Social NintenZone Social 6.0 - L'Arachel Edition, Apparently?

[mario123007]

I don't even understand what the difference is other than 76 isn't with that guy anymore. So how him being gay forced but not Tracer being gay?

For now we only see a picture, at least from what I checked, a sahme how we only get a long short novel rather than a comic strip, that's why I think it's just a bit force... like I said, hopefully we can understand more of Soldier 76's past even more.
We look back a Tracer's, her relationship was the comic was all about. And it was a Christmas themed comic so it fits even more better. That being said though this is just my own "Hot take".
Same with Tracer though, I don't really care much about it, what I want more on Overwatch lore is more shots and comics on other characters, especially the new ones.

 

[Deleted member]

It is a great week for Fantastic Four fans like myself.

 

[mario123007]

Eh, Tracer seemed like she was always written as gay. Like, when I looked at Tracer and her personality, attributes, and all around character I could see her being Lesbian. With Soldier 76 it seemed like they hit a wall of "Wow, this character really isn't interesting. How can we develop him more? I know! Let's make him suddenly gay!" Marvel did the same thing to Ice Man and while that type of storytelling can definitely be done in taste and with a definitive sense of empathy, both Soldier 76 and Ice Man just falls flat.

I'm always happy to see more LGBT characterization in media but when it's cheaply used to "develop" a character I can't help but tilt my head a bit. Being gay doesn't really do anything for 76. He's just as uninteresting as he previously was character wise. But now instead of just "uninteresting" he's "uninteresting and gay". Not a deterioration of his character but it really didn't do anything for his personality.

Exactly, no shots on LGBT at all, my problem is how they did with Soldier 76's just felt flat, to me he's always one of my most favorite character in Overwatch regardless of his sexuality.
I just checked IGN's video on both Tracer and Soldier 76's, and that somewhat sums it up when it comes to like and dislike ratio.

Edit:
I don't think I have share this but... Oh gosh last month I watch Spiderman: Into the Spiderverse. I aware most of you guys know that movie is really good, because it is, probably most favorite Spiderman movie.

And this music from the movie is really rad:

 

[Deleted member]

Eh, Tracer seemed like she was always written as gay. Like, when I looked at Tracer and her personality, attributes, and all around character I could see her being Lesbian. With Soldier 76 it seemed like they hit a wall of "Wow, this character really isn't interesting. How can we develop him more? I know! Let's make him suddenly gay!" Marvel did the same thing to Ice Man and while that type of storytelling can definitely be done in taste and with a definitive sense of empathy, both Soldier 76 and Ice Man just falls flat.

I'm always happy to see more LGBT characterization in media but when it's cheaply used to "develop" a character I can't help but tilt my head a bit. Being gay doesn't really do anything for 76. He's just as uninteresting as he previously was character wise. But now instead of just "uninteresting" he's "uninteresting and gay". Not a deterioration of his character but it really didn't do anything for his personality.

Doesn't really make any sense to me. What qualifies Tracer to be gay? Is it because she "looks gay" or "acts gay"? SMH.

I mean, I get what you're saying when it's pushed to sell a character to a certain audience. But that alone doesn't make it implausible that they're into the same sex. I find it hypocritical that usually when people complain about gay being a defining characteristic, those seem people want a justification for the character being gay.

I have a similar problem when people want no gay character to ever, ever have anything to do with acting "stereotypical gay". For instance, just because Tracer fits into more of those perceptions some people have doesn't make her a bad portrayal.

For now we only see a picture, at least from what I checked, a shame how we only get a long short novel rather than a comic strip, that's why I think it's just a bit force... like I said, hopefully we can understand more of Soldier 76's past even more.
We look back a Tracer's, her relationship was the comic was all about. And it was a Christmas themed comic so it fits even more better. That being said though this is just my own "Hot take".
Same with Tracer though, I don't really care much about it, what I want more on Overwatch lore is more shots and comics on other characters, especially the new ones.

