Official Next Smash - Speculation & Discussion Thread

[Geno Boost]

i wouldn’t call it impossible but Doshin the giant is one of the few exceptions that could be the iron giant of smash if he ever gets in official smash game
Hero can grow his size with a spell might be give a potential to a character who can be giant and balanced let’s say Agumon evolving to Greymon as gimmick is one of them

 

[osby]

I agree that it’s unlikely but it’s possible they’ve figured out how to make a huge character work in Smash between Ultimate and now. I’m not really expecting anything but I never say never.

In order to figure it out, they first need to have a desire to add huge characters. It might be something Smash devs are interested in but from what we know, there isn't anything that points to it. We already have quite a few characters sized down for Smash and they work just fine. Ridley or K.Rool aren't super accurate but neither are small characters like Pichu or Olimar.

So it's not impossible but as Will said, it also probably won't happen.

 

[Gengar84]

In order to figure it out, they first need to have a desire to add huge characters. It might be something Smash devs are interested in but from what we know, there isn't anything that points to it. We already have quite a few characters sized down for Smash and they work just fine. Ridley or K.Rool aren't super accurate but neither are small characters like Pichu or Olimar.

So it's not impossible but as Will said, it also probably won't happen.

I agree with that. I’d personally love to see it but it may not be worth the extra effort it would take to properly balance a character like that. For me, it just kind of breaks the immersion a bit when characters aren’t scaled accurately but it’s a worthy sacrifice if that’s the only way we can get them.

 

[osby]

I agree with that. I’d personally love to see it but it may not be worth the extra effort it would take to properly balance a character like that. For me, it just kind of breaks the immersion a bit when characters aren’t scaled accurately but it’s a worthy sacrifice if that’s the only way we can get them.

Honestly, it still bothers me a little when I see Pit and Palutena side by side in Smash so I can see where you're coming from.

That being said, you can say it's accurate to how playing with action figures works lol

 

[Will]

I agree that it’s unlikely but it’s possible they’ve figured out how to make a huge character work in Smash between Ultimate and now. I’m not really expecting anything but I never say never.

Pop Quiz: You’re getting camped by a Pikachu who’s spamming neutral special right… here.

How do you, the Iron Giant, confront them in a place you can’t even reach? Do you:

A. Pray your attacks go through walls
B. Chase the faster, more evasive rat around the maze parts you can reach
C. Remove 90% of all old stages from the game because they were never designed for someone that big

 

[osby]

Pop Quiz: You’re getting camped by a Pikachu who’s spamming neutral special right… here.

View attachment 386929

How do you, the Iron Giant, confront them in a place you can’t even reach? Do you:

A. Pray your attacks go through walls
B. Chase the faster, more evasive rat around the maze parts you can reach
C. Remove 90% of all old stages from the game because they were never designed for someone that big

D. Scale all stages up to Iron Giant's level because Little Mac players haven't suffered enough

 

[Gengar84]

Pop Quiz: You’re getting camped by a Pikachu who’s spamming neutral special right… here.

View attachment 386929

How do you, the Iron Giant, confront them in a place you can’t even reach? Do you:

A. Pray your attacks go through walls
B. Chase the faster, more evasive rat around the maze parts you can reach
C. Remove 90% of all old stages from the game because they were never designed for someone that big

I think 90% is a big overstatement but I see what you’re saying. I think the obvious solution there is to have the character clip through the wall or platform if they’re too big to fit. It wouldn’t look great but it’s still functional. There are several Ultimate mods for huge characters and they technically work in a similar way. There’s still a size limit on the characters so they’d still function in the majority of environments without too much clipping but it’s not an impossible hurdle. Again, I did say it’s likely too much trouble to implement but I think they could figure something out if they really wanted to.

 

[Geno Boost]

Greymon is playable in smash crusade you can exactly test that out as he is the biggest character in that game also hyrule temple is there lol

 

[Gengar84]

Greymon is playable in smash crusade you can exactly test that out as he is the biggest character in that game also hyrule temple is there lol

So how exactly does Smash Crusade handle that situation?

 

[BritishGuy54]

I feel like there’s pros and cons to a primary Xenoblade 3 character.

Noah is a sensible option, being the main character, and wielding the main sword of the game, just like Shulk and Pyra/Mythra, plus being able to unsheath the sword. But I feel like a lot of people see him as just another swordfighter.

Mio is seemingly the more popular option. Twin rings are a unique weapon, yes. But a Nia assist trophy could do the same thing, on a smaller scale.

Both Noah and Mio will likely be impossible. There isn’t an easy way to do this, like how Pokémon Trainer or Pyra/Mythra could swap easily.

Ouroboros would be interesting, I guess. But I’m not too keen on it. The swap mechanic would be more feasible here.

