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KenboCalrissian

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Speaking of Shovel Knight...

What do you think about his chances now?

Likely? Likely not? 50/50?

I'm 50/50 at this point myself.
Not having seen any evidence for myself, I'm unable to to have an opinion. All I know is the last time I asked, PushDustIn PushDustIn said he was at 70%-80% and that made me very happy.

If I were to try and remove that personal bias though, I honestly don't think I'd give it much more credit than the Twitter rumors - and it pains me to say that because I really want it to be true.
 
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True Blue Warrior

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So, shoo-in is pretty much "guaranteed to be in".

It would be sad to see Jigglypuff getting cut, but then again it's "not deserving" to be in Smash.
Lots of characters "didn't deserve to be in" in the first place.

Speaking of Shovel Knight...

What do you think about his chances now?

Likely? Likely not? 50/50?

I'm 50/50 at this point myself.
Even less than before.
 

Martingale

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Hey guys,

So obviously folk have been wondering about the Chris Miller tweets, hence why I was tagged here. I run the LaytonSmash account, and the reason why I deleted the first tweet with the photographic evidence of the tweet having taken place was due to the fact that nearly a week after it all transpired, people were still retweeting it and taking it entirely out of context. I wanted to prevent the spread of what was somewhat erroneous data, as I presented it in a definite style. I said something along the lines of "Who wants to say it? I'm too hyped to write it. ____ in Smash", which is extremely leading and not with the level of skepticism that it should have been approached with.

If you look at Miller's twitter page now (it's locked, but he accepts basically everyone who tries following him), you'll see the remainders either side of the August 22nd tweet-- the initial denial on the 3rd of August, and the "I don't know for sure" tweet afterwards. I can explicitly confirm that it was not faked, as those remnants exist, but obviously he did as I did and deleted the tweet that could be taken out of context and plastered on every pseudo-news site in the netscape. Several people other than myself read the tweet firsthand (indicated by the favourites on it at the time I observed later), so if it's necessary I can get a few other folks invovled to properly confirm.

Miller sent the tweet saying "I guess I AM in that! That's what those extra pages were in the session" to me twice, replying to two different messages and with slightly different wording, so there's no doubt that he was saying what he wanted to say in that respect. He believed it too, but didn't actually know, which he clarified afterwards. He was guessing, based on what he knew. And as I discovered with research, it's extremely common that video game voice actors have no idea of the projects they work on. It can be assumed from the context that it was a recording with Level-5's contractors rather than with Nintendo themselves, so it stands to reason he was never given an NDA to sign, because he would not have known the context of its use. Perhaps it featured a lot more grunting and shouting than his usual Layton recordings, leading him to believe it was for an action game.

The LaytonSmash account doesn't fake anything for the purposes of misleading. Any time I do make an edit for comedic purposes or as a concept, I explicitly state it as being fake in the tweet. Nearly always, I report the facts on any rumours exactly as I have received them through my sources and through the general information available on the internet, excluding what would be obviously considered spoilers. Ever since these Miller tweets blew up and I sort of disgracefully dressed it as a confirmation, I've done my best to remain as unleading with my responses to rumours as possible, and deleting that leading tweet was necessary to sustain that. I presented a lot of critical explanations as to why I believed it over the following week, and allowed people to make their minds up on it after that. Sorry for any confusion that I've caused by deleting the first tweet.
 

Burb

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Hey guys,

So obviously folk have been wondering about the Chris Miller tweets, hence why I was tagged here. I run the LaytonSmash account, and the reason why I deleted the first tweet with the photographic evidence of the tweet having taken place was due to the fact that nearly a week after it all transpired, people were still retweeting it and taking it entirely out of context. I wanted to prevent the spread of what was somewhat erroneous data, as I presented it in a definite style. I said something along the lines of "Who wants to say it? I'm too hyped to write it. ____ in Smash", which is extremely leading and not with the level of skepticism that it should have been approached with.