You wouldn't say it'd be forced if he had a female lover, would you? There's many straight characters who have lovers introduced in that fashion, where we only see a glimpse of them. Doesn't really make sense to me that somehow makes his sexuality or relationship forced, especially when from what I understand of the characters it makes sense for them to in the status they're in. 76 is old and torn and Tracer is pretty young and vibrant.


Hence why Shisho probably assumed you do have some sort of problem with him being gay regardless of whether or not you admit it.

 

[Luigifan18]

Man I wish I was still asleep.

I’m currently struggling to stay awake.

 

[Deleted member]

I have a couple new remixes to bring in the new year! :3
https://soundcloud.com/zoetrent4smash%2Funova-gym-leader https://soundcloud.com/zoetrent4smash%2Fpartners-theme

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Doesn't really make any sense to me. What qualifies Tracer to be gay? Is it because she "looks gay" or "acts gay"? SMH.

I mean, I get what you're saying when it's pushed to sell a character to a certain audience. But that alone doesn't make it implausible that they're into the same sex. I find it hypocritical that usually when people complain about gay being a defining characteristic, those seem people want a justification for the character being gay.

I have a similar problem when people want no gay character to ever, ever have anything to do with acting "stereotypical gay". For instance, just because Tracer fits into more of those perceptions some people have doesn't make her a bad portrayal.

That's hardly my point at all. Soldier 76 is first and foremost a Soldier. A soldier of the battlefield through and through. Whether it be for a cause or for himself he does his duty.

Him being in a relationship at all makes me feel like his characterization wasn't thought out quite as well as some of the others. 76 was always portrayed as a lone commando whose only goal was to finish the mission. To do what he had to do and move on to the next. I dunno. Maybe I read him wrong. Tracer on the other hand was always looking out for the little guy. Peppy, talky, spunky, a whole lot of fun. Seeing her as gay because of how her character was made sense when she was protecting the world because her girl was in it. It gave her this sense of superheroism that is usually only found in beefy men from comics. It was done exquisitely. Soldier 76's doesn't make any sense. He's a full blown soldier who doesn't care who he's fighting or where he's going so long as his war is for the right thing. If he had to betray someone on a dime because he felt like it was the right thing I feel he would. He's a soldier. Him being in a relationship, woman or man, makes me feel like they changed his personality for the sake of it. Not every character has to have a lover and the way they went with 76 doesn't really give off a satisfying feeling to me. "Oh yeah Soldier 76 is a soldier! And HE'S GAY!" Cool! What else does he do? What's his motivations? "HE'S GAY!" Oh uh, ok.

Ice Man was a ladies man through ALL the comics and then they just decided "Hey, he's gay now!" Super ****ing cheap sense of "Character Development".

 

[Deleted member]

Holy ****, Direct for today actually is dead lmao

#FinalFantasy XII THE ZODIAC AGE is coming to #NintendoSwitch on 4/30! To celebrate, check out this beautiful new artwork by character designer Akihiko Yoshida. pic.twitter.com/Q5JttH9d1M

— Nintendo of America (@NintendoAmerica) January 10, 2019

 

[Deleted member]

Doesn't really make any sense to me. What qualifies Tracer to be gay? Is it because she "looks gay" or "acts gay"? SMH.

I mean, I get what you're saying when it's pushed to sell a character to a certain audience. But that alone doesn't make it implausible that they're into the same sex. I find it hypocritical that usually when people complain about gay being a defining characteristic, those seem people want a justification for the character being gay.

I have a similar problem when people want no gay character to ever, ever have anything to do with acting "stereotypical gay". For instance, just because Tracer fits into more of those perceptions some people have doesn't make her a bad portrayal.



You wouldn't say it'd be forced if he had a female lover, would you? There's many straight characters who have lovers introduced in that fashion, where we only see a glimpse of them. Doesn't really make sense to me that somehow makes his sexuality or relationship forced, especially when from what I understand of the characters it makes sense for them to in the status they're in. 76 is old and torn and Tracer is pretty young and vibrant.