 

[Geno Boost]

So how exactly does Smash Crusade handle that situation?

he walks just fine through that area in hyrule temple but jumping barely makes him go up because of his size in that spot

 

[Will]

D. Scale all stages up to Iron Giant's level because Little Mac players haven't suffered enough

Greymon is playable in smash crusade you can exactly test that out as he is the biggest character in that game also hyrule temple is there lol

One, you’re comparing a fanmade flash game to the real game, that obviously has different sized fighters that don’t compare to the real thing. Mario in the Temple tunnel in Crusade is about as big as the real Pichu in the tunnel.

Two, Greymon looks like a taller Bowser at best. And I’m comparing that to the real Bowser.

Where’s the Iron Giant fit in all this?

 

[Gengar84]

I feel like there’s pros and cons to a primary Xenoblade 3 character.

Noah is a sensible option, being the main character, and wielding the main sword of the game, just like Shulk and Pyra/Mythra, plus being able to unsheath the sword. But I feel like a lot of people see him as just another swordfighter.

Mio is seemingly the more popular option. Twin rings are a unique weapon, yes. But a Nia assist trophy could do the same thing, on a smaller scale.

Both Noah and Mio will likely be impossible. There isn’t an easy way to do this, like how Pokémon Trainer or Pyra/Mythra could swap easily.

Ouroboros would be interesting, I guess. But I’m not too keen on it. The swap mechanic would be more feasible here.

I don’t see what’s impossible about a Noah and Mio tag pairing with a transform/switch mechanic. The only reason I’m not totally for that option is that we just did it with the last Xenoblade rep. That would be like if we got two Pokemon Trainers in a row for the Pokemon rep.

My vote is for the Ouroboros fusion because I think it’s the most unique option and they have awesome designs that would be really cool to play as. Solo Noah is the least exciting option. I like him as a character but he doesn’t offer anything particularly interesting gameplay wise. Solo Mio would be better but I’m not sure if she would feel strange on her own. That would be like getting Shionne without Alphen or Yuna without Tidus. I’m all for it but I’m not sure how likely that is. We did just get Pyra without Rex and Min Min without Spring Man so it is possible at least.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Ridley was scaled down its different from something like iron giant

Iron Giant in Multiversus is scaled down a lot from his actual size as well.

The Iron Giant is 50 feet tall. In MV, he's barely double Shaggy's height.

 

[Hadokeyblade]

I kinda just assume that any "Giant" character they would want to put in smash would be shrunk down to the general heights of everyone else while being portrayed as heavyweights.

 

[NonSpecificGuy]

I still want Elma, I’ll be real.

 

[Gengar84]

I kinda just assume that any "Giant" character they would want to put in smash would be shrunk down to the general heights of everyone else while being portrayed as heavyweights.

I really like the size they went for with Bowser in a lot of the spirit battles. That was pretty much perfect for him. Still big enough to not feel off but small enough to still function on stages. I’d even gladly take Bowser returning to his previous size from Smash 4 and Brawl. When they changed his moveset in Smash 4, they shrunk his model because he stands straight instead of hunched over and it looked like they wanted to keep him at the same height standing as he was leaning.

 

[DarthEnderX]

I kinda just assume that any "Giant" character they would want to put in smash would be shrunk down to the general heights of everyone else while being portrayed as heavyweights.

Giant characters work better as Bosses in Smash.

 

[Geno Boost]

View attachment 386930


One, you’re comparing a fanmade flash game to the real game, that obviously has different sized fighters that don’t compare to the real thing. Mario in the Temple tunnel in Crusade is about as big as the real Pichu in the tunnel.

Two, Greymon looks like a taller Bowser at best. And I’m comparing that to the real Bowser.

View attachment 386931
View attachment 386932

Where’s the Iron Giant fit in all this?

here is the thing if were talking about some specific casual stages then its true that giant character might have trouble in specific area but usually causal stages do give advantage and disadvantage to some other character as well but if were talking legal stages then there is no issue

 

[Perkilator]

I feel like there’s pros and cons to a primary Xenoblade 3 character.

Noah is a sensible option, being the main character, and wielding the main sword of the game, just like Shulk and Pyra/Mythra, plus being able to unsheath the sword. But I feel like a lot of people see him as just another swordfighter.

Mio is seemingly the more popular option. Twin rings are a unique weapon, yes. But a Nia assist trophy could do the same thing, on a smaller scale.

Both Noah and Mio will likely be impossible. There isn’t an easy way to do this, like how Pokémon Trainer or Pyra/Mythra could swap easily.

Ouroboros would be interesting, I guess. But I’m not too keen on it. The swap mechanic would be more feasible here.

