Wolf since Falco seems to have merely been Luigi-fied.
 
Joined
Oct 12, 2007
Messages
1,538
We got tons of characters that appeared on the polls, more than we did characters in Melee that were on the poll.

The situation is not only no different from Melee, but it is better in fact.
 

jay~B

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Dec 1, 2007
Messages
454
Location
somewhere out chillin
In my opinion people are just pissed becuase their character didn't get in and/or because rob was part of the roster

well here is rob gameplay and i have to say my opinion of him has completely changed due to this video:

Video link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xdxwxu8zjJ4
(I suggest you lower the volume, music is loud)

As for the people who did not get the character that they wated in brawl (Like me) then you are just gonna have to get used to the new roster. Also the 5 characters who didn't return are:

-Dr. Mario (Doc)
-Pichu
-Mewtwo
-Roy
-Young link

and these characters were all taken out for good puposes because Doc was a clone (Even thoguh i loved him, im just gonna have to get to his absence) and so was pichu. Mewtwo was replaced by lucario (sadly even though i agree that mewtwo should be here too) and roy was replaced by Ike another fire emblem character. These characters were taken out for a good reason even though they were loved by many of us thus making the roster look bigger in size and characters even though it is only 35(39 with transformations)
 

Zoolander

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jul 11, 2007
Messages
243
I love the roster. there's many unique characters (Olimar, PT), there's luigifieds (Ganon, Falco), third parties, and several other awesome characters (Ike, Wolf) to try out. They have a wide variety of choices.
 

The Director

Smash Lord
Joined
Apr 22, 2007
Messages
1,500
Location
North Carolina
I love the roster. there's many unique characters (Olimar, PT), there's luigifieds (Ganon, Falco), third parties, and several other awesome characters (Ike, Wolf) to try out. They have a wide variety of choices.
Thank you! That's what I like about this roster. Variety.

And anybody who calls BS on the roster, I have two names for you: Sonic and Snake. Be greatful.
 

The Slayer

RAWR!
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
1,239
Location
New World
NNID
Ren
3DS FC
1778-9825-9960
*sighs* I know this roster could have been better. I just know it could have been...
 

JCav

Smash Lord
Joined
Feb 2, 2008
Messages
1,217
Location
Michigan
personally, i like the roster. 35 is good i mean u have rob (a wtf character) but still theres a lot more characters. as a starfox fan, i love wolf and plan to main him but i do wish they would have a differnent final smash
 

Mikau et al

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jan 18, 2008
Messages
242
Location
shhh...it's a secret
I'm unhappy with the franchise representation. I don't see anyone analyzing that, so I'll elaborate. If you really look at it, pretty much the only series that didn't get screwed over was Kirby (and arguably DK). I’m really sorry if this is very long, but I feel someone needed to actually perform an objective analysis.

I'm sure a lot of people were at least subconsciously surprised that Kirby got an extra two reps upon the revelation of D3. No one wanted MK, but we all love Sakurai for adding him. Granted, Kirby had deserved to get one more in melee, so we can consider that since Kirby got one more rep than it (should have) had in melee, then surely some of the other popular franchises would get at least that much.

Pokemon was the other series that was an apparent indication of proportional representation. We knew that Pika and Jiggs were returning because they had no reason not to, and M2 had a perfectly good moveset and excellent popularity to make up for the fact that he sucked. Everyone hated pichu, especially since it was one of the sucky clones, and there was no justification for it to return. Afterward, PT was revealed, and Lucario was almost a given due to his massive fan base (I don't get why, but I'd rather have him than other 4th gen reps). If Kirby got two new reps, then so could pokemon (which was retrospectively a correct assumption). So, pokemon's situation was that out of its four melee reps, it would most likely lose the crappy clone and gain two new, original characters (just like Kirby did), for a total rep # increase of one. It still seems very fair, despite reality. In the end Mewtwo was booted and that is probably the biggest injustice to the melee roster and our logical assumptions about brawl's.