Hence why Shisho probably assumed you do have some sort of problem with him being gay regardless of whether or not you admit it.

Two things:

>Are you a Godzilla fan? I saw your signature and i would love to see another one on Smashboards besides me. My favourite character from the movies is Jet Jaguar. Who is your favourite one?

>I am fine with LGTB characters, and i would find it cool if a certain character of the Fantastic Four comics became one, of course with the time that would be needed.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Holy ****, Direct for today actually is dead lmao

#FinalFantasy XII THE ZODIAC AGE is coming to #NintendoSwitch on 4/30! To celebrate, check out this beautiful new artwork by character designer Akihiko Yoshida. pic.twitter.com/Q5JttH9d1M

— Nintendo of America (@NintendoAmerica) January 10, 2019

well Ill be ****ing damned
another game Sirlionhart played and loved.

its like Nintendo is telling me something

 

[Deleted member]

The Direct will be announced someday.

Patience will be key.

 

[Deleted member]

That's hardly my point at all. Soldier 76 is first and foremost a Soldier. A soldier of the battlefield through and through. Whether it be for a cause or for himself he does his duty.

That doesn't really mean anything, being a soldier alone doesn't define you as a person either. So being a soldier, no matter hardcore and having a lover aren't contradictory.

Him being in a relationship at all makes me feel like his characterization wasn't thought out quite as well as some of the others. 76 was always portrayed as a lone commando whose only goal was to finish the mission. To do what he had to do and move on to the next. I dunno. Maybe I read him wrong. Tracer on the other hand was always looking out for the little guy. Peppy, talky, spunky, a whole lot of fun. Seeing her as gay because of how her character was made sense when she was protecting the world because her girl was in it. It gave her this sense of superheroism that is usually only found in beefy men from comics. It was done exquisitely. Soldier 76's doesn't make any sense. He's a full blown soldier who doesn't care who he's fighting or where he's going so long as his war is for the right thing. If he had to betray someone on a dime because he felt like it was the right thing I feel he would. He's a soldier. Him being in a relationship, woman or man, makes me feel like they changed his personality for the sake of it. Not every character has to have a lover and the way they went with 76 doesn't really give off a satisfying feeling to me. "Oh yeah Soldier 76 is a soldier! And HE'S GAY!" Cool! What else does he do? What's his motivations? "HE'S GAY!" Oh uh, ok.

That characterization of 76 is correct, hence why he had a former lover, not a current one. And why Tracer does have a current lover.

It's not even like a characterization you never see, a hero getting split up from there lover due to their own duty is pretty cliche actually. Being upset about that is fine, but the way you state it makes it seem like you do have a problem with his ex being a man in particular hence why I'm even arguing about this.

>Are you a Godzilla fan? I saw your signature and i would love to see another one on Smashboards besides me. My favourite character from the movies is Jet Jaguar. Who is your favourite one?

Yeah, I love Godzilla. I like a ton of the monsters but my favorite is probably Ghidorah, Gigan, or Mechagodzilla. It really depends on the variation.

 

[Pyra]

February, my dudes.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

That doesn't really mean anything, being a soldier alone doesn't define you as a person either. So being a soldier, no matter hardcore and having a lover aren't contradictory.





That characterization of 76 is correct, hence why he had a former lover, not a current one. And why Tracer does have a current lover.

It's not even like a characterization you never see, a hero getting split up from there lover due to their own duty is pretty cliche actually. Being upset about that is fine, but the way you state it makes it seem like you do have a problem with his ex being a man in particular hence why I'm even arguing about this.

Yeah, I love Godzilla. I like a ton of the monsters but my favorite is probably Ghidorah, Gigan, or Mechagodzilla. It really depends on the variation.

For the record I had no idea it was his former lover. That makes more sense.

Edit: even still, him having a lover at all does still make me feel like his characterization was lot thougt out. Especially with the way he's been portrayed up to this point.

