Official BBR Matchup Chart v1.0: R.O.B.

[Zwarm]

ZSS makes me rage. -4 easily.

Spoiler

jk

I go Peach for that now, either way. Marth... I'm gonna stick with ROB. It's a fun MU, and really damn even. Samus... the only one I've ever played was Composer in a mid tier tournament when I didn't even play ROB at the time, and was on 40 hours of no sleep, sooo I have no opinion on that one.

Hi Jake!

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

i rly think lucario wins
just think about it
rob is known for his lack of kill options/power
lucario is AMAZING when he's at high percent
simple as that

not to mention his fsmash outranges every ground option we have
and he can edgeguard us very well
i think it's a -2 matchup for rob and stick by that

Pretty much what Chibo said, only I think it's a little better than -2. Yes, ROB can't kill, but he has a good keep away/spacing game when needed. Every time I play Lucarios, it always ends up getting close to a time out, because of how careful I need to play to avoid all of his nonsense. If we can get him off the ledge, ROB is very good at gimping/edgeguarding, and Lucario's recovery is very easily read and punished, which nets us earlier kills.

The negatives in the MU Chibo mentioned outweigh the positives we have, but not by much. I'd say -1.

Fsmash comes out on frame 21, if your on the ground, just PS it. This is why I tell people and try to myself Ftilt over Fsmash, almost as much range but far safer, unless he gets more aura in which Fsmash becomes is safe on block, .

[yt]7Kxnt9buxOk[/yt]

First game was pretty close, never seen a R.O.B. side B reflect so much in a match.

Second...well not so much.

The issue seemed to be more about juggles in the air because of R.O.B.s size and wieght over spacing.

I'll trust what your saying though, I'm not top player and all I have for R.O.B. knowledge is the times I've played against them in the past.

 

[CT Chia]

Yea, even though I did worse game 2, I enjoyed my play better sort of. I just lost too much of the lead early on and couldn't bring it back.

lol ROB's side B is the best, everyone felt the wrath of it at P5, and I even killed two people with it, one at 0% one at 40%

 

[DtJ Composer]

The johns I just namesearched into!

 

[Zwarm]

MM me son! GSS!

 

[Popertop]

Plus Lucario is easy to combo. He floats in the air with us so we can Fair combo the hell out of him. =3

Umm, you got that backwards.

Lucario beats rob in the air, and he can approach.

Also, Lucario can edgeguard Rob pretty well, rob's up b really hurts him here.

Rob seems to have more trouble edgeguarding lucario, fair covers lucario pretty well

stop me if any of this is wrong

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

You could just back off and UpB so high Lucario can't touch you, but GL on landing with that uair that lingers for 14 frames...or if it puts you into a frame trap for a free dair if you try air dodging through him.

You can make if back by playing smart on the ledge, and not SH something if Lucario is looking to use his Fsmash.

 

[stingers]

i would imagine lucario would be too slow to chase us with uairs, his best bet would be to punish our landing with a ground move like fsmash

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

He's not that slow, but R.O.B. with UpB is hard to catch, when he comes down is when you go for an Uair if you choose to.

It's trying to catch him when he comes down it when Lucario needs to go for R.O.B. either way.

 

[Popertop]

You could just back off and UpB so high Lucario can't touch you, but GL on landing with that uair that lingers for 14 frames...or if it puts you into a frame trap for a free dair if you try air dodging through him.

You can make if back by playing smart on the ledge, and not SH something if Lucario is looking to use his Fsmash.

yeah, that's the issue I see, you waste a lot of fuel recovering from above, then it gets predictable, you get tossed off the stage again and gimped this time because of the fuel you just used. :/
and yes I'm well aware of the Uair/Dair frame trap

It really feels like a definite Lucario advantage, either -1 or -2
If the Lucario boards feel like its even, then it would lean more towards -1, Rob for sure has worse matchups

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Pikachu is a +2 Lucario because Aura, and we work around his moveset. Lucario +3's Yoshi because Lucario literally has everything that Yoshi can't deal with well.

R.O.B. isn't like that at all, it's just small things like landing. A lot of Lucario's don't feel like it's an advantage, or if it is it's small.

It you feel it's a bad MU, I would say -1 at worst, imo.

 

[CT Chia]

Lucario can **** upB with aura sphere. If ROB recovers close, Luc can go for a fair/uair/dair. If we recover far, the moment we upB he can blast an aura sphere at us. I don't know why more Lucs don't do this.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I do, at least I think I try and go for it, but I don't think it's that bad for R.O.B. even considering that.

 

[DtJ Composer]

$1.6M money match Zwarm

 

[ccst]

Definitely Lucario's favour, like R.O.B. 45:55 Lucario (or even 40:60). Also I don't get why Olimar is a disadvantage for us... it's definitely our favour. To be more specific; R.O.B. 55:45 Olimar.

