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Official Brawl Tier Discussion (OP Updated)
- Thread starter AlphaZealot
- Start date
- Status
FishkeeperTimmay!
Smash Ace
I think the part to remember about this tactic specifically is the "stall". The fact that you keeping you opponent airborne for no reason beyond wasting time and abusing the deterioration system, I could easily see TO's banning this tactic if its abused to often.
Sh1n0b1
Smash Journeyman
Where is Falcon?
Browny
Smash Hater
OH MY GOD
the post count is over 9000!!!
also, that tier list is clearly a joke. i cant see why u-air stalling wouldnt be banned as well. sonic can infinitely stall himself if he feels like it on floating stages, why wouldnt the same ban apply to G&W?
the post count is over 9000!!!
also, that tier list is clearly a joke. i cant see why u-air stalling wouldnt be banned as well. sonic can infinitely stall himself if he feels like it on floating stages, why wouldnt the same ban apply to G&W?
**** you, you beat me to the punch.
and to the person who asked about Falcon, I've never played with him nor have anyone I've really played against. But if I went with popular opinion he'd be Bottom tier.
wasabicheese
Smash Journeyman
falcon was ***** by the lack of l-cancelling, and his moves were given tiny prority in brawl
Nigerian Star Storm
Smash Ace
But Falcon didn't nesscessarily have great Priority in Melee either.....but his comboing ability made up for that.
People, I'm not a moderator here or anything, but seriously, can I bring up some proposed rules for this thread?
1. Do not quote entire tier lists!!!! By clicking quote, you provide a link to the post--just cut their list and put "tier list" in it's place. This makes the thread easier to read, and makes it less visually unappealing
2. Post your Tier Lists as:
Tier1: XXX, YYY, ZZZ
Tier2: AAA, BBB, CCC
Tier3: LLL, MMM, NNN
it saves a ton of space, is easy to parse, and lets you comment on char placement under...^_^
I'm sorry, but it's aggravating to have to sift though 5 foot long posts, with odd ways of commenting, and the same list over and over and over and over (taking up so much space) when people comment on it
1. Do not quote entire tier lists!!!! By clicking quote, you provide a link to the post--just cut their list and put "tier list" in it's place. This makes the thread easier to read, and makes it less visually unappealing
2. Post your Tier Lists as:
Tier1: XXX, YYY, ZZZ
Tier2: AAA, BBB, CCC
Tier3: LLL, MMM, NNN
it saves a ton of space, is easy to parse, and lets you comment on char placement under...^_^
I'm sorry, but it's aggravating to have to sift though 5 foot long posts, with odd ways of commenting, and the same list over and over and over and over (taking up so much space) when people comment on it
Mr.Charisma
Smash Rookie
On another note could you guys give an optimistic opinion on Diddy's eventual tier status. i'm thinking High-Mid? Go Nuts.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
High tier material.
Similar to Fox when he falls and activates his ^B he rises a bit before firing off into the sky.
HIs bananas hit hard and glide tossing makes the,m incredibly appealing to use.
hes momentum based thoughs o you really gotta stay on top of your opponent.
Similar to Fox when he falls and activates his ^B he rises a bit before firing off into the sky.
HIs bananas hit hard and glide tossing makes the,m incredibly appealing to use.
hes momentum based thoughs o you really gotta stay on top of your opponent.
Mr.Charisma
Smash Rookie
Nice! Thanks Bro your opinions carry a lot of weight around here so thanks for not ignoring/flaming.
Grunt
Smash Master
Diddy has very low rep, but some great potential.
The first list, he'll probably be mid mid, but i see him rising later on.
The first list, he'll probably be mid mid, but i see him rising later on.
AbsoluteZero0K
Smash Rookie
I use characters because I like them too. That's why I have a list of theoretically (according to the tier list) sorry characters.
Don't get me wrong. I love Bowser. I wanted to use him in Melee but he sucked TOO much. In Brawl, I can actually win matches. He has some pretty fast/high priority moves for a character his size. The problem is that he's TOO big...it's hard to dodge COMPLETELY around other characters.