Here's my thing. Soldier 76 being the type of soldier he is does make me feel like him having a lover is contradictory to HIS character. That's my head canon though and I got that from the way he was portrayed up until this point. I dont see how it's necessarily my fault that the character was given no characterization up until now so I just assume that his characterization is his love for the battle field ad nada. It's also kind of rude of you to assume I have a problem with a gay character just because he's gay.

Honestly if he weren't gay I probably would've never found out about this because I really don't follow Overwatch lore but because of the big deal being made over his sexuality I found out about it and gave my opinion as to why I felt his characterization wasn't improved or really changed in any way by this development.

 

[Deleted member]

The Direct will be announced someday.

Patience will be key.

This coming direct could be the second best non-E3 general direct ever
Second only to the September 2018 one

 

[Deleted member]

February, my dudes.

The Carnival holidays happen in February.

 

[Deleted member]

For the record I had no idea it was his former lover. That makes more sense.

Edit: even still, him having a lover at all does still make me feel like his characterization was lot thougt out. Especially with the way he's been portrayed up to this point.

I mean, I just assume that his current self is a lot different from his younger self. He at least seems way less brooding and cranky when he was younger.

 

[Deleted member]

Oh, by the way, Final Fantasy X + X-2 HD Remaster is coming April 16th, two weeks away from Final Fantasy XII.

https://na.finalfantasy.com/news/982

Not gonna lie, I'd much rather an earlier date. However, if we're seeing a pattern of every game getting spaced out a bit, hopefully Final Fantasy VII and IX isn't too down the pipeline.

 

[Deleted member]

I appreciate Alucard trying to explain the issue properly but honestly, I'm tired of "this LGBT character being LGBT is forced". None of you would be saying that if he was straight and don't pretend like you would. Characters don't need to be written as "gay" or have fifteen layers of "foreshadowing" to them being gay so please stop with this blatant homophobia.

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

February, my dudes.

March, My guys

 

[Cutie Gwen]

I appreciate Alucard trying to explain the issue properly but honestly, I'm tired of "this LGBT character being LGBT is forced". None of you would be saying that if he was straight and don't pretend like you would. Characters don't need to be written as "gay" or have fifteen layers of "foreshadowing" to them being gay so please stop with this blatant homophobia.

I think what's also an issue is expecting Overwatch to have good writing. Isn't Mccree's age incredibly inconsistent with his backstory and the lore? It's still better than JK Rowling though. She's also a terf so **** her

 

[Pyra]

March, My guys

This sounds like a command from a really chill military captain

 

[Deleted member]

Alright, so here's what they can't really show IF a supposed Nintendo Direct will happen this month, cause by then, we'd already know about it.

• Nintendo Switch Online NES stuff
• Yoshi's Crafted World release date + trailer
• Final Fantasy XII release date
• Final Fantasy X + X-2 HD Remaster release date
• Dragon's Dogma port + release announcement

I dunno, but I'm feelin' some huge deja vu from September last year. On the bright side, two Final Fantasy games and Dragon's Dogma in one month? That seems pretty good, if you ask me. Is it good for my wallet? lol no

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I appreciate Alucard trying to explain the issue properly but honestly, I'm tired of "this LGBT character being LGBT is forced". None of you would be saying that if he was straight and don't pretend like you would. Characters don't need to be written as "gay" or have fifteen layers of "foreshadowing" to them being gay so please stop with this blatant homophobia.

I'm not being homophobic for criticizing a companies writing of a character. I'm just being a critic. I couldn't give two ****s about what's going on in the Overwatch world to be honest and to be fair I stated multiple times that it's not that he's gay, it's that he has a lover at all. He never was a character I saw as having a lover, or even former, so seeing him romantically involved at all makes me feel like his original characterization is betrayed. I didn't counter with any sort of holier than thou bigotry.

Just because I criticize something that is gay doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. It just means I see some holes in the characterization.