If you look at Miller's twitter page now (it's locked, but he accepts basically everyone who tries following him), you'll see the remainders either side of the August 22nd tweet-- the initial denial on the 3rd of August, and the "I don't know for sure" tweet afterwards. I can explicitly confirm that it was not faked, as those remnants exist, but obviously he did as I did and deleted the tweet that could be taken out of context and plastered on every pseudo-news site in the netscape. Several people other than myself read the tweet firsthand (indicated by the favourites on it at the time I observed later), so if it's necessary I can get a few other folks invovled to properly confirm.

Miller sent the tweet saying "I guess I AM in that! That's what those extra pages were in the session" to me twice, replying to two different messages and with slightly different wording, so there's no doubt that he was saying what he wanted to say in that respect. He believed it too, but didn't actually know, which he clarified afterwards. He was guessing, based on what he knew. And as I discovered with research, it's extremely common that video game voice actors have no idea of the projects they work on. It can be assumed from the context that it was a recording with Level-5's contractors rather than with Nintendo themselves, so it stands to reason he was never given an NDA to sign, because he would not have known the context of its use. Perhaps it featured a lot more grunting and shouting than his usual Layton recordings, leading him to believe it was for an action game.

The LaytonSmash account doesn't fake anything for the purposes of misleading. Any time I do make an edit for comedic purposes or as a concept, I explicitly state it as being fake in the tweet. Nearly always, I report the facts on any rumours exactly as I have received them through my sources and through the general information available on the internet, excluding what would be obviously considered spoilers. Ever since these Miller tweets blew up and I sort of disgracefully dressed it as a confirmation, I've done my best to remain as unleading with my responses to rumours as possible, and deleting that leading tweet was necessary to sustain that. I presented a lot of critical explanations as to why I believed it over the following week, and allowed people to make their minds up on it after that. Sorry for any confusion that I've caused by deleting the first tweet.
The entire thing is based around someone submitting misinformation to IMDB.

If the guy doesn't know what his recordings are being used for, and someone tells him "This site says you're in this game", it's reasonable for him to assume "Oh, maybe it's right!". IMDB is not a valid source, and has been used on numerous occasions to "confirm" characters who aren't actually present.

You say you're doing your best not to mislead people, and yet by continuing to perpetuate this nonsense, you're doing just that. I get that you want Layton in Smash, but this isn't proof of anything except the ineptitude of IMDB and Miller having no clue what he's doing.
 

Martingale

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The entire thing is based around someone submitting misinformation to IMDB.

If the guy doesn't know what his recordings are being used for, and someone tells him "This site says you're in this game", it's reasonable for him to assume "Oh, maybe it's right!". IMDB is not a valid source, and has been used on numerous occasions to "confirm" characters who aren't actually present.

You say you're doing your best not to mislead people, and yet by continuing to perpetuate this nonsense, you're doing just that. I get that you want Layton in Smash, but this isn't proof of anything except the ineptitude of IMDB and Miller having no clue what he's doing.
The key take-home point is that he had previously deconfirmed the IMDb rumour. Then, he decided to open it up again over two weeks later spontanously. That's the main reason I lend any credence to it at all.
 

Burb

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The key take-home point is that he had previously deconfirmed the IMDb rumour. Then, he decided to open it up again over two weeks later spontanously. That's the main reason I lend any credence to it at all.
The key take-home point is that the rumor originated from IMDB.

Who do you think added to the page that Layton is in Smash?
 

NintenZ

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BluePikmin11 BluePikmin11 , I'm starting to think that the Yo-Kai Watch Anime may need more censoring, as there's alot of adult themes in the English dub. I'm not saying go all 4Kids, but still.
 
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Martingale

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The key take-home point is that the rumor originated from IMDB.

Who do you think added to the page that Layton is in Smash?
That's an arbitrary point. A rumour was responded to, deconfirmed, and then unexpectedly reopened without a perceived justifiable cause. Most rumours come from anonymous sources, so honing in on the fact that it originated on IMDb is odd given the actor himself had some drive to reopen a closed book.
 

Burb

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That's an arbitrary point. A rumour was responded to, deconfirmed, and then unexpectedly reopened without a perceived justifiable cause. Most rumours come from anonymous sources, so honing in on the fact that it originated on IMDb is odd given the actor himself had some drive to reopen a closed book.
"B-b-b-b-but Miller reopened it!" doesn't change the fact that it originated on IMDB.