Seeing as there were two other franchises with comparable popularity and rep count in Melee (Mario and Zelda), it would make perfect sense to do the same for them. Mario had five reps (justifiably so, as Mario is Nintendo's primary mascot). Everyone knew Dr. Mario should be out for multiple reasons, and that would be consistent with Pokemon. Mario, if any series, deserved two new reps as well: most likely Toad and Bowser Jr. I realize Toad would have needed a moveset from scratch, as well as Peach requiring a new B move, but he/she/it is the character most representative of the mario series who hasn't been a PC yet. BJ (lol) is the second, given his increasing importance in Sunshine and Galaxy. I'm trying to be as unbiased as possible in these character choices; personally, Toad would have been one of my punching bags, but he/she/it deserves it way more than ROB. And look what we got here. Not a single new Mario rep. That is a crime and you all know it is, even those who are happy with the roster.

Since the Zelda series also had three characters and a clone, it should have also lost the clone and gained two new characters. Seeing as Sheik was back despite logical discrepancies, which was clearly an OoT exclusive, it would make sense to add reps from other great Zelda games. The only thing I liked about MM was Fierce Diety Link, but as you will soon see I think that Masks Link would not only undermine PT's uniqueness, but also be just another Link. But MM is very popular, and Skull Kid/Majora's Mask was an interesting antagonist with great potential for a unique moveset. TP, being the most recent game (as well as the most critically acclaimed since OoT), deserved someone as well, especially considering Midna's fanbase. Again, no wolf link should have been necessary--if Sakurai really wanted it in he would have added it as a Link transformation--because we don't need another link. I originally didn't want Midna in, because as much as I like her, she's only been in one game. But if a TP sequel were coming out (which there really should be), she would be a very logical choice. The only other characters I can think of that might have had a chance were Tingle (I hate the fact that Japan loves him, but that will never change—and he’s in a lot of games) and maybe Din/Nayru/(Farore) (they’ve been in a lot of games as well, although no one knows who the hell they are or would like them to be playable over more interesting characters). So, the best reps with decent popularity, relevance, and UNIQUENESS would have been Skull Kid and Midna. I'm partial to the Zelda series, but I really despise Toon Link. He should have been an alternate costume, at best. I know I just said I would be unbaised, but I think he is waaaay to overrated and have to go on a slight digression to explain to you people how stupid you are about this. Young Link should have never been in Melee, and Toon Link is basically Young Link, or at least a reminder of that atrocity. And let's face it people, the only reason you like WW is because you were tired of waiting for the next OoT. You hated what they did to Link just as much as I did/do/will do, but forced yourself to like it because that was the best it was going to get (seems a lot like what is going on right now with brawl—if DC even has a long shot of happening, I don’t know why you people aren’t willing to create a large enough mob to actually try and make it happen). I ended up buying WW and upon playing thought it was okay. Until I discovered that the sailing/wind direction thing the least efficient method of transportation in existence, the Gorons and Zoras and Gerudos were replaced by stick-things (I liked the Rito, though, and Dragon Roost Island music), and when you need to collect the eight pieces of the triforce, one of them requires that you do a stupid cabana side quest and solve inane tile puzzles ad nauseum. Something like that should have been reserved for special items, not as a mandatory trial of pain. Tingle sucks, as well. The only other thing I enjoyed about the game was how awesomely the smoke was animated. Hell, the smoke should have been a character over Toon Link.

And as a response to the people who argue that Toon Link and Link are different people, I think that's a stupid argument to have him in brawl when there are plenty of better Zelda characters. Yes, supposedly there are multiple links throughout the history of the Zelda world, and Toon Link is not the same person as Link, but that doesn't change the fact that they are both blond-haired, green-garbed, sword-wielding elfoids. I know there are countless websites trying to place the Zelda games chronologically so as to determine exactly what relationship exists between links, but that's a load of bullshiit. Nintendo doesn't care nor think about that--they will create however many different reincarnations of basically the same character just to sell their games. And when you think about it, "The Legend of Zelda" implies that all of these games are just tales told recounting the epic efforts of some ancient, mythological hero who probably never existed the way the tales describe. It doesn't matter whether they are factually consistent with each other, as long as they somehow tell a story of how great the idealogical hero "Link" is. But the point is, they are all basically Link. So to you Toon Link fans, I say thanks a lot for screwing the Zelda representation over and giving us yet another Link. My sole consolation is that you only get another clone, and hopefully it will be below sea level tier. Thank you, Sakurai, for showing the fans how stupid they are (as well as not adding wolf link or masks link as a fifth rep).