You say that a character doesn't need foreshadowing to be labeled as gay but why not? Wouldn't that be a good thing? Wouldn't that help with the characterization in the same way that a woman flirting with a man or vice versa give you a better sense that theu are straight?

As a matter of ****ing fact I assumed that Reaper and McCree were gay lovers up until the point that Ashe came along and I even still feel like they had something going on. I don't think 76 being gay did anything for the character. Nor do I think it was referenced AT ALL like I would think McCree and Reaper's would have been up to this point. But you know what if I'm going to be called a homophobe for criticizing I'll just shut my mouth.

 

[Deleted member]

Alright, so here's what they can't really show IF a supposed Nintendo Direct will happen this month, cause by then, we'd already know about it.

• Nintendo Switch Online NES stuff
• Yoshi's Crafted World release date + trailer
• Final Fantasy XII release date
• Final Fantasy X + X-2 HD Remaster release date
• Dragon's Dogma port + release announcement

I dunno, but I'm feelin' some huge deja vu from September last year. On the bright side, two Final Fantasy games and Dragon's Dogma in one month? That seems pretty good, if you ask me. Is it good for my wallet? lol no

don't forget release date too lol

 

[Deleted member]

I have a feeling that the Direct could happen this week, but because of a stretched thing:

Marvel is celebrating Fantastic Four week, and it is being great at the moment for me. However, UA3 hasn’t been mentioned yet in any form, not even in the Fantastic Four Direct about games (where they teased F4 content in Spidey PS4).

Maybe the Direct happens in any of these days, and it will feature a trailer for UA3 where they reveal the First Family.

 

[Pyra]

I'm not being homophobic for criticizing a companies writing of a character. I'm just being a critic. I couldn't give two ****s about what's going on in the Overwatch world to be honest and to be fair I stated multiple times that it's not that he's gay, it's that he has a lover at all. He never was a character I saw as having a lover, or even former, so seeing him romantically involved at all makes me feel like his original characterization is betrayed. I didn't counter with any sort of holier than thou bigotry.

Just because I criticize something that is gay doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. It just means I see some holes in the characterization.

You say that a character doesn't need foreshadowing to be labeled as gay but why not? Wouldn't that be a good thing? Wouldn't that help with the characterization in the same way that a woman flirting with a man or vice versa give you a better sense that theu are straight?

As a matter of ****ing fact I assumed that Reaper and McCree were gay lovers up until the point that Ashe came along and I even still feel like they had something going on. I don't think 76 being gay did anything for the character. Nor do I think it was referenced AT ALL like I would think McCree and Reaper's would have been up to this point. But you know what if I'm going to be called a homophobe for criticizing I'll just shut my mouth.

i mean... it's not like he wasn't planned on being gay. He's a gay character, and always has been, but it's not been relevant until just recently in that comic, no?

They said a long time ago when tracer was revealed to be gay that "She's not the only one" and I'd wager it's not just Soldier and Tracer. *shrug*

I used to be like "wow saying x is gay just for the sake of being gay" but it took me like 3 seconds of thinking to realize that gay people... are... just... gay without needing any kind of reason to be

it'd be weird if straight characters went through some kind of Straight Guy Story Arc in order to be validated as straight so why should a gay character have to lead into it, and can't just be gay lol


I mean, it's not untrue that some authors just kinda shunt the gay label onto characters for the sake of last minute representation, but I hardly think this is the case of shallow pandering and more that they've always planned for him to be into dudes lol


EDIT: Also I'm not trying to argue or anything, I didn't read the whole conversation and was just putting my two cents in as someone who was kinda jaded about this kind of thing in the past as well.

Apologies if anyone ended up taking this as an offense or anything.

 

[Dyllybirdy]

February, my dudes.

March, My guys

April, my friends.

 

[Deleted member]

April, my friends.

October 28th, my friends.

 

[Cutie Gwen]

i mean... it's not like he wasn't planned on being gay. He's a gay character, and always has been, but it's not been relevant until just recently in that comic, no?