Like, you can handwave it all you want, but everything that's popped up as a result was directly influenced by yet another random guy who knows nothing submitting false information to IMDB for the purpose of wish fulfillment.

Miller himself doesn't know exactly what he's recording Layton voices for. You said this yourself. There is nothing linking him to Smash except IMDB, a site where anyone can submit cast information.
 
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Fenriraga

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"B-b-b-b-but Miller reopened it!" doesn't change the fact that it originated on IMDB.

Like, you can handwave it all you want, but everything that's popped up as a result was directly influenced by yet another random guy who knows nothing submitting false information to IMDB for the purpose of wish fulfillment.
Not even sure if wish fulfillment is the right wording.
It's just downright trolling since most people don't understand how IMDb works.
 
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Chrono.

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I don't buy Layton's VA not knowing he was voicing the character in Smash.

I mean Howden knew he was voicing Shulk, Kyle Hebert HAD to know Ryu was in Smash since one of his lines literally is "So this is Smash".
 

SuperSegaSonicSS

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Fanservice, you know, Japanese girls wearing particular outfits... :c
>Implying kids these days haven't already seen half the stuff like that already just being on the internet/ nosy preteens.

Yeah, but...**** censorship. Let suggestive theme stay. It can't be that bad anyways.
This. Seriously, everyone at this point knows more about things like this, it's not even a big deal to begin with. I've seen just as much "fanservice" just playing Melee as Peach and that's nothing over the top as far as I'm concerned with.
 

Burb

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I don't buy Layton's VA not knowing he was voicing the character in Smash.

I mean Howden knew he was voicing Shulk, Kyle Hebert HAD to know Ryu was in Smash since one of his lines literally is "So this is Smash".
Martingale said something about the recording possibly being done by Level-5's contractors.

Which....doesn't really make sense to me, since, as you said, every other voice actor for a character owned by a third or second party clearly knew they were recording for Smash.

It's a bit hard to buy that they'd just give him a Layton script and attach an extra page of Smash Bros grunts without any context. It sounds like a way to explain around his lack of both knowledge and an NDA.
 
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AncientTobacco

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You say you're doing your best not to mislead people, and yet by continuing to perpetuate this nonsense, you're doing just that. I get that you want Layton in Smash, but this isn't proof of anything except the ineptitude of IMDB and Miller having no clue what he's doing.
"B-b-b-b-but Miller reopened it!" doesn't change the fact that it originated on IMDB.

Like, you can handwave it all you want, but everything that's popped up as a result was directly influenced by yet another random guy who knows nothing submitting false information to IMDB for the purpose of wish fulfillment.

Miller himself doesn't know exactly what he's recording Layton voices for. You said this yourself. There is nothing linking him to Smash except IMDB, a site where anyone can submit cast information.
The guy came here to clarify the whole thing because it was brought up again on the last few pages and there was some confusion over whether or not the tweets were fake.

There's no need to get on the offensive.
 
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Fenriraga

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I don't buy Layton's VA not knowing he was voicing the character in Smash.

I mean Howden knew he was voicing Shulk, Kyle Hebert HAD to know Ryu was in Smash since one of his lines literally is "So this is Smash".
Not to mention Tim Watson (Metal Face) and Riley Inge (Doc Louis)
These are particularly chatty characters. It's not like Mario where a couple grunts and yahoos will get you through a session, these guys would at LEAST have to know they were working with a fighting game in order to properly convey their roles.
 
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Burb

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The guy came here to clarify the whole thing because it was brought up again on the last few pages and there was some confusion over whether or not the tweets were fake.

There's no need to get on the offensive.
It's being used as evidence pointing towards his inclusion.

I'm justified in trying to refute it on those grounds.
 

Martingale

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"B-b-b-b-but Miller reopened it!" doesn't change the fact that it originated on IMDB.

Like, you can handwave it all you want, but everything that's popped up as a result was directly influenced by yet another random guy who knows nothing submitting false information to IMDB for the purpose of wish fulfillment.