 

[Zwarm]

$1.6M money match Zwarm

Man, I was thinking $1.5M, but 1.6 is too rich for my taste. Sorry Jake. Maybe $1?

So I've been thinking about it. Is Falco really a -2 to everyone else? I played a bunch of games with Arty and Clowsui last night, and I feel like the MU isn't as bad as we make it out to be. I even beat Clow in a MM. (Though he did suicide his last stock game 1, and he probably would have won, tbh.) Falco is very good at getting damage on us early in a stock, because of the dthrow > dair > jab > regrab dthrow > whatever. But past that, ROB doesn't have that hard of a time dealing with Falco's stuff. Lasers aren't a huge deal if you can powershield them and continue to approach. Don't be obvious with our own lasers and gyros, and he has a harder time reflecting them. Don't let the gyro lay in front of him either for the same reason. Getting him offstage isn't too hard with good reads, and killing him offstage isn't too hard. I'm still not saying it's in our advantage in any way, I just feel like it's more -1 than -2.

 

[stingers]

falco has a true CG on ROB, so if they werent doing it, then you werent playing the right falcos >.>

 

[Coney]

you guys are big babies >:[

i said ddd/rob was +2 for us, the robs said it was -4 for them, so we had to come to -3 for you guys

THAT'S INSANE AND YOU ARE ALL WIMPS

 

[stingers]

i can buy -4
play me at xanadu coney

 

[Zwarm]

I've played Coney and I don't even think it's -4, lmao. It's like -2. MK is much worse, imo.

True CG to what percent, Stingers? I said he was good at low percents against ROB, but it's not that hard to stay alive after that.

 

[stingers]

until normal cg ending percents lol. like late 30s early 40s. idk the exact number

 

[DtJ Composer]

I'll settle for $1.60

 

[Mister Eric]

you guys are big babies >:[

i said ddd/rob was +2 for us, the robs said it was -4 for them, so we had to come to -3 for you guys

THAT'S INSANE AND YOU ARE ALL WIMPS

they are! ;3

 

[Steam]

If RoB recovers at a 45 degree angle luc can't really do much to him...

if you can read lucario well once he's offstage you can do rediculous damage and in many cases get a whole stock off... Bair just ***** his recovery and luc can't try to stall RoB out.

If you shield Fsmash Ftilt punish. If you see him in startup for it you can outspace it with SH nair.

Stay on the ground. try to keep your gyro active and close to you. remember you outspace lucario and are faster inside. and if you're on the ground and he SHs your fair beats everything he can do.

RoB gets juggled really hard. even if he gets away he'll often eat an AS or something when he tries to land.

double team is hilarious when used on a spinning gryo, watch for it.

I honestly think it's even, maybe a slight lucario advantage if only because it's much
easier for lucario to get the lead back than it is for RoB.

edit: RoB can't Fair string lucario well at all... Luc really just needs to DI away/behind and RoB can't do much with his crappy air mobility... RoB really eats lucario's strings hard becaue of his massive hurtbox and ****poor air mobility. there isn't much that lucario has to read from RoB lol

 

[TeeVee]

d3 really is -4/-3 though coney lmao

 

[Mister Eric]

No. You just bad, yo!

 

[ccst]

Where are Ganondorf, Pokémon Trainer and a few other characters in that chart?

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

Ok, I talked this over a bit and I have to agree, Luc might be a -1 for R.O.B.

 

[Zwarm]

Yay for me explaining things in person. I'm so much better at doing that than I am online. I talked to Red for like, what? Maybe 5 minutes about the MU? And I convinced him it's not even.

 

[#HBC | Red Ryu]

I looked back over Chibo's set at pound and noticed what you were talking about.

 

[ccst]

Nice work LoL. xD

 

[Popertop]

I think rob might have slight edge on dk, and bowser might be worse than -1

what do y'all think?

 

[TheMike]

Where are Ganondorf, Pokémon Trainer and a few other characters in that chart?

Sorry, I forgot Zelda and the 2 line. It's been fixed.

 

[clowsui]

Man, I was thinking $1.5M, but 1.6 is too rich for my taste. Sorry Jake. Maybe $1?