They said a long time ago when tracer was revealed to be gay that "She's not the only one" and I'd wager it's not just Soldier and Tracer. *shrug*

I used to be like "wow saying x is gay just for the sake of being gay" but it took me like 3 seconds of thinking to realize that gay people... are... just... gay without needing any kind of reason to be

it'd be weird if straight characters went through some kind of Straight Guy Story Arc in order to be validated as straight so why should a gay character have to lead into it, and can't just be gay lol


I mean, it's not untrue that some authors just kinda shunt the gay label onto characters for the sake of last minute representation, but I hardly think this is the case of shallow pandering and more that they've always planned for him to be into dudes lol

Honestly I feel that's something we should implement. If you want to criticize an LGBT character, think "Would I ask the same if they were cis/straight?" If not, shut up.


Though NSG's point is him finding it difficult to believe Soldier 76 had a lover PERIOD

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Also Fiora as well, sort of.
Glad they didn't spoiled XC2 characters for the most part, which they could have.

Fiora was already spoiled in Smash 4, to be fair.

But yeah, even without trophy descriptions, Sakurai finds a way to spoil games.

Never doubt the man.

 

[Pyra]

Though NSG's point is him finding it difficult to believe Soldier 76 had a lover PERIOD

He became the way he is after "dying" and becoming angsty old dude, but as far as I'm aware he was a normal young Overwatch leader before that massive Overwatch base explosion.

I don't think there's anything that indicates he was a loner before then. I'd actually say that he had strong connections with others before then, and having a lover isn't all that weird to me.

All I want is an overwatch movie or something jfc

Honestly I feel that's something we should implement. If you want to criticize an LGBT character, think "Would I ask the same if they were cis/straight?" If not, shut up.

Yeah.
I've been trying to become a better, more open minded person as I age cause I was a super closed minded turd as a teen (which, I mean, so are a lot of other teens), and that's an easy self-check people can do if they find themselves doing something like that.

Like... people are people are people

 

[Michele]

Welp seems like the guy who said the direct date was completely wrong, despite being right in previous ones...How come? How is it possible?

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

i mean... it's not like he wasn't planned on being gay. He's a gay character, and always has been, but it's not been relevant until just recently in that comic, no?

They said a long time ago when tracer was revealed to be gay that "She's not the only one" and I'd wager it's not just Soldier and Tracer. *shrug*

I used to be like "wow saying x is gay just for the sake of being gay" but it took me like 3 seconds of thinking to realize that gay people... are... just... gay without needing any kind of reason to be

it'd be weird if straight characters went through some kind of Straight Guy Story Arc in order to be validated as straight so why should a gay character have to lead into it, and can't just be gay lol


I mean, it's not untrue that some authors just kinda shunt the gay label onto characters for the sake of last minute representation, but I hardly think this is the case of shallow pandering and more that they've always planned for him to be into dudes lol


EDIT: Also I'm not trying to argue or anything, I didn't read the whole conversation and was just putting my two cents in as someone who was kinda jaded about this kind of thing in the past as well.

Apologies if anyone ended up taking this as an offense or anything.

Still, it's not that you don't have a point but like McCree is my favorite Overwatch character and had already come to see him as gay, or bisexual, because of his flirting with reaper. And I think that's a damn good way to reference that. 76 just kind of happened and it's not a bad thing to have characters just be gay but if there was any character in the game that I would see NOT being romantically involved at all and being full blown a man's man and only to himself it would've been 76 but that whole thing just got flipped on its head so like I feel like his characterization wasn't done properly and that's why I have a problem with it. And that's it.

 

[Deleted member]

I think what's also an issue is expecting Overwatch to have good writing. Isn't Mccree's age incredibly inconsistent with his backstory and the lore? It's still better than JK Rowling though. She's also a terf so **** her

Overwatch doesn't deserve to be compared to JK "Dumbledore is Wakandian" Rowling

I'm not being homophobic for criticizing a companies writing of a character. I'm just being a critic. I couldn't give two ****s about what's going on in the Overwatch world to be honest

Doesn't seem like you don't tbh

and to be fair I stated multiple times that it's not that he's gay, it's that he has a lover at all.