Miller himself doesn't know exactly what he's recording Layton voices for. You said this yourself. There is nothing linking him to Smash except IMDB, a site where anyone can submit cast information.
I can accept your points on this. There's nothing definitively saying that Layton is in Smash over all this, and I'm merely extrapolating to a data point that I'm admittedly looking for. There's a lot of points in the rumour that are speculative in nature and conjecture, most of which surround the dates of the supposed recording. Were it recent, it hints at two more Layton projects where there are none scheduled for western release. Even the one project that is ongoing, Layton 7, is a mere mobile game and still heavily in development for Japanese release-- English VAs would not have even crossed their minds.

His behaviour on the matter seems to indicate that he recorded something in August, given his complete turnaround on the matter. He hopes that it's true, and has expressed so on more than one occasion. I know very few things for certain except for what I have observed through my own research. As with almost any rumour, the end point is that we'll just have to wait and see. It's been left open-ended, much to the contrast of ones that played out similarly like Christina Vee's Shantae listing.

I don't buy Layton's VA not knowing he was voicing the character in Smash.

I mean Howden knew he was voicing Shulk, Kyle Hebert HAD to know Ryu was in Smash since one of his lines literally is "So this is Smash".
If everything he says is true, it's likely he would have been recording for a Level-5 project, not for Nintendo, if they tacked on extra pages to a voice session. No NDA would have specifically been called for, and in the hypothetical scenario it was for Smash, provided he didn't use Smash as a noun, he'd have no way of knowing for sure. He'd be just as in the dark as anyone else not directly working on the game of the true nature of the project.
 

SuperSegaSonicSS

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If 4Kids were still around though...
I said to myself, if there's no edited sandwich, I would be highly disappointed...

I'm not disappointed, but I am because it reminded me 4Kids really did that once and would do it again because of the censorship... ugh.
 
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Champ Gold

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I don't buy Layton's VA not knowing he was voicing the character in Smash.

I mean Howden knew he was voicing Shulk, Kyle Hebert HAD to know Ryu was in Smash since one of his lines literally is "So this is Smash".
Well most of :4sonic: lines are rehashed from Colors and Generations but still credited Smith for it but he probably knew he was in.

Hell David Vincent, Laura Bailey and Matt Mercer probably knew what happened with Robin/Chrom/Lucina and how their roles were gonna happen
 

Wario Bros.

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Yeah, don't use sites where anyone can edit.

I remember very well that, before Super Mario Galaxy 2 was released, someone edited Wikipedia that Patrick Warburton was going to be the permanent voice actor for :4luigi: starting with SMG2.

I kid you not.
 

Fenriraga

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I can accept your points on this. There's nothing definitively saying that Layton is in Smash over all this, and I'm merely extrapolating to a data point that I'm admittedly looking for. There's a lot of points in the rumour that are speculative in nature and conjecture, most of which surround the dates of the supposed recording. Were it recent, it hints at two more Layton projects where there are none scheduled for western release. Even the one project that is ongoing, Layton 7, is a mere mobile game and still heavily in development for Japanese release-- English VAs would not have even crossed their minds.

His behaviour on the matter seems to indicate that he recorded something in August, given his complete turnaround on the matter. He hopes that it's true, and has expressed so on more than one occasion. I know very few things for certain except for what I have observed through my own research. As with almost any rumour, the end point is that we'll just have to wait and see. It's been left open-ended, much to the contrast of ones that played out similarly like Christina Vee's Shantae listing.



If everything he says is true, it's likely he would have been recording for a Level-5 project, not for Nintendo, if they tacked on extra pages to a voice session. No NDA would have specifically been called for, and in the hypothetical scenario it was for Smash, provided he didn't use Smash as a noun, he'd have no way of knowing for sure. He'd be just as in the dark as anyone else not directly working on the game of the true nature of the project.
Consider for a moment, the nature of Smash games and the nature of Layton games.
Smash is a fighting game.
Layton is a puzzle solver/mystery/not-a-terrible-ammont-of-fisticuffs kind of game.
That's not something terribly easy to "mask". Voice actors need one key thing: direction. You can't give a VA a line like "NO, YOU CAN'T DIE, NOT NOW!" and just expect them to go with it. Do they know that they are suppose to be sad? In denial? Angry? A mix? Maybe even sadistic, like talking to an enemy? The point is that the genres are totally different, and it wouldn't be as simple as pulling lines from Layton games like, say, they did with some of Sonic's sounds. Sonic is a fast pace action platformer, so some lines fit.
It's no different here. If he were to have recorded lines for Smash, he would have, at the very least, been told to convey the kind of tone needed for a game like Smash: a rather silly beat em up with at least a dash of seriousness. If he can't recall even what those "extra bits" were all about, then he's either not recording for something like Smash, or not a terribly good actor.
And since he IS a good actor, it's the former.