I think Noah and Mio both have equal billing to be in Smash Bros. regardless, to the point where I'd be willing to include them as separate fighters if need be. And it's not like they have to stick to their primary weapons; Noah could use the weapons of Eunie and Lanz for some moves, whereas Mio could use the weapons of Taion and Sena for some moves, since in Xenoblade 3 the characters can use the weapons of certain classes while in another.

 

[Will]

I really like the size they went for with Bowser in a lot of the spirit battles. That was pretty much perfect for him. Still big enough to not feel off but small enough to still function on stages.

They did it first with Melee’s adventure mode.

here is the thing if were talking about some specific casual stages then its true that giant character might have trouble in specific area but usually causal stages do give advantage and disadvantage to some other character as well but if were talking legal stages then there is no issue

I love competitive Smash too, and you are right. But you have to remember the other 29 out of 30 million who bought this game aren’t doing it to enter a resuscitating competitive scene.

 

[cashregister9]

Honestly I think the best way to implement Noah and Mio is just straight up add both of them to the roster as unique characters.

Maybe they could have a gimmick where they have different Final Smashes depending on whether or not the other is on their team in a team battle or something like that.

 

[Gengar84]

Honestly I think the best way to implement Noah and Mio is just straight up add both of them to the roster as unique characters.

Maybe they could have a gimmick where they have different Final Smashes depending on whether or not the other is on their team in a team battle or something like that.

My only concern there is that Xenoblade might start getting the same negative reactions from the Smash community as Fire Emblem with having so many characters at the expense of other series. I love the Xenoblade games but two full characters in one game might be a bit much, especially since we effectively had two in the last game if you count transformations as multiple characters.

 

[Capybara Gaming]

I feel like there’s pros and cons to a primary Xenoblade 3 character.

Noah is a sensible option, being the main character

How many times do we have to go over this

Noah isn't the main character. The two main characters are equally important. For story reasons they're both equally important. They have basically equal screentime. Do some research if you haven't played the game

 

[Will]

My only concern there is that Xenoblade might start getting the same negative reactions from the Smash community as Fire Emblem with having so many characters at the expense of other series.

People have been hating on Xenoblade since the day Shulk backslashed Bowser in the trailer I think you’re about a decade too late.

 

[Garteam]

I took a crack at developing a stage list for the next Smash. I limited myself to 40 returning stages (excluding Battlefield, Final Destination, Small Battlefield, and Large Battlefield) and 30 new stages, delineating which stages were being included because I tied them to a hypothetical newcomer (you could slot a lot of these stages out and slot in another stage that better reflects whatever characters actually end up in the next Smash). I tried to balance between stages I think are likely and stages I think would be cool:

Spoiler: Classic Stages

1. Hyrule Castle
2. Kongo Jungle
3. Temple
4. Corneria
5. Pokemon Stadium
6. Mute City
5. Onett
6. WarioWare Inc.
7. Norfair
8. Yoshi's Island
9. Halberd
10. Pokemon Stadium 2
11. Castle Siege
12. Skyworld
13. Smashville
14. Shadow Moses Island
15. Luigi's Mansion
16. Green Hill Zone
17. Boxing Ring
18. Gaur Plains
19. Duck Hunt
20. Wily Castle
21. Suzaku Castle
22. Midgar
23. Umbra Clock Tower
24. 3D Land
25. Pac-Maze
26. Mario Circuit
27. Flat Zone X
28. Wii Fit Studio
29. Wuhu Island
30. New Donk City Hall
31. Moray Towers
32. Dracula's Castle
33. Mementos
34. Spiral Mountain
35. King of Fighters Stadium*
36. Garreg Mach Monestary*
37. Spring Stadium
38. Minecraft World
39. Mishima Dojo
40. Hollow Bastion
41. Battlefield
42. Small Battlefield
43. Big Battlefield
44. Final Destination

Spoiler: New Stages

1. Waluigi Pinball (NEWCOMER TIED)
2. Alivel Mall (NEWCOMER TIED)
3. Mystery Island Tour (NEWCOMER TIED)
4. Scorch Gorge (NEWCOMER TIED)
5. Transient Temple (NEWCOMER TIED)
6. Paldea's West Province (NEWCOMER TIED)
7. Ushimitsu High School (NEWCOMER TIED)
8. City Escape (NEWCOMER TIED)
9. Central Highway (NEWCOMER TIED)
10. Tian Hong Yuan (NEWCOMER TIED)
11. Floating Catacombs (NEWCOMER TIED)
12. Bomberman Arena (NEWCOMER TIED)
13. Vista Hill (NEWCOMER TIED)
14. Pipe-Rock Plateau
15. Bowser's Castle
16. Sparkle Theatre
17. Mine Cart Madness
18. Crafted World
19. Caresaway Island
20. The Lanayru Sky
21. Ferenia
22. Ice Climber (Think Duck Hunt's Stage but for Ice Climber)
23. Somniel
24. Hero's Hideaway
25. Great Cote Falls
26. Avalon Forest
27. Plains of Alefgard (Retro Dragon Quest Stage)
28. Tetris
29. The Forest and Hills
30. Nuketown (general "WTF" stage prediction)

 

[Ivander]

My only concern there is that Xenoblade might start getting the same negative reactions from the Smash community as Fire Emblem with having so many characters at the expense of other series. I love the Xenoblade games but two full characters in one game might be a bit much, especially since we effectively had two in the last game if you count transformations as multiple characters.