No, you're focusing on the fact he's gay so clearly that's what you have an issue with. "Being gay doesn't add anything to his character" and "Tracer always seemed like she was written as gay" are from your first post on this page.

He never was a character I saw as having a lover, or even former, so seeing him romantically involved at all makes me feel like his original characterization is betrayed. I didn't counter with any sort of holier than thou bigotry.

Just because you didn't see him that way doesn't mean he isn't.

Just because I criticize something that is gay doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. It just means I see some holes in the characterization.

I'm not saying you're a homophobe, I'm saying this is a case of homophobia. We all have internalized and sometimes we don't notice it.
What I'm asking you to do is take a step back, look at your own argument and ask yourself "where is this coming from?"
[Quotem
You say that a character doesn't need foreshadowing to be labeled as gay but why not? Wouldn't that be a good thing? Wouldn't that help with the characterization in the same way that a woman flirting with a man or vice versa give you a better sense that theu are straight?
[/Quote]

People are gay, that's just a thing they are and you can't tell what's their sexuality of a person just by looking at them. Ergo, the same applies to characters: caracters are gay, those are just things they are, you can't tell what a character's sexuality is just by looking at them. You don't need foreshadowing to it because sexualities aren't plot points.
Why do straight people have the benefit of not needing "foreshadowing" to their sexuality? Did you just simply assume Soldier 76 was straight before this? And if characters need any sort of foreshadowing to their sexuality, what does that make of characters who don't "throw out any hints"?

 

[Professor Pumpkaboo]

Yall need to start listening to people before you start labling people things because it will save you the time of lookin like an ass when you are proven wrong in the hole you dig

 

[The Stoopid Unikorn]

Welp seems like the guy who said the direct date was completely wrong, despite being right in previous ones...How come? How is it possible?

Sometimes, it just happens.

Can't always be right.

 

[Pyra]

Irrelevant to the conversation at hand,
I'm not a huge shipper because if I do end up thinking of a connection between characters I'd like to think of more than "they're friends" or "because I want to".

People shipping Junkrat and Roadhog make me not want to talk to them for the duration of that conversation typically...
And people shipping things that wouldn't align with their established personalities/alignments etc.
For instance, Torb has a wife and SEVERAL children.
I don't think he's much for adultery so...

Not that that ever really matters and it's all just in good fun, but I mean... I've had people "agressively ship" things at me before lmao
like usually it's "okay man you do you" but if you get in my grill about it i'm gonna ignore ya

Still, it's not that you don't have a point but like McCree is my favorite Overwatch character and had already come to see him as gay, or bisexual, because of his flirting with reaper. And I think that's a damn good way to reference that. 76 just kind of happened and it's not a bad thing to have characters just be gay but if there was any character in the game that I would see NOT being romantically involved at all and being full blown a man's man and only to himself it would've been 76 but that whole thing just got flipped on its head so like I feel like his characterization wasn't done properly and that's why I have a problem with it. And that's it.

Even "emotion-devoid" Widow is shown to still visit her late husband's grave.
*shrug* Idunno, I'd say it's about time instead of saying it shouldn't have happened. He's pretty angsty now but he still holds his old connections dear (for instance, Ana).

Overwatch doesn't deserve to be compared to JK "Dumbledore is Wakandian" Rowling

This is canon now. Wakanda forever, Harry.

 

[Deleted member]

I'm not being homophobic for criticizing a companies writing of a character. I'm just being a critic. I couldn't give two ****s about what's going on in the Overwatch world to be honest and to be fair I stated multiple times that it's not that he's gay, it's that he has a lover at all. He never was a character I saw as having a lover, or even former, so seeing him romantically involved at all makes me feel like his original characterization is betrayed. I didn't counter with any sort of holier than thou bigotry.