Well most of :4sonic: lines are rehashed from Colors and Generations but still credited Smith for it but he probably knew he was in.

Hell David Vincent, Laura Bailey and Matt Mercer probably knew what happened with Robin/Chrom/Lucina and how their roles were gonna happen
Sonic is so odd lmao. Like 80% of his lines are reused but there are SOME new lines. Roger isn't exactly expensive to hire for Sonic, so I don't get it.
 
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Spazzy_D

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With inkling it's a lot like the chorus men. I'm more interested in how they would be implemented then the fact that they might be in the game.
 

Frostwraith

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Well most of :4sonic: lines are rehashed from Colors and Generations but still credited Smith for it but he probably knew he was in.

Hell David Vincent, Laura Bailey and Matt Mercer probably knew what happened with Robin/Chrom/Lucina and how their roles were gonna happen
In the trailer, Robin even says "Smash has many powerful foes, Lucina."

Those voice actors had to know what game they were voicing for because it gives context to the characters they were voicing.

On the Japanese side of things, Sakurai himself had a hand in the voice casting.
 
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TheAnvil

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I really don't understand why people think we're going to see actual ballot results. Does anyone seriously think Nintendo will release a list with all the top characters and how many votes they got?

At best we'll get a brief statement when the character is announced saying something like "this character was selected because of the ballot".
 

Martingale

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Consider for a moment, the nature of Smash games and the nature of Layton games.
Smash is a fighting game.
Layton is a puzzle solver/mystery/not-a-terrible-ammont-of-fisticuffs kind of game.
That's not something terribly easy to "mask". Voice actors need one key thing: direction. You can't give a VA a line like "NO, YOU CAN'T DIE, NOT NOW!" and just expect them to go with it. Do they know that they are suppose to be sad? In denial? Angry? A mix? Maybe even sadistic, like talking to an enemy?
It's no different here. If he were to have recorded lines for Smash, he would have, at the very least, been told to convey the kind of tone needed for a game like Smash: a rather silly beat em up with at least a dash of seriousness. If he can't recall even what those "extra bits" were all about, then he's either not recording for something like Smash, or not a terribly good actor.
And since he IS a good actor, it's the former.
The Layton series definitely has its share of fights and action scenes, during which the characters have strained breaths, shouting, cries of pain, dramatic fade-out shouts, all the sort of thing that would be incorporated into Smash, were it to happen. The slightly silly, yet sometimes serious tone that you mention is already present in the series. Having that condensed into a small session where he's only specifically voicing Layton and not any of the other characters would definitely be noticeable though. Perhaps that's what happened and it's why he sustains his hope. If the other game that's known to be worked on is considered, Layton 7, any limited voice acting that would be done for that would definitely contrast that sort of recording, given it is a text-based game based on investigating others and working out a villain in a group.

All I can say is, who knows for sure? Not even Miller. It'll just take time to see what develops.
 

Champ Gold

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In the trailer, Robin even says "Smash has many powerful foes, Lucina."

Those voice actors had to know what game they were voicing for because it gives context to the characters they were voicing.

On the Japanese side of things, Sakurai himself had a hand in the voice casting.
Funny thing while you mentioned it, there's also everything revolving around :4palutena:, who did the same thing in her trailer and the codecs.

I think voice actors have to know what they are getting into than just saying I don't know if I'm in or not.
 

Spazzy_D

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I really don't understand why people think we're going to see actual ballot results. Does anyone seriously think Nintendo will release a list with all the top characters and how many votes they got?

At best we'll get a brief statement when the character is announced saying something like "this character was selected because of the ballot".
They released the Japanese poll data from 64 to Melee so I suppose their is some precedence for it. But yeah, it's almost certainly not happening.
 
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