It will happen to any series regardless. One because there will always be people who will hate characters that aren't their most wanted. Much like Lucario, R.O.B., Wolf, Dr. Mario, Duck Hunt, etc. Two, remember Brawl and Kirby? Smash 4 and Kid Icarus? And those two had only got 2 reps each.

 

[CapitaineCrash]

How many times do we have to go over this

Noah isn't the main character. The two main characters are equally important. For story reasons they're both equally important. They have basically equal screentime. Do some research if you haven't played the game

I would even argue that Mio is more a main character than Noah. A lot of the story revolves around her being on her last term, and I also feel like Noah was way more passive for the first half of the story and Mio was more a "leader" until much later when they introduced N and Noah shines a bit more.

 

[Gengar84]

Yeah, I see Noah and Mio as co-leads but I’ve felt that way about a lot of JRPGs in the past with the most prominent male and female characters. For example, Yuna and Garnet are probably more important to the overall plot of their games than Tidus or Zidane but the player controls the male lead. I’ve always put them on equal terms despite that. Same goes for others like Alphen and Shionne or Jude and Milla. I feel like since it’s so often the case in JRPGs that the male is designated as the main protagonist despite equal importance to the story, a lot of people default to thinking of Noah and Mio in the same way.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Honestly I think the best way to implement Noah and Mio is just straight up add both of them to the roster as unique characters.

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

 

[Will]

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

How else are they going to advertise?

This is a serious question.

 

[Capybara Gaming]

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

Xenoblade 3 is considered by many to be the best in the series and you just wanna ignore that because hurr durr anime swordsman can we please stop using this excuse.

FE is gonna lose a **** ton of characters if a reboot happens, it's okay to allow Xenoblade to get another rep or two, and if the next game brings everyone back again then we have plenty of room for Noah and Mio

 

[Ivander]

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

Yeah, but I thought it was common knowledge to add in a character from every multi-million game. Mario, Pokemon, Legend of Zelda, Donkey Kong Country, Ring Fit Adventure, Animal Crossing, Metroid Dread, Kirby and the Forgotten Land, etc?

 

[osby]

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

It doesn't need to be.

But it'd be cool.

 

[BritishGuy54]

The best way to implement them is to not.

XB doesn't need to become another FE where every entry needs to get a Smash character.

I think something working in XB’s favour could be longer gaps between games. FE takes around 3-4 years. XB usually takes around 5-6. It’s a difference, even if only slightly.

 

[DarthEnderX]

Yeah, but I thought it was common knowledge to add in a character from every multi-million game. Mario, Pokemon, Legend of Zelda, Donkey Kong Country, Ring Fit Adventure, Animal Crossing, Metroid Dread, Kirby and the Forgotten Land, etc?

...most of those didn't get a character.

It doesn't need to be.

But it'd be cool.

Not as cool as more new franchises being added instead.

 

[GoldenYuiitusin]

I saw Greymon get mentioned and now I am obligated to say that Digimon should have a fighter in Smash.

That is all.

 

[Gengar84]

I saw Greymon get mentioned and now I am obligated to say that Digimon should have a fighter in Smash.

That is all.

I’d like that but I’m not big on Agumon specifically even though it’s the most likely. My favorites are Ogremon and Meramon but I don’t think either has much a chance unfortunately.

 

[Ivander]

...most of those didn't get a character.

Well yeah, some of them released after the DLC characters were all decided. I mean Metroid Dread was first announced alongside Kazuya and came out around when Sora was announced/released, so of course they haven't gotten a character so far, let alone any non-Spirit content.

 

[SPEN18]

Tbh I would prefer to just keep Shulk and Aegis and then focus on other series rather than add someone from Xenoblade 3. Xenoblade 3 was a success, though not as successful as Xenoblade 2, and we already have Aegis as a fairly recent addition repping the Switch era of XBC. But even more than that, there are other series with only 1-2 reps which I would personally prioritize before giving a third to Xenoblade (counting Aegis as 1 here), namely Animal Crossing, Splatoon, and Pikmin; even bigger series like Zelda or Kirby which are overdue for expansion I would give first crack at newcomers as well. I'm not saying XBC should be stuck at 2 reps forever, and I think if it comes out with a big hit on Switch 2 then we can revisit, just right now there's a lot of other stuff I'd like first.