Just because I criticize something that is gay doesn't mean I'm a homophobe. It just means I see some holes in the characterization.

You say that a character doesn't need foreshadowing to be labeled as gay but why not? Wouldn't that be a good thing? Wouldn't that help with the characterization in the same way that a woman flirting with a man or vice versa give you a better sense that theu are straight?

As a matter of ****ing fact I assumed that Reaper and McCree were gay lovers up until the point that Ashe came along and I even still feel like they had something going on. I don't think 76 being gay did anything for the character. Nor do I think it was referenced AT ALL like I would think McCree and Reaper's would have been up to this point. But you know what if I'm going to be called a homophobe for criticizing I'll just shut my mouth.

There's been a common idea going around as of recently that a gay character should only be gay if it serves a purpose, otherwise it is forced. What purpose? Well it depends. Sometimes they just have to qualify as an interesting character(which is pretty subjective), sometimes they have to serve the narrative, and sometimes you get the really low bull**** that gay people are only gay because they are mentally ill or suffered through some kind of abuse.

I mean the thing is, often times when people say it, they don't necessarily mean to come off that way. Some of it's even stated by people who just want to see better written gay characters in media. The problem is that makes it seem like being gay is something that even needs to have an excuse or a very specific standard which is just crazy considering that the reality is that gay people come in such a variety of different people. Boring, crazy, flamboyant, gruff, whatever.

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Yall need to start listening to people before you start lableing people things because it will save you the time of lookin like an *** when you are proven wrong in the hole you dig

If you're talking about Shisho, well the thing is he's talking about the subtext people don't even bother to look into. So it'd be rather ironic if that's the case considering that he has his stance because he sees exactly what people are saying.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

Overwatch doesn't deserve to be compared to JK "Dumbledore is Wakandian" Rowling

Doesn't seem like you don't tbh

No, you're focusing on the fact he's gay so clearly that's what you have an issue with. "Being gay doesn't add anything to his character" and "Tracer always seemed like she was written as gay" are from your first post on this page.

Just because you didn't see him that way doesn't mean he isn't.

I'm not saying you're a homophobe, I'm saying this is a case of homophobia. We all have internalized and sometimes we don't notice it.
What I'm asking you to do is take a step back, look at your own argument and ask yourself "where is this coming from?"

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People are gay, that's just a thing they are and you can't tell what's their sexuality of a person just by looking at them. Ergo, the same applies to characters: caracters are gay, those are just things they are, you can't tell what a character's sexuality is just by looking at them. You don't need foreshadowing to it because sexualities aren't plot points.
Why do straight people have the benefit of not needing "foreshadowing" to their sexuality? Did you just simply assume Soldier 76 was straight before this? And if characters need any sort of foreshadowing to their sexuality, what does that make of characters who don't "throw out any hints"?

I ASSUMED HE WAS A LONER AND DIDN'T HAVE A LOVER SHISH! That's my point. He could've been gay he could've but I never characterized him that way. He could've been straight he could've but I never characterized him like that. I characterized him as that kind of guy who deleted all distractions from his life to focus on his duty. That's the way he was presented so that's the way I characterized him.

Plus, there's nothing ever wrong with having a gay character reference that they're gay before hand. It helps because to the public eye it's "new". I still ship Reaper and McCree (been referencing that a lot recently) because of them being flirtatious, so I don't see how me not liking 76's characterization is homophobic. I'm just saying that 76 as a character wasn't at all referenced to be romantically involved, let alone gay, in any form until a single frame of a comic (I think?) recently.

Here's the thing. I would've never heard of this if it hadn't been for people making a big deal out of him being gay. So, yeah, in that way I guess I am focusing on his sexuality. And in that, I am sorry. I don't intend to sound homophobic in any way because I've been through some **** that has taught me not to be. 76 as a character never struck me as romantically involved and my first post probably doesn't help my point but I in no way meant to sound homophobic. Apologies.