So I've been thinking about it. Is Falco really a -2 to everyone else? I played a bunch of games with Arty and Clowsui last night, and I feel like the MU isn't as bad as we make it out to be. I even beat Clow in a MM. (Though he did suicide his last stock game 1, and he probably would have won, tbh.) Falco is very good at getting damage on us early in a stock, because of the dthrow > dair > jab > regrab dthrow > whatever. But past that, ROB doesn't have that hard of a time dealing with Falco's stuff. Lasers aren't a huge deal if you can powershield them and continue to approach. Don't be obvious with our own lasers and gyros, and he has a harder time reflecting them. Don't let the gyro lay in front of him either for the same reason. Getting him offstage isn't too hard with good reads, and killing him offstage isn't too hard. I'm still not saying it's in our advantage in any way, I just feel like it's more -1 than -2.

i SD'd game 3 also

in all honesty i'm not sure those were the best games to go by. i have a terrible track record vs ROBs and i don't really know the matchup even though i've played sneaky/eric a bunch

i've always thought ROB v Falco is something around -1.5 though. it's not quite as bad as -2 but not quite as good as -1. ROB has huge problems dealing w/ a passive aggressive falco up close (btw stingers i played holy tonight and i tried the new strat that we talked about, works way better than what i'd been using against you) and Falco has a certain range where ROB has to react to what he's doing (i believe it's when ROB is 2/3 of a full phantasm away). however once ROB gets a grab on Falco and sends him offstage Falco eats a substantial amount of percentage every time. Falco and ROB don't really have CPs on each other, so that doesn't really count for anything

also when ROB has a lead it's very annoying for Falco lol

 

[Mister Eric]

I will say this much. The only Falco that has simply shut me down is Shugo.
And I honestly still feel that I don't know a lot about the MU (tho I feel like that in pretty much every MU. I guess it always leaves room for improvement lol)

 

[clowsui]

if everything works out next weekend i'll be there for about 2-3 hours

eric, maybe we can play some concept matches? (seriouslies but recorded for the sake of matchup study)

 

[ccst]

i SD'd game 3 also

in all honesty i'm not sure those were the best games to go by. i have a terrible track record vs ROBs and i don't really know the matchup even though i've played sneaky/eric a bunch

i've always thought ROB v Falco is something around -1.5 though. it's not quite as bad as -2 but not quite as good as -1. ROB has huge problems dealing w/ a passive aggressive falco up close (btw stingers i played holy tonight and i tried the new strat that we talked about, works way better than what i'd been using against you) and Falco has a certain range where ROB has to react to what he's doing (i believe it's when ROB is 2/3 of a full phantasm away). however once ROB gets a grab on Falco and sends him offstage Falco eats a substantial amount of percentage every time. Falco and ROB don't really have CPs on each other, so that doesn't really count for anything

also when ROB has a lead it's very annoying for Falco lol

Falco has CPs against R.O.B., I'm very sure about that.

 

[Zwarm]

i SD'd game 3 also

in all honesty i'm not sure those were the best games to go by. i have a terrible track record vs ROBs and i don't really know the matchup even though i've played sneaky/eric a bunch

i've always thought ROB v Falco is something around -1.5 though. it's not quite as bad as -2 but not quite as good as -1. ROB has huge problems dealing w/ a passive aggressive falco up close (btw stingers i played holy tonight and i tried the new strat that we talked about, works way better than what i'd been using against you) and Falco has a certain range where ROB has to react to what he's doing (i believe it's when ROB is 2/3 of a full phantasm away). however once ROB gets a grab on Falco and sends him offstage Falco eats a substantial amount of percentage every time. Falco and ROB don't really have CPs on each other, so that doesn't really count for anything

also when ROB has a lead it's very annoying for Falco lol

Did you suicide game 3? I don't remember anymore, lol. (sun)

Camp more, that's the best advice I can give you against ROB. You camped, but you would stop even though I was still having trouble dealing with the lasers, and you would approach me randomly, and I'd punish that. The only time you should stop camping is when ROB is actually approaching with powershields, and even then, you can just side B to safety.

Falco has CPs against R.O.B., I'm very sure about that.

Falco is only really good on neutrals, so no, he really doesn't have any solid counterpicks against ROB.

 

[Mister Eric]

Gotta learn to juke them side-b's yo.

 

[8Bitman]

I swear I have no advice for the R.O.B v. Falco MU except to stay calm. Stay very very very very calm.

At the last ZP (Zero Ping Lan Center, ESAM holds Monthly tourneys there) I went to that passed this Saturday I beat Xaltis 2-1. Xaltis is the best Falco in Florida. I lost first match, I got ***** he one with one stock, a comfortable %.

Then I came back and won the next two matches. IDK what happened but when everyone sends 2Link all of the replays I will try and find it and show you all the sets.

I placed 9th out of 29 entrants...... AGAIN!!! >_<
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=299497

I got a bye 1st round, then I fought Xaltis 2nd round, beat him 2-1.
Then 3rd round I had to fight ESAM...... AHHH I LOST 1-2!!! I WAS SOOOO DAMN CLOSE!!!
And in 6th round Losers I had to fight Chaz (The best marth in Florida... PHACK!).... I lost 0-2. I hate fighting Marth that MU iz broke az all hell. I couldn't touch him. I got destroyed.

So yeah. I'm surprised I haven't talked about the tourneys I have gone to. I have gone to 5 tourneys so far. Not that interesting but I am going to try and send ESAM to losers next tourney. =3