Grunt
Smash Master
I use Ganon because he is too cute. Him and Boozer.
Dark Sonic
Smash Hero
Grunt
Smash Master
I think IC's will move up to the high end of upper tier once more IC mains begin to pick up on the uber ways they can chain grab. You can quote me when I say that IC's CG is superior to DDD's It is just harder to do because their grab has low reach.
ShadowLink84
Smash Hero
Yeah and as suhc they are stuck in mid. GG
stoopdklutz
Smash Journeyman
Ice Climbers just aren't very popular as other characters. I believe that popularity DOES affect the tier list, and since IC aren't that popular because of there extreme learning curve, they aren't represented enough.
But they have a lot going for them once you practice, like CG, desyncing, high damage output, a spammable projectile, and just overall uberness. Practice will pay off with the eskimos.
I would say they are top of mid, and can barely scrape the high tier.
But they have a lot going for them once you practice, like CG, desyncing, high damage output, a spammable projectile, and just overall uberness. Practice will pay off with the eskimos.
I would say they are top of mid, and can barely scrape the high tier.
AbsoluteZero0K
Smash Rookie
I would use Ganon, but I'm too used to his Melee version. Maybe in about a year or more after I have forgotten Melee Ganon, he won't seem as sluggish.
You can't use that function. Join Date >_>
You have to have that privilege given to you. That's why it didn't work.
stoopdklutz
Smash Journeyman
I'm fine with her in mid-tier, maybe on the upper spectrum of it.
For a little while after the game came out, she was one of my secondaries. I recently dropped her; she just didn't seem to kill as much as my other mains and secondaries.
I mean, I absolutely loved B-sticking her Forward-B-whip move, but I just couldn't land it properly.
I mean, I absolutely loved B-sticking her Forward-B-whip move, but I just couldn't land it properly.
stoopdklutz
Smash Journeyman
Well, she got side-b, bair, fairs, and uair as reliable killing moves...plus she got stungun attacks, a good hyphen smash, free projectiles in the beginning of the match, a pretty fluid playstyle, long range, and is purdy nice looking.
Browny
Smash Hater
2 minutes, max, to master the walking CG to full-charged nana usmash. it amazes me why more people dont use IC, its not like the CG is hard to do.
and imo swap peach and/or sonic for ZSS in mid tier (going off tournet results here). your mid tier is also quite small
stoopdklutz
Smash Journeyman
You mean, for one character, or overall?
Browny
Smash Hater
unless you are playing someone like marth, and you simply never use a ground attack for the entire game, not getting grabbed is just like saying 'dont get hit by pits arrows'
it wont happen
it wont happen
Or you can go into a matchup thinking, "Ice climbers, now what do they do again? OH YEAH, THEY HAVE F'ING CHAINGRABS OR, AT THE MINIMUM, AWESOME GRABS EVEN IF THEY AREN'T CHAINED!!!! Duh."
Yeah, did I say, never get grabbed? I said, don't get grabbed. Key difference. If you get grabbed and los a stock to the ice climbers quickly, or even not, then you were not playing right. You should know what they are capable of and plan accordingly. If you can't do that...
Plus, nana has to be nearby. If she's been knocked away at all, and that happens all the time because of the lag time for her moves to register, then you can't possibly chain grab. He needs nana there. That's why no one is looking at the ICs with either contempt or envy.
Yeah, did I say, never get grabbed? I said, don't get grabbed. Key difference. If you get grabbed and los a stock to the ice climbers quickly, or even not, then you were not playing right. You should know what they are capable of and plan accordingly. If you can't do that...
Plus, nana has to be nearby. If she's been knocked away at all, and that happens all the time because of the lag time for her moves to register, then you can't possibly chain grab. He needs nana there. That's why no one is looking at the ICs with either contempt or envy.
Grunt
Smash Master
ZSS has hitstun.