Now that that's over, let's look at the other, less popular franchises. Donkey Kong deserved at least one new rep. Diddy was the obvious choice. Dixie Kong fans: you're on crack. Every franchise with three reps or more gets a villain--K. Rool was the obvious choice for a third rep. I'd say that DK has about the same importance and popularity as Kirby, so it wasn't that far-fetched to have three characters. People realized, however, that for various reasons this had a very good chance of not happening despite K. Rool's general popularity and the fact that he is a villain. Those of you who say that people are bytching about their favorite character not getting in are fabricating that: do you see anyone complaining about K. Rool not getting in? I would have liked him in, yet I'm not posting a load of crap about how I hate the roster because K. Rool's not in. It's the fact that so many "shoe-ins" (K. Rool being an "almost shoe-in") not making it into brawl that so many people complain. The roster just doesn't make sense from a fan standpoint, as I am slowly proving (I'm really sorry this is so loooooong, but I think this needed to be brought up since no one else has).

Next comes Metroid. Let's face it. Ridley is the only slighted character people knew HAD to be in brawl. Especially after Kirby got two new reps. Samus was a given, and the ZSS thing was a little bonus; few consider her a completely separate character (as with Zelda). Metroid is certainly important enough to get two new reps, more so than Kirby, but the problem is the lack of decent characters. The next most likely person would have been Dark Samus. I don’t mind Dark Samus, and I know that it is a completely different character than Samus, but even if it had a completely different moveset it would feel like a sort of cop-out clone. Seeing the roster now, it still probably would have been a clone. I think it would it would have done best as a color change. But there is no excuse for Ridley not being a PC. Once again, Metroid only has one selectable PC in the roster when there was no reason it shouldn’t have gotten two. It is very safe to assume that it would never have gotten three this time around (for those that consider ZSS a separate character, then Ridley would have made it three) as while it doesn’t possess the characters to fill that, another series could have taken that slot.

Yes, I’m talking about Star Fox. By rights, it’s huge list of like five games makes it only deserving of maybe two reps. Fox is one. Falco would always be the other. The problem is that it has disproportional popularity. I don’t know why, but it’s useless to fight it. So even though SF only deserves two reps, Sakurai added Wolf. I don’t hate wolf, but with the Falco/Fox clone issue and the fact that Wolf looks way too much like Fox, cloning was going to happen. Hence the landmasters and similar movesets. The sad thing is Wolf was always going to get in over Krystal because he is more important to the series and is a much-needed villain. But the landmasters are inexcusable. And if Sakurai was willing to add a rep to a franchise that didn’t deserve it, I ask why he didn’t just add two, especially when the first was a half-@$$ed de-clone and so many people wanted Krystal in brawl. He said he wanted more females, and as people are saying only too often: she would have used a staff. I don’t think Krystal deserves to be as popular as she is, but the fans wanted her and using a staff-wielder would have made up for her lack of importance to Star Fox. And that extra Metroid slot had to be given to someone.

F-Zero deserved another rep. The series is generally a flop, the characters remain in their vehicles the entire time (hence difficulties in moveset creation), but goddammit it deserves two reps just as much as Metroid deserves three. There are definitely enough characters to choose from, and I think that might be why none were chosen. The three most likely candidates were Samurai Goroh, Black Shadow, and Jody Summer. Jody is just another generic blond who has less fanbase than the other two, so she was least likely to become playable. I think most people were rooting for Samurai Goroh, as he has the potential for a more unique moveset (and he’s a samurai, which is freakin’ awesome). If Black Shadow had made it in, he would probably be a Ganondorf clone (lol). It really depended on whether Sakurai wanted a more complex character for SSE or just a pure evil mastermind. Either way, we deserved at least one more F-Zero rep (maybe two, if you account for SF’s four reps, but considering that would have been allowed due to Metroid’s lack of characters, that argument loses potency).

Earthbound/Mother is also incredibly disappointing. I don’t see how a series with only three games deserves two reps while Metroid and F-Zero only get one, but when Lucas was revealed I think we were willing to allow it as long as Ness wasn’t a clone of him (the cruel irony of it all: Ness…a clone). It would still have been hard getting over the fact that they look the same and Ness could easily have been a color change (more irony), but Claus was always out. Yes, he looked different from Lucas (unlike Ness, although he is supposedly Lucas’ brother), and he had potential for a unique moveset (unlike Ness), but if Mother/Earthbound only had two reps, they would only get a villain PC if there weren’t any deserving protagonists (like with Metroid). Ness is another deserving protagonist. But we are all angry because Sakurai gave Earthbound/Mother another rep and didn’t bother to make it unique. Just another half-@$$ed clone.