GOD TIER!
Adapt
Smash Lord
Naw, she dies too **** easily and she's hard to use effectively. (but so much fun to play)
I think she has a huge amount of potential, but in reality she will probably get no higher than Mid-mid
Stun-gun FTW though
I think she has a huge amount of potential, but in reality she will probably get no higher than Mid-mid
Stun-gun FTW though
Kaizo
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 28, 2008
- Messages
- 140
This has no bearing on her position in the tier list. Fox in Melee was very hard to use, and he's at the top. On the other hand, Sheik was very easy to use, but only 3rd/4th. Tiers are based on characters used at the highest level of play, and a pro that mains ZSS will use ZSS effectively, regardless of how hard it is.
Also, if you were trying to say she doesn't have a big margin of error, then you're probably wrong about that, too. She doesn't have the room for mistakes that Meta Knight and Snake do, but she's actually got a lot going for her.
Adapt
Smash Lord
It shouldn't I agree. But it's probably what is keeping her back in popularity, and therefor there isn't as many people developing her metagame. Without as much development it will take longer for her true potential to be realized, therefor lowering her in early tier lists. Even a couple pro's can't think up everything.
I think she has an average margin for error, certain attacks have hitboxes all over the place (up-b, and up-smash for example) and others like ftilt are much more limited, so it all averages out.
I think she has an average margin for error, certain attacks have hitboxes all over the place (up-b, and up-smash for example) and others like ftilt are much more limited, so it all averages out.
Kaizo
Smash Apprentice
- Joined
- May 28, 2008
- Messages
- 140
Margin of error is more determined by how many mistakes you can make before you die. Some characters get put in bad spots very easily, while some need to be damaged a whole lot before they have problems. Characters like MK and Snake have a huge margin of error and have good offense. Other characters like Sonic also have a large margin of error, but really don't have the offensive power to capitalize on it.
But you're right, someone has to pick up ZSS.
metalmonstar
Smash Lord
- Joined
- Apr 30, 2008
- Messages
- 1,081
Chozen still hasn't gotten back to me yet.
Anyway I think people need to be reminded that learning curve has no effect on a tier list.
@Alpha, what is this so called diddy myth? That bananas are easy to turn against diddy? Or that diddy is a momentum character?
I don't see it often but when an opponent does pick up a banana it just seems that diddy has lost a ton of his options. I think paolkim and gimpy where having a friendly match and Gimpy picked up the banana. Paol changed his tactics after that. In other matchups he dominated with his banana tactics. If it is the momentum thing, then I think that is true. In a match versus Azen's Lucario you looked like you were winning the whole time. If we took away the percents and stocks I'm pretty sure most people would think you were clearly winning and controlling the match.
Since you are a diddy player I would enjoy your insight.
I think the whole projectile reversal thing is just a myth circulated by players because it is easier to catch a thrown item so it must be easier to use your opponents item against them. I have heard the same thing about snake's gernades and R.O.B."s gyro. I just don't see it in matches.
Anyway I think people need to be reminded that learning curve has no effect on a tier list.
@Alpha, what is this so called diddy myth? That bananas are easy to turn against diddy? Or that diddy is a momentum character?
I don't see it often but when an opponent does pick up a banana it just seems that diddy has lost a ton of his options. I think paolkim and gimpy where having a friendly match and Gimpy picked up the banana. Paol changed his tactics after that. In other matchups he dominated with his banana tactics. If it is the momentum thing, then I think that is true. In a match versus Azen's Lucario you looked like you were winning the whole time. If we took away the percents and stocks I'm pretty sure most people would think you were clearly winning and controlling the match.
Since you are a diddy player I would enjoy your insight.
I think the whole projectile reversal thing is just a myth circulated by players because it is easier to catch a thrown item so it must be easier to use your opponents item against them. I have heard the same thing about snake's gernades and R.O.B."s gyro. I just don't see it in matches.
Dan Aran
Smash Rookie
Tiers Are 4 Queers!
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