Fire Emblem got screwed over the most. It has a plethora of various characters from many different titles, so the choices were endless as to which main characters would make it in and how they would play. And look what we got: two blue-haired, sword-wielding sissies. Yes, they play differently, but they are hardly representative of Fire Emblem as a whole. Those of you who wanted Ike in, I hate you. Those of you who wanted Marth in after Ike was confirmed, I hate you more. You are about as original as Disney sequels. For those of you who wanted him in because he was “the first lord,” there were plenty of other lords that were DIFFERENT from Marth/Ike. For those of you who wanted him in because he kicked @$$, it would have made much more sense to have Lyn in with his moveset and stats. Ideally, Sakurai wouldn’t have been stupid and just had given Ike Marth’s moveset so this predicament wouldn’t exist about Fire Emblem only being represented by sword-fighters and instead have people like Sothe (new Wii game hype, just like Roy, only better cuz he has a dagger) and Micaiah (ZOMFG!!!! WHERE’S HER SWORD?!?! Oh…duh). Additionally, FE, given that it has a fair amount of games, could have used a third character, making the decisions to “cut” characters a little less grueling. And Marth’s a pansy.

The independent and retro series were generally fine (with one HUGE exception). Yoshi had no reason to not come back, and Wario had every reason to join (although I find his three costume changes excessive). Olimar was a shoe-in. He only has two games, but people love him and I love pikmin slaves. I don’t think Animal Crossing even deserved a stage, but if Tom Nook is as violent as I hear, I guess he wouldn’t have been too out of place in brawl. There was only one other series that I feel deserved a character—with one character on the presumed starting roster from a starting series and an AC secret rep looming in the shadows, only one more seemed reasonable. Isaac from Golden sun deserved to be in brawl because of his extreme popularity in Europe. I had never heard of him before, but if characters who are specifically popular to Japan (like Ness and Marth) can get in, then I figured this would be a smart political move for Sakurai—to prove that he listens to all of the fans, and not just the Japanese ones. ICs were on thin ice (lol, I made a funny) popularity-wise, but it was pretty certain that Sakurai wouldn’t throw away such a unique character(s). The same went for G&W; even though he sucks and I don’t think he is as integral to Nintendo’s history as people think he is. There was a huge toss-up between a crapload of one-time games. I think the most popular were Pit, Balloon Man, Sukapon, Takamaru, Ray 01, Lip, and Mach Rider. Realistically, only two or three would make it in max. This made sense as both Pit and ICs were revealed on the Dojo, and we figured that G&W wouldn’t be the only secret retro character, and if the game were as good as it is being hyped (along with the above projected reps), two more newcoming secret characters was realistic. Seeing as they all had nearly equal fanbases, no one really cared which—Sukapon would punch stuff, Takamaru could take Marth’s moveset so we wouldn’t have any more FE swordsmen/women, Ray could do cool robotic stuff, Lip could sit there and look cute. All had excellent potential. And we got R.O.B. I really hate R.O.B. He’s not even a character. He might have saved Nintendo the first time, but there are many other characters who have continued to save it multiple times. Nintendo wouldn’t continue to exist without such games as Zelda, Mario, and Pokemon; yet Sakurai would deny Mario and Zelda the right to a new character in exchange for R.O.B. Everyone would not have minded R.O.B. so much if it weren’t at the expense of so many REALLY GOOD AND POPULAR CHARACTERS, both retro and current.

The third party reps were a huge DUH!!! For everyone. Apparently it is really hard to get third party reps in an exclusively Nintendo franchise, as Sakurai literally revealed ALL OF THEM for hype before the game came out. Even though he implied that he would get maybe one or two more, it makes perfect sense now that he couldn’t afford to keep Sonic and Snake secret and would have revealed any others, no matter how awesome they were. I wouldn’t be surprised if he tried to get more and failed, but that’s his fault for saving it until the last minute (I mean, it was only a few months before brawl came out that he managed to get Sonic). It was also apparent that these were going to be the third party companies' icons, not just popular characters, so there was only going to be one “mascot” from each company—no Simon Belmont/Bomberman or Tails/Nights. For most, there were only three other companies that deserved reps: Capcom for it’s rivalry, Squeenix for its contributions to the NES and SNES, and Rare for its contributions to the SNES and N64 (under Nintendo). Without going into too much detail here, the obvious mascot for Capcom was Megaman, and Rare’s was Banjo-Kazooie. I really dislike Megaman and can’t see why people like him (he looks like a gay Samus), but he was the most likely given his popularity. Banjo-Kazooie deserved it simply because they were made for brawl. They were incredibly unlikely, however, as everyone knows about Microsoft’s possissiveness. Square Enix was an issue, because its rep would be from FF. Sorry Crono and KH guys, but this is “mascots” we’re talking about. I like Geno, but he was a main character in one game, and cannot be considered an “icon” to the Mario series nor a “mascot” of Square Enix. Get over it; he’s superfluous. Cloud, the most recognizable, was also the least deserving. All of the known characters from FF1-6 were only in one game (except Cid, whom all SE fans know doesn’t deserve it), and anything that was in more than one was as close as possible to a mascot, but hardly a “character”. Hence, chocobo, black mage, and mog just weren’t interesting enough to be made into characters, even if they were in a crappy Mario sports spin-off. Maybe chocobo, but that would be stretching for a movset. It would have been easy to just not choose, made even easier by the fact that SE would probably never release rights of FF characters to a fighting game with Dissidia in the making. Thus, with only one or two more third-parties, we were expecting Megaman (ugh) and hopefully but probably not Banjo-Kazooie. Sakurai should not have gotten our hopes up on that, even though it was only one character.

Again, we weren’t angry that we didn’t get the characters we wanted, we just didn’t get enough of the ones we wanted and got too many that we really didn’t want. It was inevitable that some popular characters wouldn’t make it in and one or two unpopular ones would—we just didn’t expect the roster to turn out this shiity based on the Dojo updates. But since I’ve bothered to type this much, let’s see about how big this hypothetical roster would have been that all realistic people were expecting.

6 Mario reps
5 Pokemon reps
5 Zelda reps
2/3 DK reps
3 Kirby reps
2 Metroid reps
3/4 Star Fox reps
1/2 F-Zero reps
1/2 Earthbound reps
3/4 Fire Emblem reps
4/5 Independent reps
4/5 retro reps
3/4 third-party reps
Total: 42-50 characters

Now those of you who are saying that only 50+ characters could have satisfied the “whiners” out there, try and use some of your fake logic to prove that 42 = 50. And even then, we were aware that some cuts might be made in some places (a Mario/Zelda character here, Lucario there, *cough* Ness *cough*), so we weren’t even expecting that many. Even 35 characters might have been acceptable, but the real issue here is that they are shiitty choices for characters and representation. And when you look at it, Sakurai was being a fascist pig when doing it. I would normally say nationalistic, but you can’t be nationalistic about a company. He catered to Nintendo’s wants by putting in R.O.B. He catered to his own wants by adding both D3 and MK. He catered to his/Japan’s wants by adding Lucas. He catered to Japan’s wants by adding Ike and keeping Marth, and not putting in Ridley. Then he went mad and screwed over Mario and Zelda. Overall, I think the roster is pathetic because Sakurai really didn’t listen to the global opinion on who should be in brawl—he just listened to Japan/Nintendo/himself. If you look at the three characters who didn’t make the cut in the game rip (other than Mewtwo, which was brutal) (assuming the rip is real, which it could be), it reveals that he still didn’t know wtf he was doing; how could he have thought that Dixie, Roy, and Toon Zelda/Shiek (probably Tetra w/ sheik moveset) would be acceptable replacements for K. Rool, Lynn, and Skull Kid? He really fuccked up the roster this time and after seeing SSE in play footage I’m really angry at him for creating it at all. The cutscenes are great, but everything in between is substandard sidescrolling with pretty but monotonous backgrounds. It’s very boring. And with all of the enemies that no one cares about, he could easily have eliminated them, added a few more classic enemies, and used the extra time to make some more PCs. I think everyone on this site should push for DC, because if Nintendo really listens to the fans like it says it does, we could potentially increase that roster to what it should have been. If it doesn’t, then we know why the roster sucks.

I don’t expect anyone to read all of this, even though it is mildly interesting. I would prefer it if those of you who do flame do so, however, because if there’s one thing I hate, it’s stubborn ignorance.
 
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